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Possession Limit Question?? #7438456 02/19/19 03:45 PM
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PoppinPiggies Offline OP
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In the last few days I have had this discussion a few times with no clear answer. Do ducks that are cleaned and at home in your freezer count towards your possession limit? For example would it be legal for someone to have a couple hundred duck breasts in their freezer that were all obtained while legally sticking to the 6 duck per day limit?


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Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: PoppinPiggies] #7438462 02/19/19 03:56 PM
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Good question. I would think ducks at home are included in the possession limit. I'd guess once you hit the limit it's time to do some eatin'. Of course I'm not a game warden nor a lawyer. Just my guess.

Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: PoppinPiggies] #7438466 02/19/19 03:59 PM
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I am almost positive that once it is packaged and in your freezer it is not considered game. Now different rules apply at locations away from your home, like at camp.



Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: helomech] #7438484 02/19/19 04:22 PM
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Originally Posted by helomech
I am almost positive that once it is packaged and in your freezer it is not considered game. Now different rules apply at locations away from your home, like at camp.


Not in accordance to migratory bird laws. Use to be TX vs Fed law. Texas excluded home from possession and also had a processed clause and feds didnít.

50 code of Federal regulations 20.33


It may of changed. Sniper John would know all laws state and federal on migratory though. Maybe he will chime in


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Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: PoppinPiggies] #7438492 02/19/19 04:27 PM
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Possession limits are to prevent overharvesting in the field. I cannot fathom that legally taken game at home in your freezer has anything to do with possession limits.


Originally Posted By: Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: Nogalus Prairie] #7438501 02/19/19 04:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Nogalus Prairie
Possession limits are to prevent overharvesting in the field. I cannot fathom that legally taken game at home in your freezer has anything to do with possession limits.

Agree herr

Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: PoppinPiggies] #7438502 02/19/19 04:30 PM
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Here

Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: BOBO the Clown] #7438503 02/19/19 04:31 PM
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Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown
Originally Posted by helomech
I am almost positive that once it is packaged and in your freezer it is not considered game. Now different rules apply at locations away from your home, like at camp.


Not in accordance to migratory bird laws. Use to be TX vs Fed law. Texas excluded home from procession definition feds didn’t

50 code of Federal regulations 20.33


It may of changed. Sniper John would know all laws state and federal on migratory though. Maybe he will chime in



Not sure of migratory laws, but I don't see how you could ever be prosecuted for this. Not advocating breaking laws, but meat in your freezer could have come from anywhere. I just can't see how you could be prosecuted for meat that is in your freezer. I could see it in a tag along crime, like you get busted for having 500 doves in your truck and they get a warrant and find 1000 in your freezer, but other than that I just can't see getting in trouble for having last years ducks in your freezer.



Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: PoppinPiggies] #7438514 02/19/19 04:34 PM
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Haha this is pretty much the same arguments I've been having! I've done a little research and saw some people talking about Federal & State Regulations being in opposition here but I haven't read the actual wording to check. I'm with Nogalus though...... during the season I kill ducks a lot faster than I eat them and I feel like a possession limit imposed on my freezer would just be trying to get me to stop hunting LEGALLY as much as I do.


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Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: PoppinPiggies] #7438519 02/19/19 04:36 PM
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So I can only kill 9 woodcock a year if I freeze them at home for later?

Thatís nonsensical.


Originally Posted By: Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: PoppinPiggies] #7438529 02/19/19 04:44 PM
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Page 100 of the 2018-2019 Texas Outdoor Annual gives the definition of possession limits for Hunters & Anglers. These are Texas laws, not sure where the Feds would step in.







Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: helomech] #7438532 02/19/19 04:46 PM
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Originally Posted by helomech
Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown
Originally Posted by helomech
I am almost positive that once it is packaged and in your freezer it is not considered game. Now different rules apply at locations away from your home, like at camp.


Not in accordance to migratory bird laws. Use to be TX vs Fed law. Texas excluded home from procession definition feds didn’t

50 code of Federal regulations 20.33


It may of changed. Sniper John would know all laws state and federal on migratory though. Maybe he will chime in



Not sure of migratory laws, but I don't see how you could ever be prosecuted for this. Not advocating breaking laws, but meat in your freezer could have come from anywhere. I just can't see how you could be prosecuted for meat that is in your freezer. I could see it in a tag along crime, like you get busted for having 500 doves in your truck and they get a warrant and find 1000 in your freezer, but other than that I just can't see getting in trouble for having last years ducks in your freezer.


I edited my above statement, I just a remember a couple of old cases that have popped up here. The Fed law was very ambiguous compared to state, due to processed and possession definitions.

With that said Fed defined ďpossession limitĒ and ďfield possessionĒ differently also, now I have no idea with there have been updates or Amendments.


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Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: PoppinPiggies] #7438538 02/19/19 04:48 PM
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For the possession limit are you required to maintain proof of sex/breed etc.? I would be of the mind that in your freezer has reached its final destination place and is no longer counted in your possession limit.


It's hell eatin em live
Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: PoppinPiggies] #7438542 02/19/19 04:51 PM
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I have a bunch of ducks in my freezer, I raise and harvest them. I have not duck hunted in over 20 years.



Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: PoppinPiggies] #7438546 02/19/19 04:53 PM
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They donít count once they are at the final destination.

Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: PoppinPiggies] #7438550 02/19/19 04:55 PM
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Originally Posted by PoppinPiggies
Haha this is pretty much the same arguments I've been having! I've done a little research and saw some people talking about Federal & State Regulations being in opposition here but I haven't read the actual wording to check. I'm with Nogalus though...... during the season I kill ducks a lot faster than I eat them and I feel like a possession limit imposed on my freezer would just be trying to get me to stop hunting LEGALLY as much as I do.


Donít disagree, just going by what been argued/stated via Federal Wardens involvement.

Maybe Sniper or one of our resident GWís will chime in


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Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: helomech] #7438554 02/19/19 05:02 PM
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Originally Posted by helomech
Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown
Originally Posted by helomech
I am almost positive that once it is packaged and in your freezer it is not considered game. Now different rules apply at locations away from your home, like at camp.


Not in accordance to migratory bird laws. Use to be TX vs Fed law. Texas excluded home from procession definition feds didn’t

50 code of Federal regulations 20.33


It may of changed. Sniper John would know all laws state and federal on migratory though. Maybe he will chime in



Not sure of migratory laws, but I don't see how you could ever be prosecuted for this. Not advocating breaking laws, but meat in your freezer could have come from anywhere. I just can't see how you could be prosecuted for meat that is in your freezer. I could see it in a tag along crime, like you get busted for having 500 doves in your truck and they get a warrant and find 1000 in your freezer, but other than that I just can't see getting in trouble for having last years ducks in your freezer.



Like I said going by what I have seen play out here and other situations. Feds donít have any say in species that arenít under ES protections, thatís state management 100%,, but they do on migratory birds.


Donate to TX Youth hunting program.... better to donate then to waste it in taxes

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Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: BOBO the Clown] #7438570 02/19/19 05:15 PM
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Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown
Originally Posted by helomech
Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown
Originally Posted by helomech
I am almost positive that once it is packaged and in your freezer it is not considered game. Now different rules apply at locations away from your home, like at camp.


Not in accordance to migratory bird laws. Use to be TX vs Fed law. Texas excluded home from procession definition feds didn’t

50 code of Federal regulations 20.33


It may of changed. Sniper John would know all laws state and federal on migratory though. Maybe he will chime in



Not sure of migratory laws, but I don't see how you could ever be prosecuted for this. Not advocating breaking laws, but meat in your freezer could have come from anywhere. I just can't see how you could be prosecuted for meat that is in your freezer. I could see it in a tag along crime, like you get busted for having 500 doves in your truck and they get a warrant and find 1000 in your freezer, but other than that I just can't see getting in trouble for having last years ducks in your freezer.



Like I said going by what I have seen play out here and other situations. Feds don’t have any say in species that aren’t under ES protections, that’s state management 100%,, but they do on migratory birds.




Lets assume the feds say you can't have more than a possession limit. How can they say that the cut up duck meat in your freezer is one duck or 5 ducks, or ducks I raised. Just seems way to far out to worry about. It isn't like they will just walk up to you and demand to see your freezer without lots of proof and warrants.

Not arguing, and the law may say exactly what you say. Just saying not really something to worry about. I say just hunt legally and you should not have anything to worry about.

Last edited by helomech; 02/19/19 05:17 PM.


Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: scalebuster] #7438584 02/19/19 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by scalebuster
They donít count once they are at the final destination.


It really is that simple.


Originally Posted By: Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: PoppinPiggies] #7438596 02/19/19 05:38 PM
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just to be safe, let me know where to pick up and I can take your overage's banana


hold on Newt, we got a runaway
Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: PoppinPiggies] #7438608 02/19/19 05:47 PM
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[b]Unless it has changed, this is a response from USFWS a friend got a few years ago[/b]:


I received a similar question on this topic this morning so I already had a
response typed out - it is shown below:

You raise a question that has been a topic of discussion between the Feds
and the State in recent years.

Texas Parks and Wildlife has continued to publish both in their Outdoor
Annual and Texas Waterfowl Digest that possession limits do not apply to
wildlife once it reaches a permanent residence and is finally processed.
While this statement may apply to fish, turkey, deer or other non migratory
game animals, it is in direct conflict with Federal rules governing
migratory birds.

As per federal law (50 Code of Federal Regulations 20.33) - "No person
shall possess more migratory game birds taken in the United States than the
possession limit or the aggregate possession limit, whichever applies."
20.33 has no clause which says once the birds reach the permanent residence
and are finally processed they no longer count towards a possession limit.

However, each person residing at a permanent residence is entitled to a
possession limit (regardless if they have a hunting license or not). So,
this year for instance (with regards to ducks) if there are three people
living at your permanent residence, then by Federal law you could legally
possess three possession limits or 36 ducks.

There are provisions which state that State law may be more restrictive
than Federal law when dealing with migratory birds. However, the State may
not be less restrictive, which in this case they are. For this reason,
Texas Parks and Wildlife is in error by saying migratory game birds finally
processed and at a permanent residence do not count towards a possession
limit - by Federal law they do.

I hope this clarifies your question - if you need further information, send
me another email or give me a call.

thanks

Last edited by KingHunter17; 02/19/19 06:02 PM.
Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: PoppinPiggies] #7438614 02/19/19 05:52 PM
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My question to this is. When I kill a deer and process it and put it in my freezer it is no longer considered a deer. It is just meat. When I process a migratory game bird, is it still considered a migratory game bird, or is it just considered meat, like my deer?



Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: helomech] #7438621 02/19/19 06:01 PM
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Originally Posted by helomech
My question to this is. When I kill a deer and process it and put it in my freezer it is no longer considered a deer. It is just meat. When I process a migratory game bird, is it still considered a migratory game bird, or is it just considered meat, like my deer?


Per law fed has no management of state wildlife with two exceptions ESA protections and Migratory waterfowl. Think Texas red snapper seaso/limitsn also

I Know a guy that got his butt handed to him for bringing duck sausage into the US from a Canadian hunt.


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Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: BOBO the Clown] #7438626 02/19/19 06:10 PM
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Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown
Originally Posted by helomech
My question to this is. When I kill a deer and process it and put it in my freezer it is no longer considered a deer. It is just meat. When I process a migratory game bird, is it still considered a migratory game bird, or is it just considered meat, like my deer?


Per law fed has no management of state wildlife with two exceptions ESA protections and Migratory waterfowl. Think Texas red snapper seaso/limitsn also

I Know a guy that got his butt handed to him for bringing duck sausage into the US from a Canadian hunt.


Yeah, there are some crazy laws about bringing stuff over the border. Was watching a show on it a while back. So many things can get you in hot water.



Re: Possession Limit Question?? [Re: PoppinPiggies] #7438674 02/19/19 06:57 PM
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That federal law is also part of an international treaty as well. It rarely changes, and the Feds can't even change it.

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