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GM on strike. #7608643 09/17/19 11:35 AM
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https://www.foxbusiness.com/industrials/gm-strike-offer-uaw-workers

Here are the main areas of disagreement:

GM is making big money, $8 billion last year alone, and workers want a bigger slice. The union wants annual pay raises to guard against an economic downturn, but the company wants to pay lump sums tied to earnings. Automakers don’t want higher fixed costs.
The union also wants new products for the four factories slated to close. GM currently has too much U.S. factory capacity, especially to build slower-selling cars.
The companies want to close the labor cost gap with workers at plants run by foreign automakers. GM pays $63 per hour in wages and benefits compared with $50 at the foreign-owned factories. GM's gap is the largest at $13 per hour, according to figures from the Center for Automotive Research.
Union members have great health insurance plans and workers pay about 4 percent of the cost. Employees at large firms nationwide pay about 34 percent, according to the Kaiser Family Foundation. Automakers would like to cut costs.


'It's Only Treason if You Lose."
Re: GM on strike. [Re: Superduty] #7608671 09/17/19 12:14 PM
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Headed right back to where they were.

Re: GM on strike. [Re: Superduty] #7608672 09/17/19 12:17 PM
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As much as I hate GM I hate Unions worse. Autoworkers have always been high on the pay scale for blue collar types. Hell yes GM is making money, that’s the point of being in business. You take a non union group and pay them the money the autoworkers are making and they turn around and fight for the company to stay strong.

Re: GM on strike. [Re: Superduty] #7608679 09/17/19 12:31 PM
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$63 an hour to add one part to a vehicle? Those boys need to STHU and get back to "work." I can't stand unions.

Re: GM on strike. [Re: Superduty] #7608687 09/17/19 12:46 PM
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$63 and hour?
Maybe that's why a new two wheel drive Silverado is 50 grand.


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"Give me an Army of West Point graduates and I'll win a battle... Give me a handful of Texas Aggies and I'll win a war." - General Patton


Re: GM on strike. [Re: reeltexan] #7608721 09/17/19 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by reeltexan

$63 and hour?
Maybe that's why a new two wheel drive Silverado is 50 grand.

amen brother


SPACE FOR RENT


Re: GM on strike. [Re: Superduty] #7608730 09/17/19 01:17 PM
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Re: GM on strike. [Re: reeltexan] #7608770 09/17/19 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by reeltexan

$63 and hour?
Maybe that's why a new two wheel drive Silverado is 50 grand.


I’m not defending any union but they way I understand it is it’s $63 an hour in total compensation

Hourly wage, health ins benefits and retirement all packed into that wage

Still a good blue coller wage but a bit misleading

Re: GM on strike. [Re: Superduty] #7608786 09/17/19 02:22 PM
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And they wonder why Toyota picked Alabama as their next site to build a new production plant.


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Re: GM on strike. [Re: GusWayne] #7608790 09/17/19 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by procraft05
Originally Posted by reeltexan

$63 and hour?
Maybe that's why a new two wheel drive Silverado is 50 grand.


I’m not defending any union but they way I understand it is it’s $63 an hour in total compensation

Hourly wage, health ins benefits and retirement all packed into that wage

Still a good blue coller wage but a bit misleading



^^^^Truth

Gotta smell the fake news agenda. wink


Originally Posted by Phil Robertson
Don't let your ears hear what your eyes didn't see, and don't let your mouth say what your heart doesn't feel
Re: GM on strike. [Re: Superduty] #7608792 09/17/19 02:32 PM
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"Live better, work union." rolleyes Detroit is living proof of this wonderful adage.


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Re: GM on strike. [Re: Superduty] #7608793 09/17/19 02:33 PM
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Take too much from the host, you kill the host, and everyone loses.

Re: GM on strike. [Re: Paluxy] #7608799 09/17/19 02:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Hancock
Headed right back to where they were.


Bingo


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I just turned it on . I was looking bird dogs in the butt this morning.


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Re: GM on strike. [Re: Superduty] #7608860 09/17/19 03:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Superduty
https://www.foxbusiness.com/industrials/gm-strike-offer-uaw-workers

Here are the main areas of disagreement:

GM is making big money, $8 billion last year alone, and workers want a bigger slice. The union wants annual pay raises to guard against an economic downturn, but the company wants to pay lump sums tied to earnings. Automakers don’t want higher fixed costs.
The union also wants new products for the four factories slated to close. GM currently has too much U.S. factory capacity, especially to build slower-selling cars.
The companies want to close the labor cost gap with workers at plants run by foreign automakers. GM pays $63 per hour in wages and benefits compared with $50 at the foreign-owned factories. GM's gap is the largest at $13 per hour, according to figures from the Center for Automotive Research.
Union members have great health insurance plans and workers pay about 4 percent of the cost. Employees at large firms nationwide pay about 34 percent, according to the Kaiser Family Foundation. Automakers would like to cut costs.



First of all, GM is not on strike. The American workers looking for more handouts are on strike, again.

$8 Billion is a big nothing burger for a company the size of GM...they should be making 3 times that. They are running at a 5% profit margin with flat or declining revenues. That's terrible. If the business is not growing the workers don't deserve anything.

I wish GM could tell the UAW to piss off, but they've given them too much power over the years.

And $63 an hour in compensation (no matter how you calculate it) for the majority of those workers is crazy. They should be grateful even if they were getting half that.

Re: GM on strike. [Re: Choctaw] #7608950 09/17/19 05:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Choctaw
$63 an hour to add one part to a vehicle? Those boys need to STHU and get back to "work." I can't stand unions.


Yup....F'em


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Actually, BBC is pretty damn good

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Re: GM on strike. [Re: GusWayne] #7608954 09/17/19 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted by procraft05
Originally Posted by reeltexan

$63 and hour?
Maybe that's why a new two wheel drive Silverado is 50 grand.


I’m not defending any union but they way I understand it is it’s $63 an hour in total compensation

Hourly wage, health ins benefits and retirement all packed into that wage

Still a good blue coller wage but a bit misleading



I call it the “ loaded rate”. Pretty high for non-skilled labor. I think the unions have out lived their purpose. Those folks just need to get back to work, or get on down the road.



Re: GM on strike. [Re: Superduty] #7608969 09/17/19 05:23 PM
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Over 6 figures to work at a factory making cars where robotics does most of the work and the worker just supervises a robot. Unreal. I don't like GM because they took govt money back when the 2007-08 crisis hit and couldn't stay afloat, exactly for the reasons these folks are going on strike, they capitulate to the unions too much and have too much outstanding liabilities in retirement packages. Screw GM, haven't bought a GM car and never will.

Re: GM on strike. [Re: Judd] #7608976 09/17/19 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Judd
Originally Posted by procraft05
Originally Posted by reeltexan

$63 and hour?
Maybe that's why a new two wheel drive Silverado is 50 grand.


I’m not defending any union but they way I understand it is it’s $63 an hour in total compensation

Hourly wage, health ins benefits and retirement all packed into that wage

Still a good blue coller wage but a bit misleading



^^^^Truth

Gotta smell the fake news agenda. wink


Still ridiculous, most normal companies excluding bonuses are 17% or less for benefits, including the ones that rank extremely high like USAA.

End of the day they got offered a company performance based bonus. Fire every one of them. This is the exact reason NAFTA got passed and why up until last year we still produced less cars in the US then before NAFTA.




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Re: GM on strike. [Re: wp75169] #7609185 09/17/19 09:44 PM
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Quote
You take a non union group and pay them the money the autoworkers are making and they turn around and fight for the company to stay strong.


You are describing unicorns. What makes you think GM would pay these wages to anyone without collective bargaining? The UAW and the taxpayers did fight to keep GM in business.

Re: GM on strike. [Re: Superduty] #7609193 09/17/19 09:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Superduty
https://www.foxbusiness.com/industrials/gm-strike-offer-uaw-workers

Here are the main areas of disagreement:

GM is making big money, $8 billion last year alone, and workers want a bigger slice. The union wants annual pay raises to guard against an economic downturn, but the company wants to pay lump sums tied to earnings. Automakers don’t want higher fixed costs.
The union also wants new products for the four factories slated to close. GM currently has too much U.S. factory capacity, especially to build slower-selling cars.
The companies want to close the labor cost gap with workers at plants run by foreign automakers. GM pays $63 per hour in wages and benefits compared with $50 at the foreign-owned factories. GM's gap is the largest at $13 per hour, according to figures from the Center for Automotive Research.
Union members have great health insurance plans and workers pay about 4 percent of the cost. Employees at large firms nationwide pay about 34 percent, according to the Kaiser Family Foundation. Automakers would like to cut costs.



Here is a link to the KFF Summary of findings, probably better to go to the source

https://www.kff.org/report-section/2018-employer-health-benefits-survey-summary-of-findings/

Re: GM on strike. [Re: ndhunter] #7609208 09/17/19 10:11 PM
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Originally Posted by ndhunter
Quote
You take a non union group and pay them the money the autoworkers are making and they turn around and fight for the company to stay strong.


You are describing unicorns. What makes you think GM would pay these wages to anyone without collective bargaining? The UAW and the taxpayers did fight to keep GM in business.


I guess me and my guys are unicorns then. Guess it helps that everyone started somewhere else.

Re: GM on strike. [Re: DocHorton] #7609226 09/17/19 10:28 PM
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Originally Posted by DocHorton
Originally Posted by Superduty
https://www.foxbusiness.com/industrials/gm-strike-offer-uaw-workers

Here are the main areas of disagreement:

GM is making big money, $8 billion last year alone, and workers want a bigger slice. The union wants annual pay raises to guard against an economic downturn, but the company wants to pay lump sums tied to earnings. Automakers don’t want higher fixed costs.
The union also wants new products for the four factories slated to close. GM currently has too much U.S. factory capacity, especially to build slower-selling cars.
The companies want to close the labor cost gap with workers at plants run by foreign automakers. GM pays $63 per hour in wages and benefits compared with $50 at the foreign-owned factories. GM's gap is the largest at $13 per hour, according to figures from the Center for Automotive Research.
Union members have great health insurance plans and workers pay about 4 percent of the cost. Employees at large firms nationwide pay about 34 percent, according to the Kaiser Family Foundation. Automakers would like to cut costs.



First of all, GM is not on strike. The American workers looking for more handouts are on strike, again.

$8 Billion is a big nothing burger for a company the size of GM...they should be making 3 times that. They are running at a 5% profit margin with flat or declining revenues. That's terrible. If the business is not growing the workers don't deserve anything.

I wish GM could tell the UAW to piss off, but they've given them too much power over the years.

And $63 an hour in compensation (no matter how you calculate it) for the majority of those workers is crazy. They should be grateful even if they were getting half that.


Exactly, particularly your last point about total compensation.


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Re: GM on strike. [Re: Duck_Hunter] #7609236 09/17/19 10:43 PM
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Let them suck on 250 a week. Wait until no pensions are paid to anyone. It's coming soon. Thank gawd.

Re: GM on strike. [Re: Superduty] #7609241 09/17/19 10:52 PM
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It would be interesting to have a representative group of auto workers come on down to Midland-Odessa and spend a few months working... asking about mandated break times, I don't do that task, not in our contract, we have set hours, etc. Generations of folks up north have depended on the union for their livelihood. In the south, we've never needed them as we got the same through good, hard work.

I don't think the possibility of letting GM fail in '08 was an option. Not something I studied, but consider how interconnected ALL of the GM employees, dealerships, suppliers, transportation, etc. is and the effect of all of those people and businesses suddenly out of work, that would be a pretty big shock to "the system". It wasn't like others had the money to come in and buy/rescue sizable chunks of it. It was a very difficult time in our country, I'm glad it wasn't worse and if bailing out GM was necessary, so be it. If we had held on to our stock a little longer, maybe it would have turned a profit too, but it was govt deal, so it lost money.

Charlie

Re: GM on strike. [Re: Duck_Hunter] #7609247 09/17/19 10:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by DocHorton
Originally Posted by Superduty
https://www.foxbusiness.com/industrials/gm-strike-offer-uaw-workers

Here are the main areas of disagreement:

GM is making big money, $8 billion last year alone, and workers want a bigger slice. The union wants annual pay raises to guard against an economic downturn, but the company wants to pay lump sums tied to earnings. Automakers don’t want higher fixed costs.
The union also wants new products for the four factories slated to close. GM currently has too much U.S. factory capacity, especially to build slower-selling cars.
The companies want to close the labor cost gap with workers at plants run by foreign automakers. GM pays $63 per hour in wages and benefits compared with $50 at the foreign-owned factories. GM's gap is the largest at $13 per hour, according to figures from the Center for Automotive Research.
Union members have great health insurance plans and workers pay about 4 percent of the cost. Employees at large firms nationwide pay about 34 percent, according to the Kaiser Family Foundation. Automakers would like to cut costs.



First of all, GM is not on strike. The American workers looking for more handouts are on strike, again.

$8 Billion is a big nothing burger for a company the size of GM...they should be making 3 times that. They are running at a 5% profit margin with flat or declining revenues. That's terrible. If the business is not growing the workers don't deserve anything.

I wish GM could tell the UAW to piss off, but they've given them too much power over the years.

And $63 an hour in compensation (no matter how you calculate it) for the majority of those workers is crazy. They should be grateful even if they were getting half that.


Exactly, particularly your last point about total compensation.


I'd be willing to be they would say the same thing about the money we make (regardless of what that number is). It's always easy to minimize what to pay someone when you aren't the person having to replace them.

I'm not defending the union but if you wanna bitch about a salary...doesn't the new CEO make 22 + million? Shouldn't that be where you'd start? If that the case we're sitting here telling a factory worker they shouldn't make 131k (total package) when the person running the company is making 22+ million and who know what other perks they get. Stuff is out of whack, no arguments from me.


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