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Mar 25th, 2012
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T-work with Tara #7510495
05/12/19 09:13 PM
05/12/19 09:13 PM
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Lake X
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Focus this off season is handling. She is taking case well, really working sit whistle, short tweet and full spin. It's funny when she barks at me on sit whistle "like common hurry up!". This is some think stuff, bumper disappears in it.


Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7510513
05/12/19 09:56 PM
05/12/19 09:56 PM
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Looking good!

Have you done FTP with her?

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: BradyBuck] #7510515
05/12/19 09:58 PM
05/12/19 09:58 PM
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Originally Posted by BradyBuck
Looking good!

Have you done FTP with her?

Oh yeah, I worked with a pro as well.

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7510516
05/12/19 10:00 PM
05/12/19 10:00 PM
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I been getting a long hook sit on the whistle, watched this video is great.


Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7510517
05/12/19 10:01 PM
05/12/19 10:01 PM
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Where is she at?

Been through a full FTP?

T drill with piles?

Pattern blinds?

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7510519
05/12/19 10:02 PM
05/12/19 10:02 PM
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Oh yeah I've seen everything he's got out probably 20 times..

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: BradyBuck] #7510528
05/12/19 10:13 PM
05/12/19 10:13 PM
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Completely done with FF, FTP. I have done lots of T work, but dialing it back like the video, and will slowly stretch it out then go to pattern blinds. She was born Sep 2016, she has duck hunted 2 seasons and fetched 100 ducks per season. The casting in the water has been an issue, we are going to do some t work in the water. Like this I did with my girl Molly... I'm not interested in hunt test, its all about hunting.


Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7510550
05/12/19 10:49 PM
05/12/19 10:49 PM
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This is her first month duck hunting Nov 2017. She has been doing great. First season no handling, last season a little handling, taking casts in the water was an issue last year, so we will work on that this off season.

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7510560
05/12/19 11:05 PM
05/12/19 11:05 PM
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Cool deal

Put her through a full swim-by then do pattern blinds, patterns with diversions and walk out blinds and cheating singles.

If you'll put her through all that very thoroughly you have a dog ready to start running cold blinds.

Last edited by BradyBuck; 05/12/19 11:20 PM.
Re: T-work with Tara [Re: BradyBuck] #7510566
05/12/19 11:15 PM
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I need to study up on swim-by, what is the purpose of that?

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7510570
05/12/19 11:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Guy
I need to study up on swim-by, what is the purpose of that?



Swim-by is the foundation for handling in the water.

What training material do you have?

Hillmann has it in his water fundamentals DVD and Lardy in his TRT2 dvd set. I'm sure I'm many other materials as well.

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7510574
05/12/19 11:26 PM
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Sent a PM

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7512774
05/15/19 04:52 PM
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She is doing great! Keep at it!


Bobby Barnett

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7512981
05/15/19 09:11 PM
05/15/19 09:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Guy
I need to study up on swim-by, what is the purpose of that?



Handling in the water. Swim by is a must for a retriever to become reliable handling while in the water.

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: huck18] #7513238
05/16/19 02:22 AM
05/16/19 02:22 AM
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Originally Posted by huck18
Originally Posted by Guy
I need to study up on swim-by, what is the purpose of that?



Handling in the water. Swim by is a must for a retriever to become reliable handling while in the water.

I was looking for something more specific than that. When I think about handling (and maybe many are like me), you think about controlling your dog to a spot, where the bird is. That is not swimby. Swimby is about controlling your dog on the return, I learned that doing my own homework. So your dog has fetched the duck, he is bringing it back, but he cheats on the way back and heads to shore, swimby teaches "no", I control you on the way back. Just me, I'm not so worried about that. I'm interested in helping my dog find the bird. My preference is to not handle my dog at all which is mainly what I have been doing for 2 hunting seasons. But there are times when it is needed, I want to handle her to the area where bird went down, then release her with "hunt it up" and she is on her own to find it, which many times bird has swam off and is 50 yards where it went down.

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7513270
05/16/19 03:24 AM
05/16/19 03:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Guy
Originally Posted by huck18
Originally Posted by Guy
I need to study up on swim-by, what is the purpose of that?



Handling in the water. Swim by is a must for a retriever to become reliable handling while in the water.

I was looking for something more specific than that. When I think about handling (and maybe many are like me), you think about controlling your dog to a spot, where the bird is. That is not swimby. Swimby is about controlling your dog on the return, I learned that doing my own homework. So your dog has fetched the duck, he is bringing it back, but he cheats on the way back and heads to shore, swimby teaches "no", I control you on the way back. Just me, I'm not so worried about that. I'm interested in helping my dog find the bird. My preference is to not handle my dog at all which is mainly what I have been doing for 2 hunting seasons. But there are times when it is needed, I want to handle her to the area where bird went down, then release her with "hunt it up" and she is on her own to find it, which many times bird has swam off and is 50 yards where it went down.



Swim-by is much more than just handling a dog on the way back from a retrieve. It's the foundation of handling in the water. It creates a compulsion and desire to seek water. It introduces stopping in the water and casting in the water.

If you want to have a dog that handles in the water or land you should follow a proven progression of training.

Formal obedience
FF
Simple casting
CC
Pile work
T work

*Swim-by*

Pattern blinds
Cheating singles
Channel blinds
Pattern blinds with diversions

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: BradyBuck] #7513394
05/16/19 01:29 PM
05/16/19 01:29 PM
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Looks like you are caIling water force, water T, swim-by all the same thing. I have the Evan Graham ďWater Force and Swim-byĒ DVD, I watch that last night. I bought it years ago. So yeah Iím going to do all that, this off season. Tara is real sensitive to the collar, so I need to be real careful with her on the force. Iím probably going follow the Bill Hillman videos...I like his methods better...






Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7513414
05/16/19 01:52 PM
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This is Evan Graham. He says swim-by, he says itís about the controlled return and not about handling to a spot..

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7513545
05/16/19 04:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Guy
Originally Posted by huck18
Originally Posted by Guy
I need to study up on swim-by, what is the purpose of that?



Handling in the water. Swim by is a must for a retriever to become reliable handling while in the water.

I was looking for something more specific than that. When I think about handling (and maybe many are like me), you think about controlling your dog to a spot, where the bird is. That is not swimby. Swimby is about controlling your dog on the return, I learned that doing my own homework. So your dog has fetched the duck, he is bringing it back, but he cheats on the way back and heads to shore, swimby teaches "no", I control you on the way back. Just me, I'm not so worried about that. I'm interested in helping my dog find the bird. My preference is to not handle my dog at all which is mainly what I have been doing for 2 hunting seasons. But there are times when it is needed, I want to handle her to the area where bird went down, then release her with "hunt it up" and she is on her own to find it, which many times bird has swam off and is 50 yards where it went down.


I disagree that the return is the main purpose of swim-by. I can think of many instances within your hunting mindset where swim-by is needed. Swim-by in the grand scheme of things is handling for the water, but more importantly the handler being in control and the dog going where it is told.

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7513576
05/16/19 05:32 PM
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If a dog has completed the swim by and is proficient in it. The dog should be able to handle in the water stoping to the whistles and waiting for the cast. The dog should be able to handle past a downed bird (bumber). The dog literally ďswims byĒ bumpers (birds) while being cast somewhere else.

Really has nothing to do with the return. Itís about handling in the water.

Iíve seen every video posted and follow Lardys training program.

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7514951
05/18/19 08:58 PM
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good work guy. she' s having fun, you can tell.

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: BradyBuck] #7541204
06/24/19 06:23 PM
06/24/19 06:23 PM
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Originally Posted by BradyBuck
Swim-by is much more than just handling a dog on the way back from a retrieve. It's the foundation of handling in the water. It creates a compulsion and desire to seek water.


She doesnít need any of that, took this video yesterday. I canít keep her out of the water. When I take her fishing, itís all can do to keep her in the boat.


We been doing lots casting and handling in the water, she is doing grate. Iíll post video of that sometime.

Last edited by Guy; 06/24/19 06:31 PM.
Re: T-work with Tara [Re: Guy] #7541219
06/24/19 06:38 PM
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Do what you think is best..

However I'm not just pulling this stuff out of my rear...

This is from almost every successful retriever trainer in the country.

If you don't want to do Swim-by at least do water T

If you want a reliable handling dog you should follow a proven sequential progression of training.

Formal Obedience
* "Sit"
* "Here"
* "Heel"
* Whistle commands
Force Fetch
Simple Casting
* "Over" - Right and Left
* "Back" - Right and Left
E- Collar Conditioning
Pile Work
TT
SWIM BY
Pattern Blinds
Blind drills
Walk out blinds water and land
Elementary cold blinds on water and land

Re: T-work with Tara [Re: BradyBuck] #7541232
06/24/19 06:48 PM
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We have been doing water T for couple weeks now. I got a pro trainer I consult with as well, I have had about 10 private 1-on-1 lessons and consult with over the phone/text as needed. cheers

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