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Muzzleloader advice for novice-Okla #7612990 09/22/19 04:22 PM
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freerange Offline OP
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Ive added an Oklahoma lease to my Texas place. Their rifle season is short so I plan to get a muzzleloader to extend my season. I need advise on what to get. I know almost nothing about them. I respect and appreciate all yall guys that use one as a "primitive" weapon but that is not at all my goal. I want whatever is as close to a modern rifle as i can get. I want loading and cleaning to be as EASY as possible. I also don't have a lot of time to learn how to operate and how to find the right combination of components. Im used to 1" groups with my rifle and im used to shooting out to 250 yards. Im not sure how practical it is to get that out of a muzzleloader but tell me what I can expect as compared to that. If i cannot shoot accurately out to at least 150 yards without doing a lot of tinkering and research then i may not buy one.
I have gotten a little bit of advise from a guy with similar goals as me thats been down this road recently. He recommends a TC Encore Pro Hunter 50 cal. He has one like it in stainless camo with a VX Freedom 3-9x40 Leupold. He talks about Blackhorn 209 powder and various precision style bullets. Its all completely over my head and I don't have time to learn. Im completely clueless so im looking for whatever feedback I can get. Thanks in advance.


Keep your gratitude higher than your expectations. RWH
Re: Muzzleloader advice for novice-Okla [Re: freerange] #7613008 09/22/19 04:38 PM
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BillS2008 Offline
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Go to a gun range and ask if any ML shooters shoot there. I learned more from an old ML shooter in five minutes than I did from all the books. Most ML shooters are glad to introduce a new shooter.

Re: Muzzleloader advice for novice-Okla [Re: freerange] #7613439 09/23/19 01:44 AM
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Jim Adams Offline
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I've been using a muzzleloader for all of my big game hunting inTexas and elsewhere for the last 20 years. I've harvested lots of White Tails,feral hogs and javelina, Axis. Fallow and Aoudad. I'm comfortable shooting up to 200 yds and under the right circumstances would reach out to 250. I hunt on a low fence West Texas propery primarily out of box stands so I have a solid rest and while I use a range finder I have measured and flagged (at 25 yd increments) several of the blinds I hunt from. Most of my shots are in the 125 to 150yd range and my best has been a WT Buck at 215 yds.
I now have 4 ML rifles in my gun cabinet. All are .50 Cal; 3 are Knight Disc Extremes and one is a Redemption, now made by Thompson Center. The Knights are all bolt actions and the Redemption is a break action. All 4 have top quallity scopes and the 3 Knights have adjustable triggers and the Redemption's has been polished.
After a lot of range time trying a variety of bullets and sabots I use the same components for all 4; Blackhorn 209 powder, Federal 209A primers, Harvesters Black Crush Rib Sabot and their 300 Gr PT Gold Bullet. When I do my part ,all four guns have produced 3 shot 100 yd groups of an inch or less.
There are a lot of very good MZ rifles of various types available from Knight, Cooper, TC, Remington and CVA and a number of Custom shops. It just depends on your budget. In addition there are several websites full of good information and people willing to share their knowledge. Here are a few: . Jimblackhorn209.com,edsgunshop.com, modernmuzzleloader.com,harvestermuzzleloading.com, huntingnet.com,namlhunt.com.
If you would like to drop me a email and/or visit on the phone I'll be happy to do so. There's aworld of information out there, but you need to move quickly to be ready for this years Oklahoma MZ season. I'll send you both with a PM if I can figure it out

Re: Muzzleloader advice for novice-Okla [Re: freerange] #7613467 09/23/19 02:08 AM
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A T/C Triumph with Blackhorn 209 and a spitzer bullet topped with a scope will do 200 yards with easy clean up and not too much tinkering.

Re: Muzzleloader advice for novice-Okla [Re: freerange] #7613533 09/23/19 03:31 AM
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Listen to Jim! The Knight's are a heckuva rifle.

If you are on a budget get a CVA Optima or Accura. I've had 3 different Accura's and they all shot lights out!

I concur with Jim's recipe of BH209 powder (I've found 80gr +/- by WEIGHT-- roughly 110gr by volume) is a sweet spot for velocity (1850fps) and accuracy (1.5" @ 100). I will second the choice of Harvester Scorpion PT bullets with black crush rib sabots. I shoot the 260gr for deer. This year in Colorado I had to shoot the 300gr sabertooth Harvester because they don't allow sabots.

I've had no issues with my Leupold VX1 3-9x40 holding up as far as scope choices.

Re: Muzzleloader advice for novice-Okla [Re: freerange] #7615055 09/24/19 06:46 PM
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EZ recipe for muzzleloading:

1. Any of the top brands in .50 caliber (T/C, Knight, CVA)
2. Triple 7 pellets (I prefer the magnum pellets - 2 @ 60 grain each)
3. Winchester 209 muzzleloader primers
4. T/C 250 grain Shockwave saboted bullets
5. Scope of your choice (I like the Nikon muzzleloader scopes)
6. Sight in and go hunt
7. Clean with original formula Windex (works like magic)

I have killed many more deer with a muzzleloader than anything else over the last 25 years.

Re: Muzzleloader advice for novice-Okla [Re: freerange] #7615589 09/25/19 04:26 AM
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I hunt in Oklahoma as well, got my lifetime license before i moved to Texas 21 years ago. Had a few muzzle loaders over the last 40 years or so, bought
a stainless CVA Accura about 10 years ago and like it. Break open design, easy to clean. I usually shoot it once right before season to verify zero unless
i change bullets. Clean it, bore butter a patch and run down the barrel. Use three 50gr pellets behind a 295gr PowerBelt Copper hollow point. Been doing
this for a while and see no reason to change.


If i do anything different i'll most likely get a 45 cal muzzle loader barrel for one of my Thompson Prohunter frames. If so i'll have 4 or 5 barrels to sell, may
keep one.

Re: Muzzleloader advice for novice-Okla [Re: freerange] #7616504 09/26/19 12:52 AM
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Go to Muzzleloaders.com for the best prices. I chose the CVA optima and for under $300 feel like it was a great option. It is a break action like the Accura and has a hand twist breach plug so no tool is needed to remove and clean. I use pellets so the powder is easy and consistent. I also like the PowerBelt in 245 grain.


Greg Ziemer
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Life's short... Enjoy the ride!
Re: Muzzleloader advice for novice-Okla [Re: freerange] #7616524 09/26/19 01:15 AM
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If you want to push that distance to 250 yards look into Smokeless Muzzleloaders.

Re: Muzzleloader advice for novice-Okla [Re: Sniper John] #7617476 09/27/19 02:34 AM
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freerange Offline OP
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Thanks for all the feedback guys. Sorry just now getting back but been super busy getting the new lease ready. Ive connected with a couple guys that seem to really know a lot and ive talked directly with them. I feel a lot better about going forward and getting something done before ML season. Having said that, im still gathering info so keep any comments coming.


Keep your gratitude higher than your expectations. RWH
Re: Muzzleloader advice for novice-Okla [Re: freerange] #7639884 10/23/19 03:25 PM
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I hunt muzzle loader in Oklahoma and this Saturday(10/26) is opening day for muzzle loaders in Oklahoma; some things I have learned over the last 10 years of muzzle loader hunting are.....

1. Buy a quality muzzle loader the first time - I wasted a lot of time and money before I finally got a T/C Triumph .50cal stainless and I am confident that it will be the last muzzle loader I ever have to buy. The Encore prohunter from T/C is an excellent choice also.

2. Get a good scope and solid mounts - I have the Nikon 3-9x40 with the elevation circles for drop & Talley combo mount and rings

3. Bullets - I've used alot of different brands and I swear by Barnes 250gr tipped spitfire for both accuracy and on game performance.

4. Primers - I use Remington clean bore #209 (much easier to clean the breach plug)

5. Powder - IMR White hots are what I use and they clean up easy and work flawlessly for me.

Cleaning:

1. Do you self a favor and get a large diameter cleaning rod for shotguns with the appropriate fitting to attach a .50cal bronze brush.

2. Foaming bore cleaner works well for filling the bore up and putting the breach plug in a small jar and filling it with cleaner and letting it sit. An old muzzle loader shooter gave me a recipe for cleaning - 1oz simple green, 1/2oz Murphy's oil & 8oz water; this works REALLY well and I carry a small 3oz spray bottle of this in my possibles bag.

3. The faster you clean it after firing the easier it is to clean and never leave it sitting with burnt powder in it - A buddy of mine borrowed one of my old muzzle loaders (stainless Remington 700 .50cal) and shot it, then let it sit for a couple of months before returning it..... the barrel was completely rusted and ready for the scrap pile.


Accuracy - The consistency of how you load your muzzle loader will have the biggest impact on your accuracy, just be consistent on how you load it and use the proper tools; and I usually get the best accuracy by swabbing the bore with a clean patch between shots.

Good luck this weekend if you make it out!

Re: Muzzleloader advice for novice-Okla [Re: Adchunts] #7650662 11/03/19 03:26 PM
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colt.45 Offline
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Adchunts, was reading the posts, & noticed your statement,

#'er7 - Clean with original formula Windex (works like magic)...

No disrespect, first time heard of using windex ? Majority of my shooting
tis with the black powder, sidekick, & pistals... Been choosing BP since the 70's
Never too old ta learn... Thar B solvants specially made for BP cleaning, always
used the hot soapy water method... Then a light oil B4 pudding up... Dry fire B4
loading...
Recently bought used 50 cal inline, all my guns & bows still in
texas & been adding a few for hunting here... The inline tis tough setting even first
round... Tis getting old & shoulders worn out...
See a lot of posts about cleaning after every shot... Dont me an No disrespect, my Kentucky.45
often shot 2-3 times with out cleaning, each time tis tougher seating RB , old style BP fauls barrel
But always had great accuracy ta 50yrds can or clay pigeon size target... Open sights, run brush for easier
loading & still acurate... cleaning with hot soapy water, & the light oil, when done chooting...
Every one has opinions... just my 2cents , the further the distance, the greater the spread...
As pappy say's : " One must know limits of oneself rather than the rifles... "
Didn't use my inline last year due ta not being consistantl with acraccy...
scratch tis thinking twas scope... it was hitting ta left, was getting it dialed in, confused2 could been
the pounding on me shoulder, cause it went all over so put it up...
Yet with .410 smooth bore, open sights, slug. At 25 yrs hit square black electric tape, & at 50yrds twas dime off...

In-line muzzle - tis tis shooting modern powder , reason for the 209 primers, just dont have the cartrage... Tis as simple as that...
Will try the windex cleaning... Had scrubbed the barrel, hot soapy water, & also used the new in-line cleaning solvents, B4 taking out ta choot first time... It required force even first round, more than what used on my old Kentucky after 3-4 rounds without running brush...
Maybe just getting old, me shoulders are shot, that dont help...
Any ideas, tis more than welcome ta hear...
back didn't meen ta hi-jack it...
Keep your head held high & your powder dry...
flag

edit : rofl for translation see bullfrog... scratch tis thinking even he will be getting a bang head ache on dis one, even I'm a tad confused2
flag

Last edited by colt.45; 11/03/19 03:30 PM.


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Re: Muzzleloader advice for novice-Okla [Re: freerange] #7651074 11/04/19 12:46 AM
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Adchunts Offline
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One of the old black powder gurus suggested Windex many years ago. I have been using it exclusively for around 20 years with great success. The bore in my T/C looks like new after thousands of shots. Google it and decide for yourself.

Re: Muzzleloader advice for novice-Okla [Re: Adchunts] #7651264 11/04/19 04:15 AM
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colt.45 Offline
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cheers
First ever heard of windex ...
Try it out on me 50 cal in- line...
Like said, it twas tough on first
charge after cleaning with the solvant
recommended... It twas flowed whin got it...
flag



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Re: Muzzleloader advice for novice-Okla [Re: freerange] #7651374 11/04/19 12:30 PM
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The great thing about getting a Nikon is they have a great app for how to line up your shot once you figure out your distance.
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