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Mar 25th, 2012
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Accubond not expanding? #7034109
01/11/18 02:55 PM
01/11/18 02:55 PM
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corps2010 Offline OP
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Having some issues with some Accubonds not expanding (or so I think).. I'm shooting a .300 RUM @ 3,525 avg. fps with 150 grain handloads. The last 2 deer I've shot, both had pass thru's and went 65-75 yards before expiring. No blood trail (chest cavity was full) and entry hole was the size of a nickel and exit was the size of a quarter on both deer. First buck was facing me and entry was 1" right of center and exit came out his anus. (125 yd shot). Second buck was broadside, entry was front left shoulder, slightly quartering to me, exit was tight behind off shoulder (175 yd shot)... maybe I need to start shooting them thru both front shoulders?? Thinking of switching bullets (Bergers) but curious what everyone's thoughts were on why the entry/exit holes are so small and why I wasn't getting DRT results??

Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7034131
01/11/18 03:04 PM
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DRT typically means you hit the central nervous system head, neck, spine etc. I have shot several deer/hogs through both shoulders with larger calibers 270+ that dropped dead in their tracks.

I have never used accubonds but used to shoot 140 bt's in my 270. Entry was always caliber in the vitals looked like a bomb when off and a 1/4 size exit my theory was that the bullet shed enough of its weight size and energy that it just didn't tear a huge hole on the way out, but that's just speculation I don't know. At 3500 fps you surely have plenty velocity to initiate expansion!


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Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7034132
01/11/18 03:04 PM
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Accubonds expand but stay together. Perhaps quarter inch exit holes are all you can expect. I wouldn't really have a problem with that. Why they were able to run so far is beyond me but I wouldn't switch bullets just yet.


Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7034173
01/11/18 03:23 PM
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I've gotten the same modest entry and exit on deer with 140 Accubonds in my .264, but the entire chest cavity was soup. Never had one run more than 50 feet. No complaint here.


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Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7034175
01/11/18 03:25 PM
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I've brain panned 5 hogs with my accubonds this season with 3 shots (two were pass throughs and killed the hog on the backside) and they were DRT. I shot a doe quartering away and it went through lungs and smashed exit shoulder (melted the insides) and she ran 30 yards with a phenomenal blood trail (did not have massive entry/exit holes). I shot a gobbler and it basically trashed the bird DRT. I have yet to test them at long distance but so far I like them. I'm hand loading berger VLD's to try in the off season. I did shoot a lone boar in the neck and it attempted to exit on the front shoulder but never made it out. Pancaked itself into the exit leg.

Last edited by HoldPoint; 01/11/18 03:26 PM.
Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7034189
01/11/18 03:37 PM
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I had a 160 Accubond, out of my 7 Mag at 3,140 fps, blow through a 10 pointer, both entry and exit at the crease behind the shoulders, left a 1 inch exit, little blood trail on the start, more midway and found him 40 yards in the brush. It took off like Bolt on a relay. Insides was mushy. A few week later, another 160 Accubond through the ears of a 200 plus boar, left a .40 caliber sized ear piercing on the ear on exit and DRT. I don't have issues with it, but it seems that the Accubond holds up pretty well and mushroomed nicely without grenade -ing inside before the exit like Ballistic Tips do.

Why would you use a 150 grain bullet with a 300 RUM? Go heavier.

Last edited by TackDriver; 01/11/18 03:38 PM.
Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7034227
01/11/18 03:59 PM
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My 2 cents on this is at that speed you are getting expansion but the petals of the bullet are coming off inside the body and what you are seeing exit is the base of the bullet. The animal is dead so result is satisfactory but you might move up bullet weight if you want a bigger exit hole.

Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7034229
01/11/18 04:00 PM
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So you can get 3500 fps.


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Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: Eyesofahunter] #7034230
01/11/18 04:00 PM
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Originally Posted By: Eyesofahunter
My 2 cents on this is at that speed you are getting expansion but the petals of the bullet are coming off inside the body and what you are seeing exit is the base of the bullet. The animal is dead so result is satisfactory but you might move up bullet weight if you want a bigger exit hole.


I agree.


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Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7034238
01/11/18 04:05 PM
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Sounds to me like they are working perfectly. Dead animal, quarter size exit...

Central nervous or breaking bones is your other option. Trail 60 yards or throw away bloodshot meat? Hmmm... I will trail for 60 yards.


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Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7034239
01/11/18 04:05 PM
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The accubonds are a tough bullet and designed to hold together. So what's happening is the bullet is expanding, mushrooming out, holding together and penetrating deep and giving you an exit. That's exactly what it was designed for. (I'm actually surprised it's holding together that good with these speeds!!)

The interior of the deer will be mush, since the speeds are so high. But DRT shots often come from CNS shots, or sometimes a good heart hit.

If you are looking for carnage type wound channels and nasty exit wounds, you are shooting the wrong bullet (I can believe I'm telling someone an Accubond is the wrong bullet!!). Berger VLD's or a good soft point will give you those results. IMO, 150 grain is way too light for a RUM. (You have what I call a Ricky Bobby load- "I wanna go fast!") It would not be what I recommend, but...



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Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: ChadTRG42] #7034262
01/11/18 04:18 PM
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I think you're correct on all accounts. I've used factory HSM ammo in the past using 168 grain bergers and they did decent but would shed almost all their weight and have no exit. (which is what they're designed to do if I'm reading that right). I'm probably going to go up in weight to a 210 grain VLD bullet with my next batch. I'm thinking that will give me the DRT results and an exit would as well. (I think the Accubonds are going so fast that the animal isn't soaking up all the energy the RUM has and punching a hole in and out). I'm open to anymore suggestions??

Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: Texasteach] #7034280
01/11/18 04:31 PM
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Originally Posted By: Texasteach
Sounds to me like they are working perfectly. Dead animal, quarter size exit...

Central nervous or breaking bones is your other option. Trail 60 yards or throw away bloodshot meat? Hmmm... I will trail for 60 yards.


Agreed.

Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7034304
01/11/18 04:50 PM
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Quarter size exit tells me they are expanding. Chest full of blood but no blood trail tells me that they were bleeding out, it's just that they died before the chest cavity filled up with blood to the point of the hole, and therefore did not leak out. If you want DRT results, you need to hit the central nervous system. Try a high shoulder shot. As Chad said, if you're looking for carnage and blowing whole shoulders off, then you have the wrong bullet. Accubonds are designed to expand, but hold together. IMO, you have the right bullet, and it is doing it's job.


Originally Posted By: txhuntingguide
If I choose to hunt in a coon tail hat, a pink tootoo and hip waders that is my fine...
Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: Eyesofahunter] #7034440
01/11/18 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted By: Eyesofahunter
My 2 cents on this is at that speed you are getting expansion but the petals of the bullet are coming off inside the body and what you are seeing exit is the base of the bullet. The animal is dead so result is satisfactory but you might move up bullet weight if you want a bigger exit hole.


My experience with Accubonds is that there are no petals. These bullets mushroom perfectly, and stay together.


Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7034546
01/11/18 07:42 PM
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bump up to at least 168 gr for a bigger hole. Agree with Postoak Accubonds don't petal they mushroom.
larger gr bullet will give you a larger mushroom and a bigger exit.


Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7034850
01/11/18 11:43 PM
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Hopefully one of you can tell me about my experience with Nosler Trophy Grade 110 gr. Accubonds in my 257 Roberts. The 1st 2 deer I shot this year was with the 110 gr. factory loads. Both deer responded in the same way. Very little sign of blood showing where I shot them at. Both deer ran like they were heart shot. Both deer didn't start really bleeding for 50 yds. or so and there would be a pile of blood in 6-10" circles about every 15-20 yds. We didn't look for the 1st deer for almost 2 hrs. following the shot and it took almost an hour after that to find the 1st real spot of blood. Blood played out after 100 yds or so and we used a young dog which had been used to find several deer and when the blood played out, the dog acted like he couldn't smell it any longer.

The 2nd deer bled the same way. We used another dog on this one (a really nice buck). The dog acted like he was on the track for Lord knows how long after the blood played out. On this deer, the 1st 8" or so spot of blood we found had some matter in it that looked like lung but obviously not or I think we would have found it. We looked for the deer for almost 5 hours before giving up. It made me sick to my stomach. I wanted so bad to kill one with the Roberts, but I didn't go back to the woods for over a week. Next trip I took my 25/06 and dropped a buck in its tracks.

After the 1st deer, I went and made sure the rifle was still "on" before I took it back to the woods and chalked the 1st one up to shooter error (still not saying it wasn't). However, even though I am not the world's greatest shot, it has been years since I had missed one and in almost 50 yrs. of hunting I can only recall 2 deer that I had hit and not gotten over those years. Also, shooting for the shoulder it seems like if I had shot low there should have been white hair and if I had shot high shoulder it should have dropped there. With that bullet and speed out of that round what would the bullet had done if it hit the shoulder blade? Please, no one tell me if I had hit them right I would have gotten them. Not saying I didn't, but for both to have bled the same way it is just an odd deal to me. Thanks for anyone's help...Eddie

Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7034897
01/12/18 12:29 AM
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An Accubond pushed hard will sometimes shed the front of the bullet much like a partition does. Particularly at close range or busting bone. In these cases the exit will be small but internal damage will be great. That is the price you pay for penetration. All bullet performance is give and take. There is no free lunch. An accubond through both lungs of a whitetail will put it down pretty quick but they will usually run 30-125 yards. Low through the lungs will put it down with an almost immediate blood trail and is ideal for a certain kill that is easy to find and a big target. There is no deer alive that is capable of shaking off a double lung with an accubond at reasonable range. If a large exit is what you want, a heavy for caliber cup and core does that best.


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Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: Smokey Bear] #7034971
01/12/18 01:18 AM
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Originally Posted By: Smokey Bear
An Accubond pushed hard will sometimes shed the front of the bullet much like a partition does. Particularly at close range or busting bone. In these cases the exit will be small but internal damage will be great. That is the price you pay for penetration. All bullet performance is give and take. There is no free lunch. An accubond through both lungs of a whitetail will put it down pretty quick but they will usually run 30-125 yards. Low through the lungs will put it down with an almost immediate blood trail and is ideal for a certain kill that is easy to find and a big target. There is no deer alive that is capable of shaking off a double lung with an accubond at reasonable range. If a large exit is what you want, a heavy for caliber cup and core does that best.


Agree. The Accubond is designed to lose 1/3 of it's weight just like the Partition. Only the back part of the bullet is bonded so you get about 65% weight retention just like the Partition.

Last edited by scottfromdallas; 01/12/18 01:18 AM.

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Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7034981
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Nosler Technician said that the partition & accubond are designed to expand to twice the rifle caliber. example 308 expands to 616 or close to that.







Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7035017
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uuhh.. me thinksts you be worrying about something you needn't smile


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Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7035057
01/12/18 02:12 AM
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That bullet at and estimated impact velocity of 3200fps is going to shed petals/mushroom. But it is killing deer so I would nnot over think this.

Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7036725
01/13/18 04:19 PM
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Placement is the issue, not bullet performance. If you go high shoulder with a 300 RUM you’re going to destroy a lot of meat.


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Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7038725
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Image above is a 142 Long Range Accubond after passing through about 5' of elk. Weighed right at 60 grains. MV = 3250 or so, impact velocity around 3000 fps. Bullet went through the pelvis and the off shoulder. Used one of these this year on a little hill country whitetail at roughly 250 yards. Exit wound about the size of a quarter. Deer was DRT. Entrance about 4 ribs behind the near shoulder and exited the rear of the off shoulder.

Below is an image of a 90 gr Accubond after passing through 5 1 gallon jugs of water at 50 yards. MV = 3200 fps, impact velocity around 3100 fps (guesstimate). Final weight at 50 gr.


This is what I've come to expect using LRAB/AB's from my rifles.

As with pretty much any bullet, placement trumps displacement.

Last edited by Bbear; 01/15/18 01:23 PM.

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Re: Accubond not expanding? [Re: corps2010] #7054107
01/26/18 07:59 PM
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I shoot a 300wby. I have used the partition and accubond with no problems, bullet is 180 grain. I used the Barnes ttsx this year on recommendation of a friend. I shot a doe this year with the 180 ttxs at 180 yards. She took off like it just scared the fool out of her and I thought I missed. She was broadside so went and looked for blood anyhow as I had a good rest. She ran close to 60 yards with the top of her heart tore up and lungs bout the same way. She was dead and didn't know it. I have heard old timers call it the death run, as you know it don't take a deer very long to go 60 or so yards. With a high shoulder shot she would fallen right there I am sure. I did save some meat but there isen't a whole lot on a doe shoulder. I shot a 385 lb. boar a few years back with the 300 using the partition and it went in one shoulder and out the off side shoulder. I wanted him right there because didn't want to go lookin for him and wanted to shoulder mount him. I never ran them through a chrony. I think ur bullet is light for the caliber, just my opinion.

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