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Confusing point in my Training #8024157 10/26/20 02:49 PM
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kemon86 Offline OP
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I seem to be stuck in a rut with my dog. Some days are great, some days are awful. When working blinds, she is struggling with the initial "back." If she sees a left over or right over, she will bolt for those bumpers off the stand, even though my hand is pointing to the back of the "T." Maybe I went too fast? Any help appreciated on how you guys taught or drilled left backs, right backs, and overs. Also, is it really a blind if she sees you place the bumper on the ground?

Re: Confusing point in my Training [Re: kemon86] #8024336 10/26/20 04:40 PM
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BradyBuck Offline
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True blinds should not be attempted with most dogs until they have been through simple casting, pile work, T, TT, pattern blinds and walk out blinds.

The biggest hurdle to having a good blind running dog is confidence.

You want your dog to line up and look out, know and trust you that there is a bird there for them.

This takes time and baby steps.

I have a few questions before I get into how you should proceed.

Are you following a proven training progression? If so, which program?

Has your dog been FF properly?
Has your dog been CCed properly?
Have you put your dog through simple casting?

If you answered yes to these questions and have a dog who knows how to respond to collar pressure then you are ready to move to force to pile.

You should not set out your over piles for T until your dog has built up great momentum driving to the back pile from both your side and front sit. Sending on "back" from side and left and right casts with "back" from front sit position. You should also be able to stop the dog on the whistle coming in from the pile and stop going to pile.

Only when you have forced to the back pile and have a dog who is driving to that pile should you move on into T work.

When you do start T make sure to continue to keep momentum driving to back pile and do not stop often.

When you set out your overs make sure they are inconspicuous, especially if the dog already wants to take overs or line to the overs. I use orange bumpers with no stake for dogs like this.

Remember this are all baby steps in the process of eventually having a dog that is confident in running cold blinds.

Another note is to make sure you are consistent in your movements and cue words. You should be working on the ability to move with your dog by using "here" "heel" to line up, "dead bird" as cue it's a blind, "good" for when the dog is locked in and focused correctly and then hand down before sending.

So it should go something like this..

Walk up to the line, use "sit", "here" to pull right, "heel" to push left, "dead bird" to cue blind, "good" when locked in, hand down, "back"



Last edited by BradyBuck; 10/26/20 04:41 PM.

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Re: Confusing point in my Training [Re: kemon86] #8024340 10/26/20 04:43 PM
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Leonardo Offline
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Put her back on a check cord. You should be going to the back pile far more often than the left or right. Technically not a blind but that is not important right now. The piles are established and she should know where they are. You want the dog working with you and following your lead.

Re: Confusing point in my Training [Re: kemon86] #8024342 10/26/20 04:44 PM
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Leonardo Offline
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Are you following a program? Smartworks, Lardy, ect…

Re: Confusing point in my Training [Re: kemon86] #8024344 10/26/20 04:45 PM
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Leonardo Offline
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Brady Buck is on point, I would suggest following his lead.

Re: Confusing point in my Training [Re: kemon86] #8024949 10/27/20 12:27 AM
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kemon86 Offline OP
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Yes on force fetched. Not sure was CC is? I’m following Freddy Kings videos on YouTube. I simply misunderstood, these aren’t necessarily “blinds” are they? I’m just teaching her the patterns of right back, left back and overs, correct?

Re: Confusing point in my Training [Re: kemon86] #8025041 10/27/20 01:33 AM
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BradyBuck Offline
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Originally Posted by kemon86
Yes on force fetched. Not sure was CC is? I’m following Freddy Kings videos on YouTube. I simply misunderstood, these aren’t necessarily “blinds” are they? I’m just teaching her the patterns of right back, left back and overs, correct?



I am familiar with Freddy's progression

It's is

Formal obedience
CC (Collar Conditioning)
FF (I personally FF before CC)
Simple casting
Pile work
Single T
TT
Pattern blinds

Pattern blind do not involve overs, really shouldn't involve much casting at all at first. You are just lining to the pattern blind.

If you have not followed the above progression you should back up.

Teaching right and left turns and overs in close quarters is "simple casting"


Last edited by BradyBuck; 10/27/20 01:38 AM.

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Re: Confusing point in my Training [Re: kemon86] #8025071 10/27/20 01:55 AM
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kemon86 Offline OP
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Thanks for the tip!

Last edited by kemon86; 10/27/20 01:56 AM.
Re: Confusing point in my Training [Re: kemon86] #8025960 10/27/20 06:05 PM
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Originally Posted by kemon86
Thanks for the tip!


Sent you a PM


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Re: Confusing point in my Training [Re: kemon86] #8026835 10/28/20 02:11 AM
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I dont worry which way the dog turns when going to the back pile, as long as he/she goes back. Turning right or left comes with wagonwheel. When the dog goes to the side piles, means it needs to go to the back pile more. Send from remote (front) for awhile and it will clean up easier.

Robby

Re: Confusing point in my Training [Re: kemon86] #8029375 10/29/20 08:34 PM
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Have the piles laid out like you are running your T drill. Then once the dog is awaiting a direction, throw a bumper to the back pile - then send back. after lots of time and repetition the dog associates the back pile with back. Can be applied to either directional command. Thats how i sharpen/reinforce them when the dog is a little rusty.

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