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Ban or Grandfathered in? #7577726 08/11/19 10:04 PM
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procraft05 Online Content OP
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The bs is only going to continue each and every year.

I suspect sooner than later the powers that be will choose one of these on AR’s

I believe Canada grandfathered pistols years ago. But no further sales of transfers

What’s your bet?

I’d bet grandfathered...more would go along.

I believe it’s unconstitutional too

They are gonna try and shove this down our throats


Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: procraft05] #7577729 08/11/19 10:08 PM
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Hopefully everybody has notified their elected officials that unconstitutional kneejerk reactions can result in being unelected from office.

Just my .02,
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Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: procraft05] #7577747 08/11/19 10:24 PM
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There has already been an AW ban under Clinton. I suspect it would be the same to start then figure out a way to confiscate everything when the next shooting happened.

Last edited by krmitchell; 08/11/19 10:28 PM.
Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: krmitchell] #7577750 08/11/19 10:28 PM
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Originally Posted by krmitchell
There has already been an AW ban under Clinton. I suspect it would be the same to start then figure out a way to confiscate everything.


Idk, my gut says they say that “didn’t work” last time

And fully try and do one or the other.


Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: procraft05] #7577762 08/11/19 10:45 PM
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Originally Posted by procraft05
Originally Posted by krmitchell
There has already been an AW ban under Clinton. I suspect it would be the same to start then figure out a way to confiscate everything.


Idk, my gut says they say that “didn’t work” last time

And fully try and do one or the other.



From the brief research I did online most things pointed to no difference in murder rates during the time the ban was implemented. So yes I would argue it was worthless and didn’t work smile

Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: procraft05] #7578233 08/12/19 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by procraft05
The bs is only going to continue each and every year.

I suspect sooner than later the powers that be will choose one of these on AR’s

I believe Canada grandfathered pistols years ago. But no further sales of transfers

What’s your bet?

I’d bet grandfathered...more would go along.

I believe it’s unconstitutional too

They are gonna try and shove this down our throats


I would agree except that all of the stuff that has been done in the past was tested all the way to the Supreme Court. That in itself has set a lot of precedence in "stone".


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Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: procraft05] #7578392 08/12/19 06:45 PM
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I hope the city folk can figure out what us country folk need to do. I just love city folk telling me how to live.

Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: procraft05] #7582503 08/17/19 11:20 PM
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There are more killings every year by knives and by hammers than there are by rifles, with that being said they will not easily disarm anyone with a rifle. Most of it is just talking points to get people emotional enough to vote for those who oppose guns.


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Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: RattlesnakeDan] #7583376 08/19/19 02:40 AM
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Originally Posted by RattlesnakeDan
There are more killings every year by knives and by hammers than there are by rifles, with that being said they will not easily disarm anyone with a rifle. Most of it is just talking points to get people emotional enough to vote for those who oppose guns.


Yessir


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Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: procraft05] #7583440 08/19/19 04:30 AM
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Anyone that votes for a Democrat is voting for and approves of both.

Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: tehachapi] #7583454 08/19/19 05:38 AM
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Originally Posted by tehachapi
Anyone that votes for a Democrat is voting for and approves of both.


Sad but true


-Bryan

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Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: procraft05] #7608817 09/17/19 03:01 PM
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Eventually a “smart” Democrat will come along. They will either ban ammo sales in certain calibers or tax it into the stratosphere to where new ammo cannot be bought. Any gun without ammo is useless. That way they can render many if not most ineffective and legally not even touch on our 2nd amendment rights. THIS is why I never stop buying ammo. Earl


Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: Earl] #7609809 09/18/19 05:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Earl
Eventually a “smart” Democrat will come along. They will either ban ammo sales in certain calibers or tax it into the stratosphere to where new ammo cannot be bought. Any gun without ammo is useless. That way they can render many if not most ineffective and legally not even touch on our 2nd amendment rights. THIS is why I never stop buying ammo. Earl


Yup. Been saying this for years. Not sure why more actions have not been taken against ammo but I am with you. Buy buy buy.

Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: procraft05] #7609866 09/18/19 06:32 PM
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Ammo ban's/excessive taxes would get tossed by the SC. I thought I had read one time where this was decided a long time ago and bans/excessive taxes on ammo would be considered something like a poll tax. I didn't find ruling with a quick Google search, so it may have just been something people said over and over and wasn't actually true. However, after the Heller ruling, the issue was tested in 2014 by the 9th circuit in Jackson v. City of San Francisco.

https://reason.com/2019/09/05/walma...rdering-them-to-stop-selling-ammo-would/

The article quoted a section from the 9th circuit decision:
"The Second Amendment protects "arms," "weapons," and "firearms"; it does not explicitly protect ammunition. Nevertheless, without bullets, the right to bear arms would be meaningless. A regulation eliminating a person's ability to obtain or use ammunition could thereby make it impossible to use firearms for their core purpose. Cf. Heller….(holding that "the District's requirement (as applied to respondent's handgun) that firearms in the home be rendered and kept inoperable at all times … makes it impossible for citizens to use them for the core lawful purpose of self-defense and is hence unconstitutional"). Thus "the right to possess firearms for protection implies a corresponding right" to obtain the bullets necessary to use them..."


Last edited by gtrich94; 09/18/19 06:34 PM.

Thanks,
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Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: gtrich94] #7609962 09/18/19 08:11 PM
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Originally Posted by gtrich94
Ammo ban's/excessive taxes would get tossed by the SC. I thought I had read one time where this was decided a long time ago and bans/excessive taxes on ammo would be considered something like a poll tax. I didn't find ruling with a quick Google search, so it may have just been something people said over and over and wasn't actually true. However, after the Heller ruling, the issue was tested in 2014 by the 9th circuit in Jackson v. City of San Francisco.

https://reason.com/2019/09/05/walma...rdering-them-to-stop-selling-ammo-would/

The article quoted a section from the 9th circuit decision:
"The Second Amendment protects "arms," "weapons," and "firearms"; it does not explicitly protect ammunition. Nevertheless, without bullets, the right to bear arms would be meaningless. A regulation eliminating a person's ability to obtain or use ammunition could thereby make it impossible to use firearms for their core purpose. Cf. Heller….(holding that "the District's requirement (as applied to respondent's handgun) that firearms in the home be rendered and kept inoperable at all times … makes it impossible for citizens to use them for the core lawful purpose of self-defense and is hence unconstitutional"). Thus "the right to possess firearms for protection implies a corresponding right" to obtain the bullets necessary to use them..."



Tobacco is currently being taxed into non use. Why not ammo?

Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: procraft05] #7610051 09/18/19 10:04 PM
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Because owning/smoking/selling tobacco isn't a right in the Constitution. Alcohol is a better comparison. It's covered by the 21st amendment and there are taxes on it. However, no one is talking about taxing each beer by $1000 or $10,000


Thanks,
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Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: gtrich94] #7610900 09/19/19 10:27 PM
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The constitution speaks specifically about arms, it doesn't say a word about ammunition. It can be done away with nothing more than a stroke of someone's pen like they have done with varying classes of ammunition deemed to be "armor piercing". The constitution didn't save Chinese ammo from being imported, 76n ammo, or the bad little 5.7 "AP" from being banned. It won't save entire calibers from being banned which is what they will do when someone finally gets their big fat liberal head out of their [censored] and thinks about it long enough.

Oh and while it sounds nice (and I'm in agreement) with the legal position that was stated that stretches the 2nd Amendment to cover ammunition in order to make a firearm operable - that is nothing more than an opinion that can be set aside by more liberal minded jurists. When it gets down to it (and one day it will) the legislative and/or executive branch will ban whatever they want to ban and unfortunately the jurists will interpret it as they will. If conservatives hold sway in the judicial branch at the time then a ban would not stand, but if they don't - it would. The very next time that the Democrats control the White House and both houses of Congress we will see the first act of this drama come to play. God Willing, Trump will have been able to position the judiciary to where it can withstand the attack because it will come just as soon as they have the opportunity. If you think the confirmation hearings for Gorsuch and Kavenaugh were rough - just wait and see what happens if Trump gets to nominate a 3rd SC Justice..

Originally Posted by gtrich94
Because owning/smoking/selling tobacco isn't a right in the Constitution. Alcohol is a better comparison. It's covered by the 21st amendment and there are taxes on it. However, no one is talking about taxing each beer by $1000 or $10,000


Last edited by Earl; 09/19/19 10:53 PM.

Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: procraft05] #7611083 09/20/19 12:42 AM
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Americans are in a position of being outgunned by our own government since 1934 when the NFA was established...exactly what our founding fathers didn't want.




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Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: procraft05] #7611495 09/20/19 02:53 PM
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Colt just joined Dick's in the jackass category, they have decided to no longer sell ARs to the general public. I suspect their sales are down quite a bit anyway, so they will not be losing a lot in doing so [so they think], but what they are not counting on is the folks who will not buy anything from them now that they have done this.

Last edited by DeckArtist; 09/20/19 02:53 PM.

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Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: DeckArtist] #7626703 10/07/19 11:09 PM
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Originally Posted by DeckArtist
Colt just joined Dick's in the jackass category, they have decided to no longer sell ARs to the general public. I suspect their sales are down quite a bit anyway, so they will not be losing a lot in doing so [so they think], but what they are not counting on is the folks who will not buy anything from them now that they have done this.


Strictly a business decision, they weren’t, “virtue signaling .” The civilian AR pipeline is full, with very good quality offerings from others at much more affordable prices. They indicated this in their message to dealers and distributors. Notice they didn’t call a press conference to announce their intentions. They simply can’t compete on price with their AR line. Meanwhile, they do have lucrative contracts for military and LE customers and want to focus their production capability on those orders for now. They are doing well in their 1911 and revolver lines though. If you were a business owner, would you continue producing products that were filling warehouses and not being purchased in useful numbers?

Quote
In fact, according to Spitale, Colt’s manufacturing capacity for AR-style rifles is currently tied up in producing guns for outstanding contracts. Given this demand and given the lack of demand from the retail side of the market, Colt’s determination to suspend retail production is good business sense. M16s and AR-15s are different rifles, and to tie up production capacity in producing commercial semi-auto-only guns that nobody’s buying at the expense of outstanding military contracts is just bad business.

Meanwhile, Colt is re-focusing its efforts on another segment of the market that has seen increased demand and continues to be a big driver for the company: handguns.

Re: Ban or Grandfathered in? [Re: procraft05] #7630726 10/12/19 04:07 PM
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It is going to get worse.


Absolutely nothing is improved with negativity!

The right to an opinion gives absolutely no validity to that opinion.
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