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Re: MANAGEMENT BUCKS
[Re: freerange]
#7876199
06/20/20 08:56 PM
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Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 8,425
freerange
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 8,425 |
A freaky horned one from a few years ago. He actually had a couple thin points about like pencils coming outa the base on the left. This was in the earlier years before we kept a real good history on TC and we didnt communicate among hunters like we do now so I dont really know the history on him. Im fairly certain that anything like this is not genetic but some type of injury/dirty shedding. Little girl that killed him was really excited rather you called him a cull or a trophy. ,
At some point in life its time to quit chasing the pot of gold and just enjoy the rainbow. FR Keep your gratitude higher than your expectations. RWH
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Re: MANAGEMENT BUCKS
[Re: freerange]
#7876261
06/20/20 10:30 PM
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Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 6,032
tlk
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 6,032 |
cannot tell from pics but assume he was just not broken off. Injury most likely
You can't fix stupid
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Re: MANAGEMENT BUCKS
[Re: DLALLDER]
#7876635
06/21/20 01:32 PM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 10,988
Texas buckeye
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 10,988 |
FR great buck for a first time deer hunter.
STX, I believe you have shown that ugly deer in the past, if I remember correct. You posted him on an age thread. If that is the same one, knowing having history is the lesson for sure.
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Re: MANAGEMENT BUCKS
[Re: stxranchman]
#7877524
06/22/20 01:41 PM
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Joined: May 2006
Posts: 9,794
ILUVBIGBUCKS
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 9,794 |
. Notice the small notch or tear in his right ear.
guessing he had a tag in that ear at one time? In a couple of the pictures he looked as though he might have been injured as his shoulders look a little strange? There is no doubt there must be something different about him or I'm pretty sure you would have put him in sausage long before he was as old as he was in that last picture. lol
High fence, low fence, no fence, it really doesn't matter as long as you're hunting!
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Re: MANAGEMENT BUCKS
[Re: DLALLDER]
#7877603
06/22/20 03:02 PM
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 12,861
PMK
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 12,861 |
yes, TC really help to give a longer term history on the area deer, and keeping the history from year to year seems to help identify separation, culling, saving, age, etc. Here are a few of the culls we had 3-5 years picture history on, slick on one side every year, and varying small points, these are some of the ones the biologist saw earlier pictures of that said need to go. estimates were youngest was 4.5 and the oldest was 6.5 based on TC and visual history. I will look to see if I can find more pictures of some on the non-G1 but not finding them offhand.
"everyone that lives dies but not everyone who dies lived..."
~PMK~
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Re: MANAGEMENT BUCKS
[Re: tlk]
#7879987
06/24/20 06:18 PM
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Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 8,425
freerange
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 8,425 |
cannot tell from pics but assume he was just not broken off. Injury most likely I didnt even think that it might look like he just broke off his beam, but I can see that now. We saw him up close and especially after the kill. It was obvious it wasnt a broke beam. That good right side had really good mass for our place and a big base. He was the same way on the bad side with a real big pedicle/base area. He had 3 points coming out of that pedicle area kinda like pencils or cigars and he broke two off. I just dont think anyway that genetics would cause that good a rack on one side and then the big base with trash on the other. Messed up pedicle just did not allow normal growth, IMO. Ive got more weird horns I can post but ive been waiting for STx to tell us about that real teeny one he posted.
At some point in life its time to quit chasing the pot of gold and just enjoy the rainbow. FR Keep your gratitude higher than your expectations. RWH
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Re: MANAGEMENT BUCKS
[Re: freerange]
#7880141
06/24/20 09:49 PM
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Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 8,425
freerange
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
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Bucks like this I just call "lopsided". Nothing real freaky about either side but one is just way bigger than the other. Only unusual antler trait would be how his right brow comes off his beam-very low. Hes pushing 150 on one side and 120 at best on the other. Just looks like two totally different deer. This is a few years ago and im showing pics of two different years and hes pretty much the same both years. Never saw him that we know of after the second year but he may of looked way different and we didnt keep as good a track of pics back then. Would of been a real solid deer if he would of matched the good side. He stood up right beside me as I drove by in the one pic(well actually all the pics but he was real close in one.) The first pic is the LAST year and the other 3 are the year before. These 3 are the year before. I dont know at all if the velvet pic is him or not but I think so, and yall can offer opinion on that.
At some point in life its time to quit chasing the pot of gold and just enjoy the rainbow. FR Keep your gratitude higher than your expectations. RWH
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Re: MANAGEMENT BUCKS
[Re: stxranchman]
#7886258
06/30/20 08:51 PM
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 60,296
stxranchman
Obie Juan Kenobi
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Obie Juan Kenobi
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 60,296 |
Are idiots multiplying faster than normal people?
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Re: MANAGEMENT BUCKS
[Re: freerange]
#7886267
06/30/20 08:58 PM
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 60,296
stxranchman
Obie Juan Kenobi
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Obie Juan Kenobi
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 60,296 |
Now that is ugly..... You gonna give us some history? Hes certainly had enough time to do better than that. From that one pic...do you think he was always that ugly? Can tell why he is that way....Genetics? Age? Lack of nutrition? Sick? Injured? Wounded? or Combination of some of them all? Here he is the next summer after the pics above. Notice the small notch or tear in his right ear. I assume you are setting us up for a teaching point which is great. I do not know whats wrong but assume hes seen better racks and better health. Probably a combination of the factors you listed. I assume you mentioned the notched ear for ID purposes and not a hint to his issues(youre not real big on hints.) Just that you can't really make a "management" call off of one year of antler growth on an unknown buck. This buck was probably never going to be anything special but most thought he was over the hill. I knew why he went downhill like he did..he was wounded during late Dec.
Are idiots multiplying faster than normal people?
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Re: MANAGEMENT BUCKS
[Re: freerange]
#7886290
06/30/20 09:14 PM
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 60,296
stxranchman
Obie Juan Kenobi
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Obie Juan Kenobi
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 60,296 |
Bucks like this I just call "lopsided". Nothing real freaky about either side but one is just way bigger than the other. Only unusual antler trait would be how his right brow comes off his beam-very low. Hes pushing 150 on one side and 120 at best on the other. Just looks like two totally different deer. This is a few years ago and im showing pics of two different years and hes pretty much the same both years. Never saw him that we know of after the second year but he may of looked way different and we didnt keep as good a track of pics back then. Would of been a real solid deer if he would of matched the good side. He stood up right beside me as I drove by in the one pic(well actually all the pics but he was real close in one.) The first pic is the LAST year and the other 3 are the year before. These 3 are the year before. I dont know at all if the velvet pic is him or not but I think so, and yall can offer opinion on that. The bucks I have seen that look like this usually had broken an antler out of their skull cap during the rut. That low browtine is probably a 2nd beam that is due to the skull damage. IME bucks like this can go back to looking normal in 2 yrs from the damage. If, if they do not re-damage that side the rut the very next year after the original damage. When I have seen them break it out year after year they never have much more than a mainbeam with a point or two or a mess of points from one base like the first one your posted. I saw this buck the season before when he had that left side broken into the skull. It was bouncing around loosely when he walked or ran. The only thing holding it was the hide around it so he eventually lost it or shed it later that season. The next year he grew this...notice the second little beam or point like yours above. He had really badly damaged skull, so he was not ever going to look normal again.
Are idiots multiplying faster than normal people?
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Re: MANAGEMENT BUCKS
[Re: stxranchman]
#7887172
07/01/20 05:05 PM
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Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 8,425
freerange
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 8,425 |
As usual Stx blows me away with the knowledge he has gained through all his experience. We are very lucky to have him as a contributor and I hope he continues to post. How old do you think he was the year that he looked so crummy which I guess was the next year after the injury?? The information you gave about the results of an entire beam being broken out of the skull cap is very important I think. I always felt the lop side racks were NOT genetic but some type of injury but wasnt sure how likely it would be attributed to that type of breakage. Certainly makes sense and i appreciate the info. I hope everyone is getting the idea that a "freak horn" buck is likely not inferior genetically and lots of thought should be given before killing them based on how they look in just one year.
At some point in life its time to quit chasing the pot of gold and just enjoy the rainbow. FR Keep your gratitude higher than your expectations. RWH
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Re: MANAGEMENT BUCKS
[Re: DLALLDER]
#7887286
07/01/20 07:06 PM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 10,988
Texas buckeye
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 10,988 |
What is amazing to me is these bucks can essentially take a hole of their skull out and still survive, good luck having many humans from this day and era doing that.
One thing to remember, studies have shown that shooting good or bad deer does nothing to dictate future genetics for the herd, if a single “good” buck is taken due to freaky injury related antlers or weak antlers due to sickness or injury, the result will not be deleterious to the herd. Likewise, keeping them around is not likely to make any significant positive trend in the herd for the simple fact they may not be able to successfully breed that year (or in future years). So while the thoughts are good to know about the potential future for some of these bucks, this is another reason to have a good understanding of your herd and history with bucks. If the injured was a great buck one year and had potential to return to greatness, then keep it around, but if it was never bound for glory, then shoot away (or let someone else) if desired.
Shooting and/or not shooting one messed up buck in a native LF population for the most part is not going to affect anything for future seasons other than acting as one less mouth to feed, and sometimes those sick deer eat a lot to help fight disease/injury.
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