I am researching AR since I am rookie in the AR field. I am seeing the bushmaster predator and varmint series with a 20 and 24" barrel. I am wanting to keep my budget as cheap as possible and I am wondering if the 16" barrells in the .223 is accurate enough to hunt with. I wont be going to the range to just shoot. Looking to take out coyotes and hogs. All advice appreciated?

It's more about the ammo in the AR15. They all seem to shoot fairly well. For hunting I would advise hand loads using 60 grain partitions. Fit the load to the gun and it will be very accurate. My 16" RR does just fine.

I had a DPMS Sportical 16" barrel for awhile and I think I paid about $575 for it. It's the cheapest AR you can buy. It would put 5 shots of $6 a box PMC FMJ under 3/4". Most ARs are capable of shooting under and inch. You might look at the Wyndam Weaponry or Rock River predators. Bushy has kind of lost their reputation but I have no experience with them personally. I'm currently building a Spike's in 6.8 SPC for my hog and varmint rig and I'm going with a 16" barrel to keep the weight down.

Partitions for Yotes? I'd rather shoot VMAX or Bergers.

My first AR was a Bushmaster predator. It shot decent but it was 24" and way to long and heavy. I sold it to go lighter.

I then went with a RockRiver 20" in a heavy barrel predator model. It was more accurate and little bit better to carry but still heavier than I wanted to tote around. Since they came out with a 16" a couple years ago.

Then I got all excited about the Larue Predatar. I fell hook line and sinker for marketing and kool aid. It shot worse than my Rock River and was never really balanced right. I did not like it and sold it off.

My last and current I built custom. It shoots the best of the others but not that much better than the RR. I don't claim to be a good shooter from the bench but it does about the size of a quarter groups with factory ammo

The barrel weight on this gun is 32 oz and 16" long. To me 16" is long enough. If I could shave some more weight on the barrel I would. It just got to the point at the time of $ and how much were the extra oz's worth for something I pick up a handful of times a year.

I would go with a brand with a guarantee or go with a custom barrel. The trigger, handgaurd, and weight were very important to me.

How far out do you plan on shooting? More than likely I woukdnt worry about a 16" barrel, it should be fine. I would be more concerned about being able to hit a target than confusing oneself with the magical technicalities of bullets and barrels. It's a coyote, not elk or brown bear.

Where you located, perhaps we can meet up and do some shooting.

My Colt LE6920MPB will shoot MOA at 100 yards with 5.33$ a box TUL Ammo. It may do even better than that if I could shoot better. ARs are pretty awkward on a bench.

Haven't stretched it out any further yet, but I bought it as a predator gun.

A lot of it depends on how far you want to shoot? If you are wanting to do day or night shooting or both? If you plan on calling them up or are just shooting on sight? How heavy a bullet do you want to shoot as the twist rate on the barrel will affect heavier bullets or lighter bullets differently? If you want to collect them all or just hit them and let them run off and die elsewhere?

My AR is a Bushmaster Varminter 24" barrel. Yes it's heavy but with the added length on the barrel you can really stretch the 223's legs. This is a 5 shot group at 100 yards. At 200 yards it will consistently group 1" groups. I shoot Federal Premium 55 grain BTHP and it LOVES them.


The wife has a DPMS Oracle with a 16" barrel. It is MUCH lighter but at farther distances is not nearly as accurate, but if your are out walking a lot it is much easier on you. I'm a pretty big boy 6'3" 265lbs so the weight is not as big an issue to me as it is my 5'3" wife.

The other thing, probably more important,that you need to consider is glass to go on top. I started out with a 3-9x40 nikon buckmaster on top of my gun. It would shoot 3/4" groups all day long. I then switched it out for a Zeiss 4-14x50 and started shooting ragged holes. I would rather have a $600 AR with a $600 scope than a $1000 AR with a $200 dollar scope.

you ask for it so there it is my

I was thinking hogs. Plus I gotta bunch of 60g partitions!

That is very sound advice and the problem most people have. They spend a fortune on a "tacticool" rifle and then put a POS Chinese scope on top and wonder why it shoots Minute of Barn Door. Spend some money on optics if you want to shoot tight groups.

Accuracy is consistency. Short barrels are stiff barrels, therefore they are less picky about various powder charges for a given bullet. The downside to a short barrel is loss of muzzle velocity, that's it. The longer the barrel, the more room it has for complete powder burn. That's why the shorter the barrel the more fire it shoots out the end in low light.

If it'll shoot 1" at 100, you'll be fine. Just learn how fast they're leaving the barrel so you know retained velocity and, therefore retained energy delivery, on soft tissue, down range. Knowing velocity and ballistic coefficient will allow you to know the trajectory before trying it on paper or steel, prior to a shot on a coyote. That is, if you plan on shooting beyond the 100 yard zero range.

I'm with you there. Been wanting to try some of the 60 grainers but I've found that the Berger Flat Base HPs 52 grainers will put a pounding on the pigs.

My 16 in sig m400 shoots under an inch with my 70 grain tsx handloads and just as good with factory hornady vmax and speer 64 grain soft points. And thats without a free floating rail. I personally dont like carrying around a heavy 24 in barreled AR.

16 inch barrels are fine, if you have a high quality AR it will probably exceed your expectations. I have a Colt LE6920 that at 50 yards I can easily get 2-3 inch groups shooting as fast as I can pull the trigger.

Guys I really do appreciate all of the advice. I made my purchase last night. I bought a DPMS AR .223 from Academy on Sale for $599. I bought a Red Field 9x42 scope for it and payed $159 for the scope. I bought 100 rounds of cheap 55 grain ammo and 40 rounds of the Hornady VMAX for real action. Hope to be out in the snow this weekend doing some shooting if I can get it sighted in between now and then.

Thanks again for all of your advice!

congrats on a excellent buy! i gotta feeling you'll be asking more questions as time goes by. i just want to make a prediction that within a year you'll be shopping for a stripped lower receiver.

Welcome to BRD = Black rifle disease.

Similar story here. Started off with a Rock River Varmint 24" bull bbl, a blast to shoot on bench (bug hole groups)but too heavy for carrying around. Now have a Rock River 16", Leupold 4-12 in Burris Pepr QD, all the bells and whistles, kill light, etc and its still waay lighter than the varmint model. Shoots under 1" at 100yds with my 55gr Vmax handloads. 2 stage match trigger on the Rock River is excellent. Works well on coyotes, pigs, etc.