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Mar 25th, 2012
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A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows #7656331 11/08/19 08:17 PM
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I understand the need for... and fully support the effort behind A/R (Antler Restriction) counties. It has made a marked difference here in Deep East Texas. However, it seems more and more we are seeing bucks with a tendency to grow tall, narrow antlers. They will have good tine length, pretty good main beam length and can put on mass with time...but won't make the minimum A/R spread requirement of 13" inside. Or if they do, they won't until they are 4.5-5.5 yrs. old.

I have game cam pics and video of 3 different 8 points and one 10 point that won't make the minimum. Partly because they are young 2.5-3.5 but if not for the inside spread restriction.... these would make great bucks for kids or beginners. I won't post them all, but one example below.

We have bucks with all antler shapes/types here...no question about that. But there seems to be an increase in taller, narrow 'racks' than what I've seen in the past and I keep pretty good photographic records from one year to the next.

If you have anything similar please post your pics and share your thoughts and observations.

Attached Files AR spread2.jpgAR spread1.jpg

Spartans ask not...how many, but where!
Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656349 11/08/19 08:35 PM
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Not huge but I have three years of pics of this 11 point. He loves to hang out at feeders. Have had him at 15 yards several times.

Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656361 11/08/19 08:53 PM
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I thought a few years of Antler Restrictions was going to cure all of this, and there would be plenty of nice deer in every age range? All they need are a few years.... what has it been now, 15?

There should be tons of 4.5-7.5 year old bucks out there now. grin bolt

Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: sig226fan (Rguns.com)] #7656367 11/08/19 08:59 PM
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Originally Posted by sig226fan (Rguns.com)
I thought a few years of Antler Restrictions was going to cure all of this, and there would be plenty of nice deer in every age range? All they need are a few years.... what has it been now, 15?

There should be tons of 4.5-7.5 year old bucks out there now. grin bolt

There would be if all hunters followed the rules. I was sitting in a small cafe Sunday and a man on his cell phone at the next table said," I got a buck today." No, it was just a little bit shy, But
the one Bill shot was nowhere close to making it." Of course, I was in East Texas.


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Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: sig226fan (Rguns.com)] #7656419 11/08/19 09:52 PM
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Originally Posted by sig226fan (Rguns.com)
I thought a few years of Antler Restrictions was going to cure all of this, and there would be plenty of nice deer in every age range? All they need are a few years.... what has it been now, 15?

There should be tons of 4.5-7.5 year old bucks out there now. grin bolt


That I know of, hunters have taken at least 10 deer so far this year in Mills County over 140, including several over 150 and a 165. 20 years ago there would have been 2-3 for an entire season and many years there wasn't a single deer that broke 140.


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Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: QuitShootinYoungBucks] #7656432 11/08/19 10:07 PM
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Originally Posted by QuitShootinYoungBucks
Originally Posted by sig226fan (Rguns.com)
I thought a few years of Antler Restrictions was going to cure all of this, and there would be plenty of nice deer in every age range? All they need are a few years.... what has it been now, 15?

There should be tons of 4.5-7.5 year old bucks out there now. grin bolt


That I know of, hunters have taken at least 10 deer so far this year in Mills County over 140, including several over 150 and a 165. 20 years ago there would have been 2-3 for an entire season and many years there wasn't a single deer that broke 140.


Exactly right. We used to own 800 acres in Goldthwaite (Mills County) back then and I did a lot of hunting on that property. A 110-120 class deer back then was considered pretty good. Lots of deer, but not good quality. Turkey out the Wazoo...though.


Spartans ask not...how many, but where!
Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656453 11/08/19 10:26 PM
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If 99% of them make 13" by 7.5 years old, then the antler restrictions are doing EXACTLY what they were designed to do
In the 2 years we have had them for muleys up here, I have seen a very positive difference. I personally wish the entire state had antler restrictions for WT AND mule deer!

Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656460 11/08/19 10:30 PM
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Narrow 10 point (2 of his points don't show in the first pic because of the angle). Will probably get wide enough eventually...still a young deer.

But I feel as if I am seeing more bucks through the years with antlers that are going UP and not so much out????

Attached Files Narrow 10 pt_b.jpgNarrow 10 pt_a.jpg

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Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: Chuckw] #7656461 11/08/19 10:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Chuckw

In the 2 years we have had them for muleys up here, I have seen a very positive difference. I personally wish the entire state had antler restrictions for WT AND mule deer!



I wouldn’t go that far, as a lot of areas don’t need them.

But in high pressure areas, they certainly do help grow bigger bucks

Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656463 11/08/19 10:33 PM
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People always post up the 10% of mature deer that don’t make AR’s and forget about the 90% that were harvested and able to make it to maturity because of them

Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: txtrophy85] #7656464 11/08/19 10:34 PM
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Originally Posted by txtrophy85
Originally Posted by Chuckw

In the 2 years we have had them for muleys up here, I have seen a very positive difference. I personally wish the entire state had antler restrictions for WT AND mule deer!



I wouldn’t go that far, as a lot of areas don’t need them.

But in high pressure areas, they certainly do help grow bigger bucks

Agree I don't want them either!


It's hell eatin em live
Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656467 11/08/19 10:36 PM
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Anyone have any ear tip spread data for east texas/northeast texas bucks? I'd bet if those top two bucks are mature and have a 16 or so inch ear tip length they make 13 inches. I think part of it is just being willing to take the risk.


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Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656479 11/08/19 11:06 PM
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Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656492 11/08/19 11:24 PM
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I have no problem with ARs. Just wish some of the game wardens would show a little leniency on fully mature bucks that are close. I shot a post mature eight point five years ago that never gave me a straight on view. When I walked up on him my heart skipped a beat for a minute when I saw how close to 13" he was. Turned out to be 13 1/2" spread. But I believe the spirit of the law is not to keep us from shooting 8 year old deer.

Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: txtrophy85] #7656497 11/08/19 11:30 PM
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Originally Posted by txtrophy85
People always post up the 10% of mature deer that don’t make AR’s and forget about the 90% that were harvested and able to make it to maturity because of them


^^^^^

Not this 'people'. wink

I appreciate what A/R has done over the years in the area I hunt. I would submit that compliance in East Texas is likely much less than in other areas...I am sad to say. Just the same...the results of A/R speak for themselves. We've always had pretty good genetics here. The issue in the past has been Age Structure. Too many bucks being taken before maturity.

I might argue that in certain locales (10%) is the number of bucks (3.5 yrs or older) with narrow spreads, but of course I have no way to prove that. Only anecdotal evidence of increased sightings where I hunt.

I am 100% for A/R and with normal genetic propensities...the vast majority of bucks WILL be greater than 13" inside at 3.5 or older. Too...you have to be careful not to mistake a young deer (with good genetics, good antlers) for something that clearly will never get better.

I do wonder however (IF compliance were good)....over a long period of time would we be favoring tall, narrow racked bucks over wider ones enough to make a noticeable difference in the herds?

Last edited by flintknapper; 11/08/19 11:48 PM.

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Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656509 11/08/19 11:52 PM
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I have a few Bucks that will probably not meet AR's. I am not in an AR county What I am thinking since what I do is I normally charge $100 per point for any Buck. But what I am thinking about doing is if a Buck is less than 13 inches wide only charge $50 per point. That way maybe I can entice a few hunters to help me take those out of the gene pool. Normally hunters only want larger Bucks. Maybe this is a way to help me out to get better genetics. What do you think? Maybe even the counties that have AR's need to think about doing something like this every few years..

Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656593 11/09/19 02:31 AM
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AR’s work, sure there’s gona be the exceptions here and there but overall they’re working


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Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656635 11/09/19 03:33 AM
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Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: Stratgolfer] #7656692 11/09/19 11:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Stratgolfer
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Haha....there ya go. That buck is a 'chunk' too, great body size....just lacking nice antler shape. And I thought mine were bad.


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Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656914 11/09/19 06:06 PM
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Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656933 11/09/19 06:41 PM
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I was told if you hunted with MLD tags that antler restriction was not enforced on that property.How hard is it to get MLD tags?

Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656943 11/09/19 07:07 PM
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All I know from ranching and through the years raising a variety of different animals that you try to breed to get the best out of an animal. You don't breed inferior animals and expect all of a sudden you are going to get something exceptional as an offspring. The only way I have seen to change the genetics is every year get rid of the worst examples. Also take out the oldest females. Keep doing this year after year keeping the best and taking out the oldest females. It has worked for me on Ibex and I would think it would work on any type of animal. You may be seeing a few better bucks but year after year having narrow antlered bucks breeding females that are half of the equation is eventually going to bite you in the rear.

Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: David7912] #7656947 11/09/19 07:11 PM
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Originally Posted by David7912
I was told if you hunted with MLD tags that antler restriction was not enforced on that property.How hard is it to get MLD tags?


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Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656951 11/09/19 07:21 PM
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Here's a couple that probably made 13" but I let them walk.....

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Re: A/R counties..post up your Tall & Narrows [Re: flintknapper] #7656954 11/09/19 07:27 PM
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One more....

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