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Heavy guns often mean sure shooting #6576004 12/07/16 04:38 PM
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Texas Dan Offline OP
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So you think you can hold that lightweight rifle more steady than a heavier gun? Think again.

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"Some people will never like you because your spirit irritates their demons."
Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Texas Dan] #6576009 12/07/16 04:40 PM
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That's why all of the guns I stand or high-rack hunt with have heavy contour stainless barrels and weigh 12-13 pounds.

Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Texas Dan] #6576011 12/07/16 04:40 PM
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Don't believe everything you read on the internet. I can make far more shot in target standing unsupported with my 6lb AR15 than with my 14lb bolt gun.

Last edited by BigPig; 12/07/16 04:40 PM.
Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Texas Dan] #6576035 12/07/16 04:51 PM
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^^^^^^
This

Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Texas Dan] #6576055 12/07/16 04:58 PM
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Is the author of the article even talking about shooting unsupported? It mainly seemed like he was claiming that heavier rifles were easier to hold steady when you are in shooting position or using a rest of some sort.

Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: MacDaddy21] #6576097 12/07/16 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted By: MacDaddy21
Is the author of the article even talking about shooting unsupported? It mainly seemed like he was claiming that heavier rifles were easier to hold steady when you are in shooting position or using a rest of some sort.


While my personal experience has always agreed with those who say a heavier gun is easier to steady without a solid rest, I believe the same mechanics apply when using one. In fact, I would say I need a rest to hold a light gun as steady as I can an unsupported heavier rifle.

The issue brings to mind another shooting mechanic where there is often debate. That is, using a lower magnification increases your ability to steady your rifle. Yes, you can see crosshair wobble more easily with a higher scope magnification. However, you can better control it by turning it down.


"Some people will never like you because your spirit irritates their demons."
Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Texas Dan] #6576108 12/07/16 05:28 PM
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There's a reason why target rifles are heavy. The Match rifles and Service Rifles at Camp Perry will weigh about 15lb.


The secret to a long life is to try not to shorten it.
Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Texas Dan] #6576114 12/07/16 05:31 PM
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It all depends on technique. I was taught to look for a support. If that wasn't available then get into a proper shooting position. Anyone with good training rarely shoots "offhand". That's what God gave us knees and elbows for. wink

I choose which rifle I carry based on how far I am going to have to carry it, what my surroundings are, and more importantly what caliber I need for the game. I always choose the heavier rifle if I can.


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Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Tactical Cowboy] #6576128 12/07/16 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted By: Tactical Cowboy
There's a reason why target rifles are heavy. The Match rifles and Service Rifles at Camp Perry will weigh about 15lb.


That's twice the weight of my heaviest rifle, a wood-stocked Weatherby .270.

Last edited by Texas Dan; 12/07/16 05:41 PM.

"Some people will never like you because your spirit irritates their demons."
Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Texas Dan] #6576288 12/07/16 07:35 PM
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Offhand, I shoot a lighter gun better. Off a rest, I shoot a heavier gun better.

That's just me though, I surely do not speak for everyone.

Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Texas Dan] #6576522 12/07/16 09:58 PM
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Not sure on rifles but I can say for sure a heavier pistol usually shoots better with less recoil. I had a buddy who took a desert eagle in 50ae in as a trade and told me to go with him to shoot it that pistol was heavy but dead accurate I was able to group bullseye no problem

Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Texas Dan] #6576597 12/07/16 10:44 PM
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I like my hunting rifles like I like my women. Short, thick, and quiet.


Originally Posted by unclebubba
Just to make sure that it is done thoroughly, I go both ways.

Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Texas Dan] #6576699 12/07/16 11:53 PM
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am falling for the short thick ones myself


NRA all the way god guns and guts made us free , i want all three
Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: TexFlip] #6576713 12/08/16 12:00 AM
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Originally Posted By: TexFlip
I like my hunting rifles like I like my women. Short, thick, and quiet.


rofl you need a barrel sticker of exactly that rofl


Originally Posted by Phil Robertson
Don't let your ears hear what your eyes didn't see, and don't let your mouth say what your heart doesn't feel
Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Texas Dan] #6576798 12/08/16 01:20 AM
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Originally Posted By: Texas Dan
Originally Posted By: MacDaddy21
Is the author of the article even talking about shooting unsupported? It mainly seemed like he was claiming that heavier rifles were easier to hold steady when you are in shooting position or using a rest of some sort.


While my personal experience has always agreed with those who say a heavier gun is easier to steady without a solid rest, I believe the same mechanics apply when using one. In fact, I would say I need a rest to hold a light gun as steady as I can an unsupported heavier rifle.

The issue brings to mind another shooting mechanic where there is often debate. That is, using a lower magnification increases your ability to steady your rifle. Yes, you can see crosshair wobble more easily with a higher scope magnification. However, you can better control it by turning it down.


The wobble doesn't change with magnification, your perception of it does.


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Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: poisonivie] #6576882 12/08/16 02:38 AM
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Originally Posted By: poisonivie
Originally Posted By: Texas Dan
Originally Posted By: MacDaddy21
Is the author of the article even talking about shooting unsupported? It mainly seemed like he was claiming that heavier rifles were easier to hold steady when you are in shooting position or using a rest of some sort.


While my personal experience has always agreed with those who say a heavier gun is easier to steady without a solid rest, I believe the same mechanics apply when using one. In fact, I would say I need a rest to hold a light gun as steady as I can an unsupported heavier rifle.

The issue brings to mind another shooting mechanic where there is often debate. That is, using a lower magnification increases your ability to steady your rifle. Yes, you can see crosshair wobble more easily with a higher scope magnification. However, you can better control it by turning it down.


The wobble doesn't change with magnification, your perception of it does.


And the lower perception impacts your muscle reflexes which are not quick and precise enough to correct the wobble you see more clearly with a higher magnification. There are basically three ways to deal with wobble:

1. Use a solid rest to help steady the gun
2. Turn down the magnification so that wobble becomes less noticeable. As a result, you'll stop "chasing" a steady aim. (This also points to why a heavier gun is easier to hold steady. The heavier weight puts a greater load on your reflexes, which helps reduce wobble.)
3. Since it's impossible to hold a completely still and steady aim, train your muscle reflexes to create circular movements as tight as possible around the target center.


"Some people will never like you because your spirit irritates their demons."
Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: poisonivie] #6577244 12/08/16 01:53 PM
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Originally Posted By: poisonivie
Originally Posted By: Texas Dan
Originally Posted By: MacDaddy21
Is the author of the article even talking about shooting unsupported? It mainly seemed like he was claiming that heavier rifles were easier to hold steady when you are in shooting position or using a rest of some sort.


While my personal experience has always agreed with those who say a heavier gun is easier to steady without a solid rest, I believe the same mechanics apply when using one. In fact, I would say I need a rest to hold a light gun as steady as I can an unsupported heavier rifle.

The issue brings to mind another shooting mechanic where there is often debate. That is, using a lower magnification increases your ability to steady your rifle. Yes, you can see crosshair wobble more easily with a higher scope magnification. However, you can better control it by turning it down.


The wobble doesn't change with magnification, your perception of it does.


Thank you...

I use the best power for the occasion. I use higher magnification as a rule. The only time I turn the mag down is in low light.

Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Texas Dan] #6577255 12/08/16 02:00 PM
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Originally Posted By: Texas Dan
Originally Posted By: MacDaddy21
Is the author of the article even talking about shooting unsupported? It mainly seemed like he was claiming that heavier rifles were easier to hold steady when you are in shooting position or using a rest of some sort.


While my personal experience has always agreed with those who say a heavier gun is easier to steady without a solid rest, I believe the same mechanics apply when using one. In fact, I would say I need a rest to hold a light gun as steady as I can an unsupported heavier rifle.

The issue brings to mind another shooting mechanic where there is often debate. That is, using a lower magnification increases your ability to steady your rifle. Yes, you can see crosshair wobble more easily with a higher scope magnification. However, you can better control it by turning it down.


You're not controlling it any better. It just appears that way because the reticle movement is more exaggerated at higher power.

All else being equal, a heavier rifle is easier to shoot accurately. Pretty basic, but the ultra ultra light rifle craze a few years back proves that some lessons always need to be re-learned. A good basic weight for a mountain rifle is about 7-7 1/2 pounds all in. Goes up from there depending on the use/application. If all I ever used a rifle for was blind sitting I would take the Camp Perry approach too.


Originally Posted by Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Nogalus Prairie] #6577267 12/08/16 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted By: Nogalus Prairie
You're not controlling it any better. It just appears that way because the reticle movement is more exaggerated at higher power.


To the contrary, it's much like keeping a vehicle more evenly spaced in the middle of the lane by keeping a perspective or view further down the road. The mind is providing inputs the muscles and reflexes are more capable of tracking without over correction.

I'm sure it could be better explained by someone well versed in Control Systems theory, which I am clearly not.


"Some people will never like you because your spirit irritates their demons."
Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Gone to Texas] #6599270 12/23/16 04:02 AM
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[quote=Gone to Texas]Offhand, I shoot a lighter gun better. Off a rest, I shoot a heavier gun better.


I agree with that. I shoot my Tikka T3 Lite good off hand, but shoot my Heavy 308 very well off a stand or bagged up. Its all about getting steady.


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Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Texas Dan] #6599748 12/23/16 04:00 PM
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Originally Posted By: Texas Dan
Originally Posted By: poisonivie
Originally Posted By: Texas Dan
Originally Posted By: MacDaddy21
Is the author of the article even talking about shooting unsupported? It mainly seemed like he was claiming that heavier rifles were easier to hold steady when you are in shooting position or using a rest of some sort.


While my personal experience has always agreed with those who say a heavier gun is easier to steady without a solid rest, I believe the same mechanics apply when using one. In fact, I would say I need a rest to hold a light gun as steady as I can an unsupported heavier rifle.

The issue brings to mind another shooting mechanic where there is often debate. That is, using a lower magnification increases your ability to steady your rifle. Yes, you can see crosshair wobble more easily with a higher scope magnification. However, you can better control it by turning it down.


The wobble doesn't change with magnification, your perception of it does.


And the lower perception impacts your muscle reflexes which are not quick and precise enough to correct the wobble you see more clearly with a higher magnification. There are basically three ways to deal with wobble:

1. Use a solid rest to help steady the gun
2. Turn down the magnification so that wobble becomes less noticeable. As a result, you'll stop "chasing" a steady aim. (This also points to why a heavier gun is easier to hold steady. The heavier weight puts a greater load on your reflexes, which helps reduce wobble.)
3. Since it's impossible to hold a completely still and steady aim, train your muscle reflexes to create circular movements as tight as possible around the target center.
this


hold on Newt, we got a runaway
Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: TexFlip] #6600072 12/23/16 07:10 PM
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Originally Posted By: TexFlip
I like my hunting rifles like I like my women. Short, thick, and quiet.



roflmao My man!

Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: Texas Dan] #6601203 12/24/16 07:25 PM
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I have owned several Marlin 1895's, and the best by far for off-hand shooting is the 1895CB model with the 26" tapered octagon barrel, and full-length magazine tube.

The trick to shooting off-hand with a heavier barrel is to swing it up, obtain the sight picture and fire in one smooth motion. - If you take time to do anything else, muscle tremors will screw up your accuracy. If you are slow at getting the sight picture, then you might as well forget it and find a rest of some kind. It all must be done quickly and smoothly.

A low powered scope, or a peep sight with a large aperture is best for this. I've not tried a dot sight with a heavy rifle but it would probably work, too.

I developed this technique back when I shot black powder rifles with long, heavy barrels. It works and with practice, it works very well.

Last edited by charlesb; 12/24/16 07:35 PM.

Kind regards, charlesb


Re: Heavy guns often mean sure shooting [Re: charlesb] #6601280 12/24/16 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted By: charlesb
The trick to shooting off-hand with a heavier barrel is to swing it up, obtain the sight picture and fire in one smooth motion. - If you take time to do anything else, muscle tremors will screw up your accuracy. If you are slow at getting the sight picture, then you might as well forget it and find a rest of some kind. It all must be done quickly and smoothly.

A low powered scope, or a peep sight with a large aperture is best for this.


This is so "outside the box" for many shooters, and yet, so true.


"Some people will never like you because your spirit irritates their demons."
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