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Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike #5373794 10/22/14 04:29 PM
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sloveless Offline OP
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Okay, so this is a ~300 acre property I hunt in McCulloch county. It is LF, relatively high hunting pressure, with other folks on the property and neighbors that are trigger happy. We rarely see mature deer, but I am trying to not be the neighbor that shoots the 2yr old bucks. We have a pretty poor buck to doe ratio, and I try to work on that every year, but I think I am the only one that shoots does - everybody else just shoots bucks.

With that said, give me some thoughts and age estimates for this 10 pt. This is probably one of the top 2 bucks I have seen on this property in ~5 years. I'm going to guess 3.5 just for kicks. Sorry for the somewhat crappy pics, he didn't want to stand broadside like a good boy.



Okay, so here is my spike. I am thinking he is young, but with this amount of length, if he was going to branch I imagine he would have already. Don't want to start the shoot vs. save the spike debate. Thoughts on age and if this is genetic. I think 2.5 and am leaning towards shoot.



It has been a really good year it seems, way more basket 8s than we have seen in past. We used to see a lot of 4-6 point 1.5/2.5 YO's, this year seems like almost all of our young bucks look like this:

Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: sloveless] #5373879 10/22/14 05:26 PM
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He looks 3.5 to me.

If your happy with him then take him!


It's hell eatin em live
Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: sloveless] #5373883 10/22/14 05:28 PM
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spike is last years fawn, bigger buck looks 3.5 to me too

Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: sloveless] #5373894 10/22/14 05:32 PM
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You have a good age progression in the pics, Id say the spike is 1.5 YO, the little 6 or 8, cant tell if he has brows or not is 2.5 YO, and the ten looks 3.5 YO.


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Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: sloveless] #5373971 10/22/14 06:09 PM
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The 10 looks 2.5 max 3.5 and could be a stud. The spike is a yearling.


Every potential trophy buck needs "another year";)
Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: redchevy] #5373991 10/22/14 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted By: redchevy
You have a good age progression in the pics, Id say the spike is 1.5 YO, the little 6 or 8, cant tell if he has brows or not is 2.5 YO, and the ten looks 3.5 YO.

Yep ^^

The spike debate is up to you. Nearly every spike is a 1.5, only on rare occasions will a buck any older than that be a spike.

Personal I don't think a spike will ever have what a 4 or 6+ point 1.5 yr old buck will. So I shoot spikes, BUT my herd has enough of those 4-6+´s that I can still have a good buck carry over.

There are people that have herds where killing every spike would eliminate 75% of their young bucks. Fast forward 4 yrs and they have very few mature bucks after killing an entire age class.

Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: sloveless] #5374001 10/22/14 06:26 PM
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2.5 on the ten. Don't think he is 3.5 from those pics.


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Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: BOBO the Clown] #5374016 10/22/14 06:34 PM
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Originally Posted By: BOBO the Clown
2.5 on the ten. Don't think he is 3.5 from those pics.


If the ten is 2.5 then your saying that that smaller 6/8 pt and the spike are the same age or the spike was born this year?


It's hell eatin em live
Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: BOBO the Clown] #5374017 10/22/14 06:35 PM
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Originally Posted By: BOBO the Clown
2.5 on the ten. Don't think he is 3.5 from those pics.

Last pic would be 1.5 then? Or some age class as the ten?

popcorn

Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: sloveless] #5374019 10/22/14 06:35 PM
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Thanks for the input everybody. I really like the 10, but I will probably give him a pass this year. If he is really only a 2.5/3.5 YO, and he can manage to make it a few years he could be a bruiser for this property! Those brows sure could end up being pretty wicked looking.

My main reason for leaning to shoot the spike is based on the rest of the herd, all of the other young bucks look pretty good. Add in the spike length, and I think this guy should be branching by now. My main concern is the poor buck:doe ratio - probably won't make my mind up until I see him through a scope.

Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: sloveless] #5374022 10/22/14 06:39 PM
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If you have a poor buck to doe ratio as in few bucks and a lot of does I would not shoot the spike and shoot a doe.


It's hell eatin em live
Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: sloveless] #5374054 10/22/14 06:59 PM
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I'd concur with others at 3.5 YO on the 10. Plenty of potential, with really nice brows and good mass/tine length for that age.


"In a civilized and cultivated country, wild animals only continue to exist at all when preserved by sportsmen."
-Theodore Roosevelt
Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: sloveless] #5374082 10/22/14 07:10 PM
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My guess is 2.5 on the 10 and the spike and basket buck are 1.5


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Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: redchevy] #5374095 10/22/14 07:15 PM
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Originally Posted By: redchevy
Originally Posted By: BOBO the Clown
2.5 on the ten. Don't think he is 3.5 from those pics.


If the ten is 2.5 then your saying that that smaller 6/8 pt and the spike are the same age or the spike was born this year?


From those limited pics

Spike and little guy are same age. I hunt Brady. There are two distinct deer herds in that county. With distinct body weights. They intermingle more and more every year, you will have big body weight swings.

This is a straight up 3.5 year old deer. And in Dec heavily rutted up.



Watched him since he was a wee-little guy. He has had same wave every year on bad side, and white back foot. 9/10 on here would call him 4.5 do to his neck brisket. What you don't see in that pic is he is at an incline moving up. Once he is on flat ground neck goes back to normal 3.5

Here is a 2.5 year old.


Fully mature 6.5.

4.5 year old but teeth were more 3.5 and only history we had of him. Wish I had more history






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Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: redchevy] #5374110 10/22/14 07:20 PM
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Originally Posted By: redchevy
If you have a poor buck to doe ratio as in few bucks and a lot of does I would not shoot the spike and shoot a doe.


hum........ or, you shoot his junky a$$ and 3 does with him.. problem solved

Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: sloveless] #5374187 10/22/14 08:03 PM
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I would let both of them walk and focus on the does

Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: sloveless] #5374360 10/22/14 09:51 PM
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The last 3 years I hunted in McCulloch county 10 miles south of Brady near Voca. In my opinion it is a great deer county with potential for some very nice bucks. I would pass on the spike because he is very young. the ten point looks to be 3.5 years and is a good buck similar to some we saw on our lease. I killed a 5.5 yr old ten point last year that was 19 inches wide and a 4.5 year old 11 point that was 18.5 inches wide in 2012. We never saw either of these deer on camera and only had one encounter with one while working before season. In my opinion if you are patient and give the ten a pass he will be a toad next year, and who knows you might see an old toad you have never seen by being patient. We sure did.

Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: sloveless] #5374398 10/22/14 10:22 PM
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If you have a bunch of 1.5 YO 6-8 points I'd shoot the spike.

I love the briwtines on that 10!

Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: BOBO the Clown] #5374448 10/22/14 11:01 PM
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Originally Posted By: BOBO the Clown
Originally Posted By: redchevy
Originally Posted By: BOBO the Clown
2.5 on the ten. Don't think he is 3.5 from those pics.


If the ten is 2.5 then your saying that that smaller 6/8 pt and the spike are the same age or the spike was born this year?


From those limited pics

Spike and little guy are same age. I hunt Brady. There are two distinct deer herds in that county. With distinct body weights. They intermingle more and more every year, you will have big body weight swings.

This is a straight up 3.5 year old deer. And in Dec heavily rutted up.



Watched him since he was a wee-little guy. He has had same wave every year on bad side, and white back foot. 9/10 on here would call him 4.5 do to his neck brisket. What you don't see in that pic is he is at an incline moving up. Once he is on flat ground neck goes back to normal 3.5

Here is a 2.5 year old.


Fully mature 6.5.

4.5 year old but teeth were more 3.5 and only history we had of him. Wish I had more history






Good pics and description. up

Since you have the experience in the area I can't really argue. And I agree with all the bucks in your pics!!, but in the OP pics I can't get pic 1 and the last buck in the same age class. I don't see him being last year's fawn like the spike either. That big of a swing in body structure isn't something I've seen in the few different herds I've hunted, but every herd is different.

You mentioned that there are 2 distinct herds in that area. That is really interesting and not something I've ever seen. Learn something new everyday.

Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: sloveless] #5374637 10/23/14 12:59 AM
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You got to remember Brady has had some of the best rains in the state last TWO years so they are real healthly. Buck crop this year is the best health I've seen since 2007. Should be some studs come out of there. Fawn crop is crazy, very heavy recruitment this year. That last pic I posted is western mason county, but only 30 miles as a crow files to the other deer in Brady. His body weight was much less then the western 4.5 year old or older Brady deer.

Eastern Brady has more of that mason/llano body types typical hill country, western Brady is large bodied, longer legs..more west Texas like. Western deer of Brady will out weight eastern by 20lbs plus at 6.5 usually some times more.

Op has a potential stud on his hands. Even if he is 3.5, what do you think that deer will be at 6.5.... Stud!!!



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Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: Mountain Man] #5374657 10/23/14 01:08 AM
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Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
The last 3 years I hunted in McCulloch county 10 miles south of Brady near Voca. In my opinion it is a great deer county with potential for some very nice bucks. I would pass on the spike because he is very young. the ten point looks to be 3.5 years and is a good buck similar to some we saw on our lease. I killed a 5.5 yr old ten point last year that was 19 inches wide and a 4.5 year old 11 point that was 18.5 inches wide in 2012. We never saw either of these deer on camera and only had one encounter with one while working before season. In my opinion if you are patient and give the ten a pass he will be a toad next year, and who knows you might see an old toad you have never seen by being patient. We sure did.


Voca got some studs, 173 was killed few years back via bow


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Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: BOBO the Clown] #5374682 10/23/14 01:17 AM
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Originally Posted By: BOBO the Clown
You got to remember Brady has had some of the best rains in the state last TWO years so they are real healthly. Buck crop this year is the best health I've seen since 2007. Should be some studs come out of there. Fawn crop is crazy, very heavy recruitment this year. That last pic I posted is western mason county, but only 30 miles as a crow files to the other deer in Brady. His body weight was much less then the western 4.5 year old or older Brady deer.

Eastern Brady has more of that mason/llano body types typical hill country, western Brady is large bodied, longer legs..more west Texas like. Western deer of Brady will out weight eastern by 20lbs plus at 6.5 usually some times more.

Op has a potential stud on his hands. Even if he is 3.5, what do you think that deer will be at 6.5.... Stud!!!


That rainfall is really dependent on where you are standing in that county. I have buddy who has had 4 bad years for total rainfall and below average. He has had rainy periods but not a wet year that was above average. His tanks have not caught run off to fill the pit in that time period.
A lot will depend on the ranch in that county even as much as location from what I have seen. On those larger ranches east of Brady you will find larger bodied bucks that score very well. There are a couple of land owners that have some really great bucks east of town. One large LO has land all over the county. The best deer seen was seen close to Brady Lake on a helicopter survey about 4 yrs ago that was a typical 7x7 that would have grossed low 180's.
The deer in OP is a 3yr old IMO. I have seen very very few 2 yr olds that were LF deer or even native HF deer that had browtines that long. Is it possible... yes, probable... no. You also have to remember if that deer was born in the drought year and I mean bad drought year, he started life in a hole nutrition wise. He is lucky to have survived that year. That is why I am thinking his a 3 yr old also.


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Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: sloveless] #5374698 10/23/14 01:26 AM
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this is a very interesting read…these deer look huge. my lease is in Robert Lee and i see many pics of peckerheads, 2.5's all over the place…i am not sure i am going to spend a tag on a spike, unless i know for sure he's 2.5 or 3.5. we have one heavy spike i may let the wife shoot as a cull buck, but we have many culls on the property.

Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: stxranchman] #5374735 10/23/14 01:40 AM
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Originally Posted By: stxranchman
Originally Posted By: BOBO the Clown
You got to remember Brady has had some of the best rains in the state last TWO years so they are real healthly. Buck crop this year is the best health I've seen since 2007. Should be some studs come out of there. Fawn crop is crazy, very heavy recruitment this year. That last pic I posted is western mason county, but only 30 miles as a crow files to the other deer in Brady. His body weight was much less then the western 4.5 year old or older Brady deer.

Eastern Brady has more of that mason/llano body types typical hill country, western Brady is large bodied, longer legs..more west Texas like. Western deer of Brady will out weight eastern by 20lbs plus at 6.5 usually some times more.

Op has a potential stud on his hands. Even if he is 3.5, what do you think that deer will be at 6.5.... Stud!!!


That rainfall is really dependent on where you are standing in that county. I have buddy who has had 4 bad years for total rainfall and below average. He has had rainy periods but not a wet year that was above average. His tanks have not caught run off to fill the pit in that time period.
A lot will depend on the ranch in that county even as much as location from what I have seen. On those larger ranches east of Brady you will find larger bodied bucks that score very well. There are a couple of land owners that have some really great bucks east of town. One large LO has land all over the county. The best deer seen was seen close to Brady Lake on a helicopter survey about 4 yrs ago that was a typical 7x7 that would have grossed low 180's.
The deer in OP is a 3yr old IMO. I have seen very very few 2 yr olds that were LF deer or even native HF deer that had browtines that long. Is it possible... yes, probable... no. You also have to remember if that deer was born in the drought year and I mean bad drought year, he started life in a hole nutrition wise. He is lucky to have survived that year. That is why I am thinking his a 3 yr old also.


I'm still sticking with 2.5 with those pics, I did notice the brows and questioned my gut but I'm going to stick with 2.5 unless we get better pics.

My favorite ranch there went on the sale.. You got 25mill?


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Re: Age/thoughts on 10pt and a spike [Re: BOBO the Clown] #5374772 10/23/14 01:55 AM
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Originally Posted By: BOBO the Clown
Originally Posted By: stxranchman
Originally Posted By: BOBO the Clown
You got to remember Brady has had some of the best rains in the state last TWO years so they are real healthly. Buck crop this year is the best health I've seen since 2007. Should be some studs come out of there. Fawn crop is crazy, very heavy recruitment this year. That last pic I posted is western mason county, but only 30 miles as a crow files to the other deer in Brady. His body weight was much less then the western 4.5 year old or older Brady deer.

Eastern Brady has more of that mason/llano body types typical hill country, western Brady is large bodied, longer legs..more west Texas like. Western deer of Brady will out weight eastern by 20lbs plus at 6.5 usually some times more.

Op has a potential stud on his hands. Even if he is 3.5, what do you think that deer will be at 6.5.... Stud!!!


That rainfall is really dependent on where you are standing in that county. I have buddy who has had 4 bad years for total rainfall and below average. He has had rainy periods but not a wet year that was above average. His tanks have not caught run off to fill the pit in that time period.
A lot will depend on the ranch in that county even as much as location from what I have seen. On those larger ranches east of Brady you will find larger bodied bucks that score very well. There are a couple of land owners that have some really great bucks east of town. One large LO has land all over the county. The best deer seen was seen close to Brady Lake on a helicopter survey about 4 yrs ago that was a typical 7x7 that would have grossed low 180's.
The deer in OP is a 3yr old IMO. I have seen very very few 2 yr olds that were LF deer or even native HF deer that had browtines that long. Is it possible... yes, probable... no. You also have to remember if that deer was born in the drought year and I mean bad drought year, he started life in a hole nutrition wise. He is lucky to have survived that year. That is why I am thinking his a 3 yr old also.


I'm still sticking with 2.5 with those pics, I did notice the brows and questioned my gut but I'm going to stick with 2.5 unless we get better pics.

My favorite ranch there went on the sale.. You got 25mill?

I am sticking with my gut and 3.5 since that is what I said when I looked at the pic knowing how dry it was 3 yrs ago. Very few fawns survived that year.
What ranch? There are some dang good ones east of town. If I had the money that is where I would start looking. Great genetics and big deer in that area.


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