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Mar 25th, 2012
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High Fence Exotic Question #7659567 11/12/19 03:47 PM
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Gonna keep this simple and not discuss many of the specifics.

You and another hunter pay to shoot two exotics for a meat hunt. Basic kill fee, guide fee, and lodging fee required. You book two weeks in advance on short notice. Several hunters are already there when you show up Saturday at noon. They kill their animal Saturday evening and leave Sunday morning. One hunter misses his exotic animal that evening. 200yd shot. Clean miss. Guide doesn't even look for blood. Other hunter never shoots.

Owner requires both hunters pay full fee after hunt. Kill fee, lodge fee, and guide fee. You don't wound or kill any animal.

Am I in the right or wrong to dispute what is owed? And this isn't just an Axis doe. Substantial animal and price.

Last edited by eneat1119; 11/12/19 03:49 PM.
Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: eneat1119] #7659572 11/12/19 03:52 PM
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I'm going to assume there's no contract, because most specifically state 'blood = kill'. Since no blood was found IMO you don't owe the kill fee unless there is specific verbage about shots taken on game. I guess the guide was not with you when you took the shot?

I'm not sure what the part about other hunters matters unless you are arguing that you hunted part of the weekend while they hunted more?

IMO you owe everything but the kill fee but I feel information is missing.


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Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: eneat1119] #7659593 11/12/19 04:11 PM
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I don't see how you can be charged for a kill fee if you never even pulled the trigger. And I don't think the other hunter should owe anything if the guide didn't even look for blood.
Just my 2cents


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Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: eneat1119] #7659597 11/12/19 04:15 PM
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No nothing else is missing. No contract. Guides were with both hunters. Both hunters were in stands 600yds apart overlooking same rightaway. Owner plainly said we had our shot and missed. Not his fault.

We had a great time there up until then. Loved it. This is a first for me to pay for no kill.

Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: eneat1119] #7659605 11/12/19 04:19 PM
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There should be no kill fee if an animal was not wounded and the other hunter did not even shoot at an animal. This is why a guide fee is charged to cover his cost. A lodging fee should also be charged. Post the outfitter on here so others can be warned.

Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: eneat1119] #7659606 11/12/19 04:19 PM
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Originally Posted by eneat1119
No nothing else is missing. No contract. Guides were with both hunters. Both hunters were in stands 600yds apart overlooking same rightaway. Owner plainly said we had our shot and missed. Not his fault.

We had a great time there up until then. Loved it. This is a first for me to pay for no kill.


He has his point but terrible business ideology. You will never be a repeat customer now now will you recommend him.

With out a sign kill fee contract you don’t have much to stand on. If it says kill fee I would dispute it


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Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: eneat1119] #7659608 11/12/19 04:21 PM
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Kill fee is a kill fee and should be just that. No blood and no kill. They have these other fees which are basically trespass fees and those are incurred when you enter the gate.

I will say I hit a Nilgai cow once, but could not find blood. We all knew I had hit it and I was prepared to pay the cost. Became a moot point as we pressed on, found the wounded animal and dispatched it.

Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: eneat1119] #7659609 11/12/19 04:22 PM
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Originally Posted by eneat1119
Basic kill fee, guide fee, and lodging fee required.


OP said the kill fee is required. Sounds to me like the deck is stacked in favor of the operator in the event of a miss/no shot hunt.

Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: eneat1119] #7659627 11/12/19 04:31 PM
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I didn't want to be more specific but I will.

This hunt was my dad's idea. He is getting knee replacement surgery in December and wanted a nice cow elk to last till his recovery. I took my 13yr old son wanting him to shoot one and my 8yr old to watch. Owner gave us a discount on the hunt for the elk ($1200 to $1000 each) and lowered the lodging fee for both my boys from $150/night to $50. This is all over the phone with my dad.

I discussed having other hunters already there because the owner's reasoning for making us pay full price was he could've had other deer hunters there. I told him I doubted it since we booked so late. We were an add-on to an already existing hunting party. He said he did his job and put us on an elk and it wasn't his fault my son missed. Which he missed 3 times. How? I do not know as he never misses. My guide and the owner were witness to the shots and both concluded he had missed. My dad looked for blood about 30 seconds in the dark before the owner picked us up. We never thoroughly looked for blood or the animal. It ran into a heavy thicket that was 25 yards away from being shot.

Anyhow I told the owner I would gladly pay the lodging and guide fees but wouldn't pay the kill fee. He got upset and went on a rant. Bad thing is my dad had already paid $1200 on arrival. I ended up paying $600 to the owner and $200 in tips to the guides which were awesome to me and my boys.

Just a crappy deal. Theres nothing illegal to what he did but it just aint right IMO.

Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: HuntnFly67] #7659630 11/12/19 04:33 PM
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Originally Posted by HuntnFly67
Originally Posted by eneat1119
Basic kill fee, guide fee, and lodging fee required.


OP said the kill fee is required. Sounds to me like the deck is stacked in favor of the operator in the event of a miss/no shot hunt.


I'm going off what the owner said would be the fee to kill one. Terrible communication on his part possibly and being my dad's first time hunting high fence he didn't ask.

Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: eneat1119] #7659658 11/12/19 05:01 PM
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I think this is a lesson for both sides, honestly. I don't blame the owner for charging a kill fee after putting you on game and three shots. He did everything that was required and you failed him. However, the lack of a contract that specifically states what a 'kill' fee covers is where he failed you. If it's in writing there much less room for interpretation.


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Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: eneat1119] #7659793 11/12/19 07:15 PM
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Originally Posted by eneat1119
Gonna keep this simple and not discuss many of the specifics.

You and another hunter pay to shoot two exotics for a meat hunt. Basic kill fee, guide fee, and lodging fee required. You book two weeks in advance on short notice. Several hunters are already there when you show up Saturday at noon. They kill their animal Saturday evening and leave Sunday morning. One hunter misses his exotic animal that evening. 200yd shot. Clean miss. Guide doesn't even look for blood. Other hunter never shoots.

Owner requires both hunters pay full fee after hunt. Kill fee, lodge fee, and guide fee. You don't wound or kill any animal.

Am I in the right or wrong to dispute what is owed? And this isn't just an Axis doe. Substantial animal and price.

scratch
Kill fee - nothing killed owner not out anything...
Guide fee - Guide doesnt even look for blood... Alway's look for blood...
Lodge fee - If ya stayed ya stayed

bang chances are the owner reading this thread...
They have side of story also...
Did lease thing, every one was, Friend told me about his experieince with day hunt confused2 didnt impress me..
Leases got too expenive, Twas Truely a Blessing when a WMA opened up just down the road...
2cents Tis your money, dont let others influance how ya spend it...
Best wish's...
keep your head held high & your powder dry...
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Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: eneat1119] #7659797 11/12/19 07:18 PM
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Was it someone advertising on here?


The Astro’s are cheating scum bags!
Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: QuitShootinYoungBucks] #7659811 11/12/19 07:34 PM
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Originally Posted by QuitShootinYoungBucks
I think this is a lesson for both sides, honestly. I don't blame the owner for charging a kill fee after putting you on game and three shots. He did everything that was required and you failed him. However, the lack of a contract that specifically states what a 'kill' fee covers is where he failed you. If it's in writing there much less room for interpretation.


Hard to argue with that.


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Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: Sneaky] #7659828 11/12/19 07:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Sneaky
Originally Posted by QuitShootinYoungBucks
I think this is a lesson for both sides, honestly. I don't blame the owner for charging a kill fee after putting you on game and three shots. He did everything that was required and you failed him. However, the lack of a contract that specifically states what a 'kill' fee covers is where he failed you. If it's in writing there much less room for interpretation.


Hard to argue with that.


True, however, them not even looking for blood is odd and that would give me heartburn about being charged a "kill fee" As mentioned, nothing laid out in writing is what makes this tough.


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Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: eneat1119] #7659898 11/12/19 08:48 PM
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The guide not looking for blood makes me feel pretty comfortable he was certain there was no bullet hole in the animal. The reverse would not be thinkable.

Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: eneat1119] #7659906 11/12/19 08:52 PM
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Sounds like a bad deal for the hunter that never took a shot. Hopefully no one else on here is hunting with this outfit since you are protecting their identity.

Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: eneat1119] #7659907 11/12/19 08:52 PM
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Originally Posted by eneat1119
Gonna keep this simple and not discuss many of the specifics.

You and another hunter pay to shoot two exotics for a meat hunt. Basic kill fee, guide fee, and lodging fee required. You book two weeks in advance on short notice. Several hunters are already there when you show up Saturday at noon. They kill their animal Saturday evening and leave Sunday morning. One hunter misses his exotic animal that evening. 200yd shot. Clean miss. Guide doesn't even look for blood. Other hunter never shoots.

Owner requires both hunters pay full fee after hunt. Kill fee, lodge fee, and guide fee. You don't wound or kill any animal.

Am I in the right or wrong to dispute what is owed? And this isn't just an Axis doe. Substantial animal and price.


It sounds like maybe Dad and the guy had a misunderstanding/weren't clear about the specifics. The guide should have specified if the kill fee was "required" as in mandatory or if it was associated with a kill or blood. Not very clear from what I can tell.


Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: procraft05] #7659935 11/12/19 09:19 PM
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Originally Posted by procraft05
Was it someone advertising on here?




No. Not sure how dad found them. They've never been mentioned on here.

Like I said place was great and I loved it right up until that point where money was discussed. Poor communication on both ends and both at fault.

IMO tho "no kill or blood on ground" equals no kill fee. Thats what I was unhappy about. My son felt like doodoo afterwards and that didn't help lol

Last edited by eneat1119; 11/12/19 09:19 PM.
Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: TX_LT230FH] #7659940 11/12/19 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by TX_LT230FH


It sounds like maybe Dad and the guy had a misunderstanding/weren't clear about the specifics.


Wouldn't be the first time and without a doubt not the last! laugh

Re: High Fence Exotic Question [Re: eneat1119] #7662233 11/14/19 11:45 PM
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All of the places I have hunted in the past have required payment for the full hunt up front. At the conclusion of the hunt, if blood has been drawn, the full payment remains with the ranch owner. If a shot opportunity has been presented and either a clean miss or a pass (looking for better animal, etc.) has occurred then usually that "trophy fee" is applied to a future hunt, the guide fee and lodging fee are "paid". If no shot opportunity has presented itself, then the hunter is given the option of applying the "trophy fee" to a future hunt or having it refunded. Also in that case, some of the guide fee may be refunded as well. No lodging refund if you stayed the whole time.
If a ranch doesn't have those basic rules laid out, and they don't include those rules in writing as part of your "contract" (which usually includes the waiver that they all have you sign), then I look for a different ranch.


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