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Mar 25th, 2012
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FL sizing question #7068217
02/06/18 06:58 PM
02/06/18 06:58 PM
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Buzzsaw Offline OP
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I know, really??? while FL sizing my 6.5 Creedmoor brass. It takes allot of force to size them up and back down. I mean like trying to loosen a rusted on lug nut!!! Here is my process

1. tumble brass clean

2. Redding FL sizer NOT a bushing die. It does have the carbide sizer button, supposed to eliminate the need for inside neck lube.

3. Lube with Redding sizing wax or Imperial. I try to keep the wax on the case body only, do you guys coat the whole case?

4. Redding Big Boss II press.

5. when I run a lubed case up into the die it is pretty hard and feels like it almost is scratching the cases but doesn't show it. When I bring it back down there is allot of resistance coming back through the sizer button. Sometimes it feels like I'm gonna stick a case. I haven't used ONE SHOT in years, messy, hell, its all messy

6. I'm bumping shoulder back just so the bolt closes easily.

Sound normal?

Thought about sending the die back to Redding to see if it needs polishing. I clean the sizer after every 15-20 rounds or so to get left over lube off, etc. from what I can see, it looks fine confused2


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Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7068228
02/06/18 07:02 PM
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It's the sizer button. Carbide or not I've found this typical.


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Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7068236
02/06/18 07:05 PM
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I use ONE SHOT and have never experienced what youre describing. I do get the top 2/3 of the case if not more and inside the neck. The only time I skip lube is on straight wall carbide die sizing. I should clean my dies more often than I do but truth is I may load several hundred rounds without cleaning the dies. Never an issue.

Did stick a case once turning 35 whelen into 338-06. No fun.

Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7068257
02/06/18 07:16 PM
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Thanks guys, yea, its almost like I'm forming a new case. I'll put the
"stock" button back in and try One Shot.


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Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7068275
02/06/18 07:28 PM
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Better stay with the regular lube, rather than switch to the Hornady ďOne StickĒ. Remember that I warned you...

Re: FL sizing question [Re: 603Country] #7068318
02/06/18 07:47 PM
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Originally Posted By: 603Country
Better stay with the regular lube, rather than switch to the Hornady “One Stick”. Remember that I warned you...
up


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Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7068358
02/06/18 08:14 PM
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Lube is beneficial on the inside and outside of the neck, as well as the body of the case.

It should take some pressure, but on a 6.5 CM nothing particularly hard.

Even on a big case like a 338 LM, not very much pressure is required.

Use more lube.

Check runout on the neck before and after sizing. Should be 0.001" or less after sizing, otherwise something is wrong.

Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7068499
02/06/18 10:12 PM
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On my 7mm08 it is pretty smooth and easy but on my 300 win mag, sometimes it can be a real bugger. Just FYI



Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7068837
02/07/18 02:18 AM
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Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7068852
02/07/18 02:27 AM
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DO NOT leave case lube inside the mouth, and then load a bullet!!!

It will throw off your pressures and drastically effect your speeds.



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Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7069010
02/07/18 04:32 AM
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Buzz,
try using these to adjust the die to set the shoulder back 0.0015Ē - 0.003Ē max.

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/101274...with-comparator


Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7069019
02/07/18 05:04 AM
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To answer your question, yes I lube the shoulder and neck as well as the body, but very lightly on the shoulder or you will get dimples.

I would partial FL resize instead of "full" FL resize just to extend case life. I doubt FL sizing would make sizing much harder though.


Re: FL sizing question [Re: GLC] #7069049
02/07/18 08:34 AM
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Originally Posted By: GLC
On my 7mm08 it is pretty smooth and easy but on my 300 win mag, sometimes it can be a real bugger. Just FYI


I donít know if this is the case or not, but Iíll toss it out there as a possibility. I have limited experience hand loading, and Iíve always used the collet die, so I canít compare. I bet someone like Chad or JG could elaborate.

Thereís a collet die made by Innovative Technologies for resizing belted cases just above the belt. The idea behind it is that all resizing dies push brass towards the belt and never quite reach this area to size it, creating a bulge. The collet die resizes just this portion of the case to bring it back to proper dimensions and extend case life. It can also be slid on the case backwards to check if it even needs it or not. I can confirm that it does what it is supposed to do, but I couldnít say for sure that it is necessary or if that could have anything to do with your difficulty in sizing a belted case. Like I said, Iíve always used it, so I canít say for sure that itís actually beneficial. I do know that a lot of people have claimed that it has solved problems for them, but a lot of people reload belted cases many times without issue and without the collet die.


Re: FL sizing question [Re: FiremanJG] #7069062
02/07/18 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
DO NOT leave case lube inside the mouth, and then load a bullet!!!

It will throw off your pressures and drastically effect your speeds.
Seemed like in another thread it was mentioned to tumble the brass again after sizing to remove lube inside the neck, if I remember correctly. Is that a reasonable approach?

Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7069096
02/07/18 12:17 PM
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Yes.

Re: FL sizing question [Re: patriot07] #7069278
02/07/18 02:39 PM
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Originally Posted By: patriot07
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
DO NOT leave case lube inside the mouth, and then load a bullet!!!

It will throw off your pressures and drastically effect your speeds.
Seemed like in another thread it was mentioned to tumble the brass again after sizing to remove lube inside the neck, if I remember correctly. Is that a reasonable approach?


Yes, I do this, then run a brush in and out or a qtip

I should have someone film me doing the process, you could see what I'm talking about. It may be normal. Hell I cant make an expensive bullet shoot good, I dam sure cant figure out a YouTube post hammer


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Re: FL sizing question [Re: postoak] #7069285
02/07/18 02:42 PM
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Originally Posted By: postoak
To answer your question, yes I lube the shoulder and neck as well as the body, but very lightly on the shoulder or you will get dimples.

I would partial FL resize instead of "full" FL resize just to extend case life. I doubt FL sizing would make sizing much harder though.



Its funny you mention "dimples" thee only cases which dimple bad are the Hornady, they suck. The NORMA are really great and the new ALPHA are really good too.

I did stretch out the primer pockets a bit with my excessive pressure trial loads. I got primer flow and the ejector rubbed "bright" spot, along with the old stiff bolt lift


"I ain't here for a long time, I'm here for a good time"
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Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7069297
02/07/18 02:48 PM
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Buzz, take the button off and resize it, see if problem goes away.

Check the thickness of the case body on shoulder and on case head on unsized fired brass and virgin brass, what are the difference in measurements?

Last edited by TackDriver; 02/07/18 02:51 PM.
Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7069342
02/07/18 03:16 PM
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You don't have to remove the One Shot from the case mouth...that is the beauty of the stuff. It's all I use but I use it much like Chad said and never force a case in a die. I also don't own but 1 die that has it's expander button still on it...it's my last non-bushing die to replace, I just don't shoot it enough to justify the costs.

My guess is taking the expander button off a full size die that isn't a bushing die will result in too much neck tension.


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Re: FL sizing question [Re: Judd] #7069350
02/07/18 03:20 PM
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Originally Posted By: Judd
You don't have to remove the One Shot from the case mouth...that is the beauty of the stuff. It's all I use but I use it much like Chad said and never force a case in a die. I also don't own but 1 die that has it's expander button still on it...it's my last non-bushing die to replace, I just don't shoot it enough to justify the costs.

My guess is taking the expander button off a full size die that isn't a bushing die will result in too much neck tension.


Yup. Could get an expander mandrel and set tension but you're still overworking the brass imo vs a set bushing.


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Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7069358
02/07/18 03:30 PM
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sorry for my ignorance

so, I can take the "stem completely out and FL resize. Then, would i need a de-capper die?


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Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7069359
02/07/18 03:30 PM
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You could always turn case necks to make that work.




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Re: FL sizing question [Re: Sneaky] #7069371
02/07/18 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted By: Sneaky
Originally Posted By: GLC
On my 7mm08 it is pretty smooth and easy but on my 300 win mag, sometimes it can be a real bugger. Just FYI


I donít know if this is the case or not, but Iíll toss it out there as a possibility. I have limited experience hand loading, and Iíve always used the collet die, so I canít compare. I bet someone like Chad or JG could elaborate.

Thereís a collet die made by Innovative Technologies for resizing belted cases just above the belt. The idea behind it is that all resizing dies push brass towards the belt and never quite reach this area to size it, creating a bulge. The collet die resizes just this portion of the case to bring it back to proper dimensions and extend case life. It can also be slid on the case backwards to check if it even needs it or not. I can confirm that it does what it is supposed to do, but I couldnít say for sure that it is necessary or if that could have anything to do with your difficulty in sizing a belted case. Like I said, Iíve always used it, so I canít say for sure that itís actually beneficial. I do know that a lot of people have claimed that it has solved problems for them, but a lot of people reload belted cases many times without issue and without the collet die.


From my experience and talking with others about loading belted cases, the bulging is from FL sizing the whole case to the belt. If you are just bumping the should back a few thousandths its not an issues. I have 300 win cases with 5 loads on them and never had the bulging issue.


Re: FL sizing question [Re: Buzzsaw] #7069407
02/07/18 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted By: Buzzsaw
so, I can take the "stem completely out and FL resize. Then, would i need a de-capper die?


Buzz, if you take out the expander ball during FL resizing, the case neck will be very tight. The ideal is that the expander ball controls amount of neck tension after sizing when you pull the case back out after FL sizing. If you measure this difference, it will be a lot of neck tension. I would not recommend this. Just lube up the cases, inside and out, and call it good, and use the expander ball. FL resizing will work just fine.



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Re: FL sizing question [Re: Teal28] #7069496
02/07/18 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted By: Teal28
Originally Posted By: Sneaky
Originally Posted By: GLC
On my 7mm08 it is pretty smooth and easy but on my 300 win mag, sometimes it can be a real bugger. Just FYI


I donít know if this is the case or not, but Iíll toss it out there as a possibility. I have limited experience hand loading, and Iíve always used the collet die, so I canít compare. I bet someone like Chad or JG could elaborate.

Thereís a collet die made by Innovative Technologies for resizing belted cases just above the belt. The idea behind it is that all resizing dies push brass towards the belt and never quite reach this area to size it, creating a bulge. The collet die resizes just this portion of the case to bring it back to proper dimensions and extend case life. It can also be slid on the case backwards to check if it even needs it or not. I can confirm that it does what it is supposed to do, but I couldnít say for sure that it is necessary or if that could have anything to do with your difficulty in sizing a belted case. Like I said, Iíve always used it, so I canít say for sure that itís actually beneficial. I do know that a lot of people have claimed that it has solved problems for them, but a lot of people reload belted cases many times without issue and without the collet die.


From my experience and talking with others about loading belted cases, the bulging is from FL sizing the whole case to the belt. If you are just bumping the should back a few thousandths its not an issues. I have 300 win cases with 5 loads on them and never had the bulging issue.


+1

My .300 WM cases measure .509" base diameter before firing and .514" after firing. They will chamber as long as I set the shoulder back .003-.005" and don't seat the bullet out too far.

I think what has been suggested is to try, just as an experiment, to FL size without any decapping/ neck expanding, just to see if the pressure eases up considerably.


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