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Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5296874 09/09/14 06:32 PM
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You're right and the 4wd & the diesel will sell faster....didn't say they wouldn't sell I said "they don't sell well". If you're a guy like me that doesn't keep a truck long that is important...if you are like some who keep them until they start costing a bunch of money to fix then by all means buy a 2wd gas 3/4 ton...if not, I promise you'll be pizzed when it comes time to sell.


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Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5297006 09/09/14 07:44 PM
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Or when pulling something lol. I pull a weigh wagon grain cart to corn plots and while it's a bumper pull trailer that 6.0 sure knows it's back there. I pulled a gooseneck scale trailer from lubbock to brownfield and got about 3.5mpg and the 6.0 was screaming unless I went about 50mph. From brownfield to college station I had a tail wind so I could manage about 65 mph and got a whopping 4.7 mpg. You usually talk about how 6th gear is gone when pulling, well in the beast of a 6.0 I struggled to find 4th gear during that trip

Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: Dustnsand] #5297019 09/09/14 07:53 PM
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Originally Posted By: z71dustin
Or when pulling something lol. I pull a weigh wagon grain cart to corn plots and while it's a bumper pull trailer that 6.0 sure knows it's back there. I pulled a gooseneck scale trailer from lubbock to brownfield and got about 3.5mpg and the 6.0 was screaming unless I went about 50mph. From brownfield to college station I had a tail wind so I could manage about 65 mph and got a whopping 4.7 mpg. You usually talk about how 6th gear is gone when pulling, well in the beast of a 6.0 I struggled to find 4th gear during that trip


And you are saying im saying there is never a need/use for a diesel and im not. Just most people who have a 25-30 foot camper they pull a handful of times a year and a 20 foot boat don't "need" one. Im not sayin that you or nobody has a use for a diesel truck, but many out there don't. Sounds like the OP knows he doesn't need one and would like to avoid the higher initial cost and higher cost of fuel and maintenance while maintaining the capability to do what he needs to.


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Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5297309 09/09/14 10:50 PM
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My first truck in high school was a 6.0 chevy that I still have today. Will it pull my faith wheel or my gooseneck loaded down with hot rods? Sure, but it doesn't do it anywhere near as easy as my 6.7 powerstoke. I had to haul my trailer out to the lease about a month ago while my diesel was in the shop and had it screaming going down 20 going about 60 getting crap for gas mileage..but it got the job done and has never left me stranded. I personally don't understand why anyone would buy a new 3/4 gas these days with the price of trucks, for what you're spending you might as well drag it out another year or two and get something that is going to hold its resale and pull anything you hook up to it. But to each his own I guess.


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Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5297317 09/09/14 10:54 PM
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Originally Posted By: fbchunter
If you get a chevy i would be sure you get 4.10 gears.


Originally Posted By: z71dustin
It's a gutless bastard when hooked to a something of any weight.


Yes.

Absolutely get the 4.10s if you go GM, they make a lot difference. Of course, mine (6.0 4x4 CCLB 3.73s) is a gutless turd empty, that's only slightly more of a turd while towing. I fully agree about 6th being utterly useless. I absolutely hate driving this truck. It's a tool that I can use to accomplish anything I need it to do, but it's just a kick in the gnards wringing every ounce of power out of it to do it. At this point, I'm going to have it tuned to get the torque management reduced, and see if it makes enough of a difference in drivability, if not, it's getting traded.

I owned a diesel, but didn't need it, much the same as probably 60% or better of diesel owners around here. I've been looking at the 6.2 and 6.4, I don't think I'd buy another GM.

Last edited by Shotgun Willie; 09/09/14 11:01 PM.
Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5298389 09/10/14 02:00 PM
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I know the 6.0 might seem gutless, but any gas engine compared to a diesel seems gutless.

The 6.0 V8 is a strong motor and loves to rev, which in the high RPM band is where it makes most of its power.

Since the OP is looking for something to just tow a car hauler around with on occasion, the 3/4 ton gas is the way to go. Why spend the extra money on the truck itself, the fuel, and maintenance for something one doesn't need.



Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5298404 09/10/14 02:08 PM
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Kinda what Ive been saying but seems like some folks think everyone with a jet ski needs a diesel. roflmao

There is a difference between need want and prefer. I don't think some understand it.


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Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5298436 09/10/14 02:21 PM
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I agree. Actually, the low torque curve and towing prowess of the diesel is why I now drive a Ford Ecoboost. 420 Ft-lbs of torque at 2,500 RPM instead of 335 ft-lbs at 4,000-5,000 RPM I had with my Chevy 5.3 V8. Plus the EB has 365 HP. I loved my Chevy and have nothing against it, but that Ecoboost is nice!

I would love to have a diesel but for the cost, it would just be stupid for me too. That Ecoboost really fills a nice segment to me. Tons of power and torque with good fuel economy.



Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: HOU Razorback] #5298565 09/10/14 03:20 PM
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Originally Posted By: HOU Razorback
I know the 6.0 might seem gutless, but any gas engine compared to a diesel seems gutless.

The 6.0 V8 is a strong motor and loves to rev, which in the high RPM band is where it makes most of its power.


Oh, no, it's gutless. grin I've driven a ton of different trucks and this one is, by far, the biggest turd I've owned. I think it's a combination of the 3.73s and the oppressive torque management, but this thing literally feels like a 6 cylinder truck. That gets horrific mileage. 400ish ft lbs doesn't do you any good when the computer doesn't let you have it.

My brother has an Ecoboost, and I prefer it for towing. Max torque at an RPM that's actually usable when exiting a stop light. It takes a long time for the 6.0 to get to high rpms from a stop when it's got 8k lbs tagging along, and I know it's supposed to be that way, but I hate running Ranger Hill at 4k rpms just to hold 60mph. Unfortunately, I'm quite fond of the long bed, and the max payload of the Ecoboost just isn't quite there for what I need, even with the max tow package.

Even with all that, I don't haul that much often enough to justify the absurd maintenance costs of a diesel.

Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5298586 09/10/14 03:28 PM
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I guess we all have different expectations and definitions of what works and what doesn't. Ive pulled 8k or more with a '94 1/2 ton chevy several times. Last time was back and forth from normange to san Antonio and maintained speed fine.

Towed close to that with an '11 1/2 ton chevy and 5.3 and it did better than the '94 and got better mileage. Last gas 3/4 I had experience with was an '02 chevy 6.0 gas and 4.10's and I wouldn't hesitate to hook 10k to it and get on the road. Sure you had to tow in 3rd gear and turn around 3200 rpm, but to me for that motor 3200 rpm is not screaming.


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Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5298614 09/10/14 03:39 PM
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I have my oil changed at the ford dealership for $70.00 in my 2012 6.7L, its not cheap but affordable. Your going spend more on gas when towing vs maintenance on a diesel engine and with the diesel you can tow just about anything you want without putting some serious hurt on the motor and drive train. A transmission job will be alot more than an oil change or fuel filter replacement. Some people say the cost between both will balance out over time I disagree you get twice the truck for twice the time and it comes out cheaper in the long run with a diesel. Just stay away from the ford 6.0L /6.4L and you'll be OK.

Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5298627 09/10/14 03:44 PM
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Meh. It is what it is. It'll do whatever I tell it to do, and hasn't given me any issues thus far. I just don't enjoy running it at high rpms to get the torque out of it, and 6 speeds doesn't do any good when the truck doesn't know which one it wants to use.

That's the one thing I miss about the diesel, put it in gear, and go. That gear is where it stayed until you got to where you were going.

Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5298635 09/10/14 03:46 PM
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If you towed 8k with a 5.3 (my wife has one in her yukon) without any issues you must have been going down hill, that is impossible, that engine makes more noise than power. I pulled my 16ft trailer with a ranger on it 60 miles and it hated it I think it got to overdrive once going down hill. IMO a 1/2 ton is made for pulling to your neighbors house and no further. ??????????????3200RPMS????????????CRAZY you have 1800RPMS left and your redlining. Do what you want hand but your running thin on efficiency.

Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: spg] #5298645 09/10/14 03:50 PM
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Originally Posted By: spg
I have my oil changed at the ford dealership for $70.00 in my 2012 6.7L, its not cheap but affordable. Your going spend more on gas when towing vs maintenance on a diesel engine and with the diesel you can tow just about anything you want without putting some serious hurt on the motor and drive train. A transmission job will be alot more than an oil change or fuel filter replacement. Some people say the cost between both will balance out over time I disagree you get twice the truck for twice the time and it comes out cheaper in the long run with a diesel. Just stay away from the ford 6.0L /6.4L and you'll be OK.


When towing our tt with and o4 or 05 duramax or a 04 cummins or a 2010 cummins they all get about 12 miles per gallon. Pulling it with the half ton chevy yilded 11 mpg and pulling with a gas 6.0 got you 10mpg. 2 mpg dif while towing isn't going to make a hill of beans.


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Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5298818 09/10/14 05:22 PM
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Never mentioned fuel mileage redchevy, just pointing out a gas truck will not hold up engine and transmission wise, that's where your ownership of a gas truck will exceed owning a diesel. Gas trucks are not made to haul large travel trailers. Also, if you got 10mpg towing a TT with a 6.0L gas burner your miscalculating or you have the best one in world, my brother in law has one and he's lucky to get an average of 12mpg without a load.

Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5298926 09/10/14 05:59 PM
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Only vehicle I'v ever driven that got close to 5mpg was a 80's model 1 ton chevy dually with a 454 6 speed and 4.56 gears in it. I honestly don't know how people get such God awful mileage out of a vehicle. Both the 6.0's we have had averaged in the 14's empty and would get close to 16 on strict hwy trips. Of course that was driving 65 mph and not racing anyone to get to 65. Owned sever gas burners with well over 200k miles on them. Not saing they last as long as a diesel, but I think they last longer than most people hang on to them either way.

I pass the same old mid 2000's chevy 2500 hd most mornings on the way to work with an 18-20 foot gooseneck and two bobcats on it, it may not be as classy as a diesel, but go and tell that fella they wont do.

Again Im not saying there is no need for diesel trucks and that nonone has a need for a diesel truck, just that there is a legit market and demand for a gas heavy duty.

Gas pickups kept fleet service alive for a while when all the diesels went to pot. Buddy of mine always complained about his chevy 6.0 that it was gutless etc as a work truck, but it sure started and went to work every day for 200k miles till the company sold it and bought a ford diesel. Gas may not be fashionable or cool but they still get it done.


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Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: spg] #5298936 09/10/14 06:04 PM
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I used one of my dad's work trucks to pull my 30 foot, 7800 pound travel trailer to brownwood. That 6.0 Chevy did just fine. It had the Allison trans in it and it was working. I set the cruise on 70 and had no problem. Didn't pass many gas stations going there but I figure it got 14mpg coming home unloaded. Truck has 200,000 miles on it and never been in the shop.

Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: spg] #5298980 09/10/14 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted By: spg
If you towed 8k with a 5.3 (my wife has one in her yukon) without any issues you must have been going down hill, that is impossible, that engine makes more noise than power. I pulled my 16ft trailer with a ranger on it 60 miles and it hated it I think it got to overdrive once going down hill. IMO a 1/2 ton is made for pulling to your neighbors house and no further. ??????????????3200RPMS????????????CRAZY you have 1800RPMS left and your redlining. Do what you want hand but your running thin on efficiency.


In a 5.3 you should have about 2800 rpm to get to read line.

In a chevy diesel the 04 and 05 we have reline at 3200 and tow at 65 at 2000-2100 rpm in OD they are only 1200 rpm away from redline, whats your point?

I never saw OD in the 5.3 towing bigger stuff with it, lighter stuff the boat light flatbed you put it in 5th and it runs about 2200 at 70 put it in 4th for bigger stuff in it runs less than 3k, which is perfectly acceptable.

My 94 in the onwners manual directed you to take it out of OD if towing anything or even in hilly terrain. I towed our 20 foot boat in OD with no issues. Towing in 3rd gear wound the rpms up to about 27-2800 rpm at 65, at 70 it was 3k rpm and it redlined at 4k rpm. I sold that truck with 265k miles on it original motor and transmission never been rebuilt or had motor or transmission work done. Pulled a trencher with that truck that weighed over 9k lbs dry by itself not counting the trailer it was on 100 miles each way on I-10 going 65 with no issues other than a little sway. In no way would I recommend doing that every day with the truck or even often, but there is a huge difference between a 90's model 350 with a 700R4 that barely squeaks out 200 hp and 300 lb ft of torque on a good day and a modern hd gas truck putting out 2x the hp and a lot more torque.


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Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: redchevy] #5298991 09/10/14 06:34 PM
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Originally Posted By: redchevy
Both the 6.0's we have had averaged in the 14's empty and would get close to 16 on strict hwy trips.


What's the setup on those? Cab? Bed? 4x4? Tires?

My '11 CCLB 4x4 on 275/70/18s has never gotten more than 12mpg for a tank, and it only hit 12.0 mpg once. That's holding at 65-75 without the cruise control, speeding up on downhills and letting it slow on uphills, and not running it over 3000 rpm on takeoffs. Essentially, grandpa driving it to see if it would milk any more mileage. I'll be honest, I find 16mpg really hard to believe.

Two different dealers swear there's nothing wrong with it.

Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5299016 09/10/14 06:47 PM
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They are both 2wd crew cab 6' beds. One is a 2500 hd with 4.1 gears the other is 1500 hd with 3.73's. Both have stock size e range tires.

Change your 3k on startup to 2 or 2500 rpm it will go up. If your gonna call it grandpa driving I never saw grandpa ever hit 3k grin

At the end of the day I love and have owned a couple diesel trucks, no a gas wont pull like a diesel, but that's a far cry from not doing it. May turn a few more rpm bur a bit more gas and take a little longer to get to speed, but that don't mean they cant do it.


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Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5299055 09/10/14 07:09 PM
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Thanks for the truth Shotgun Willie..........RedChevy, how can a diesel truck have anything to do with fashion? I'm just an old farmboy that wound up in the oilfield, nothing to do with fashion, I'm talking about pulling power and capability......Yes, your gas truck will pull heavy loads but not for long and with additional cost and potential damage to the truck. I'm trying to help you make the right decision and save you problems. Hell, even 3/4 diesels are shy for big loads, I had to install air bags on my truck to handle a 27ft gooseneck + 5ft dovetail loaded with a 85hp tractor.

Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: spg] #5299081 09/10/14 07:19 PM
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Originally Posted By: spg
Thanks for the truth Shotgun Willie..........RedChevy, how can a diesel truck have anything to do with fashion? I'm just an old farmboy that wound up in the oilfield, nothing to do with fashion, I'm talking about pulling power and capability......Yes, your gas truck will pull heavy loads but not for long and with additional cost and potential damage to the truck. I'm trying to help you make the right decision and save you problems. Hell, even 3/4 diesels are shy for big loads, I had to install air bags on my truck to handle a 27ft gooseneck + 5ft dovetail loaded with a 85hp tractor.


Every bit of info I have give is no bs fact. I accept I don't drive as aggressively as most people that is where my better fuel mileage comes from. Again Im not trying to say nodody has a need for a diesel pickup. The OP asked about GAS trucks, Im guessing he doesn't tow a 100 hp tractor all the time. Fella that goes to church with me has an approx. 100 hp tractor with loader he brings to the church from time to time for site work, hi tree trimming etc. guess what it shows up on every time a 2000's model chevy 2500 hd 6.0 gas on a 30 foot gooseneck.

Why do I see so many diesel truck owners who don't even have a trailer? People don't buy them just because they need them. up


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Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: redchevy] #5299092 09/10/14 07:24 PM
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Originally Posted By: redchevy
Originally Posted By: spg
Thanks for the truth Shotgun Willie..........RedChevy, how can a diesel truck have anything to do with fashion? I'm just an old farmboy that wound up in the oilfield, nothing to do with fashion, I'm talking about pulling power and capability......Yes, your gas truck will pull heavy loads but not for long and with additional cost and potential damage to the truck. I'm trying to help you make the right decision and save you problems. Hell, even 3/4 diesels are shy for big loads, I had to install air bags on my truck to handle a 27ft gooseneck + 5ft dovetail loaded with a 85hp tractor.


Every bit of info I have give is no bs fact. I accept I don't drive as aggressively as most people that is where my better fuel mileage comes from. Again Im not trying to say nodody has a need for a diesel pickup. The OP asked about GAS trucks, Im guessing he doesn't tow a 100 hp tractor all the time. Fella that goes to church with me has an approx. 100 hp tractor with loader he brings to the church from time to time for site work, hi tree trimming etc. guess what it shows up on every time a 2000's model chevy 2500 hd 6.0 gas on a 30 foot gooseneck.

Why do I see so many diesel truck owners who don't even have a trailer? People don't buy them just because they need them. up


Thats one you need to buy.........I'm guessing your church buddy doesn't live to far from church? More power to you, get you a gas it should be able to do what ever a diesel can do, no problem.

Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: EasyMoney] #5299107 09/10/14 07:28 PM
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Not too far, about 20 miles.

Again how do you not see that not everybody is driving an oil field fleet service truck? How do you not see that everybody is not running a hot shot rig with a 35 foot trailer every day?


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Re: 3/4 ton gas rig help [Re: spg] #5299163 09/10/14 07:56 PM
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BS! Back before the modern day diesels came to be all you had were the 454's and 460's. In the 70's and 80's the town I worked in was ruled by the oil field. There WERE NO DIESELS and 100's of 454's pulling 15k to 16k pound backhoes on tandem dual trailers everywhere and for a long time. That is all there was back then unless you went with a semi setup. I've had all the diesels, have had a 4wd diesel with a few mods that would smoke all four tires from a roll. Saying a gas truck won't last hauling a load is nothing but ego talking or lack of being realistic. I have several trucks, one being a 97 Ford F350, regular cab, flat bed, with a 460 and 5 speed manual, still going, still hauling 16k pounds of round bales all over a few times a year, when is it supposed to fail? Hauls a 4020 with duals and water in tires, dozer blade on front,6 ft round baler, well over 20,000 lbs not including the trailer. On a long hill I may need to drop from 5th to 4th, so what, does that mean I must turn in my man card because, heaven forbid, I down shifted? What is it I'm not supposed to be able to tow? Will the newer diesels do it easier, sure, but I haul it the speed limit just fine, do I need to be able to haul it faster? If I needed to tow often and heavy, I'd 100% go back to a diesel. But for a few times a year now, the numbers are just not there.

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