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Mar 25th, 2012
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I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm #7016265
12/30/17 12:47 AM
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Is there a difference?

I believe the FBI, needs the less recoil for most of the mba graduates to qualify and not be scared when they pull the trigger. The gun in the majority of the FBI world is more of a accessory than what is truly needed. This is not TV.

This is just my speculation and I have been wrong before, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.


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Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: Superduty] #7016314
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9mm....less recoil, cheaper ammo, higher mag capacity, thinner weapons, lighter weight, similar lethality, etc. Honestly, I don't see any real benefit to 40 cals.

Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: Superduty] #7016328
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Since the Miami shootout in the early 80s that led to the development of the 10mm, and subsequently the 40 S&W, bullet technology has changed for the better. I used to think the 9mm was a pipsqueak, but it's all different after 30 years.




I'm here to give and receive knowledge, not affirmation or adoration. If you don't like it, mierda dura. Intellectual honesty is not for fragile egos.
Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: DocHorton] #7016343
12/30/17 01:36 AM
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Originally Posted By: DocHorton
9mm....less recoil, cheaper ammo, higher mag capacity, thinner weapons, lighter weight, similar lethality, etc. Honestly, I don't see any real benefit to 40 cals.


Faster bullet..it’s all about penetration.....hit a bone and it deflects(9mm)...I wish to break that bone and penetrate.

Remember: recoil - force leaving the gun.

Last edited by Superduty; 12/30/17 01:37 AM.

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Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: RiverRider] #7016344
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Originally Posted By: RiverRider
Since the Miami shootout in the early 80s that led to the development of the 10mm, and subsequently the 40 S&W, bullet technology has changed for the better. I used to think the 9mm was a pipsqueak, but it's all different after 30 years.


I still like my 45 acp but I parted ways w my 40 cal years ago as the ballistics closed the gap between 9 and 40 I carry 9mm most days


i am cancelling my subscription, i am tired of your issues!
Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: Superduty] #7016347
12/30/17 01:39 AM
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I have been carrying a 10mm..so enough about penetration....I do have instances where I will carry deep concealed and will be going with a .40.


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Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: Superduty] #7016348
12/30/17 01:40 AM
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I wouldn't want to be shot with any of them. I think in a gunfight I'd prefer a 9mm with more capacity and less recoil than a 40 or 45. My nightstand gun is a 40, my carry gun is a 9mm, and my range gun is a 45, so I'm not particularly partial to any of them. I just think a 9mm gets you back on target quicker and offers more rounds, which is more important than the relatively small ballistic differences between the rounds.

Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: luv2brode] #7016349
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Originally Posted By: luv2brode
Originally Posted By: RiverRider
Since the Miami shootout in the early 80s that led to the development of the 10mm, and subsequently the 40 S&W, bullet technology has changed for the better. I used to think the 9mm was a pipsqueak, but it's all different after 30 years.


I still like my 45 acp but I parted ways w my 40 cal years ago as the ballistics closed the gap between 9 and 40 I carry 9mm most days


Ballistics gel is not real world.....muscle, bone, clothes....etc.


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Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: patriot07] #7016353
12/30/17 01:43 AM
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Originally Posted By: patriot07
I wouldn't want to be shot with any of them. I think in a gunfight I'd prefer a 9mm with more capacity and less recoil than a 40 or 45. My nightstand gun is a 40, my carry gun is a 9mm, and my range gun is a 45, so I'm not particularly partial to any of them. I just think a 9mm gets you back on target quicker and offers more rounds, which is more important than the relatively small ballistic differences between the rounds.


I have carried a 10mm g29 concealed, just is a little cumbersome. I carried a g36 for the longest time....it was not bad, but going forward it will be a g27..same frame as a g26...minus one round......not too worried about one round.


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Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: patriot07] #7016359
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Originally Posted By: patriot07
I wouldn't want to be shot with any of them. I think in a gunfight I'd prefer a 9mm with more capacity and less recoil than a 40 or 45. My nightstand gun is a 40, my carry gun is a 9mm, and my range gun is a 45, so I'm not particularly partial to any of them. I just think a 9mm gets you back on target quicker and offers more rounds, which is more important than the relatively small ballistic differences between the rounds.


In a gunfight..10mm G20 hands down......16 rounds with one in the pipe.....45 caliber is for girls at that point.


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Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: Superduty] #7016380
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40=sissyfied 10mm
9mm=sissyfied 40

Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: Superduty] #7016384
12/30/17 02:32 AM
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I'll stick with my compact 10mm for carry, really like the .38 Super (9x23) but I only have it in a full size. Most 38 Super available in the U.S. is a light load, most everywhere else it is loaded HOT reaching 357 mag ballistics and 19 rounds in a full size....BUT I forgot, they can't handle the recoil. The FBI started with a 10mm, reduced it to a 40 cal when they couldn't handle it and now a 9mm flush

Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: Superduty] #7016398
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Originally Posted By: Superduty
Originally Posted By: patriot07
I wouldn't want to be shot with any of them. I think in a gunfight I'd prefer a 9mm with more capacity and less recoil than a 40 or 45. My nightstand gun is a 40, my carry gun is a 9mm, and my range gun is a 45, so I'm not particularly partial to any of them. I just think a 9mm gets you back on target quicker and offers more rounds, which is more important than the relatively small ballistic differences between the rounds.


In a gunfight..10mm G20 hands down......16 rounds with one in the pipe.....45 caliber is for girls at that point.
I'll tell you what - you stand in front of me and let me shoot you with a few 9mm rounds and we'll see how it feels...deal?

I get that 10mm offers ballistic advantages, but it's like arguing that a 30-06 is better than a 270 for deer. Sure, it's better on paper, but is it going to make a real-world difference? Unlikely.

Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: patriot07] #7016402
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Originally Posted By: patriot07
Originally Posted By: Superduty
Originally Posted By: patriot07
I wouldn't want to be shot with any of them. I think in a gunfight I'd prefer a 9mm with more capacity and less recoil than a 40 or 45. My nightstand gun is a 40, my carry gun is a 9mm, and my range gun is a 45, so I'm not particularly partial to any of them. I just think a 9mm gets you back on target quicker and offers more rounds, which is more important than the relatively small ballistic differences between the rounds.


In a gunfight..10mm G20 hands down......16 rounds with one in the pipe.....45 caliber is for girls at that point.
I'll tell you what - you stand in front of me and let me shoot you with a few 9mm rounds and we'll see how it feels...deal?

I get that 10mm offers ballistic advantages, but it's like arguing that a 30-06 is better than a 270 for deer. Sure, it's better on paper, but is it going to make a real-world difference? Unlikely.



Keep doing what your doing....I have no doubts a brick would hurt as well.

loco

Last edited by Superduty; 12/30/17 02:50 AM.

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Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: Superduty] #7016406
12/30/17 02:48 AM
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9mm holds more rounds, that's the advantage.

I have had this conversation with a Police Lieutenant friend. He shared some documents with me showing the recent testing of .357 Sig, 9mm, .40 S & W, and .45 ACP. Bullets are better now, and the 9mm is no slouch. Penetration and expansion tests of all the cartridges mentioned showed no clear winner among the entire group. In other words, all were solid performers.

I've always been a .45 guy, but there is a case to be made of having 17+1 before a mag change.



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Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: FiremanJG] #7016410
12/30/17 02:49 AM
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Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
9mm holds more rounds, that's the advantage.

I have had this conversation with a Police Lieutenant friend. He shared some documents with me showing the recent testing of .357 Sig, 9mm, .40 S & W, and .45 ACP. Bullets are better now, and the 9mm is no slouch. Penetration and expansion tests of all the cartridges mentioned showed no clear winner among the entire group. In other words, all were solid performers.

I've always been a .45 guy, but there is a case to be made of having 17+1 before a mag change.


Agreed, hence the 10mm.


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Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: Superduty] #7016411
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Originally Posted By: Superduty
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
9mm....less recoil, cheaper ammo, higher mag capacity, thinner weapons, lighter weight, similar lethality, etc. Honestly, I don't see any real benefit to 40 cals.


Faster bullet..it’s all about penetration.....hit a bone and it deflects(9mm)...I wish to break that bone and penetrate.

Remember: recoil - force leaving the gun.


40 cal is not faster than 9mm, and penetration is nearly identical. Google it....lots of info out there. Most of your perceived advantage is in your head.

Biggest advantages are mag capacity and reduced recoil which allows more shots on target more quickly. 40 cal has almost double recoil with 10% better ballistics.

Ballistics don't win gunfights...accuracy and speed win, every time.

Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: Superduty] #7016413
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Originally Posted By: Superduty
Originally Posted By: patriot07
Originally Posted By: Superduty
Originally Posted By: patriot07
I wouldn't want to be shot with any of them. I think in a gunfight I'd prefer a 9mm with more capacity and less recoil than a 40 or 45. My nightstand gun is a 40, my carry gun is a 9mm, and my range gun is a 45, so I'm not particularly partial to any of them. I just think a 9mm gets you back on target quicker and offers more rounds, which is more important than the relatively small ballistic differences between the rounds.


In a gunfight..10mm G20 hands down......16 rounds with one in the pipe.....45 caliber is for girls at that point.
I'll tell you what - you stand in front of me and let me shoot you with a few 9mm rounds and we'll see how it feels...deal?

I get that 10mm offers ballistic advantages, but it's like arguing that a 30-06 is better than a 270 for deer. Sure, it's better on paper, but is it going to make a real-world difference? Unlikely.


I was referring to capacity when I quoted you.

Keep doing what your doing....I have no doubts a brick would hurt as well.

loco


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Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: DocHorton] #7016415
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Originally Posted By: DocHorton
Originally Posted By: Superduty
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
9mm....less recoil, cheaper ammo, higher mag capacity, thinner weapons, lighter weight, similar lethality, etc. Honestly, I don't see any real benefit to 40 cals.


Faster bullet..it’s all about penetration.....hit a bone and it deflects(9mm)...I wish to break that bone and penetrate.

Remember: recoil - force leaving the gun.


40 cal is not faster than 9mm, and penetration is nearly identical. Google it....lots of info out there.


‘Nearly”


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Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: Superduty] #7016416
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Originally Posted By: Superduty
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
9mm holds more rounds, that's the advantage.

I have had this conversation with a Police Lieutenant friend. He shared some documents with me showing the recent testing of .357 Sig, 9mm, .40 S & W, and .45 ACP. Bullets are better now, and the 9mm is no slouch. Penetration and expansion tests of all the cartridges mentioned showed no clear winner among the entire group. In other words, all were solid performers.

I've always been a .45 guy, but there is a case to be made of having 17+1 before a mag change.


Agreed, hence the 10mm.


I want a 10mm as a hunting pistol. The Glock Chad has, with that (what is it?) 5" barrel is not something I would carry all day, every day. It is the ultimate semi-auto cartridge, no doubt. But the others will work well on a human. We aint near as tough as feral hogs.



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Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: FiremanJG] #7016422
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Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
Originally Posted By: Superduty
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
9mm holds more rounds, that's the advantage.

I have had this conversation with a Police Lieutenant friend. He shared some documents with me showing the recent testing of .357 Sig, 9mm, .40 S & W, and .45 ACP. Bullets are better now, and the 9mm is no slouch. Penetration and expansion tests of all the cartridges mentioned showed no clear winner among the entire group. In other words, all were solid performers.

I've always been a .45 guy, but there is a case to be made of having 17+1 before a mag change.


Agreed, hence the 10mm.


I want a 10mm as a hunting pistol. The Glock Chad has, with that (what is it?) 5" barrel is not something I would carry all day, every day. It is the ultimate semi-auto cartridge, no doubt. But the others will work well on a human. We aint near as tough as feral hogs.


I know right..10mm is overkill for bad guys (depends on load),....what I like about the 10mm is the versatility..you can carry it to blind(Buffalo bore), use it for self defense or just target shooting, hunting...great round as well as high capacity.


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Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: Superduty] #7016427
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Originally Posted By: Superduty
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
Originally Posted By: Superduty
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
9mm....less recoil, cheaper ammo, higher mag capacity, thinner weapons, lighter weight, similar lethality, etc. Honestly, I don't see any real benefit to 40 cals.


Faster bullet..it’s all about penetration.....hit a bone and it deflects(9mm)...I wish to break that bone and penetrate.

Remember: recoil - force leaving the gun.


40 cal is not faster than 9mm, and penetration is nearly identical. Google it....lots of info out there.


‘Nearly”


Yes, nearly. The 40 cal actually has LESS penetration than the 9mm with some ammo. Also, the human heart is less than 5" inside your chest....the difference of 12" vs 13" will NOT matter in a gunfight. Take a ruler and measure the distance between your chest and your backbone. It's simple anatomy.

Here's a link to some ballistic and penetration data for your education....scroll down to post 38.

http://www.hkpro.com/forum/hk-handgun-talk/147220-buy-not-buy-p2k-357sig-lem-4.html

Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: Superduty] #7016434
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“With some ammo”

Doc really?


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Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: Superduty] #7016437
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Originally Posted By: Superduty
Originally Posted By: patriot07
Originally Posted By: Superduty
Originally Posted By: patriot07
I wouldn't want to be shot with any of them. I think in a gunfight I'd prefer a 9mm with more capacity and less recoil than a 40 or 45. My nightstand gun is a 40, my carry gun is a 9mm, and my range gun is a 45, so I'm not particularly partial to any of them. I just think a 9mm gets you back on target quicker and offers more rounds, which is more important than the relatively small ballistic differences between the rounds.


In a gunfight..10mm G20 hands down......16 rounds with one in the pipe.....45 caliber is for girls at that point.
I'll tell you what - you stand in front of me and let me shoot you with a few 9mm rounds and we'll see how it feels...deal?

I get that 10mm offers ballistic advantages, but it's like arguing that a 30-06 is better than a 270 for deer. Sure, it's better on paper, but is it going to make a real-world difference? Unlikely.



Keep doing what your doing....I have no doubts a brick would hurt as well.

loco
If you want to throw bricks at a bad guy, have fun with it. But I'm gonna stick with my 9mm and 40 S&W.

Re: I just have too,...9mm vs .40. FBI...changing back from .40 to 9mm [Re: Superduty] #7016440
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Carry a 40 most days, during winter months I carry a 1911 in 45, and shoot a Glock 34 9mm as my competition pistol. I like all three don't feel under gunned with any of them.


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