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How many animals you think.... #7235670 07/26/18 12:55 AM
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Were wounded and lost prior to modern smokeless powder cartridges?

Was thinking about this yesterday. I bet there were a ton of animals wounded and lost due to inaccurate rifles, low energy, poor bullets, lack of practice with the weapon, etc

Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: txtrophy85] #7235672 07/26/18 12:58 AM
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731,336

Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: SapperTitan] #7235675 07/26/18 12:59 AM
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Originally Posted By: SapperTitan
731,336


Same number i came up with

Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: RJH1] #7235678 07/26/18 01:01 AM
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Originally Posted By: RJH1
Originally Posted By: SapperTitan
731,336


Same number i came up with
clap


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Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: RJH1] #7235684 07/26/18 01:06 AM
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Originally Posted By: RJH1
Originally Posted By: SapperTitan
731,336


Same number i came up with
Simple algebra LOL

Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: txtrophy85] #7235785 07/26/18 02:28 AM
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And the ones lost from primitive weapons, spears, sharp rocks, driven off cliffs........

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Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: txtrophy85] #7235796 07/26/18 02:38 AM
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I would bet it was fewer than you may think. When those weapons were being used, the people using them were doing so to keep from starving. When that is your motivator, you tend to be a lot more sure about your shot. Also, just because they were using "primitive" weapons, it doesn't mean that they didn't kill efficiently. There is a reason that elk are no longer found in the Eastern states and that whitetails populations were very low in at the turn of the century. Most game animals are not that hard to kill. I have killed deer with a cap and ball pistol.


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Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: txtrophy85] #7235797 07/26/18 02:38 AM
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It could well be that fewer animals were lost in "olden days".

Inaccurate rifles: Well, the Winchester 1866, Winchester 1873 and similar lever guns like the Henry chambered for black powder cartridges like the 44-40 and 45 Colt can hardly be considered inaccurate rifles within the range limit of those cartridges. And certainly the venerable Sharps and Remington Rolling Block rifles in 45-70, 45-90, 44-120, 50-90 were not inaccurate rifles. They were capable of outstanding long range accuracy.

Low energy: Those in the pistol cartridge category would be considered low energy by todays rifle standard. But they certainly have all of the energy necessary for clean 100 yard kills. The big single shot rifle cartridges had plenty enough energy for bison at 300 yards.

Poor bullets: Lead and lead alloy bullets are not poor bullets when used within their velocity limits. Those who used them likely made them work quite well. Whitetails are not that difficult to cleanly kill even with relatively small round balls. Just ask Boon and Crocket.

Lack of practice with the weapon: I suspect todays average hunter has a lot less time behind the trigger over the course of a year than did the average hunter prior to the smokeless cartridge era.

Anyway, that's my take on the subject.


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Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: txtrophy85] #7235816 07/26/18 03:03 AM
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I'd bet more animals have been lost since the introduction of smokeless powder... bolt


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Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: txtrophy85] #7235829 07/26/18 03:23 AM
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I've seen deer killed with a 44-40. It's like a wall hits them.


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Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: txtrophy85] #7235852 07/26/18 03:43 AM
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With like black powder rifles they tended to get in a lot closer as well. Much more then most Texas deer hunters do today.


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Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: txtrophy85] #7235945 07/26/18 11:18 AM
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I would think they were pretty proficient with whatever weapon they were using due to the fact they had to be or they would have went hungry. Shots were much closer since they were actually hunting and not sitting watching a food plot in a bag(feeder) or food plot. Lot more of many of the game animals back then so they had a larger variety to choose from. Lot less pressured animals were probably easier to hunt. They were hunting to eat, usually not for the largest trophy animal out there.



Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: txtrophy85] #7235956 07/26/18 11:39 AM
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I would say more are wounded today by bow hunters who never practice and just start hunting when the season opens.


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Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: Pitchfork Predator] #7235987 07/26/18 12:20 PM
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Originally Posted By: Pitchfork Predator
I would say more are wounded today by bow hunters who never practice and just start hunting when the season opens.


A lot more where probably lost prior to Indians getting the domestic horse.


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Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: txtrophy85] #7235992 07/26/18 12:30 PM
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Originally Posted By: txtrophy85
Were wounded and lost prior to modern smokeless powder cartridges?

Was thinking about this yesterday. I bet there were a ton of animals wounded and lost due to inaccurate rifles, low energy, poor bullets, lack of practice with the weapon, etc


A "ton" is a rather lowball figure, don't you think? Even with modern smokeless powder, no doubt there are many tons of deer lost in my county every deer season, LOL.


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Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: Pitchfork Predator] #7236003 07/26/18 12:44 PM
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Originally Posted By: Pitchfork Predator
I would say more are wounded today by bow hunters who never practice and just start hunting when the season opens.


This. I was on a lease one year in East Texas opening weekend of bow season rolls around,
I set up a Target on Friday and am practicing at 50 yards. These rednecks were astonished and were like I ain't shot my bow in 2 years. Never shot it that far. I guess the record should show that they really did not hunt but rode 4 wheelers all day. Think I hunted that place 2 times and heard 2 wheelers all day everyday.

Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: Pitchfork Predator] #7236015 07/26/18 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted By: Pitchfork Predator
I would say more are wounded today by bow hunters who never practice and just start hunting when the season opens.

I have to agree with Pitchfork on this one.
I also want to say that even though I think I am the best hunter in the woods today, I most likely would be at the bottom of the list when it came to how mountain men hunted.


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Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: Pitchfork Predator] #7236164 07/26/18 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted By: Pitchfork Predator
I would say more are wounded today by bow hunters who never practice and just start hunting when the season opens.


I know a lot of bow hunters and none of them just start hunting right when season opens without practicing....all shoot all thru the year


with that being said, with todays compound bows.....you really don't need to practice alot to be proficient within 30 yards once you have it down



I can pick up my bow not having shot it since the previous season and have zero issue making kill shots at 20 and 30 yards



Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: txtrophy85] #7236182 07/26/18 03:15 PM
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Originally Posted By: txtrophy85
Were wounded and lost prior to modern smokeless powder cartridges?

Was thinking about this yesterday. I bet there were a ton of animals wounded and lost due to inaccurate rifles, low energy, poor bullets, lack of practice with the weapon, etc


I'm currently reading an account written by a cavalry lieutenant stationed in western Nebraska during the Civil War. They routinely hunted buffalo with their Colt 1860 Armies and lost I don't know how many buff.

Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: Choctaw] #7236259 07/26/18 04:32 PM
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Originally Posted By: Choctaw
Originally Posted By: txtrophy85
Were wounded and lost prior to modern smokeless powder cartridges?

Was thinking about this yesterday. I bet there were a ton of animals wounded and lost due to inaccurate rifles, low energy, poor bullets, lack of practice with the weapon, etc


I'm currently reading an account written by a cavalry lieutenant stationed in western Nebraska during the Civil War. They routinely hunted buffalo with their Colt 1860 Armies and lost I don't know how many buff.



No doubt a sharps hunting rifle in .45-90, .50-110 , etc. made more than adequate hunting rifles, and one would assume that majority of hunting took place with them.


but also undoubtably a lot of game was shot and shot at with henry rifles, colt revolvers, .44-40's, 38-40's, etc.

Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: Choctaw] #7236272 07/26/18 04:57 PM
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Originally Posted By: Choctaw
Originally Posted By: txtrophy85
Were wounded and lost prior to modern smokeless powder cartridges?

Was thinking about this yesterday. I bet there were a ton of animals wounded and lost due to inaccurate rifles, low energy, poor bullets, lack of practice with the weapon, etc


I'm currently reading an account written by a cavalry lieutenant stationed in western Nebraska during the Civil War. They routinely hunted buffalo with their Colt 1860 Armies and lost I don't know how many buff.


The Indian War of 1864, by Eugene Ware?

Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: txtrophy85] #7236277 07/26/18 05:00 PM
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Read up on how many buffalo were killed on the great plains with old Sharps rifles in just a few years.

Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: unclebubba] #7236303 07/26/18 05:27 PM
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Originally Posted By: unclebubba
I'd bet more animals have been lost since the introduction of smokeless powder...

^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ THIS ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ more than likely^ ^ ^

i know of more than a few animals that were wasted and never looked
for because the intended target didn't drop in it's tracks the way
they thought it should have. at least one did drop on the
spot, but the shooter didn't see it because he closed his eyes when
he pulled the trigger. when we walked out, there it lay deader than
a bag of hammers.
i'd also add that the hunters from the old days didn't spend all
their hunting time playing with their phones, and they sure weren't
"bored" while they were out in the bush. a "bored" hunter in those
days could end up as a rag covered carcass from not paying attention
to their surroundings.

Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: deerfeeder] #7236316 07/26/18 05:38 PM
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Originally Posted By: deerfeeder
Originally Posted By: Choctaw
Originally Posted By: txtrophy85
Were wounded and lost prior to modern smokeless powder cartridges?

Was thinking about this yesterday. I bet there were a ton of animals wounded and lost due to inaccurate rifles, low energy, poor bullets, lack of practice with the weapon, etc


I'm currently reading an account written by a cavalry lieutenant stationed in western Nebraska during the Civil War. They routinely hunted buffalo with their Colt 1860 Armies and lost I don't know how many buff.


The Indian War of 1864, by Eugene Ware?


Yup.

Re: How many animals you think.... [Re: txtrophy85] #7236360 07/26/18 06:12 PM
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They seemed pretty effective at killing bison in the old days.


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