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Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this #7749227 02/18/20 06:05 PM
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I briefly scanned an online article from another State that the headline read You can’t hunt your way out of this - poison is the answer or something to that effect.

Been thinking about it today - I’m sensing the poison bills of the future will gain some traction due to the amount of corporate money behind the science and companies involved in the delivery products. I personally feel like we’ve dodged the bullet a couple of times but that we are running short on time and reasonable thinking in the political chairs....

Before I throw out an unproven concept I want to frame it by crediting the human race with many technological achievements , some going back 50-60 years....

* we put humans in space and in a station for years at a time

* we’ve seen target guided missiles and computer assisted targeting of air flight weapons

* we have Bluetooth devices wired to the home that turn lights on/off , play music while we’re away, doorbell cameras that allow you to talk to people when not home

* vehicles that park themselves and drive themselves

So why not , why can’t Texas invest in a pilot program that attacks the feral pig problem like this:

State sponsored targeting and acquisition teams : Aerial drone operators who fly the skies over lands whom the owners have registered with the State to allow for fly overs and access to their properties, via smart key locks, by registered and vetted civilians who take the fly over reports and do the shooting in the same period.

So from the State side: A Drone Operator files a flight plan from the shift and is given 10-15 properties to report on (real time) to a closed broadcast system (which the Game Wardens have access to). And these reports indicate number of hogs viewed and GPS coordinates and times. All this is quickly rolled up into a report that has some limited metrics regarding frequency of sightings, access points, and special messages regarding accessibility via foot or vehicle.

From the civilian hunter side: you must register and be vetted by the State, to access the system and smart locks on gates. Receive a confirmation that the property is available to hunt and check/in check/out with number of hogs engaged and status of hogs. You bear a great deal of liability under such a program to leave it as you found it - pay for damage to crop, equipment, and you should be carrying a State requires legal liability insurance policy of at least 1 million dollars.

From the landowner side : expect surprises , some good some bad but consider the overall effectiveness of the program versus the current and or proposed alternatives . Participation is voluntary and you can open and close your property daily based on if your experiencing hog problems or not or have crops being put in etc etc etc

Anyhow just putting an idea out there before I have to read more articles about how poisoning is the solution ....

Feel free to critique the idea , add to it or say it’s the dumbest idea you’ve ever read -

texas


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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7749244 02/18/20 06:16 PM
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First of all, love the concept. Would be super fun to be part of the "SSET- Super Swine Eradication team"

Would be very difficult once spring greens up until things die way back in the late fall, effectively making this a 6 month program during deer hunting season, unless this was all done via thermal, even then would be difficult in densely forested areas

Would need to have some seriously respectful hunters, and almost have some sort of deterrents/penalties/eliminations for leaving gates open or garbage or other issues land owners will have. That could run into some serious he said/she said type drama.

Some serious outlay of capital by the state, whereas poison has virtually no capital outlay from the state. That's a big problem in my mind.

I am sure there's more...

But that would be a blast!

Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7749251 02/18/20 06:21 PM
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I am pretty sure there would be FAA requirements concerning licensing of drone operators, so that would put a hitch it the gitalong of this idea, but it would be interesting …


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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7749261 02/18/20 06:29 PM
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I think, when all is said and done, sterilization or some form of birth control is the only logical solution to this problem. I could be wrong but it did lead to the eradication of the screw worm almost 60 years ago. The advances in technology since then could surely come up with a practical solution.


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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7749288 02/18/20 06:57 PM
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"You bear a great deal of liability under such a program to leave it as you found it - pay for damage to crop, equipment, and you should be carrying a State requires legal liability insurance policy of at least 1 million dollars."

Just a guess, but I would say very few hunters would sign up with liabilities and responsibilities like that.


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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7749380 02/18/20 08:07 PM
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In my experience....lots of property owners want to bitch about hogs....few want you really doing something about it. They might actually want it done but litigation, letting unknown folks on their land, risk to livestock, etc might be the real reason they don't let folks help...regardless, they don't get the help.

Hogs is and has become a big business...Outfitters, night vision folks, gun makers, etc.

I'm starting to think very few really want them gone 100%.


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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7749390 02/18/20 08:20 PM
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Rolling Thunder Hog Eradication. Sure, why not?


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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7749470 02/18/20 09:29 PM
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I own a good amount of property and I let several people I know and trust hunt and trap on my places free of charge.
So I'm not one of those people.


Character is what you do when nobody's looking.
Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7749562 02/18/20 10:40 PM
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Lots of issues with this plan...liability and such...and the state will never allow the use of weaponized drones. I have been in the middle of this since early 2016 with the state and others. Warfarin was the first "poison" that was pushed. understand, this came from a small company not some huge entity. It was a husband and wife owned company. The lab that did the testing was owned by the same couple but they swapped roles in the ownership. No way the lab was going to say the product didn't work. Their studies had huge holes in it. We were able to get that stopped until at least the next legislative session. Meantime, TPWD has been studying Sodium Nitrite for around 12 years. In their initial field trials in North Texas they killed over 200 birds and had to stop. The delivery system has been the issue. They are back at it currently. If they can solve the delivery system issue, Sodium Nitrite is not a bad choice. Sterilization would be a good choice also, but that hasn't risen to the top...yet.

Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7749685 02/19/20 12:32 AM
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The drone part sounds good, but would be tough to implement with current laws, particularly since it’s the FAA and not the State of Texas. Everyone would need to be FAA Part 107 certified, all operations today-the drone operator-observer have to have line of sight with the drone at all times. Need a permit to observe game with one and to fly at night, requires a waiver from the FAA by location and conditions that’s a lot more than just a checkbox. My drone/thermal camera is $10k, who’s going to fund that and insurance for unplanned flight events?

I think Judd is correct in his assessment. I would think there’s more individuals trying to make money with hogs vs those losing money.

I think the poison thing will continue to be looked at, but it’s not like they’re going to spray it from a plane while we sleep. If you go back to the ‘Texas is mostly private land”, only those who want it, will use it, if it comes to fruition.

I’ll join the team, do I get a patch if I do?

Charlie


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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Judd] #7749727 02/19/20 01:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Judd
In my experience....lots of property owners want to bitch about hogs....few want you really doing something about it. They might actually want it done but litigation, letting unknown folks on their land, risk to livestock, etc might be the real reason they don't let folks help...regardless, they don't get the help.

Hogs is and has become a big business...Outfitters, night vision folks, gun makers, etc.

I'm starting to think very few really want them gone 100%.


All about the Big Buck$...
Got hooked on the hog hunts in the 80's... First lease on was for the 24-7-365 hog hunting on a 1,100 acre lease. We didnt hunt the hugs at night during deer season.
Later a WMA opened up just down the road... Hunted
several of the other WMA's deer & hog hunts with son.

confused2 done my part in letting others know of places ta hog hunt...
Tisn't a execative hunt, gotta put in the miles, finding hogs always been the easy part.
The work begins getting em out...
Back straps, quarters, no gutting, need get on ice, warmer the weather, faster get on ice.
Back pack with liner worked best for me...
cheers very interesting thread...
Keep your head held high & your powder dry...
This is a hunting forum, lots of people willing ta help.
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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7749789 02/19/20 02:10 AM
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Judd you not supposed to say that out loud. You nailed it.

Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7750130 02/19/20 01:52 PM
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Too man landowners don't want them gone or even trapped. It provides them a source of income after deer season. It's hard enough to get permission to trap, let alone letting a bunch of yahoo's with guns show up and hunt a place.


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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: CharlieCTx] #7750187 02/19/20 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by CharlieCTx
The drone part sounds good, but would be tough to implement with current laws, particularly since it’s the FAA and not the State of Texas.


Though some federal rules apply, the use of of drones is controlled moreso by the TPWD and its laws. https://tpwd.texas.gov/business/permits/land/wildlife_management/aerial_wl_management/

Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: PigMoney] #7750245 02/19/20 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by PigMoney
Too man landowners don't want them gone or even trapped. It provides them a source of income after deer season. It's hard enough to get permission to trap, let alone letting a bunch of yahoo's with guns show up and hunt a place.



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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7751215 02/20/20 01:02 PM
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Nope! Never will let another so called "respectful hunter" have access to my place. Some attitudes change real quick when they have to be reminded of activities allowed (even when no one is watching.)


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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7751280 02/20/20 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Pig_Popper
I briefly scanned an online article from another State that the headline read You can’t hunt your way out of this - poison is the answer or something to that effect.

Been thinking about it today - I’m sensing the poison bills of the future will gain some traction due to the amount of corporate money behind the science and companies involved in the delivery products. I personally feel like we’ve dodged the bullet a couple of times but that we are running short on time and reasonable thinking in the political chairs....

Before I throw out an unproven concept I want to frame it by crediting the human race with many technological achievements , some going back 50-60 years....

* we put humans in space and in a station for years at a time

* we’ve seen target guided missiles and computer assisted targeting of air flight weapons

* we have Bluetooth devices wired to the home that turn lights on/off , play music while we’re away, doorbell cameras that allow you to talk to people when not home

* vehicles that park themselves and drive themselves

So why not , why can’t Texas invest in a pilot program that attacks the feral pig problem like this:

State sponsored targeting and acquisition teams : Aerial drone operators who fly the skies over lands whom the owners have registered with the State to allow for fly overs and access to their properties, via smart key locks, by registered and vetted civilians who take the fly over reports and do the shooting in the same period.

So from the State side: A Drone Operator files a flight plan from the shift and is given 10-15 properties to report on (real time) to a closed broadcast system (which the Game Wardens have access to). And these reports indicate number of hogs viewed and GPS coordinates and times. All this is quickly rolled up into a report that has some limited metrics regarding frequency of sightings, access points, and special messages regarding accessibility via foot or vehicle.

From the civilian hunter side: you must register and be vetted by the State, to access the system and smart locks on gates. Receive a confirmation that the property is available to hunt and check/in check/out with number of hogs engaged and status of hogs. You bear a great deal of liability under such a program to leave it as you found it - pay for damage to crop, equipment, and you should be carrying a State requires legal liability insurance policy of at least 1 million dollars.

From the landowner side : expect surprises , some good some bad but consider the overall effectiveness of the program versus the current and or proposed alternatives . Participation is voluntary and you can open and close your property daily based on if your experiencing hog problems or not or have crops being put in etc etc etc

Anyhow just putting an idea out there before I have to read more articles about how poisoning is the solution ....

Feel free to critique the idea , add to it or say it’s the dumbest idea you’ve ever read -

texas



No, just no.


If someone really wants hogs off their land there are plenty of people willing to use their free time to help a farmer/landowner with their hog "problem." Hell, many are willing to pay to get to go shoot pigs, no reason to take taxpayer dollars when the problem can be alleviated for free or even profit for a landowner. We have enough welfare programs and govt spending as it is.

FYI, any landowners in my area that have a hog problem, I will be glad to help you out and won't even charge you. I can shoot them with a bow, shotgun, or rifle, whatever your preference is. I will even follow all the rules you set, whether someone is watching or not. And if i don't like your rules, i will pass on helping you out, not try to circumvent them.

There are responsible hunters out there, just gotta look for them.

Have a good one and quit trying to spend other people's money :-)

Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7751328 02/20/20 02:23 PM
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I’m not trying to spend other people’s money - I pay taxes too so I get the rub.

The model of helping landowners that you lay out is what we’ve all been striving to do since before many of us were born.

The issue is there are more hogs these days and more lawyers and less ethics swirling about which makes the effectiveness of what used to be the sound approach less viable.

And so as we stall - they’re going to spend our money anyways and do what they want - hence the thread , try to sway it to a non-poison , non-chemical solution that won’t harm the environment of livestock.


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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7751342 02/20/20 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Pig_Popper
I’m not trying to spend other people’s money - I pay taxes too so I get the rub.

The model of helping landowners that you lay out is what we’ve all been striving to do since before many of us were born.

The issue is there are more hogs these days and more lawyers and less ethics swirling about which makes the effectiveness of what used to be the sound approach less viable.

And so as we stall - they’re going to spend our money anyways and do what they want - hence the thread , try to sway it to a non-poison , non-chemical solution that won’t harm the environment of livestock.



While i agree with the no poison/chemical solution to the hog issue, owning land, or anything for that matter is a risk. No one helps me with my roof, termites, etc as a homeowner, so asking the public for help with a "problem" that a landowner has that they can quite literally make money on will never get my support. But instead of taking care of their own issues, many landowners seem to want to complain to the state and have others pay for their problems. I tend to be against welfare, in any of it's forms.

There are a lot of good people out there willing to help with eliminating pigs, and yes there is some risk involved, but when you own something it becomes your responsibility, and not the govts. Least that is my opinion, but it seems many people don't feel that way

Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7751383 02/20/20 03:06 PM
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Or....we could just let people shoot them 24/7/365, thermals, archery, shotguns, rifles with no caliber restrictions, no license necessary, allow trapping, snaring, helicopters, bring people in from out of state. Set up buying stations to encourage hunting and trapping, put a bounty on them in bad counties.....this will surely eliminate the wild hog. Oh yeah, we already do that. Well, let's just keep doing it and have some fun.
A lot of people being fed, lot of buzzards being fed, lot of money being spent. I just can't get behind poisoning, too hard to target them and they adapt and would quit eating poison after the first year for the most part, in my opinion.


Just like Jesus, sometimes you gotta kill some hogs.
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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: pnh] #7751680 02/20/20 07:25 PM
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Originally Posted by pnh
I think, when all is said and done, sterilization or some form of birth control is the only logical solution to this problem. I could be wrong but it did lead to the eradication of the screw worm almost 60 years ago. The advances in technology since then could surely come up with a practical solution.


I agree 100%. We're not going to ever control hogs unless someone figures out how to interrupt the breeding cycle.


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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: TexasKC] #7751794 02/20/20 09:30 PM
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Originally Posted by TexasKC
Originally Posted by pnh
I think, when all is said and done, sterilization or some form of birth control is the only logical solution to this problem. I could be wrong but it did lead to the eradication of the screw worm almost 60 years ago. The advances in technology since then could surely come up with a practical solution.


I agree 100%. We're not going to ever control hogs unless someone figures out how to interrupt the breeding cycle.

Even if they do figure it out. There are too many people who like them too much. I think eradication would only last so long till some bubba turned a few loose on his back 40 and the mess all began again.


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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: TexasKC] #7751835 02/20/20 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by TexasKC
Originally Posted by pnh
I think, when all is said and done, sterilization or some form of birth control is the only logical solution to this problem. I could be wrong but it did lead to the eradication of the screw worm almost 60 years ago. The advances in technology since then could surely come up with a practical solution.


I agree 100%. We're not going to ever control hogs unless someone figures out how to interrupt the breeding cycle.


Yep - feral hogs are simply too prolific to hunt/trap enough to have even a marginal impact on numbers for any lasting time. They breed too quick, and the litter size is too great. Two years ago, a buddy of mine allowed the State of Oklahoma to test a eradication program on one of his sections. Using helicopters, the state killed 300 hogs over two weeks - on 640 acres. And as we can all guess, because budgets only allow the State to do pieces at a time, within a few months, the hogs had moved back in to roughly as many as he had before.

I do not think poison is the answer, but hope some effective means of birth control might be.


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Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Dalroo] #7751851 02/20/20 10:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Dalroo
Originally Posted by TexasKC
Originally Posted by pnh
I think, when all is said and done, sterilization or some form of birth control is the only logical solution to this problem. I could be wrong but it did lead to the eradication of the screw worm almost 60 years ago. The advances in technology since then could surely come up with a practical solution.


I agree 100%. We're not going to ever control hogs unless someone figures out how to interrupt the breeding cycle.


Yep - feral hogs are simply too prolific to hunt/trap enough to have even a marginal impact on numbers for any lasting time. They breed too quick, and the litter size is too great. Two years ago, a buddy of mine allowed the State of Oklahoma to test a eradication program on one of his sections. Using helicopters, the state killed 300 hogs over two weeks - on 640 acres. And as we can all guess, because budgets only allow the State to do pieces at a time, within a few months, the hogs had moved back in to roughly as many as he had before.

I do not think poison is the answer, but hope some effective means of birth control might be.


Your buddy should have let people hunt his place. Even at 50 bucks a pig that comes out to $15,000.

Re: Come on State of Texas Legislature - Lets get serious about this feral hog problem! Poison isn’t the solution ,consider this [Re: Pig_Popper] #7751881 02/20/20 10:50 PM
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Why can't we chemically sterilize pigs???


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