I have a Ruger 77 stainless in 223. Had a Benchmark barrel put on it and everything squared up and cleaned up. Dang gun is gonna make me crazy. When it gets coppered up, there’s no warning at all. You go from little groups to 3 inch groups, instantly. Put Boretech Eliminator in it and it bleeds blue like you cut its throat. Then it’s Ok again. I am not happy. New gun or new barrel, but something is gonna happen next year. I want something like my Tikka 260 with the #4 Brux barrel. Bullet always goes where it should. Neighbor shot the 260 today. He said “Wow”. No kidding.

I like the Ruger Hawkeye, and for 30 or 40 shots it’s right where it should be. But then it parks one out in right field, and you wonder what the h___ just happened. Well, copper happened. Clean it, and you are back into nice groups. So strange.

Well, maybe I’ll sell it or give it to my nephew, for his kids. Or keep it. Or just get a danged Tikka. Something is gonna happen next year. You want this thing? Call me.

What powder and bullet?
What powder charge?
What twist rate?

yep, even "I" would start with a Tikka over a Ruger 77 anytime.

Hang in there maybe Santa will bring you another barrel

Bullet: 40 gr Nosler BT, 55 gr BT, 60 gr Partition, and 65 gr Sierra GK.

Powder: mostly H335, but Varget and AA2230

Brass: Lapua

Primer: CCI BR4

Barrel: #2 contour Benchmark

Twist: 1 in 9

I just cleaned it. Lots of copper. Then I shot a few foulers and a few groups. Groups were small, though I didn’t measure.

If I get a new barrel, I promise you it will be a cut rifled barrel in a heavier profile.

I’ve got a good bit of money in this rifle. It ought to shoot better. Grump grump grump...

some=tings wong

try 24.0 gr varget, 69gr Sierra MatchKings. If this doesnt work,

weigh your trotline with it.

seriously, its hard to make any .223 shoot "bad" Maybe run it by benchmark, they may swap it out.

I have a factory Remington 700 in 17 Remington that will shoot extremely well for about 20 shots before copper fouling get so bad the groups go way off. Solution has been CFE223, still making 4250 with 25 gr bullets and accuracy doesn't start to degrade until at least 80 rounds down the pipe. Hated to mess with a factory gun that shoots .12 to .25 inch groups at 100 yards but wanted to get more than 20 shots before cleaning that tiny tube out.

With the CFE loads brush patch and gun scrubber own the barrel and after a few patches it is back to shooting tiny groups but can get 4X the shots before having to clean it. Just something that has improved the shooting on a bad copper fouler of mine

I have a Benchmark barrel on a 7mm STW with a little over 400 down it and have yet to use a metal removing solvent. It makes 1 hole 5 shot groups at 100 meters and hardly any bigger at 300 meters.

Have you considered using some of the new powders that inhibit copper fouling?

^^^^^^^ Unfortunately I have no idea how to post pictures on this forum.

Edit: Truth be told the rifle looks a little bit silly since I stuck a 30 inch barrel on it. It began life as a Remington 700 VLS stainless in 7 mm STW. I burned out the original barrel it had and had the action blueprinted and a new barrel stuck on it in the same chambering. It still has the original stock that has been that has been beded.

The majority of copper build up will be at the end of the barrel, try using a nylon brush applying forward and backwards strokes to the end of the barrel being careful not go past the end if you haven't tried this method already.

Why so many loads for one rifle?

Have you tried getting it completely clean, then sticking one load in it, and keep running it? Does it do it on every load combo from totally clean to X number of shots?

A .223 should not copper foul that quick, and especially to that extreme with only 30 rounds down the tube. Each barrel will obviously have its own personality, but I’d be getting a hold of Benchmark and/or a bore scope. The way you describe it makes me think something with the bore is out of spec, or just incredibly rough. You didn’t state how many rounds total you had down the barrel. If it’s brand new, it may smooth out as the barrel is seasoned during break in. This just requires a lot of shooting and elbow grease. Lapping is another alternative, though Benchmark barrels are supposed to be hand lapped from the factory. All that said, I would still expect better performance from a Benchmark barrel. I would contact the smith who built the rifle and see what they have to say. They may be able to run a bore scope down the tube and pinpoint the issue. After that, a call to Benchmark to see what they offer.

Fireman, I normally shoot the 40 gr BTs in it. That’s what I bought it for - critter control. But then I decided to shoot a few pigs with it, so I got some 65 gr GKs. And then I tried the 60 gr Partitions for more ‘pig penetration’. This barrel is the second one. The rifle gets shot a bunch, though barrel 1 was replaced when I had the gun accurized, and not because I wore it out.

It’s a pretty accurate rifle when clean, or pretty clean. I like the gun. When accuracy goes bad, I use Boretech Eliminator and get the barrel real clean and then I’m back in business and accurate. If somebody owned it and shot it like a hunting rifle (20 or so times a season), they’d have no complaints. But I shoot it a lot, as do the grandkids and neighbors. Total rounds through it are probably over 1000 and less than 1500 or maybe 2000. That’s a total WAG.

So...options are to keep it and clean it more often and quit bitchin, sell it and get something else, or have a Brux with a heavier profile put on it. I’m leaning toward the new Brux or other cut rifled barrel. That choice is based on my Tikka 260 with the Brux barrel that never seems to have copper in it and shoots into small groups every day and every time.

I can say this with confidence. The button rifled barrels I have owned, and one I still own, need to be cleaned more frequently, than the cut rifled barrels I own. Like, four times more often through a set number of rounds. Example:

Cut rifled 6.5 Creedmoor, 400 rounds, one cleaning.
Cut rifled 7mm-08, 400 rounds, one cleaning.
Button rifled 7mm-08 A.I., 400 rounds, 4 cleanings (every 100).

Once I can take possession of my new suppressor, the 7mm-08 A.I. barrel will get replaced with a Bartlein. Ain't nobody got time for all that cleaning, and then 10 rounds to get it fouled back in!

In any case, with this rifle of yours, I would clean, shoot load #1 and document how many rounds it takes to foul in and shoot, and how many rounds before it is shooting poorly again. Then repeat the process for loads #2, and #3. It might make you settle on one load for the rifle, which is what I do for all of my rifles. Each rifle has its' own lot of powder, a set powder charge, and the same bullet over and over. That is a significant way of removing variables.

Suggestions noted. The 260 shoots 120 gr BTs until I switch to 100 gr BTs for varmint hunting when deer season is over. Other than that rifle, only the 223 has multiple bullets/powders. I’ll do some more shooting today after the wife leaves for a lunch with the ladies. And probably clean it. Next year I’ll either trade it or have it rebarreled. At this moment I’m leaning toward getting a new Tikka, but a new barrel would be cheaper.

Better news. I cleaned it well, fouled it, and let it get nice and cool. Then got an MTM box with known-to-shoot-well 40 gr Nosler BTs. Shot a very nice group. Then loaded up my best load for 60 grain Partitions and it shot very well. All with cold barrel. Ok, I can live with this for a while. Early next year I’ll get a rebarrel with a heavier contour cut rifling barrel.

Just keep it not too coppered and a cold barrel, and all is acceptable.

You could try one of the polishing methods, seems it would help. The barrelmaker should be told about it even if they do nothing.

I’m still tinkering with it, trying this and that. Found some 65 gr Sierra GKs in my pile of bullets, and found notes saying that 24.3 gr of H335 put 3 in one hole a couple years ago. So...I loaded up 5 to try. Put 4 in one hole and I twitched one a touch wide. By golly that bullet will shoot. I figure I can get by for a while with this barrel, and early next year I’ll get a new barrel.

This is and has been a real finicky rifle. I think we all agree that it’s best to know your rifle and learn what the barrel likes, when it fouls, and such as that. I just can’t get that comfort factor with this barrel. Every time I think I have it figured out, it turns out that I’m wrong.

I’m not going to mess with the Benchmark barrel people. I’ll just get a new barrel - heavier profile and cut rifling.

Don't you make fun my beloved Ruger 77 Mr. Buzz!

Ok! With luck, this is my last comment on THAT rifle, and it’s a positive comment. It was shooting rather loose this morning, and I was not happy. Decided to clean it and let it cool down, but this time I left the copper alone and used Shooter’s Choice to get the carbon fouling. Put a couple of foulers through it and let it cool again. And as Gomer would say, “surprise, surprise”. It shot quite well with the 65 gr GKs, 60 gr Partitions, and 40 and 55 gr BTs.

Tomorrow morning, we’ll recheck all of the above. Maybe the demon rifle has been beaten...

I had more trouble finding a good load with a stable powder in 223 than I have with other calibers (primarily my 6.5, which shot almost all loads pretty well). I'd be glad to not load 223 again...

Patriot, I hear ya. My other rifles/calibers have long time determined loads - powder, bullets, primers. And I don’t shoot as many bullet weights and types as I do with the 223. In the 223 I’ve shot weights of 40, 50, 53, 55, 60, 63, 64, 65, and 69. I bought the 223 for front yard/pasture varmint control, so I bought a big sack of 40 gr Nosler BTs. Then I figured that I should shoot some 55 gr BTs too. And then I needed a pig/deer capable bullet, I got some Partitions and 65 gr GKs. As for powders, I tried BL(C)-2, AA2230, Varget, H335, IMR4064, IMR3031, and one or two more. After dealing with the demon rifle for a couple of years and Heaven knows what the round count is, and finally learning what care and cleaning it needs, I found that H335 works best for me. I use it behind the 40 gr BTs, Partitions, and 65 gr GKs. Those are all the bullets I plan to use from now on, and they all shoot great (even the Partition).

I think I now have my lifetime loads for all my rifles, even the demon rifle.

I shoot slot of H335, but I could not get decent groups out of the 65gr SGK or 69gr SMK with the H335. I switched to RL-15 for the heavier bullets and groups shrunk dramatically...