is the best shotgun shell on the planet next to lead.

Convince me otherwise?

Nopes, its a dirty load


Heavy shot is, there is no substitute

I’d have to agree with Beaver. I only shot 5 black cloud shells out of my o/u last week and I couldn’t believe how dirty the barrels were. Going with hevi shot for tomorrow’s hunt, so I can see the difference.

Patterned well in my old Mossberg, awful patterns in my ATA

My benelli with the Muller choke hated it.
I'm with the other guys, I like the hevi steel.

I'll shoot anything federal puts out with the flite control wad-- it makes for an awesome turkey load and does the same with non-toxics for waterfowl. I shoot it through a slightly more open choke with great results (Carlson extended Light Mod). Never had an issue with it causing jams in a SBEII or Maxus.

I don't think it is a necessity for shooting decoying birds- I normally shoot Winchester silver box or Kent. But when I've been in areas with longer shots or a high chance of geese, nothing handles the #2 black cloud very well.

Hopedale you funny, stop trying to bring back the old days, no one cares about BC any more.

You are correct if you want your duck meat damaged and tenderized before it hits the water

Yup! Same here.

I think it is great that people used to pay $27/box for 3" blackcloud ammo and now you can get it with a rebate for $14/box.

I can't believe people pay $14 for a box of shells when you can get good shells for $8 a box with a rebate or $10 without.

People should spend more time learning how to decoy ducks and shoot better than paying for overpriced shells.

If you can shoot, you do not need Heavy Steel or Black Cloud, neither will make you shoot better.

I guess I show my age, We grew wanting to kill duck and know we fooled them into range. I guess that why the urge to kill birds at 60 yards has not been a great interest. I want to see feet dropped and eye balls over decoys. I have put then in range, have called them in over decoys or snuck up on them on tank dam. I guess this is why the 3.5 , heavy shot, black cloud, etc...did not impress me, but irritated more often than not, I hunted with groups that thought the idea of shooting 60+ yards was going to more birds. All it was is an excuses to sky bust, the limit is 6 ducks = six shells, even if there 2 1/2,2 3/4, 3 & 3.5 inches. Before the ya ya crowd starts I have killed 6 birds in 10 shots with 2 1/2 inches shell, scout, scout and practice calling. I even went on binge as young dump fellow to shot ducks with all the possible gauges I could. The .410 was the question, price and I did not want to cripple birds, I would call then in and shot on the water if possible. So 4 teal with 5 shots, yes called into decoys and watched a lot fly by; I learned to see bird behavior. So the shooter is the key, not that I shot better; I do not want to waste ammo, shred birds, walk 60+ yards to retrieve birds or cripple birds at long ranges from a less than perfect shot on a tight choke. I shot my birds with Kent or the Winchester silver box out off an improved cylinder.

Yes, I did shot lead and it was still one shot one bird.

U can get dove load in nr 6 for $3.99 a box
Excellent for decoying ducks

I wonder how many people have any idea what they are shooting be it barrel design, choke design, load design and the purpose or combination of each outside of the trade names and hype. Shot could be steel, tungsten, blends, duplex. Choke differences like difference between a modified lead choke vs modified steel choke, chokes that intentionally strip wads, chokes that intentionally don't. Barrels true bore diameter, over bored, forcing cone length, etc. Wads that stay with the shot, wads that open faster, etc. Pellets that are round, pellets that are belted, etc. Shell with buffer. How different density or different size pellets act differently in different chokes. Or if shooting a brands Hevi shot, what the true density really is. I bet there are a lot of hunters doing things like shooting BC with wad stripping chokes, BC with IC chokes over decoys, Shooting Hevi Steel thinking they are shooting something more dense than steel. Using a modified Lead Choke with steel and not realizing they are really shooting a full choke, and so on. You have to read past the hype on this stuff.

BTW, I have been shooting Kent Bismuth. Closest thing to lead out there and I killed many a duck with lead in my early waterfowl years.

Kent is good, with a good choke

This year, scouting 4-6 ducks on each pond, i went expensive like tungsten expensive

Other years i had 20-50 ducks on bunches of ponds, so i went cheap loads

This year i had to go with better loads, as i did not have time chasing cripples

I have been hunting for 40 years, and figured out that cheap steel beyond 35-45 yards cripples them too many times

I couldt risk it this year.

Still shooting the same $340 case after 22 hunts

Of course, 16 years of my hunting in europe was all nr 5 lead 2 3/4 and 2 1/2 inch loads
Lead is just so good, its cheap and kills, any other load besides heavy shot will wound them beyond 50 yards

I know, i know, u supposed to shoot decoying ducks decoying within 20 yards, and on 6 hunts it went like that, but this year my shots were mostly well further than that. They are educated

I used to only shoot the cheap Winchester Xpert shells and was extremely inconsistent even on the same hunt. I cut one open one day was surprised to see the [censored] quality of the pellets inside. Hardly any were the same size and most were very misshapen.
I have since switched to a Jebs choke and shoot either #2 or BB Hevi-Steel. It has been an extreme difference in my kill rate per shell.
We kill mostly big ducks which is why I like the larger pellets; no dog and finding them is much easier if they are dead on the water.

To each their own. Every gun, shell, and situation is different for water fowling depending on which part of the state or country you are in.

I agree with you on Xperts, have not shot them in 10 years, had the same issues you did and cut one open to see the crap they put in them one day and never bought another box.
There are many other options in that price range that are very good and have good shot in them.

Rio, Federal, Browning BXD, Fiochi, and sometimes Remingtons, all cheaper when bought at the right time with rebates.

I could care less what anyone else shoots but these arguments are always funny.

I hunt big ducks too, mallards primarily, and never have trouble killing them within 30 yards dead. The problem is the follow up shots when there leaving after your buddy misses and you have take those finish shots 40-50 yards out, sometimes we will cripple them then.