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Mar 25th, 2012
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Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds #5294524 09/08/14 03:59 PM
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Gone to Texas Offline OP
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Last Monday for the opener I bought a case of Remington 2 3/4 1 1/4 oz loads in #8 shot. For whatever reason, just about ever bird I shot was wounded and not stone dead. I even had 1 that I shot, it helicoptered down, hit the ground, then as I was walking over to it, the bird got up and flew away like nothing happened.

Now, I am not the best shot around, I don't even claim to be, but has anyone had similar results with this ammo? I was using an Imp. Cly. choke.

This weekend I went out with a Mod. Choke and Estate 2 3/4 1 oz #7.5 loads and the doves were dropping dead as a door nail, only had 1 wounded out of 15 birds.


Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: Gone to Texas] #5294556 09/08/14 04:12 PM
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Same thing happened to me opening day, in fact I was just talking to a buddy about that the other day. My guess, we were just missing, plain and simple!


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Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: Gone to Texas] #5294584 09/08/14 04:23 PM
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Pattern your loads, is the only way to know what they are doing for sure. Have seen some that had holes a bird could be missed in the center of the pattern.

Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: Gone to Texas] #5294587 09/08/14 04:25 PM
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In scenario #2 you tightened your pattern, and used a very slightly heavier shot which should carry more energy for deeper penetration. However, shot punching through doves usually isn't an issue.

All shotgunning is about putting pellets in the target, and if you were only putting 1 possibly 2 pellets in during scenario #1 that could be the problem, or putting 2-4 pellets in using scenario 2 could be enough of a difference.

Lastly, you were shooting 2 different loads, shot sizes, brands of ammo, and different chokes. Leading I would guess to vary different pattern densities coming out of your gun. So it's hard to compare.

Solution, buy a few boxes and varieties of ammo test which one gives you the best pattern for your dove load with your usual hunting ranges and chokes. Stick with the best one,and then you know if you miss or wound lots of birds it's you and not the ammunition!


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Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: tinkerbell] #5294608 09/08/14 04:32 PM
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Originally Posted By: tinkerbell
In scenario #2 you tightened your pattern, and used a very slightly heavier shot which should carry more energy for deeper penetration. However, shot punching through doves usually isn't an issue.

All shotgunning is about putting pellets in the target, and if you were only putting 1 possibly 2 pellets in during scenario #1 that could be the problem, or putting 2-4 pellets in using scenario 2 could be enough of a difference.

Lastly, you were shooting 2 different loads, shot sizes, brands of ammo, and different chokes. Leading I would guess to vary different pattern densities coming out of your gun. So it's hard to compare.

Solution, buy a few boxes and varieties of ammo test which one gives you the best pattern for your dove load with your usual hunting ranges and chokes. Stick with the best one,and then you know if you miss or wound lots of birds it's you and not the ammunition!


clap


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Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: Gone to Texas] #5294618 09/08/14 04:40 PM
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According to all old-stuck-in-the-past duck hunters lead shot brings down all birds stone cold dead so this thread is a hoax.

Nah...kidding of course...typically when I don't kill a bird dead it's because I made a shot just good enough to get a few pellets in it...it was not a great shot or it was from too far away.

I think what Tinker says is a given...you should go through the paces and see what your choke and load of choice looks like on paper. I'd just take a few scraps of cardboard out on your next hunt and shoot them from the distance you feel you should be shooting ideal shots from and see what they look like.


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Dear Lord please bullwhip me for saying this but I agree, Marcstar is in the lead. Please nobody use this as a quote!!!
Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: Gone to Texas] #5294622 09/08/14 04:42 PM
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I always shot those Remington Shells and I had the Same Problem a few years ago, I switched over to Mod. Choke and Use same shells but in #7.5 shot and Problem Solved!!!!!

SK


"ALWAYS BE YOURSELF: BECAUSE THOSE WHO MATTER DON'T MIND, AND THOSE WHO MIND...................DON'T MATTER"
Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: tinkerbell] #5294636 09/08/14 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted By: tinkerbell
In scenario #2 you tightened your pattern, and used a very slightly heavier shot which should carry more energy for deeper penetration. However, shot punching through doves usually isn't an issue.

All shotgunning is about putting pellets in the target, and if you were only putting 1 possibly 2 pellets in during scenario #1 that could be the problem, or putting 2-4 pellets in using scenario 2 could be enough of a difference.

Lastly, you were shooting 2 different loads, shot sizes, brands of ammo, and different chokes. Leading I would guess to vary different pattern densities coming out of your gun. So it's hard to compare.

Solution, buy a few boxes and varieties of ammo test which one gives you the best pattern for your dove load with your usual hunting ranges and chokes. Stick with the best one,and then you know if you miss or wound lots of birds it's you and not the ammunition!


I'll add another little caveat on to this scenario. When he changed the amount of shot 1-1/4 oz vs. 1 oz. he most likely increased the speed of the shot-string by up to as much 200-250 fps. This, in conjunction with heavier shot density and tighter pattern can have a huge impact on bringing birds down. Plus, the leads you are giving the birds might be more suited to faster loads, i.e. getting the shot-string out in front of the birds quicker so you have more margin for error on the pattern.



Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: jtprocaddie] #5294689 09/08/14 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted By: jtprocaddie
Originally Posted By: tinkerbell
In scenario #2 you tightened your pattern, and used a very slightly heavier shot which should carry more energy for deeper penetration. However, shot punching through doves usually isn't an issue.

All shotgunning is about putting pellets in the target, and if you were only putting 1 possibly 2 pellets in during scenario #1 that could be the problem, or putting 2-4 pellets in using scenario 2 could be enough of a difference.

Lastly, you were shooting 2 different loads, shot sizes, brands of ammo, and different chokes. Leading I would guess to vary different pattern densities coming out of your gun. So it's hard to compare.

Solution, buy a few boxes and varieties of ammo test which one gives you the best pattern for your dove load with your usual hunting ranges and chokes. Stick with the best one,and then you know if you miss or wound lots of birds it's you and not the ammunition!


clap


cheers

Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: Gone to Texas] #5295126 09/08/14 08:38 PM
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Thanks for the info! Sounds like I need to pattern my shotgun!


Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: Gone to Texas] #5295812 09/09/14 02:44 AM
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Opening Day I was shooting #8's also and was wounding birds, after half a box I switched to the #7.5's and birds have been falling ever since! It does not seem like a lot of difference, but I can verify for me that I knock down a lot more birds with my 1&1/8oz of #7.5 shot. I just had to burn up those #8's and I will never buy anything other than the #7.5's again.


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Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: Gone to Texas] #5295963 09/09/14 04:04 AM
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Butt shooting.

Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: Gone to Texas] #5296066 09/09/14 10:49 AM
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I am not a fan of a #8 pellet. 7.5 is where i draw the line.


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Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: Gone to Texas] #5296258 09/09/14 01:19 PM
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I went to a rio high brass #6 load and it flat out kills them no more wounded birds.

Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: Gone to Texas] #5296735 09/09/14 05:30 PM
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shot size is directly related to energy and penetration at distance.....

#8 shot..while acceptable for dove....is relatively small. unless you're dove are pretty close and well within acceptable shotgun distance, you'll find that the #8 BBs lack the energy to penetrate very deeply.

I like to shoot a mod choke with #7.5 in most instances. for moderate distance dove...this will normally knock them flat. for up close dove on really good fields....an IPC choke with #8 or even #9 can be good. this will be in-effective at any sort of distance though.

I've hunted public fields where there were lots of white-wing flying up high, real high...mod chokes and 7 shot won't reach them. but full or xtrafull chokes with #6 shot will. the heavier shot carries distance better. at the far reaches of effective shotgun range....the pattern will be pretty spread out. you will likely only hit your bird with one maybe two pellets. the larger #6 bb will bring them down. at shorter distances the #6 will turn them into hamburger meat.

a pump action shotgun is the single most versatile weapon on the planet. look at your hunting situation and match accordingly.

I've hunted everything from dove/duck/quail/deer/hog/etc....all with a Remington 870 pump 12ga

everything from #9 shot to 000 buck to rifled slugs all thrown down the same mod choke barrel.


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Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: Gone to Texas] #5296751 09/09/14 05:36 PM
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also...in dove loads.....for a 20ga...the standard shot charge is 7/8 oz shot and max a 1oz...don't buy ammo that advertises less. you might be saving a little money...but you're putting fewer pellets in the air meaning lesser pattern density and more misses. these loads also will not cycle well in autos.

for a 12ga....standard load is 1-1/8oz or max of 1-1/2oz shot. don't buy less for the same reasons above. you will see lots of 12ga with 7/8oz shot loads. these are cheap. they go bang....and I don't care to be on the business end of one. but they are generally much less effective.


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Re: Dove Ammo and Wounded Birds [Re: Gone to Texas] #5297052 09/09/14 08:19 PM
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i agree on the choke situation. i had the same problem in mow O/U with imp cyl and a modified choke and heavy dove loads. lots of wounded birds. now in my citori i have 2 modified chokes and heavy dove loads. works wonders on birds!

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