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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: Choctaw]
#8004025
10/09/20 05:04 PM
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 18,546
ducknbass
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Yeah. He was big, real big. I was scared. I dove under a car in the parking lot and tried to get away from him. I was crying. He got on his knees and begged me to come out, promised not to hurt me. I did. We hugged, he let me go. See what happens when an opinion is formed without all the facts? Don't do it. Well played.
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: ducknbass]
#8004026
10/09/20 05:08 PM
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 18,546
ducknbass
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All of this just reminds me that when I was a kid growing up in Rockwall county and a few police officers that I had run-ins with used to Tell me that I should go to the academy and be a police officer. I knew I was not cut out to be a police officer and I still hold that the same opinion of myself. I'm glad I'm not a police officer and have to make those decisions. I'm glad that when I make a judgment decision at work that does not end up on the news. I don't know why anybody would do it.
I was talking to a friend the other day he is pretty much always siding with the Black lives matter group he is a liberal. I asked him if he felt like the world today was the same as it was when he was a kid or if it was worse. He said the world is crazier today it's a lot more violent. I said yeah so you're asking police officers to go out in the world that is more violent but to not be more violent. I didn't check out
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: ducknbass]
#8004052
10/09/20 05:28 PM
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 33,799
Buzzsaw
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you got to be a bad azz to be a cop. not a di_k just a bad azz
SPACE FOR RENT
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: Grizz]
#8004080
10/09/20 06:01 PM
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 12,331
Duck_Hunter
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So you are a LEO and you have a noncompliant person....you have three choices to gain control of the person.
1. Go hands on and try to overpower them 2. Use the tazer to gain compliance 3. Use your service weapons to gain compliance/end threat
What would you do? “Gain control.” Per the Rangers, he walked up to shake his hand. Until video comes out (and even then, there will probably be ambiguity), we don’t know if there was a need to “gain control.” It sounds like, per the report, the fight was over, the couple involved in the domestic dispute either left or dispersed, and the good samaritan walked up to try to welcome the officer. There was no situation to gain control of, if that’s the case. Both parties could have done things differently, if that’s how it played out. But I don’t know if “gain control” of a fight that happened before the officer showed up is the right way to try to arm chair QB this. What was he gaining control of if the guy who broke the fight up was in a position to walk up and try to shake the officer’s hand? The problem with this incident is we don't know for sure how it originated. I've read a version in which he broke up a fight between other people and I've read a version in which he was just involved in a fight with someone else. Either scenario results in his being detained, even more so if he is possibly intoxicated. SnakeWrangler's question comes in at the point he reportedly tried to walk away from the officer who was trying to detain him for investigation. At that point the officer likely had reasonable suspicion that Price had committed Disorderly Conduct and/or Public Intoxication. I agree, we don’t know for sure how it originated. Was he trying to detain him, though? It sounds like he walked up to the officer when the officer got out of his vehicle. The couple having the domestic dispute was apparently gone. What commands were given by the officer? We don’t know if he was trying to detain him or at what point he approached the officer. SW’s starting at the “gain control of a person” point and we don’t even know if the officer tried to gain control or what was happening when the officer pulled up. It sounds like the fight was over, so why would he try to detain someone when he doesn’t even know what took place or who was involved. If the officer pulled up and the dead guy was clearly winning the fight (say, was on top of the other guy pummeling him) and the officer clearly thought he was the aggressor, that would make “gain control of the person” reasonable but it doesn’t sound like that was the case (based on the Ranger report saying he approached the officer to shake his hand). That’s all I’m saying. I’m not taking sides either way. I have a lot of questions. No matter the missing details, I think both parties could have made decisions that would have resulted in a different outcome and it’s sad.
I just turned it on . I was looking bird dogs in the butt this morning.
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: barndoor]
#8004088
10/09/20 06:07 PM
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 12,331
Duck_Hunter
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the good samaritan walked up to try to welcome the officer. There was no situation to gain control of, if that’s the case.
You obviously have no clue about law enforcement. Please stay in your lane. Bad guys always come up to you and try to befriend you on calls. You know why??? Because they don’t want to go jail. This guy was apologizing to the officer about some glass on the ground implying like he’s the one that did it. I am going to become very suspicious about someone coming up on me to shake my hand and apologizing about some glass on the ground, therefore I am going to detain his arse until I figure out what’s going on. I do agree the officer was very young, inexperienced, and scared. First, you removed the context from my post by not including “per the report,” meaning what the Texas Rangers released about what happened. Second, you shouldn’t use the word ‘always.’ Every bad guy in the history of the country has walked up and tried to befriend the officer responding to the call? How did the TV show Cops even air an episode if they ‘always’ walk up to responding officers and try to shake hands? Third, what did the officer say? Did he give commands? Did the guy disregard the commands? All of that matters, and we don’t have answers. So your hypothetical about what you would do doesn’t matter to me.
I just turned it on . I was looking bird dogs in the butt this morning.
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: Duck_Hunter]
#8004113
10/09/20 06:22 PM
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 12,220
Grizz
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The problem with this incident is we don't know for sure how it originated. I've read a version in which he broke up a fight between other people and I've read a version in which he was just involved in a fight with someone else. Either scenario results in his being detained, even more so if he is possibly intoxicated. SnakeWrangler's question comes in at the point he reportedly tried to walk away from the officer who was trying to detain him for investigation. At that point the officer likely had reasonable suspicion that Price had committed Disorderly Conduct and/or Public Intoxication.
I agree, we don’t know for sure how it originated. Was he trying to detain him, though? It sounds like he walked up to the officer when the officer got out of his vehicle. The couple having the domestic dispute was apparently gone. What commands were given by the officer? We don’t know if he was trying to detain him or at what point he approached the officer. SW’s starting at the “gain control of a person” point and we don’t even know if the officer tried to gain control or what was happening when the officer pulled up. It sounds like the fight was over, so why would he try to detain someone when he doesn’t even know what took place or who was involved. If the officer pulled up and the dead guy was clearly winning the fight (say, was on top of the other guy pummeling him) and the officer clearly thought he was the aggressor, that would make “gain control of the person” reasonable but it doesn’t sound like that was the case (based on the Ranger report saying he approached the officer to shake his hand). That’s all I’m saying. I’m not taking sides either way. I have a lot of questions. No matter the missing details, I think both parties could have made decisions that would have resulted in a different outcome and it’s sad. According to the Ranger's affidavit, Lucas was dispatched to a disturbance/possible fight in progress. No mention of who was involved or if someone was trying to break it up, just a fight in progress. When he arrived, Price approached him and told him the broken glass was because of him and someone tried to wrap him up. That alone gave Lucas reasonable suspicion to detain him and figure out what was going on. Again, based on the affidavit, Lucas had no idea who was involved in the initial fight or what the circumstances were other than knowing Price was involved based on his own statements. Lucas also stated he had some indication that Price was intoxicated. Based on all of that information, I have absolutely no doubt Lucas was trying to detain Price at that point and Lucas himself said he was trying to detain him. Whether anything that happened after that point was justified is something I simply don't know.
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: Grizz]
#8004308
10/09/20 08:43 PM
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 12,331
Duck_Hunter
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The problem with this incident is we don't know for sure how it originated. I've read a version in which he broke up a fight between other people and I've read a version in which he was just involved in a fight with someone else. Either scenario results in his being detained, even more so if he is possibly intoxicated. SnakeWrangler's question comes in at the point he reportedly tried to walk away from the officer who was trying to detain him for investigation. At that point the officer likely had reasonable suspicion that Price had committed Disorderly Conduct and/or Public Intoxication.
I agree, we don’t know for sure how it originated. Was he trying to detain him, though? It sounds like he walked up to the officer when the officer got out of his vehicle. The couple having the domestic dispute was apparently gone. What commands were given by the officer? We don’t know if he was trying to detain him or at what point he approached the officer. SW’s starting at the “gain control of a person” point and we don’t even know if the officer tried to gain control or what was happening when the officer pulled up. It sounds like the fight was over, so why would he try to detain someone when he doesn’t even know what took place or who was involved. If the officer pulled up and the dead guy was clearly winning the fight (say, was on top of the other guy pummeling him) and the officer clearly thought he was the aggressor, that would make “gain control of the person” reasonable but it doesn’t sound like that was the case (based on the Ranger report saying he approached the officer to shake his hand). That’s all I’m saying. I’m not taking sides either way. I have a lot of questions. No matter the missing details, I think both parties could have made decisions that would have resulted in a different outcome and it’s sad. According to the Ranger's affidavit, Lucas was dispatched to a disturbance/possible fight in progress. No mention of who was involved or if someone was trying to break it up, just a fight in progress. When he arrived, Price approached him and told him the broken glass was because of him and someone tried to wrap him up. That alone gave Lucas reasonable suspicion to detain him and figure out what was going on. Again, based on the affidavit, Lucas had no idea who was involved in the initial fight or what the circumstances were other than knowing Price was involved based on his own statements. Lucas also stated he had some indication that Price was intoxicated. Based on all of that information, I have absolutely no doubt Lucas was trying to detain Price at that point and Lucas himself said he was trying to detain him. Whether anything that happened after that point was justified is something I simply don't know.
I just turned it on . I was looking bird dogs in the butt this morning.
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: ducknbass]
#8004836
10/10/20 11:42 AM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 12,370
RedRanger
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So the cop is in Collin jail on with a 1 million dollar bail?
Or has he been bailed out yet?
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: ducknbass]
#8004856
10/10/20 12:08 PM
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 33,799
Buzzsaw
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SPACE FOR RENT
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: Guy]
#8004917
10/10/20 01:33 PM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,244
barndoor
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I'm not a police officer so I cannot state what should or should not have happened but in my mind as not a police officer tasing him walking away with his hands in the air doesn't seem like a good idea but again I'm not a police officer so I'm not saying it was wrong I just didn't seem right to me.
What should he have done, let him walk off? Serious question. If a cop tells you to stop, and you keep walking off, it leaves him with no other choice. “Leaves him with no other choice”? A subject merely walking away from an officer giving him orders to stop doesn’t warrant the use of a Taser What should he have done? I didn't see BigPig response to this question.
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: ducknbass]
#8004930
10/10/20 01:55 PM
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 21,370
Bullfrog
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Remember in school when you walk behind someone and kick their foot to the side so it would catch their own foot and they’d trip and everybody would laugh? Maybe that’s all that was needed We won’t know till the facts come out
Man if I knew what Oxner knows I could throw away what I know
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: Bullfrog]
#8004955
10/10/20 02:26 PM
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 12,220
Grizz
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Remember in school when you walk behind someone and kick their foot to the side so it would catch their own foot and they’d trip and everybody would laugh? Maybe that’s all that was needed We won’t know till the facts come outThis is 100% accurate. The information surrounding most of these incidents that comes out early is typically from eye witnesses, many of whom have their own agendas affecting their "memories" of the event (speaking in general terms). Even the criminal complaint won't have all of the information in it. The purpose of the complaint is to simply establish probable cause for an arrest, nothing else. It is very common for a five page report to be reduced to one paragraph for a criminal complaint.
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: Grizz]
#8004966
10/10/20 02:38 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 26,160
Concho
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Remember in school when you walk behind someone and kick their foot to the side so it would catch their own foot and they’d trip and everybody would laugh? Maybe that’s all that was needed We won’t know till the facts come outThis is 100% accurate. The information surrounding most of these incidents that comes out early is typically from eye witnesses, many of whom have their own agendas affecting their "memories" of the event (speaking in general terms). Even the criminal complaint won't have all of the information in it. The purpose of the complaint is to simply establish probable cause for an arrest, nothing else. It is very common for a five page report to be reduced to one paragraph for a criminal complaint. I always like to see the good and the bad in arrest affidavits, as my career progressed I came to understand that most stories have two or three sides, and some folks act out of fear and confusion. While sometimes a person's acts or omissions constitute a crime it isn't always as cut and dry as the affidavit. Anyway, we shall see when ALL the facts come to light.
Last edited by Concho; 10/10/20 02:39 PM.
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: ducknbass]
#8005383
10/10/20 10:50 PM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 12,370
RedRanger
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Why isn't the cop locked up in Hunt county jail?
Why is he in Collin county?
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: ducknbass]
#8005402
10/10/20 11:19 PM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 10,823
DannyB
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Suspicion of intoxication is being mentioned. When will the toxicology report come out?
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: Buzzsaw]
#8005404
10/10/20 11:21 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 91,416
bill oxner
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Quail hunting is like walking into, and out of a beautiful painting all day long. Gene Hill
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: ducknbass]
#8005405
10/10/20 11:21 PM
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Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 9,763
Tin Head
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If the guy was white,yellow, green, blue, red, it would be a issue.
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: RedRanger]
#8005419
10/10/20 11:41 PM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 8,365
LoneStarSon
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Why isn't the cop locked up in Hunt county jail?
Why is he in Collin county? Probably for his own protection. He was a jailer there for a while.
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: Concho]
#8005525
10/11/20 02:10 AM
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 12,331
Duck_Hunter
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Remember in school when you walk behind someone and kick their foot to the side so it would catch their own foot and they’d trip and everybody would laugh? Maybe that’s all that was needed We won’t know till the facts come outThis is 100% accurate. The information surrounding most of these incidents that comes out early is typically from eye witnesses, many of whom have their own agendas affecting their "memories" of the event (speaking in general terms). Even the criminal complaint won't have all of the information in it. The purpose of the complaint is to simply establish probable cause for an arrest, nothing else. It is very common for a five page report to be reduced to one paragraph for a criminal complaint. I always like to see the good and the bad in arrest affidavits, as my career progressed I came to understand that most stories have two or three sides, and some folks act out of fear and confusion. While sometimes a person's acts or omissions constitute a crime it isn't always as cut and dry as the affidavit. Anyway, we shall see when ALL the facts come to light. Your post history betrays you, Concho.
I just turned it on . I was looking bird dogs in the butt this morning.
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: LoneStarSon]
#8005654
10/11/20 10:59 AM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 12,370
RedRanger
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Why isn't the cop locked up in Hunt county jail?
Why is he in Collin county? Probably for his own protection. He was a jailer there for a while. Ok, makes sense now So the other Fort Worth cop who shot the lady thru her window still doesn't have a court date and it's been over a year now, they are saying due to COVID. It looks like this wolfe city dude won't make bail, will he spend the next year in collin county jail waiting trail? The Fort Worth cop bail was only $200K, while the wolfe city guy is 1 million. I think you have to get like 10% to make bail.
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: Duck_Hunter]
#8005761
10/11/20 01:53 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 26,160
Concho
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Remember in school when you walk behind someone and kick their foot to the side so it would catch their own foot and they’d trip and everybody would laugh? Maybe that’s all that was needed We won’t know till the facts come outThis is 100% accurate. The information surrounding most of these incidents that comes out early is typically from eye witnesses, many of whom have their own agendas affecting their "memories" of the event (speaking in general terms). Even the criminal complaint won't have all of the information in it. The purpose of the complaint is to simply establish probable cause for an arrest, nothing else. It is very common for a five page report to be reduced to one paragraph for a criminal complaint. I always like to see the good and the bad in arrest affidavits, as my career progressed I came to understand that most stories have two or three sides, and some folks act out of fear and confusion. While sometimes a person's acts or omissions constitute a crime it isn't always as cut and dry as the affidavit. Anyway, we shall see when ALL the facts come to light. Your post history betrays you, Concho. Show me a time when I didn't say "Wait for the facts."
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: RedRanger]
#8006009
10/11/20 06:39 PM
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 5,119
GUTIT
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[quote=RedRanger]Why isn't the cop locked up in Hunt county jail?
Why is he in Collin county? Probably for his own protection. He was a jailer there for a while. Ok, makes sense now So the other Fort Worth cop who shot the lady thru her window still doesn't have a court date and it's been over a year now, they are saying due to COVID. It looks like this wolfe city dude won't make bail, will he spend the next year in collin county jail waiting trail? The Fort Worth cop bail was only $200K, while the wolfe city guy is 1 million. I think you have to get like 10% to make bail. [/quote My son did his transfer and booked him in. Read every piece of information on the case available as required. There is a lot more than what the armchair quarterbacks are saying and that’s all I can say about it. Prayers for the family of Johnathan (who I have actually met), and this young officer. My son is not much older than him. As our resident LEO have stated, until you wear the badge and are actually in these situations, you have no clue what it’s like. Anyone one of them including my son can face a same situation any given day. Stay safe
Stronghold Construction Group Commercial and Residential Project Management Managing all your construction needs Kent@StrongholdConstructionGroupDOTcom
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: GUTIT]
#8006109
10/11/20 08:34 PM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 12,370
RedRanger
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[quote=RedRanger]Why isn't the cop locked up in Hunt county jail?
Why is he in Collin county? Probably for his own protection. He was a jailer there for a while. Ok, makes sense now So the other Fort Worth cop who shot the lady thru her window still doesn't have a court date and it's been over a year now, they are saying due to COVID. It looks like this wolfe city dude won't make bail, will he spend the next year in collin county jail waiting trail? The Fort Worth cop bail was only $200K, while the wolfe city guy is 1 million. I think you have to get like 10% to make bail. [/quote My son did his transfer and booked him in. Read every piece of information on the case available as required. There is a lot more than what the armchair quarterbacks are saying and that’s all I can say about it. Prayers for the family of Johnathan (who I have actually met), and this young officer. My son is not much older than him. As our resident LEO have stated, until you wear the badge and are actually in these situations, you have no clue what it’s like. Anyone one of them including my son can face a same situation any given day. Stay safe My only question is why was he in Collin County Jail vs Hunt County where Wolfe City is. I see he was fired on Thursday and Texas Ranger's have recommended murder charges, and he is has a 1 million dollar bail speaks volumes. I will let the criminal justice system do their job.
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: RedRanger]
#8006141
10/11/20 08:56 PM
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 5,119
GUTIT
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He was a previous Hunt County Jailer and has inside information of how the jail operates and also many previous fellow employees. In the interest of safety for the public, himself, and to keep everything on a “level playing field”, they decision was made to transfer him to a “neutral” jail. Collin County was chosen as the best option.
Stronghold Construction Group Commercial and Residential Project Management Managing all your construction needs Kent@StrongholdConstructionGroupDOTcom
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Re: Any wolfe city folks on the forum?
[Re: ducknbass]
#8006148
10/11/20 08:59 PM
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 23,613
Payne
Cat Herder
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I think it's because he was a jailer at the Wolfe City/Hunt co jail, something about he knows the procedures at the jail. That's what I remember from an article I read a while back.
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