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Training session with Molly today #4113484 03/11/13 02:43 AM
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Guy Offline OP
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We will be working on blind retrieves all off season. But I started out with a mark retrieve to make it a little exciting. Then I did 2 blind retirves. First blind retirve is in the trees to the right, probably about 80/90 yards. The next blind retrieve is in the bushes to the left, about 70/80 yards. She is still popping, but we getting better each week. The first retrieve she pops about 15/20 yards, I try to correct with a “back” but she wants to stop anyway. hammer


Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: Guy] #4113667 03/11/13 04:15 AM
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that's one fine dog!

kelly


Mossy oak prostaff
www.kentoutdoors.com/
I live in spokane washington but still guide in texas
Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: kellygunner] #4113675 03/11/13 04:21 AM
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hell that looked good to me, nice work up


If I put my wife in a high fence will her rack get bigger?
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Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: caldwelldeerhunter] #4116975 03/12/13 06:53 PM
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Jay Brown Offline
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Guy, Your pup is looking good. You might want to get in touch with a trainer to help with transitioning to blinds. Popping itself is not uncommon, but how you handle it shapes your dog down the road. you can also contact Evan Graham on the net for some tips. What program are you using ?
JB

Last edited by Jay Brown; 03/12/13 06:54 PM.
Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: Jay Brown] #4117041 03/12/13 07:18 PM
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beaversnipe Offline
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Looks good.
Wished i had my wife trained like that.
Back, back, more back, keep on backin

Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: beaversnipe] #4118408 03/13/13 11:18 AM
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Looks good from here!! Nice work!!


If you dont take a chance you will not get a chance!!!
www.tripleshotgamecalls.com


Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: Jay Brown] #4118655 03/13/13 01:59 PM
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Guy Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: Jay Brown
Guy, Your pup is looking good. You might want to get in touch with a trainer to help with transitioning to blinds. Popping itself is not uncommon, but how you handle it shapes your dog down the road. you can also contact Evan Graham on the net for some tips. What program are you using ?
JB

Jay, been there done that. We are way past all that, there is really no “transition to blinds” to be done, Molly has been doing blind retrieves from her first hunting season 7 years ago. She retrieved 192 ducks last season, most of which were blind retrieves as most of the time I had her completely cover up with burlap and she could not mark. She may not look like an 8 year seasoned dog, but that is because I’m armature dog trainer, and Molly is my first gun dog to train. But we do get better each year.

Here is a little back ground on Molly’s training history.

-Born Sep 2005, I got a puppy DVD, and it was all fun first 8 months, basic obedience, marks, etc...

-June 2006 we started formal obedience and e-Collar conditioning – I used Mike Lardy e-Collar conditioning DVD.

-July/Aug 2006, I forced fetch Molly, with the help from a pro. He did the first couple sessions, I watched, I did a couple training sessions and he watched, the rest I did on my own and met with him a few more times . I really had no other experience with force fetch, just purely instructions from the pro. Had I watched a DVD on force fetch, it would have helped me. We did not do force to pile (a major hole here), then hunting season started. Molly did great her first hunting season.

-2007 off season, still no further training for myself, I went to a retriever training seminar, they were showing casting drills, right and left. So did some of this with Molly. Big mistake. Should never have done this without force to pile work first. Hunting season started, tried casting her, right and left she did fine as this is what we trained on, but I soon realize she did not know “back”.

-2008 offseason, I realized my mistake and I needed to go back and do force to pile. And that is what I did, and bought Evan Graham DVDs, and this is what I followed. I have bought nearly all his DVDs, and for the next few years, I interacted with him on another internet forum, and he was very helpful. However, because I did not do force to pile in the beginning and waited 3 yrs, it was a tough row to hoe. She casted well (we did a lot of 8 handed casting), but getting her to go back was very difficult, especially long backs. So this has been our challenge for years, last off season she did not train at all due to injury (recommendation from my vet, Dr Ed many probably know). But she did great this hunting season and made great strides with “back”, she finally got it. That is why this off season I’m excited to train with her again.

But we are taking it slow. We are doing 1 training session a week (a new spot every time), and only a couple retrieves at that.

Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: Guy] #4119296 03/13/13 07:01 PM
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Jay Brown Offline
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Guy, Sounds like you are in control. I am hesitant to offer training advice to folks I don't know, just was not aware of your experience. Both programs are great, and the fact that you realized/identified your problem shows you really paid attention.
Hope all continues well with both of you.
Are you running any hunt tests ? We have one here in april, (SA), and will be the last one of the spring for me.
JB

Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: Jay Brown] #4119357 03/13/13 07:24 PM
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Shoot I'd hunt with y'all..for sure

Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: Jay Brown] #4120717 03/14/13 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted By: Jay Brown
Are you running any hunt tests ?

No, have always wanted to, just really don’t have the time. Have done a couple HRC fun hunts (unofficial hunt tests) about 5 years ago, those were great experiences.. My next dog I may get into the hunt test thing, I know I would like it. For now we train for hunting, and fun of course..

Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: Guy] #4123865 03/15/13 09:58 PM
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Guy, are you up for any suggestions? If so, shoot me a PM. I had similar problems with my dog when he was young. He's 8 also.


Mud Shark

Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: Mud Shark] #4124478 03/16/13 06:15 AM
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Originally Posted By: Mud Shark
Guy, are you up for any suggestions?

Are you a pro? I'll take some pro advice. grin

I been sending her on some long retrieves and really challenging her to see what she can do. She is doing great in my book, she is just pooping because she lacking confidence because I'm challenging her on difficult retrieves. The solution more times than not for almost ever dog problem is “simplification”. I’m gonna give that a try this weekend, and I bet I fix the popping. up

Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: Guy] #4124498 03/16/13 07:13 AM
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Originally Posted By: Guy

she is just pooping


Goodness Guy, you gotta let her finish before sending her. grin

Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: Guy] #4124769 03/16/13 02:32 PM
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No sir, I'm not a pro, but at one point and time, I was training my first dog by my self too.

The dog can do the work, but its like you said, she lacks confidence. She doesn't have issues with obedience or taking casts, just with popping. Not what I would consider a major hole, but its something that you want fixed, especially if the majority of ducks picked up are blind retrieves. .
When my dog was having that same problem, I got with a friend of mine who is a pro and we ran 100 yard pattern blinds. We ran the same 4 blinds every day for 3 weeks. We'd run each one anywhere from 6-10 times per day, picking up all the bumpers at one blind, then moving to the next.

Boring? Sure. But we didn't pop anymore.

Now anytime we pop in the field, a day of pattern blinds is a quick fix.

By no means do I think it would take 3 weeks of pattern blinds to get where you want. But I bet a week or 10 days of running pattern blinds would build her blind line confidence.


Then once that is fixed, go run the different blinds all the new/different blinds.

Last edited by Mud Shark; 03/16/13 02:45 PM.

Mud Shark

Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: Mud Shark] #4124856 03/16/13 03:27 PM
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Thx mud shark. up

Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: Guy] #4124906 03/16/13 04:06 PM
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You bet Guy. Let us know if it works!!!


Mud Shark

Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: Mud Shark] #4125016 03/16/13 05:48 PM
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If going back to pattern blinds is the simple fix every time your dog starts popping, that is probably what I need to do. But I was going to first shorten the cold blinds and see how she does. If no popping then gradually go with longer cold blinds. But if she still pops on shorter cold blinds, then I do need to go back to pattern blinds.

I’m trying to get her to go where she does not know about, no where she thinks it is. That is one reason I’m going to different spots.

Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: Guy] #4125307 03/16/13 09:45 PM
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From personal experience, only try to fix one problem at a time.

Popping is the first issue, no matter if the blind is 20, 50, 100 or 300 yards. Get her confidence and her momentum up with those pattern blinds/lining drills. She's popping because she's not confident on the line she is supposed to take. When she hears "back" she's supposed to take that line until you stop her.

It's hard to see on the video because she's out there a pretty good way, but it looks like she takes the cast you want her to. Is that right?

Running those pattern blinds helps the dog take better lines, close to you and farther out, in the direction you want them to go.

Also, is she collar conditioned?


Mud Shark

Re: Training session with Molly today [Re: Mud Shark] #4125416 03/16/13 11:23 PM
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Yeah she took all the right casts and she has been e-collard condition, I provided her training history above..

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