texashuntingforum.com logo
Main Menu
Advertisement
Affiliates
Advertisement
Newest Members
DonohoeSass, NickW, SeanTHing, Ameliano, DorothyC
66842 Registered Users
Top Posters(All Time)
dogcatcher 102,268
bill oxner 69,434
stxranchman 55,847
SnakeWrangler 52,263
RKHarm24 44,585
rifleman 44,451
BMD 41,064
Big Orn 37,484
Facebook
Forum Statistics
Forums45
Topics429,403
Posts6,461,090
Members66,842
Most Online19,184
Feb 5th, 2020
Print Thread
Am I being Unreasonable? #4085978 02/27/13 03:30 AM
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 2,013
T
thewrap Offline OP
Veteran Tracker
OP Offline
Veteran Tracker
T
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 2,013
So back in July I bought my Brittany from a member on here. (1911 Cowboy AKA Matt and Shelbee) I picked him up with his papers and brought him home. Didn't notice anything out of the ordinary. He did fall alot which I though was just him being a puppy. Had him at the vet for his vaccinations and she noticed that something wasn't right with the way he was walking. They took some XRays and said everything looked fine there and gave him a work up and couldn't find anything but recommended I see a neurologist. Took him to the specialist and they diagnosed him with either a degenerative or underdeveloped cerebellum which was causing him to fall, walk strangely and have a lack of balance. Unfortunately it isn't anything that's treatable and can get better or worse without warning. So immediately I make a call to Shelbee explaining what was happening and wanted to know if any of the other puppies were going through the same thing. She said no but come to find out that the mother went through something similar until the she was 6 months old. Believe me I wish this had gone away when he was 6 months. I kept updating Shelbee on his status as time went on. September rolled around and it was very clear he was not going to get any better. I called and talked with Shelbee saying that I wanted my money back. (I was amazed that it hadn't been offered back to me for the troubles I had gone through already). She didn't respond to that but said she would get back to me. Well about an hour later I got an email back from Matt saying that I wasn't going to get my money back because they weren't responsible for the dog and that there wasn't anything in the genetic line of the dogs that would indicate what I was saying and also they had seen all the other pups and that they all were doing fine. This is where I started getting mad.

First off I had explained from the day I knew that this was a birth defect that hadn't metastasized until after I had gotten him and that he wasn't going to recover from it.
Second I had asked that they come take a look at him and said where I was going to be every weekend for the next 4 months which was only half an hour from where we originally met.

I've tried numerous times to get in touch with them to no avail.

I'm at a loss. I feel like I have valid reasoning for getting my money back so am I crazy or being unreasonable.
Keep in mind that I bought this dog because I wanted a bird dog. And since his diagnosis it has become very obvious that he won't be able to be one.


Jesse Reynolds
Professional Home Inspector TREC ID# 21526
www.integrityhomeinspectionservice.com
Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: thewrap] #4086007 02/27/13 03:41 AM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 135
T
TexasBlazer72 Offline
Woodsman
Offline
Woodsman
T
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 135
Any kind of health guarantee when you bought the pup? Very tough situation to be in but I would keep trying to work the situation with the breeder.

Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: TexasBlazer72] #4086012 02/27/13 03:43 AM
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 2,013
T
thewrap Offline OP
Veteran Tracker
OP Offline
Veteran Tracker
T
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 2,013
Nope no guarantee which I think is BS because this was something that the dog was born with. I have confirmation of that from the specialist.


Jesse Reynolds
Professional Home Inspector TREC ID# 21526
www.integrityhomeinspectionservice.com
Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: thewrap] #4086040 02/27/13 03:57 AM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,034
M
MS1454 Online Content
Veteran Tracker
Online Content
Veteran Tracker
M
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,034
How did you come to find out the mother had this issue?

No your not being unreasonable at all. They knew the mother had this issue and they had no business breeder her because of it. If there was not a health contract, your probably up a creek.

Tough situation no doubt, but seems all you can do is spread the word about their pups and how they handled the situation. The right thing would be for them to refund your money but doesn't look like that's gonna happen. Buyer beware.

Last edited by MS1454; 02/27/13 03:58 AM.

Originally Posted By: Fooshman
I'll take a Black Female every time.

Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: MS1454] #4086044 02/27/13 03:59 AM
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 2,013
T
thewrap Offline OP
Veteran Tracker
OP Offline
Veteran Tracker
T
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 2,013
Originally Posted By: MS1454
How did you come to find out the mother had this issue?

Shelbee explained that to me when I had first broke the news to them.


Jesse Reynolds
Professional Home Inspector TREC ID# 21526
www.integrityhomeinspectionservice.com
Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: thewrap] #4086083 02/27/13 04:11 AM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,038
IronSpikeLabs Offline
Veteran Tracker
Offline
Veteran Tracker
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,038
Is this a "breeder" or someone who just happened to breed a couple of dogs? The difference is, the breeder approaches it as a business and does things like provide health guarantees and genetic defect warranties. A reputable one should also care about the long term consequences of not standing behind their dogs. If it wasn't a breeder and there was no guarantee or warranty, there may not be much you can do despite the heartache and medical expenses.



IRON SPIKE RANCH & KENNELS
Started & Prospective Gun Dog Pups
http://www.youtube.com/ironspikeranch
http://ironspikeranch.net
Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: thewrap] #4086086 02/27/13 04:12 AM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 108
B
BPence Offline
Woodsman
Offline
Woodsman
B
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 108
Sounds like a breeder to steer clear of. Do they have other breeds or just brittanys?

Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: IronSpikeLabs] #4086096 02/27/13 04:15 AM
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 2,013
T
thewrap Offline OP
Veteran Tracker
OP Offline
Veteran Tracker
T
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 2,013
Originally Posted By: IronSpikeLabs
Is this a "breeder" or someone who just happened to breed a couple of dogs? The difference is, the breeder approaches it as a business and does things like provide health guarantees and genetic defect warranties. A reputable one should also care about the long term consequences of not standing behind their dogs. If it wasn't a breeder and there was no guarantee or warranty, there may not be much you can do despite the heartache and medical expenses.

Not a breeder just a family who had an AKC registered litter. Last time I make that mistake. I am filing his papers now to the AKC to let them know what happened.


Jesse Reynolds
Professional Home Inspector TREC ID# 21526
www.integrityhomeinspectionservice.com
Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: thewrap] #4086334 02/27/13 11:21 AM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,085
D
Don Dial Offline
Veteran Tracker
Offline
Veteran Tracker
D
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,085
I didn't see what you paid for the animal, but if it was a lot then the health and genetics are assumed to be warranteed..Small
Claims Court. My wife raises Old Eng. Mastiffs she guarantees their health to 1 yr..and also will take them back if the indivual cannot take care of them any longer..Most reputable breeders do this..but she also gets $1K up for the pups..my male
was $2500 as a pup..and they cost about $6,000 a yr. to maintain
4 animals, w/out raising any pups..which usually are C section.
If all is as you stated, you should be able to get a judgement for the costs of the animal and vet care..Don

Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: Don Dial] #4086399 02/27/13 12:44 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,741
S
stinkbelly Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
S
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,741
This is why I own Deutsch Drahthaars. The breed organization guarantees that the dogs are sound. I don't have the time or knowledge to follow bloodlines and breeders to see who is a true breeder with the best interest of the breed in mind and who is just a person who thought it would be cool to have a litter and make some money.

If what you have said is true and they knew of the history of this disorder, then in my opinion they are fully responsible for those puppies. Now the big question comes up, are you willing to give that puppy back to them for a full refund? I have seen breeders that require the puppy back for a refund. I can understand, but it also feels a little dishonest since they know you are attached to the pup.

Basically, I don't think you are being unreasonable. They owe you something if what you said is true.

I would like to hear their side of the story.

Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: stinkbelly] #4086559 02/27/13 02:14 PM
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,034
C
CCBIRDDOGMAN Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
C
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,034
I've talked to you about this before via P.M. so you know how I feel, I can't understand why someone would breed a dog that they know had problems like that. I would stay after them, IMO, they owe you your money back on the pup.

I thought the last time I asked you about the pup, you said it was doing better? Good luck.


Originally Posted by bill oxner
Haven't had it in years but never spit any out.


Originally Posted by bill oxner
I am a sucker for happy endings and strapped cowboys.
Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: CCBIRDDOGMAN] #4086584 02/27/13 02:24 PM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 69,434
bill oxner Online Content
THF Celebrity
Online Content
THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 69,434
Sometimes the headache is not worth the refund. I feel sorry for the pup.


Quail hunting is like walking into, and out of a beautiful painting all day long. Gene Hill


[Linked Image]




Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: bill oxner] #4086886 02/27/13 04:11 PM
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 2,013
T
thewrap Offline OP
Veteran Tracker
OP Offline
Veteran Tracker
T
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 2,013
Don I only paid $425 for the dog plus what it cost me to drive to Memphis, TX to get him. I've been told by a few people that small claims court would be an option but I kind of feel that without any guarantee I don't have enough for a certain judgement.

Stinkbelly I don't think I could ever voluntarily give the pup up, especially give him back to the people I got him from. If they handle this situation so poorly I couldn't imagine how they'd handle it if they had to live with the dog every day. He still means alot to me and I really want to do right by him. Even though he'll never have the chance to be a bird dog he's still my number 2 guy.

CC last time we spoke he was doing better. He's managed to get better at some things but worse at others. I think part of it is due to his energy level being so high. To try and keep me a little bit more mellow he gets walked twice a day which I think helps him most of the time.

Other than his physical disability he's just a typical mischievous puppy.
I'll see about getting some new videos posted of him.


Jesse Reynolds
Professional Home Inspector TREC ID# 21526
www.integrityhomeinspectionservice.com
Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: thewrap] #4086972 02/27/13 04:45 PM
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,034
C
CCBIRDDOGMAN Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
C
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,034
Poor little guy. After thinking about it a little more, I do think Bill is right, it won't be worth the headache. And I would bet that if you did win in small claims court, you would have to give up the pup & I wouldn't be willing to do that. I would feel the same way that you do though, taken advantage of.


Originally Posted by bill oxner
Haven't had it in years but never spit any out.


Originally Posted by bill oxner
I am a sucker for happy endings and strapped cowboys.
Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: CCBIRDDOGMAN] #4087090 02/27/13 05:37 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,556
B
BenBob Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
B
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,556
Propose to them that they give you back half of your money and you keep the pup. It is not a great deal of money either way, but they should not have bred the mother if they knew this was a possibility. I guess it is sort of like my FIL says, "If they can live with what they did, I sure can too." In the long run, their sales have already taken a hit and all over them not doing the right thing.


Tired, Wired, and Uninspired
Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: BenBob] #4087105 02/27/13 05:46 PM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 268
S
stylesp Offline
Bird Dog
Offline
Bird Dog
S
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 268
Bad deal all around

Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: stylesp] #4087152 02/27/13 06:05 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,429
S
slow944 Offline
Pro Tracker
Offline
Pro Tracker
S
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,429
Man I'd hate to have to give up Max. He's a great pup that I got from CC. But yeah, word of mouth is spreading on here and they'll probably not get any sales of future litters thru THF.


I Have A 45 And A Shovel. Don't Mess With Texas!

According To "Kierchof's Law" Murphy Was An Optimist!

Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: slow944] #4087273 02/27/13 06:58 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,556
B
BenBob Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
B
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,556
thewrap, you showed what kind of person you are when you said you still wanted to keep the pup. As far as I am concerned, you are a top of the line person for just that reason.


Tired, Wired, and Uninspired
Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: BenBob] #4092194 03/01/13 05:29 PM
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 808
D
Dkhntr Offline
Tracker
Offline
Tracker
D
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 808
I have a dog that has problems like yours nome also will just uncontrollably start peeing with no control. This dog is a pain in the a-- but wife and i loves him to death. I feel for you. Your dog already has a spot In your heart. I do agree you dog should have had a guarantee another dog of mine is a britt and he cost 250 and had a guarantee on him so cost of dog does not matter.

If cut my losses make sure every one knew not to buy from that breeder and just love you pup and give them the best life possible.

Contact a britt rescue I'm sure you could get a healthy one to hunt with rather cheap.

Good luck with what ever route you take.

Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: Dkhntr] #4092267 03/01/13 06:04 PM
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,338
B
Bigjoe8504 Offline
Pro Tracker
Offline
Pro Tracker
B
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,338
You are nicer than I am. I would be all over them for my money back. If I were to keep the pup I would demand at least half back. Whether it was $20 or $2,000 you paid for a healthy pup. Same could be said if you found your pup to have parvo or another deadly disease. I wouldn't dream of breeding a dog with a known issue and then to not stand behind your pups is rediculous. Legally I don't know if there is any grounds unless you specifically asked at some point if the parents had any known issues. If you did ask then you have legal means as false information was blatently given. I'm sure you shook hands at some point in the transaction which in Texas is a binding contract. everything you agreed to on the issue is solid at that point.

Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: Bigjoe8504] #4092533 03/01/13 08:06 PM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,506
J
jorge Offline
Extreme Tracker
Offline
Extreme Tracker
J
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,506
I'd get after em man. I have labs and so far had good luck with buying em, but knowing that it had potential issues is like selling you a lemon car or a gun that has known to be problematic. Just ain't right.


Jorge Sakai
D.R.T. Outfitters

Contact #: 210-837-6742
GEORGE.SAKAI@YAHOO.COM

"Two things that define an individual what you do when you have everything, and what you do when you have nothing."


Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: jorge] #4093266 03/02/13 12:45 AM
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 152
R
Rockhunter Offline
Woodsman
Offline
Woodsman
R
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 152
I'm really sorry to hear about this happening. Why is it so hard for people to stand behind their products. Although I doubt it, I hope they are not breeding the dog anymore. That's really cruel to keep producing pups that might have this disorder.

Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: thewrap] #4093362 03/02/13 01:27 AM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,038
IronSpikeLabs Offline
Veteran Tracker
Offline
Veteran Tracker
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,038
Originally Posted By: thewrap
Originally Posted By: IronSpikeLabs
Is this a "breeder" or someone who just happened to breed a couple of dogs? The difference is, the breeder approaches it as a business and does things like provide health guarantees and genetic defect warranties. A reputable one should also care about the long term consequences of not standing behind their dogs. If it wasn't a breeder and there was no guarantee or warranty, there may not be much you can do despite the heartache and medical expenses.

Not a breeder just a family who had an AKC registered litter. Last time I make that mistake. I am filing his papers now to the AKC to let them know what happened.


This is so sad. I guess anyone who would be unscrupulous enough to knowingly breed a dog that will produce pups like this would also be unscrupulous enough to turn a deaf ear to your concerns. Sadly, it sounds like to get anything done, you will have to strong arm them. So sorry.



IRON SPIKE RANCH & KENNELS
Started & Prospective Gun Dog Pups
http://www.youtube.com/ironspikeranch
http://ironspikeranch.net
Re: Am I being Unreasonable? [Re: IronSpikeLabs] #4095802 03/03/13 06:48 AM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 2,177
A
Aquaman Offline
Veteran Tracker
Offline
Veteran Tracker
A
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 2,177
Some times you can get in contact with AKC and they can hold up individual papers in the future.


"Speak softly and carry a big stick" - Teddy Roosevelt
Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread

© 2004-2019 OUTDOOR SITES NETWORK all rights reserved USA and Worldwide
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.3