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Mar 25th, 2012
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224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! #7487983
04/15/19 06:25 PM
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We (me + 2 buddies) are building 3 identical AR-15 rifles in 224 Valkrie. 22" Wilson Combat barrels, 1:6.5" twist. I have 1000 pieces of Starline brass and 3500 bullets of the 75 grain ELD-M headed our way. Barrels, AR upper parts, and ammo components will be here Wednesday and Thursday. We plan on shooting the 75 grain ELDM about 2900 fps. I have been wanting to build a new suppressed .224" caliber rifle that is hotter than the normal 223/5.56 round to shoot the heavier 75+ grain bullets faster. We decided on the 224 Valkrie.

Anyone reload for the 224 Valkrie? I have done a few rounds from standard reloading sources, but do not have any actual field data yet with the 75 grain bullets. I'm looking forward to this project and build!

Once ready, we are talking about planning a prairie dog trip. 223 Rem bolt gun, 224 Valkrie, and 6.5x47 for longer range stuff.



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Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7487985
04/15/19 06:27 PM
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Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7487993
04/15/19 06:35 PM
04/15/19 06:35 PM
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I plowed mules.
Originally Posted by Roll-Tide
I did build a cabin. Aka the brokeback shack.

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Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488012
04/15/19 06:55 PM
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Over twist much? laugh I hate this trend that has started.

That'll be a fun little monster to shoot...enjoy it Chad.


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Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488017
04/15/19 07:00 PM
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1:6.5 twist eek2

You know the powder to use. Go find pressure.


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Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488026
04/15/19 07:14 PM
04/15/19 07:14 PM
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I'm soooo skeptical about this caliber. By no means am I trying to intentionally stroke your/yall's egos, but..if you/yall can't make this caliber work then I'm going give up on it forever.

The only person one I know personally that I'd deeem a "gun/reloading" guy who tried gave up on it. Couldn't really get the heavier 80-90 grains bullets to work with anything in his set up. The 65 to 70's, he getting such bad results at higher loads, ie speeds, that it didn't seem worth it to him.

Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488036
04/15/19 07:20 PM
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Well, I want to have options for the 88 grain ELD-M also, which needs a 1:7" twist. Wilson only has 1:6.5" twist for the 224 Valkrie, which I think is great. It allows for the heavier bullets, if you want. And (which I think is the best option) the faster twist allows for easier and more consistent bullet expansion and more nasty wound channels. I'll try the 75 and 88 grain ELD-M's on critters of all sizes and see how she does!



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Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488040
04/15/19 07:22 PM
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KR, need more info on the details on why it didn't work. Rifle set up, bullets and powders used? Factory ammo? I have heard first hand from customers about the issues with some of the factory ammo being slower and not very consistent. Consistency is what is needed when promoting a 1000 yard capable .224" round.



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Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488114
04/15/19 09:10 PM
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Originally Posted by ChadTRG42
KR, need more info on the details on why it didn't work. Rifle set up, bullets and powders used? Factory ammo? I have heard first hand from customers about the issues with some of the factory ammo being slower and not very consistent. Consistency is what is needed when promoting a 1000 yard capable .224" round.


My friend mostly shot reloads.

For what it's worth, he would admit he's no expert in shooting, ar building or reloading. But he, like I, have been able to make some setups shoot very well. When we chatted, he was just confused as to why he couldn't get this one to go as we were comparing my grendel results vs his valkyrie.

Definitely a 7 twist barrel. I don't remember the manufacturer but seemed reputable enough. It was 22" with something that wasn't muzzle threaded, ie no muzzle device.
I gave him about 30 75gr amaxes I didn't want anymore. I know he tried one of the really heavy Barnes bullets, he loves Barnes bullet. Don't know what else.
Don't remember powder but he used a couple of what he had and he bought a single pound of something he was recommended. So very limited here, so, we both thought here is where it seems like it needs more expertise, specific powder selection.

BTW, we concluded we liked the grendel better because it seemed to be more "forgiving" of powder selection. We theorized that Valkyrie maybe one of these calibers that if you hone in the right combination of powder charge and selection. I think that might even mean that this caliber will only be good for powders that are temp sensitive. Obviously the grendel is not a "1000 yard" caliber but I haven't met a single person that has one that can out shoot my grendel at 300 so I must remain skeptical until i do. it's usually complaints about how bad it performed.
Analogy: Yes a ferrari F1 is certainly faster than my sedan in theory BUT you can't find racing fuel in Katy and there is a speed bump between my home and office so what do I care if my sedan gets me home faster?

Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488136
04/15/19 09:30 PM
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In short he develops loads like Buzz?


Originally Posted by Phil Robertson
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Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488163
04/15/19 10:07 PM
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There certainly are a few tricks to getting an AR to shoot well. If you know what you are doing, it's not that difficult. I have full confidence in finding a great load with some 75 grain ELD-M's. I can take a $2500 custom AR and make it shoot like crap with the wrong combo. I can take the exact same rifle and make it shoot 1/2 moa with the same bullet by changing to the right powder and burn rate. AR's can certainly be more finicky than a simple bolt gun. But once you understand it, it's not that hard. Most people go too aggressive with their bullets and powder burn rates. They look only at what powder yields them the fastest speeds. Often times that high velocity is with the wrong powder to shoot well in an AR. But it goes fast!



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Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488203
04/15/19 11:03 PM
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What is the difference between the 224 Valkrie and a 224 Grendel?

Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: Judd] #7488275
04/16/19 12:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Judd
In short he develops loads like Buzz?

peep


"some people say I got a drinkin problem........I got no problem drinkin at all......."


Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: BigPig] #7488284
04/16/19 12:48 AM
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Originally Posted by BigPig
What is the difference between the 224 Valkrie and a 224 Grendel?



I think it is one is a Grendel case the other is using the 6.8SPC case but with a few changes, case body shortened and shoulder angle changed. The 224 V has less case capacity more in line with the 22PPC I think

Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: kmon1] #7488287
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Originally Posted by kmon1
Originally Posted by BigPig
What is the difference between the 224 Valkrie and a 224 Grendel?



I think it is one is a Grendel case the other is using the 6.8SPC case but with a few changes, case body shortened and shoulder angle changed. The 224 V has less case capacity more in line with the 22PPC I think


So a 224 Grendel would be a little faster?

Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488290
04/16/19 12:59 AM
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I would think so but not sure about with the real long bullets like the 88s or 90gr. To use the longee bullets is I think why the Val is shorter so they still fit the mag and functioning length for the AR15

But for bullet weights and profile the 22 Grendel should be a little faster

Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488299
04/16/19 01:13 AM
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Not sure what others are talking about but I meant my 6.5 grendel was a better choice than my friend's 224 valkyrie. Is there such a thing as 22 grendel?

Also not sure what it's exactly meant by "buzz" reloading. Knowing him, it can go either way as a compliment or an insult. If u mean I like things that are simplified sometimes, heck yes

Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: BigPig] #7488319
04/16/19 01:23 AM
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Originally Posted by BigPig
Originally Posted by kmon1
Originally Posted by BigPig
What is the difference between the 224 Valkrie and a 224 Grendel?



I think it is one is a Grendel case the other is using the 6.8SPC case but with a few changes, case body shortened and shoulder angle changed. The 224 V has less case capacity more in line with the 22PPC I think


So a 224 Grendel would be a little faster?


Google Search

6.5 Grendel case capacity: 35.0 grains of water and about 32.5 grains powder

6.8 SPC case capacity 34.8–36.9 H2O

Couldn't find the case capacity for the .224 Valkyrie. It is based on the 6.8 SPC I think.


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Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: Korean Redneck] #7488320
04/16/19 01:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Korean Redneck
Not sure what others are talking about but I meant my 6.5 grendel was a better choice than my friend's 224 valkyrie. Is there such a thing as 22 grendel?

Also not sure what it's exactly meant by "buzz" reloading. Knowing him, it can go either way as a compliment or an insult. If u mean I like things that are simplified sometimes, heck yes


Buzz reloading is a powder charge that has worked for other people, but he doesn't do any testing in his own rifle.


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Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: FiremanJG] #7488347
04/16/19 01:50 AM
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Originally Posted by FiremanJG
Originally Posted by BigPig
Originally Posted by kmon1
Originally Posted by BigPig
What is the difference between the 224 Valkrie and a 224 Grendel?



I think it is one is a Grendel case the other is using the 6.8SPC case but with a few changes, case body shortened and shoulder angle changed. The 224 V has less case capacity more in line with the 22PPC I think


So a 224 Grendel would be a little faster?


Google Search

6.5 Grendel case capacity: 35.0 grains of water and about 32.5 grains powder

6.8 SPC case capacity 34.8–36.9 H2O

Couldn't find the case capacity for the .224 Valkyrie. It is based on the 6.8 SPC I think.


I have no idea. I’ve just been reading about the 224 Grendel and how much people are liking it.

Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488383
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The 22 and 6 Grendel have interested me for a while, AR performance sells his barrels with custom Hornady full length dies. You can also use Redding bushing dies and barrels available from several sources. But I haven’t convinced myself to build one yet.

I built an upper with a BHW 6x6.8 barrel a few years ago, used CH4D full length custom dies. With an 18” barrel I was getting 2950-3000fps with 85gr bullets IIRC. Got bored and sold it..

The nice thing about the 224V is barrels, brass, factory ammo, dies are all readily available.

For varmint hunting, I think I’m just going to stick with my 223 ARs. Picked up and old style RRA predator pursuit recently for a truck gun. I haven’t hand loaded since moving a year ago, I need to get my shop built so I can drag my stuff out of storage. So factory 223 for now

Interested to see your results on this project Chad

Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488466
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I had my best results with 2000 MR /Varget/ and your favorite Reloder 17.
Was visiting with a couple of FClass shooters in Mississippi who also said 2000 MR was the cat’s meow for tha Valkyrie.
Mine shot well enough that a friend who watched me shoot it took it home.....He called and said come by his office and instead of the rifle he gave me a check. cool


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Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488539
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I think a lot of people are missing the mark on what 224V could be useful for. It could be a very good training tool: relatively cheap ammo, long heavy bullets, low recoil, and supposed to be pretty long barrel life.

Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488695
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Originally Posted by ChadTRG42
There certainly are a few tricks to getting an AR to shoot well. If you know what you are doing, it's not that difficult. I have full confidence in finding a great load with some 75 grain ELD-M's. I can take a $2500 custom AR and make it shoot like crap with the wrong combo. I can take the exact same rifle and make it shoot 1/2 moa with the same bullet by changing to the right powder and burn rate. AR's can certainly be more finicky than a simple bolt gun. But once you understand it, it's not that hard. Most people go too aggressive with their bullets and powder burn rates. They look only at what powder yields them the fastest speeds. Often times that high velocity is with the wrong powder to shoot well in an AR. But it goes fast!


Can you answer about using the ELD-M’s. I thought this style of bullet has to be seated so far back in the case to fit in the mag, it hampers powder amount.

Also, you’re right in that AR’s can be a little finicky to load for, but not a big deal to get around. For instance, I have a IMR 4198 and 55 grain Varmageddon load that is super accurate and soft shooting, but won’t work with rifle length gas systems. Not enough oomph to cycle the bolt.

Last edited by tenyearsgone; 04/16/19 01:40 PM.
Re: 224 Valkrie- AR Build underway! [Re: ChadTRG42] #7488747
04/16/19 02:20 PM
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The 224 V is based (loosely) on the 6.8 SPC case. It has the same exact case head size as a 6.8, so you can use a 6.8 SPC bolt carrier for the 224 V. But you can't simply neck down the 6.8 to .224" and get the long heavy .224" bullets to fit in an AR mag. The bullets would have to be seated much too long. So the design of the 224 V is to use the 6.8 case, shorten the case length and move the shoulder back some. The shoulder on the 224 V is .1" shorter than the 6.8 (1.3-1.203"), and the overall case length is shorter by .075" (1.675"-1.6"). This will allow the long .224" bullets to fit in an AR mag, and be seated in the case properly. It's the same exact concept the 6.5 Creedmoor did compared to the 260 Rem (as far as the shorter shoulder and shorter case length goes). And the 224 V has the optimum 30 degree shoulder angle, where the 6.8 has a 23 degree shoulder angle.

Some of the newer rounds being developed now are being designed to accommodate the heavy and high BC bullets we are seeing now. The reason why the 6.8 round is a great choice for an AR, is the lighter weight 270 bullets (.277" diameter) have a real short ogive to tip length. This will allow them to be seated out long, have more powder capacity inside the case (means more speed) and still fit and feed in an AR.


224 Valkrie
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6.8 SPC
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Last edited by ChadTRG42; 04/16/19 02:26 PM.


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