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Mar 25th, 2012
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selecting bullet and barrel combo #7060527
01/31/18 09:03 PM
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Friday I will be going to Alamo to speak with them about re-barreling my 308 to another 308. I have never had this done and seek advise. The job of this rifle is to shoot targets as far as 800 and possibly hunt in the future. I have heard it's better to choose a bullet then build around that. I'd like to load a hunting bullet rather than a target bullet for several reasons. I'm considering Berger VLD 175 or 185gr, Hornady ELD-X 178gr, and Nosler Accubond LR 168gr. Please recommend others that would suit this purpose. I'm considering 24-26 inches of bull barrel as I don't plan to make hikes across great distances with it. I'm thinking 1:11 twist will be good to stabilize bullets of the 168-200 grain variety. Feel free to point out things I may be overlooking and make recommendations of any sort. That is the purpose of this thread after all. I don't want to say after spending about $800, "I should have...".
Thanks for the input,
Gary

Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7060542
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Rebarreling is really easy. If you are dead set on the 308, I'm not going to unpersuade you. I shoot more 308 than any other caliber. But if you were going to set up a rifle on a short action with a standard bolt face for long range (600 yards +), I'd lean you towards a 7mm-08. The 7mm bullet options have much higher BC's than the 308 options do, and you can launch them faster. More velocity and higher BC means flatter trajectory, less wind drift, and more energy on target at extended distances.

A 162 ELD-M or even a 150 grain ELD-X would make a very nice dual purpose round. Sure, the 6.5mm options are good, but the heavier bullets do make a difference further out. I'd go 7mm-08, unless you are dead set on the 308.



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Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7060580
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X2 on the 7-08. Ive shot and loaded for both.


As far as the barrel length 24-26Ē would be strictly cosmetic. Much research has been done as to the 308 and barrel length. Iím fairly certain 20-22Ē will burn any powder you can safely put in it and have less harmonics. Theoretically more accurate.

My tikka CTR in 308 has a 1:11 twist. No issues stabilizing the Hornady 178s but I was definitely pushing that load.

Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7060715
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X3 on the 7-08. 1:9 twist. 24Ē for 150 eld-x or 26Ē for 162 eld-x or 168 Berger VLD

Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7060901
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7mm-08, 7mm-08, 7mm-08!!!! nuts

1:9" twist, 162 gr ELD-X

It'll shoot far, hit hard, wash your truck, do your laundry, and clean the dishes.



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Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: ChadTRG42] #7061035
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Originally Posted By: ChadTRG42
Rebarreling is really easy. If you are dead set on the 308, I'm not going to unpersuade you. I shoot more 308 than any other caliber. But if you were going to set up a rifle on a short action with a standard bolt face for long range (600 yards +), I'd lean you towards a 7mm-08. The 7mm bullet options have much higher BC's than the 308 options do, and you can launch them faster. More velocity and higher BC means flatter trajectory, less wind drift, and more energy on target at extended distances.

A 162 ELD-M or even a 150 grain ELD-X would make a very nice dual purpose round. Sure, the 6.5mm options are good, but the heavier bullets do make a difference further out. I'd go 7mm-08, unless you are dead set on the 308.


Canít argue with that.


Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: Sneaky] #7061044
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Originally Posted By: Sneaky
Originally Posted By: ChadTRG42
Rebarreling is really easy. If you are dead set on the 308, I'm not going to unpersuade you. I shoot more 308 than any other caliber. But if you were going to set up a rifle on a short action with a standard bolt face for long range (600 yards +), I'd lean you towards a 7mm-08. The 7mm bullet options have much higher BC's than the 308 options do, and you can launch them faster. More velocity and higher BC means flatter trajectory, less wind drift, and more energy on target at extended distances.

A 162 ELD-M or even a 150 grain ELD-X would make a very nice dual purpose round. Sure, the 6.5mm options are good, but the heavier bullets do make a difference further out. I'd go 7mm-08, unless you are dead set on the 308.


Canít argue with that.


You could....just wouldnít make near as much sense clap

Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7061119
02/01/18 03:21 AM
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Put it this way.

I have one 6.5 Creedmoor
I have one .308 Win
I have two 7mm-08 (one is A.I.)

I was tasked with guiding two friends in rifle builds. Their goals were target long range, killing out to 500 yards, short action. Both of them are shooting a 7mm 162 gr ELD-X. Again 7mm-08 A.I.

But the standard 7mm-08 is no slouch. It can drive a 162 gr at 2700 fps MV, with a 24" barrel. Cheats the wind like a 140 gr 6.5mm, delivers more foot pounds than the 6.5mm and .308 Win past 300 yards.

Force me to use one short action cartridge to do it all, 7mm-08.

Tomorrow, or Friday, I will probably shoot the remaining 162's I have. I will have brass to clean, anneal, size, trim. Then I have a box of 150 gr ELD-X I will find a load for, just because I want to see what it will do. Then I will order more 162's or 150's depending on what I find out with the 150's.



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Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7061710
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1. 7mm-08 uses same bolt as 308, yes?
2. At what length barrel are commonly used powders burnt in 7mm-08, meaning max barrel length required?
3. Can I make 7mm-08 out of 308 brass?
4. If I choose 7mm-08 AI, I must form these cases. Do standard loaded rounds produce good results while forming AI?
5. What happened to the love for 308?

Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7061714
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Originally Posted By: garyrapp55
1. 7mm-08 uses same bolt as 308, yes?
2. At what length barrel are commonly used powders burnt in 7mm-08, meaning max barrel length required?
3. Can I make 7mm-08 out of 308 brass?
4. If I choose 7mm-08 AI, I must form these cases. Do standard loaded rounds produce good results while forming AI?
5. What happened to the love for 308?


1- yes
2-whatever barrel length you want
3-Yes 7-08 is a necked down 308 case
4-Yes, you have to fire form brass cases. Yes, standard loads will shoot very good during fire forming.
5-There's plenty of love for the 308 still. But there are better bullets available than the 308 now in the same size case.



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Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: ChadTRG42] #7061728
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Originally Posted By: ChadTRG42
Originally Posted By: garyrapp55
1. 7mm-08 uses same bolt as 308, yes?
2. At what length barrel are commonly used powders burnt in 7mm-08, meaning max barrel length required?
3. Can I make 7mm-08 out of 308 brass?
4. If I choose 7mm-08 AI, I must form these cases. Do standard loaded rounds produce good results while forming AI?
5. What happened to the love for 308?


1- yes
2-whatever barrel length you want
3-Yes 7-08 is a necked down 308 case
4-Yes, you have to fire form brass cases. Yes, standard loads will shoot very good during fire forming.
5-There's plenty of love for the 308 still. But there are better bullets available than the 308 now in the same size case.


3. You can also make 7mm-08 brass out of .243, and .260 Rem.

4. 7mm-08 A.I. shoots terrific while fire formimg. I went through it with 3 rifles last year. Easily half-MOA while forming. Once formed they shot even tighter, and significantly faster. 24" barrels gained 120 fps at the muzzle, on fired brass.

5. When you care about BC, the 7mm rules, over the .308 Win. And the short action 6.5's.



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Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7061750
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Originally Posted By: garyrapp55
1. 7mm-08 uses same bolt as 308, yes?
2. At what length barrel are commonly used powders burnt in 7mm-08, meaning max barrel length required?
3. Can I make 7mm-08 out of 308 brass?
4. If I choose 7mm-08 AI, I must form these cases. Do standard loaded rounds produce good results while forming AI?
5. What happened to the love for 308?

In regards to 5. The main advantage it has is ammo is everywhere. I am not sure there is an ammo retailer in the us that doesnít have 308. However most have 7mm-08 imo.

But if you reload there is no reason not to go 7mm.

Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: FiremanJG] #7061756
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Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
3. You can also make 7mm-08 brass out of .243, and .260 Rem.

Yeah, I went backwards on some 243 to 308, just to see. Only 1 of about 10 was crushed. I think I might be sold on the 7AI, I will discuss with Alamo tomorrow. I can't imagine they don't have that reamer. If I choose 7mm, I'm thinking 24" A.I. barrel, 1:9 twist so I can run some 150+ grain projectiles. Regardless, am I missing anything? Thank you gents for all your help.
Gary

Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7061775
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What do you make of this statement.
" if you intend to hand load for better accuracy, then throating to a dummy round is the ticket. When you send us dummy rounds to throat to you are, in effect, asking us to make the chamber to fit your ammunition instead of you being required to make your ammunition to fit the chamber"

This was in regards to the free bore of certain Wheatherbys. Any reason to consider for others?

Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7061789
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162 gr. ELD-X 7mm-08 A.I.
O.A.L. 2.840"

That tells me I don't have a long thoat. Fits in an A.I. magazine fine.



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Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7061802
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That 7mm-08ai sure is fun!


"A vote is like a rifle; it's usefulness depends on the character of the user" Theodore Roosevelt
Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: dee] #7061807
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Originally Posted By: dee
That 7mm-08ai sure is fun!


Like you know!


peep



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Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7061837
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Originally Posted By: garyrapp55
What do you make of this statement.
" if you intend to hand load for better accuracy, then throating to a dummy round is the ticket. When you send us dummy rounds to throat to you are, in effect, asking us to make the chamber to fit your ammunition instead of you being required to make your ammunition to fit the chamber"

This was in regards to the free bore of certain Wheatherbys. Any reason to consider for others?


Yes. The short action rounds are important to make sure the bullet you plan to run will fit and feed out of the magazine. I have seen shooters build a full custom rifle and plan to shoot a certain bullet. But the gun smith building the rifle uses a standard SAAMI reamer, which often has a long throat, and the bullet the customer wants to shoot won't fit in the magazine correctly. So, yes, if you plan to shoot a certain bullet and you want to verify that it will fit in your magazine and still chamber correctly, the dummy rounds are a wise choice.



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Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7061960
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Hey Gary, I just had a standard 7-08 built by Alamo and have a full season under its belt. If you have any questions about chamber specs and performance , let me know and Iíll PM you my number. Mineís got a 20Ē barrel.

Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: cblackall] #7061981
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Originally Posted By: cblackall
Hey Gary, I just had a standard 7-08 built by Alamo and have a full season under its belt. If you have any questions about chamber specs and performance , let me know and Iíll PM you my number.

cblackall, thanks, I may reach out to you after my conversation tomorrow with Alamo. All I really want to know, (I'm sure it's my anxiety eating me, I'm sure it will be fine) is the distance from ogive to lands. I don't want the throat too deep. I can't imagine shooting over a 175 grain bullet.

Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7062006
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I had the same questions. All they could provide me with were reamer specs, which were really difficult to decipher. Iím not sure about the AI, but their standard 7-08 is a PTG SAMMI spec reamer. It has a super long throat. I believe my OAL with a 162 ELD M was 2.935 kissing the lands. I went with an AI style magazine, and am loading to 2.860. I could go longer, but Iíd have to notch my receiver which Alamo refused to do. My Accurate mags allow 2.890 with the binder plate, and 2.950 without. Even jumping that far, it still shoots great, which is why I havenít bothered notching the receiver myself...yet.

Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7062051
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I know a guy with a tighter throat A.I. reamer. It has chambered three barrels, only.

162 gr and H-Varget is where it's at!



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Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: FiremanJG] #7062063
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Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
I know a guy with a tighter throat A.I. reamer. It has chambered three barrels, only.

162 gr and H-Varget is where it's at!


Well, if Alamo can't get me hooked up, we'll be talking about your guy.

Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: garyrapp55] #7063249
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FiremanJG, clean out your PM's, you can't accept anymore, or shoot me one please sir.

Re: selecting bullet and barrel combo [Re: FiremanJG] #7063384
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Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
I know a guy with a tighter throat A.I. reamer. It has chambered three barrels, only.

162 gr and H-Varget is where it's at!


What he said!!!! up


Maybe Today.
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