Et Tu maximus_flavius?

Ouch

We had one we could not find due to darkness. Was shot with rifle but not gut shot, found it early next morning after a 20 degree night. The meat was good thankfully.

Personally, I wasn't trying to pick on archery, it was just the most recent one I saw. I also watched one further back where they shot a bull elk 5 times with a large magnum and acted like it was a great feat of hunting/shooting.

I've also seen a couple of shows recently where the guys went home empty-handed rather than take a bad shot. I commend those guys.

The best videoed hunting ive seen in 20 years came off of youtube.

I have a love hate with shows. They can be the best and worst promoter of our heritage and traditions.

One thing I think we ignore or failed to mention is true wounding death rate of gun vs bow. Neither are ideal situations but archery does have its advantages on non-lethal bad shots. With that said I do commend those that can admit they need to back out to have any chance of finding an animal. The no blood no hit ideology is terrible

I love to archery hunt elk but it’s mainly because I only want to hunt bugling bulls. Elk probably has the largest non lethal wound rate.

Regardless more weapon seasons based on a sustainability model is more opportunity outside pursuing and participating in our heritage

Pull the arrow? This isn’t dances with wolves where the arrow sticks in maybe 6” most arrows fired from modern bows zip right on thru a deer

Every single bow hunter I know practices more with their bow than with their rifle. The head start is just a technicality as most bowhunt all year long ( not to mention MLD rifle season starts the same time as archery season ) and not just during October. This time of year I’m shooting at least 25-40 arrows a day, as do most bow hunters I know. How many rifle hunters do you know that shoot 25-40 rounds a day?

I don’t know what redneck arrow slingers you have in your neck of the woods but if you want to take a group of guys down at the archery shop and guys down at the local shooting range a week before deer season and compare skills and ethics, the archery guys win hands down.

I’ve had to listen to that presumptive mess your spewing my entire life and when pressed, no one could ever come up with an example of what turned them off about bowhunting, it was just assumptions and preconceived notions

What turns me off about bow hunting is seeing deer on camera with arrows sticking in their haunches that the neighbors put there.

Yeah we bowhunters get it. If your not sitting in a big box with a heater and a cooler of beer your not a real hunter.

In Gillespie county I had a young man neighbor once tell me he's a bow hunter "'Cause using a rifle just wasn't enough of a challenge." Apparently, it had nothing to do with him liking to climb the fence and poach on his neighbors' properties.

If the first shot when practicing is not exactly where you want then the other 24-39 are a waste of time for me. I am shooting 3-9 shots per day depending on what my first arrow does. I am concentrating on making that first shot count since I am only going to get one chance in the field. If my first shot is good I will shoot 2-8 more at various ranges, concentrating on every shot at that range. If my first shot is not good then I may stop at one or shoot 3 shoot max that day. This is what works for me.
For me I think archery hunters will wait for the shot they like, where as a rifle hunter will take the shot that is given to them. I hunt with a bow, crossbow, muzzle loader or rifle every season. After the shot, I am watching and listening to what the deer is doing and which direction is heading when it leaves. Most TV guys are promoting themselves and their sponsors to the camera/viewers. It is more about the kill than the shot placement to them. I have seen some shots taken on video that were poor to say the least and the aired on the shows. Nothing was said until the recovery about how poor the shot was either. You can tell if they are showing marginal to bad shots on their shows that they are trying to fill in the 13 shows they need for that season. The better shows just do not show those hunts on the air even though they may have happened. Many times you can tell by how much rigor is in the dead animal as to how long it was till it was recovered. Lot of times they are hoping you did not see the bad shot then raving about the current broad head they are shooting at the time. It makes up for their "marginal" shot placement.

I completely agree with most everything being said on this thread and to be completely honest I quit watching hunting shows years ago because of crap like this along with a lot of them killing immature deer just to get it on tape and sell a show.

One thing I will say is that a bow is every bit as deadly as a rifle when the broadhead is put where it is supposed to go. The bow hunter simply has to be much, much closer than a rifle hunter with a 300 win mag. It is simply all about ethics and knowing your ability and equipment, either with a bow or with a gun.

Another thing I will say is if an animal is shot through the gut, especially with a bow, then don't leave the damn deer out there all night to suffer, die, and go to waste. Call a deer dog guy and get that deer found. Good deer dogs will find EVERY deer shot through guts EVERY time. Once they have that 'gut smell' in their nose they are not losing that scent!

There are plenty of good guys available with great dogs that charge reasonable fees to find the animals, especially in S Texas such as Roy Hindes, Robbie Hurt, Kevin Dubose, and several others.

Seems every year on opening morning, I always hear that hunter in the distance that rips off 5 rounds in 10-20 seconds....clearly he's "practiced and ethical".....

Can't tell you how many deer I've seen while hunting with broken front or hind legs, giant holes in their guts and yes, arrows/bolts sticking out of their buts.

The inability to accurately shoot your weapon is not just a "bow hunter" thing...

I do the same may have gotten it from one of your recommendations. I dont sit at home and pour shot after shot after shot as i dont think it helps. I try to focus on everything im doing and make especially the first shot be dead on, if it isnt ill shoot enough to figure out what i did wrong and quit for the day.

I picked up a crossbow this year, nothing like a verticle bow. had it sighted in with less than 5 arrows on a newly mounted scope. Passed it around and myself my wife my mom and dad all stuck one in the bullseye at 35 yards first shot.

This. Some of the places I bow hunted back in Arkansas, you were in a race with the coyotes. If you didn’t find your deer within 30 minutes to an hour, the back end would be gone. Saw it on several occasions (fortunately none were mine).

I don’t believe any group of hunters can claim the moral high ground. There are bad apples in every bunch. I’ve seen groups of rifle hunters running dogs (when it was legal) empty 4-5 semi autos at running deer. One guy I knew would brag about hitting deer with the last shot of his thirty round mag. He didn’t care where he hit it, just wanted to slow it down for another shot. Wasn’t illegal, so what do you do?? BTW, that was the last conversation I had with the thirty-round guy. I cut all ties with him after that.

If the first shot isn’t on the money then every shot after that is a waste.

Volume shooting helps condition your “memory” to be instinctive when the moment of truth comes.

It’s more for form and strength conditioning rather than accuracy.

A week prior to season I just walk out and shoot a single arrow. Do this several times a day

I agree with you 100%

Everyone makes a bad shot now and then. Dad once told me of an Old Feller that Gut shot deer; said you can get closer and shoot them where you want afterwards. All in all, if you made a bad shot...don't try and make it better than it was. I have passed up several Larger bucks because they didn't present a ethical shot.

So he was accurate enough to hit the guts but not accurate enough to hit the heart/lungs.....


Everyone makes bad shots. I’ve made them. I agree on a lot of shows they make them more often than people would like and then try and pass it off like it was a good hit.

The only shows I watch, if they make a bad shot, they say they made a bad shot.

If your shooting that day is poor or your form is poor then IMO it is a waste of time to condition your shooting habits from that day IMO. Volume shooting with poor form can create poor memory IMO. I would rather quit for that day before I wear myself out shooting to much. In late spring till mid summer I shoot one to two time per week. When I do shoot I take 3 shots everyday at 20 yards. I do that from turkey season till about July 1st and then start to shoot daily. Then I start to move out to 30 and 40 yards. Still only shoot 3 shots at each range. If my shooting is not what I like at 20 yards, I generally stop that day and wait till the next day. I will say that 90% of the time my first shot 20 yards is where I was aiming or dang close to it so that is why I limit to 3 great shots per distance that day. If my shooting form is a bit different I can tell immediately on my shot or shot group. Like you I am about form and repetition on my shots. If it is bad that day then I don't want try to shoot myself back to the correct way. I just stop and then start over the next day. I am not the best shot anymore and pick my shot ranges based off of that. When hunting I try to be under 20 yards on my shots and learned to read the animals posture as to how/where to aim. That is what has worked for me and it still does. Others have different routines and are much better at archery than I am also. But I stick with what works for me and gives me the most confidence.

Saw a similar shot on a black faced impala. Bow hunter shot him almost walking straight away. I believe it was Tom Miranda in Namibia, but that could be incorrect. They recovered the animal the same day only a short time later; however, I would not shoot an animal in the a$$.

ha ... I had a monster (well, for Llano county circa late '70s, I was in my teens) 10 point that a number of us had seen but could never get a clean shot at him. He even showed up in camp one day to drink out of the water trough next to our school bus converted to RV and it was a mad scramble by 3 grown men and me to grab a gun and get out the door first (he ran off BTW). One day my dad and I were driving back to our stands and we see him and another smaller mature 8 point running a doe ... it was the doe, the 10 point and the 8 point in that order. I stepped out of the truck, knowing where they would pop out into a clearing, leveled off my gun, the doe pops out hauling it, rifle off safety since I knew I would only have a split second to shoot, I see antlers pop out thru the scope and the only shot I had was the white flag running straight away, BLAM, and he rolled, then the 10 point popped out continuing after the doe ... Dang it, I shot the 8 point. My dad laughed at me since that was my last buck tag. Upon inspection, the bullet hit just above the bung hole, passed all the way thru above the guts and demolished the liver, lungs and heart, lodging in front of the shoulder between meat and skin. I just knew I was fixing to have a mess to field dress, but nope, absolutely nothing busted and no wasted meat. My dad told me I was the luckiest hunter he ever saw with that shot. BTW, no one ever killed that big 10 point while we were on that lease, nor the surrounding leases that we know of.

That same lease we had a new guy (friend of one of the other lease member) that was fresh out of the Army, back from Vietnam, shooting a mini 14 ranch rifle with scope. There is not telling how many deer that guy shot in the guts. We got to joking with him and nicknamed him Ole Gutshot, he didn't care much for it but we said prove us wrong and we will drop it. The next 3 years he kept his handle ...

but I agree, now that I am older and hopefully wiser, you only take a clean ethical shot or don't squeeze the trigger (except hogs).

Pmk,

What you just described is commonly known as a “Texas heart shot” and isn’t really an unethical shot. As you probably discovered it resulted in a very dead deer.

You put a bullet or arrow up the poop chute it will (in most cases ) reach lungs/heart and the animal will die. With a rifle the base of the tail shot is also very effective in anchoring the animal but normally will require a finishing shot as it only breaks the back.

The ol Texas heart shot is great on hogs

Rifle hunting on a deer, it’s not ethical

Bow hunting a deer, is. It only unethical, it should be criminal

Anyone shooting a deer in the [censored] on my place will get run off that day.

Why is it ok on a Hog but not a deer? I don’t see how it can be ethical on one animal but not another?


An up the butt shot isn’t ideal but it’s a legitimate kill shot for those that know anatomy and have pinpoint bullet placement.

I personally would not take that shot with an arrow.


Curious as to how it’s an unethical shot? It’s really no different from taking a shot at a deer facing you, it’s just flipped around.




Before anyone jumps on me, I’m not advocating shooting deer up the butt or at the base of the tail. I’m just stating that it works in knocking them down