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Mar 25th, 2012
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Positive Gun Dog training #7139288
04/12/18 05:39 PM
04/12/18 05:39 PM
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jmw2018 Offline OP
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Hi,

I have a 16 week old English Cocker. I am looking for someone in Texas who uses the positive training method (or close to it). I have found a few in states nearby but wanted to check in Texas before making a decision. Thanks!

Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: jmw2018] #7163541
05/08/18 05:50 AM
05/08/18 05:50 AM
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Cliff & Cactus Outfitters Offline
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Curious to learn more about this. The only one I can find is the academy in Colorado. As cool as it sounds it must be the most expensive training option out there... Wish Texas had some options.

Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: jmw2018] #7163796
05/08/18 03:16 PM
05/08/18 03:16 PM
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Abilene, TX
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BradyBuck Online content
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Why?

Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: jmw2018] #7164137
05/08/18 08:54 PM
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mattyg06 Offline
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Robert Milner also teaches with a similar method at Wild Rose kennels which has it's roots in British training methods. Also look into Maurice Lindley, Steady with Style, who also has a similar method.

Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: mattyg06] #7164838
05/09/18 02:52 PM
05/09/18 02:52 PM
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Spring, Tx
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kindall Offline
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Originally Posted By: mattyg06
Robert Milner also teaches with a similar method at Wild Rose kennels which has it's roots in British training methods. Also look into Maurice Lindley, Steady with Style, who also has a similar method.


Mo's methods are not 100% positive, but I sure like the way he trains.



Shopping with your husband is like hunting with the game warden.
Experience is what you get, when you didn't get what you wanted.


Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: kindall] #7165005
05/09/18 05:50 PM
05/09/18 05:50 PM
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Most effective training uses both positive and negative, the mix (balance) used depends on the dog. 100% positive does not even make sense, that would mean never correcting your dog, or even teaching the word ďnoĒ.

I guess what you guys mean is no ecollar?

Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: Guy] #7165316
05/09/18 11:39 PM
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Originally Posted By: Guy
Most effective training uses both positive and negative, the mix (balance) used depends on the dog. 100% positive does not even make sense, that would mean never correcting your dog, or even teaching the word ďnoĒ.

I guess what you guys mean is no ecollar?


Maybe thats what they are after.
But I know Mo uses ecollars, and also FF dogs.



Shopping with your husband is like hunting with the game warden.
Experience is what you get, when you didn't get what you wanted.


Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: jmw2018] #7165569
05/10/18 11:59 AM
05/10/18 11:59 AM
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Abilene, TX
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I don't understand what "the positive training method" means?

It was going to send my dog to a trainer I would look for a trainer that was "fair".

It doesn't matter if you use a collar or not every training method should use both positive and negative techniques.

Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: Guy] #7165940
05/10/18 05:56 PM
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Wise County
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Originally Posted By: Guy
Most effective training uses both positive and negative, the mix (balance) used depends on the dog. 100% positive does not even make sense, that would mean never correcting your dog, or even teaching the word ďnoĒ.

I guess what you guys mean is no ecollar?


Sounds like you described society and school to me!

Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: jmw2018] #7165947
05/10/18 06:09 PM
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Iím 100% positive with mine. 100% positive they will whoa every time if theyíre wearing a shock collar.

Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: scalebuster] #7165966
05/10/18 06:28 PM
05/10/18 06:28 PM
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The Great State
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Originally Posted By: scalebuster
Iím 100% positive with mine. 100% positive they will whoa every time if theyíre wearing a shock collar.

clap

My Brittany seems to hear a helluva lot better with her hearing aid... I mean e-collar on.

There are lots of folks that don't know what they're doing with them tho. Burnin a dog that doesn't understand WTH is going on. realmad


Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: LarryCopper] #7166112
05/10/18 08:35 PM
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There is also a lot of pro trainers out there that use too much force on their dogs. Some dogs deal with it just fine, some dogs deal with it not so good (they have terrified look on their face on a sit whistle), and some dogs canít deal with it at all. The later the trainer says the dog is no good, canít hunt, only good for a pet. I donít buy that.

I use force on my dog, but I also read my dog, and I want that tail wagging on a sit whistle.

Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: jmw2018] #7166172
05/10/18 09:24 PM
05/10/18 09:24 PM
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Texas
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I have a good friend who told me he was going to use positive training on his GSP. He used treats and a clicker. The dog learned quick but he never proofed things. He carries a leash hunting. When he is ready to go to the truck, if his dog is not ready, he has to drag his a$$ back. The dog is happier with the outcome than my buddy.

IMO a solid combination of positive teaching and behavior altering corrections when necessary yield the best results.

You own what you condone.

Last edited by Smokey Bear; 05/10/18 09:28 PM.

Smokey Bear---Lone Star State.
Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: jmw2018] #7166500
05/11/18 02:02 AM
05/11/18 02:02 AM
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Abilene, TX
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Just finished FF a day or two before this video. You can tell she's super scared and is having no fun at all.



Last edited by BradyBuck; 05/11/18 02:05 AM.
Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: jmw2018] #7166502
05/11/18 02:03 AM
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This is a short 17 second video of my girl Molly you may find humorous.

This was 2012, she passed 2015 btw. She was 7 years old at the time, duck youth season out west, her first hunt of the season. We got to motel late Friday night, I pulled ecollar out to charge it up and Molly right there "strap that baby on lets go!". I thought it was funny so I snap a quick video. But this is what you want, dog confident they are in control, ecollor means fun, perform commands quickly and swiftly, no corrections and all fun.


Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: jmw2018] #7167335
05/11/18 10:17 PM
05/11/18 10:17 PM
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I used nearly 100% "positive" training methods be it operant conditioning, behavior shaping, positive reinforcement, clicker training, etc. on my current dog and on my second Vizsla doing so. I have used other training methods with a few other hunting dogs in my life and greatly prefer how I do it now. I do think a combination is best depending on the individual dog. I don't think your going to find a local hunting gun dog trainer focusing entirely on "positive" training methods or even having a full understanding of it. If your serious, I would contact someone like Chad Hines Willow Creek kennels in Minnesota who trains this way. At least two siblings to my dog have spent time there. They have some great instructional youtube videos online if you choose to do your own training. You truly miss out by not doing your own training IMHO.

Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: Guy] #7170764
05/15/18 09:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Guy
This is a short 17 second video of my girl Molly you may find humorous.

This was 2012, she passed 2015 btw. She was 7 years old at the time, duck youth season out west, her first hunt of the season. We got to motel late Friday night, I pulled ecollar out to charge it up and Molly right there "strap that baby on lets go!". I thought it was funny so I snap a quick video. But this is what you want, dog confident they are in control, ecollor means fun, perform commands quickly and swiftly, no corrections and all fun.



That's how my girl acts. My yellow lab, Ruby, wore an e-collar since she was 10 weeks old. I put it on her every time we did something fun and in the field. She wore it for close to 6 full months before it was ever turned on and used on her. Now when I get the e-collar out she comes running because she knows it means fun.

Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: mattyg06] #7170912
05/16/18 12:11 AM
05/16/18 12:11 AM
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Originally Posted by mattyg06
Originally Posted by Guy
This is a short 17 second video of my girl Molly you may find humorous.

This was 2012, she passed 2015 btw. She was 7 years old at the time, duck youth season out west, her first hunt of the season. We got to motel late Friday night, I pulled ecollar out to charge it up and Molly right there "strap that baby on lets go!". I thought it was funny so I snap a quick video. But this is what you want, dog confident they are in control, ecollor means fun, perform commands quickly and swiftly, no corrections and all fun.



That's how my girl acts. My yellow lab, Ruby, wore an e-collar since she was 10 weeks old. I put it on her every time we did something fun and in the field. She wore it for close to 6 full months before it was ever turned on and used on her. Now when I get the e-collar out she comes running because she knows it means fun.


All of mine get fired up when they see the collar and canít wait to get it on, except for my little soft dog Lucy. She never wears one and will mind at a word. She needed it to get her to honor another dog and wants no part of it. She never busted a bird this year and wonít work with harsh training.
My top dog Kate wore one all season but I donít remember juicing her all year. Itís amazing how much better she can hear with it on. Sheís smart and would probably work fine without one but I like an immediate response. Sheís much slower to mind without the collar on when sheís running on the pasture at my house.
My Shorthair Bonnie gets the electricity on a regular basis. She is young and if you want her to listen a mild stimulation beats the hell out of telling her repeatedly. Every dog is different and you and your hunting partners will be much happier if youíre not constantly hollering and repeating commands. Youíll enjoy your days in the field or blind much more if you have the option of a shock collar. A lot of great dogs would wash out if it werenít for good collars. I remember the days before we had good collars and having to beat the sht out of hard heads to get them to mind. The collar is the only way to go for most dogs and fixes problems quickly. I use a hands on approach to train a pup but once they know a command they should obey it the first time. Anyhow thatís my book report on negative reinforcement.

Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: mattyg06] #7174094
05/19/18 02:53 PM
05/19/18 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by mattyg06
Originally Posted by Guy
This is a short 17 second video of my girl Molly you may find humorous.

This was 2012, she passed 2015 btw. She was 7 years old at the time, duck youth season out west, her first hunt of the season. We got to motel late Friday night, I pulled ecollar out to charge it up and Molly right there "strap that baby on lets go!". I thought it was funny so I snap a quick video. But this is what you want, dog confident they are in control, ecollor means fun, perform commands quickly and swiftly, no corrections and all fun.



That's how my girl acts. My yellow lab, Ruby, wore an e-collar since she was 10 weeks old. I put it on her every time we did something fun and in the field. She wore it for close to 6 full months before it was ever turned on and used on her. Now when I get the e-collar out she comes running because she knows it means fun.


My lab is the same way. He gets excited when I pull it out and behaves slightly better (he does really well without it when playing fetch in the backyard, too).


Originally Posted By: bill oxner
I just turned it on . I was looking bird dogs in the butt this morning.


Re: Positive Gun Dog training [Re: jmw2018] #7181018
05/27/18 10:48 AM
05/27/18 10:48 AM
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Texas
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USscott Offline
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Many of you posting here need to realize there is a huge difference in the spaniel breeds in and of themselves. You would NOT approach training an English Cocker Spaniel the same way you would a Brittany
or a Boykin. Whole different process. Add to that... seeking out a positive methodology or aversive approach
is highly dependent upon the individual student in the case of spaniels. This is a breed that requires a WHOLE lot of experience gathered over years. As such there are only 2-3 nation wide that truly specializes in this breed. It is in the best interest of the canine to go to one of these programs and not be limited to just Texas.


Conservation is using a well trained retriever.
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