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Questions for rural/land real estate agents. #2794313 11/29/11 08:38 PM
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I'm getting frustrated with the process of making offers on land.
We received our last offer refusal this morning.

We've tried 3 different "buyers agents" all recommended offering 25% ~ 30% or more below asking price on the various properties we selected.
These suggestions are based on their years of experience in the areas and their comparables,,, we haven't been able to find any relevant comparables from any source other than what they supply.
The asking prices seem fairly high, their recommended offers seem fair or at least a starting point.
All these properties have been on the market for at least 3 years, some over 10.
We went against our first agents suggestion of 30% less and offered 18% less on our 1st choice, that seller was the most offended of them all.

Every single offer we've made has been flatly refused with no counter offer or interest in receiving another offer from us, obviously the sellers were offended.
We have at least 7 years into locating viewing and coming to a final decision on a list of 5 different properties carefully selected to offer on in the order they suited our wants just incase a deal or two went south.
But all 5 going sour?

Our agents said;
That's the way it goes, they don't really want to sell, the sellers just have it on the market incase a person with more money than brains comes along.

I'm not saying these folks don't know their business but how is a buyer suppose to know the actual value or make a reasonable offer on a property?

Is most land on the market today severely over priced and the sellers just leave it on the market at that price in hopes someone will come along and pay full asking price?

Is it time to leave the buyers agents out of it and run the risk over paying for the property?

Yes, I've read the questions about buying land sticky many times.

I guess our search starts over.

Sorry about the long windedness, frustration is getting the better of me right now.


Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: Rustler] #2794333 11/29/11 08:46 PM
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Sounds like to me your agent might be right. I've bought 4 ranches and have offered a lot less than what they asked. They come back with a counter and I do the same. Each time we were able to meet in the middle and both parties were happy. The first and biggest ranch I used an agent. I learned a lot for him and on the last 3 I delt with the landowners myself.

Seems odd they they didn't come back with a counter. That what makes me think they really don't want or have to sell, unless they get their price.



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Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: Stompy] #2794568 11/29/11 10:04 PM
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You are exactly right in your conclusion. Many landowners are just waiting for the big pay day. They don't have to sell the land but are more than willing to if they get their asking price.

The buyers agent shouldn't have any adverse affect on purchasing the property. The listing agent is splitting the commission the seller has already agreed to pay with the buyers agent and not costing the seller any more money.

If you are looking for a deal then you need to find out who needs to make a deal. Sometimes it means that your ideal property isn't in the mix because of price. Exceptions might have to be made to buy at the price you are willing to pay.


Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: Leonardo] #2794588 11/29/11 10:08 PM
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I believe the agent is doing his job protecting you from yourself. It takes time to find a correct deal. Wait for it.


Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: olducker] #2794747 11/29/11 10:47 PM
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I would look at it this way, if the property has been on the market a long time and they won't even work with what you are putting out there, then there really is no market for it. You would be stuck with an overpriced investment and probably never get out what you put into it unless killing a deer is worth it.

Have you asked the selling agents to provide comps or substance for what they are asking? A buddy of mine just bought some land in the Eastland area and seemed to get a good deal on it but had no water.


Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: olducker] #2794899 11/29/11 11:28 PM
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I appreciate the input. There are no relative comps out there that we are able to find on our own, just the comps the agents we've used provided. To me they aren't much help, none of those seem relevant either.

I bought property many years ago so maybe my view on how things work now is antiquated.

Its hard to understand why or believe property is being listed 30% or more above market value on a routine basis.

On one property 2 buyers agents recommended offering so much less I didn't think it was worth making the offer.
Example;
148 acres.
Good fence cross fenced nice entry gate good interior roads, paved county road frontage, water and elec on site where we'd want it, 2 ponds never went dry this summer both full now, 60 acres improved pasture including a 10 acre lush manicured food plot with scattered trees, 40 native grass pasture with scattered trees and good cover, 48 acres excellent cover heavy trees with small live creek. Good drainage, good elevation changes none in flood plane.
One 900 acre neighbor to the north one 4000+ acre neighbor on the the other 2 sides, no hunting on either place, 400 acre hunting lease across the county road.
Less than 2 hours from the house.

Asking price 3250 per acre, both agents recommended offering $1750 per acre, that sound right to anyone?

Both agents nearly had a stroke when we offered 2250 per acre,one refused to submit the offer.
The offer was turned down in 4 hours.

We'll keep looking, I haven't stopped for more than 30 years, got my wife interested in it about 7 years ago.
That's what makes all our offers being rejected so frustrating to me, she's losing interest.



Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: Rustler] #2797638 11/30/11 07:11 PM
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I think your agent is steering you wrong.Asking price is $3250 an acre and you offer them $1750...I'd be offended also.After the description you provided. Which part of Texas are we talking about? Central Tx is more expensive than say east Tx. I do agree it is a buyers market and you would think some of these folks would act accordingly,not so,many are holding on to their original prices from 4-5 years ago.Keep looking,you'll find someone that NEEDS to sell.



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Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: Erathkid] #2797880 11/30/11 08:32 PM
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I fully understand the regional land price differences.

I guess I didn't make in clear in my previous post.
On the place I used as an example that was listed for 3250 we didn't offer $1750, we offered $2200 per acre.

The 2 buyers agents we used on that one property recommended offering no more than $1750 per acre.
We thought that 1750 wasn't worth the effort to even make an offer from our past experiences, so, we offered $2200 per acre.
One of them basically quit saying he wanted no part in us offering that high of an amount for the land.
We would've payed $2500 per acre and been very happy about it.
I'd bet that place wouldn't stay on the market a month at $2800 per acre.

It's a tuff spot to be in when the sellers agent shows us 3 or 4 comps with so many improvements on the land they aren't anywhere near relevant at all.
Then buyers agents wants us to go by their experience and show us 5+ year old comps, completely burnt land or land with zero improvements on it as comps.

5 different properties, 5 different selling agents.
3 different buyers agents.
5 offers made, 2 of those offers exceeding the recommendations of our buyers agents by $500 ~ $1000 per acre.
5 offers refused with no reason or counter offer given or interest in receiving another offer.

We used 3 highly recommended and experienced buyers agents, I imagine they should know what a place is worth and how to go about closing a deal for a customer.

I don't get it, it makes no sense to me.


Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: Rustler] #2798017 11/30/11 09:25 PM
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dang



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Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: passthru] #2798058 11/30/11 09:39 PM
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I hate to agree with realtors because for the most part I find them deplorable, but I have offered on 3 pieces of land and got 2 of them:

1. 6 acres overlooking a leg of Lake Travis - Not waterfront, but only 600 yards to public park with boat ramps. Great views, top of mountain. Asking price: $146k We bid: $98k Offer accepted.

2. 40 acres Lavaca County near Yoakum. No improvements. Live, deep creek at back of property. Asking: $196k. We bid: $122k After 5 months, seller sold it for $122.5k to cash buyer (not me).

3. 40 acres Burleson County near Lexington. Electricity, City water at road, pond, woods, pasture. Asking price: $176k We bid: $128k Offer accepted.

It has been my experience that people tend to believe their land is worth what the parcel that sold for the highest in the county sold for. They're wrong about 90% of the time.

A property that's been on the market for over a year is someone that doesn't really want to sell, but will for the right price. Friend of mine had a grandma that actually listed her ranch twice: First time for $1.2mm - got full price offer. Didn't take it. Second time: $1.76mm - got full price offer. Didn't sell, realtor sued for commission. Won.

I'd take a look at Texas A&M's rural land sales trend analysis. I don't know where they get their numbers, but they're supposedly off of actual sales prices and not just asking prices.


Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: cameron00] #2798076 11/30/11 09:47 PM
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I'll also say that I had the exact opposite problem in that the realtor I was using was trying to push me to buy at the asking price and would tell me I was ridiculous for suggesting it was too high.

Will not use that gentlemen again. Had I listened to him, I'd have paid $5k for a parcel that ultimately sold for $3.2k per acre.


Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: cameron00] #2798271 11/30/11 10:47 PM
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I agree with Cameron00 on alot of this.

Also I dont know where your looking or how recently you have made these offers, but if it is in oil country you may as well hang it up.

You know what they say Location Location Location. You looking at 140 sumodd acres in the middle of BFE or in Bexar county or some other county within easy drive of a metropolitan area?

A really good friend of mine just bought a place a couple weeks ago, they offered quite a bit less than the asking price and were shocked when it was accepted. Again I dont know where your looking, but this was in the braketville area.


Last edited by redchevy; 11/30/11 10:49 PM.

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Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: redchevy] #2799108 12/01/11 02:55 AM
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I specialize in land and rural property sales, and a lot of what has been said here is true. Although I must say that every transaction has many different variables. Your agent should give you his opinion of what it worth and what a good offer would be, but if you choose to offer more or less then he should make that offer happily. Some agents do take their suggestions to personal and forget they are there to do whats best for you. If the person you are working with is not willing to do that then I suggest finding someone who will. And yes there are a lot of people of have listed properties with no need to sale unless they get the exact crazy price they are asking. I would suggest finding an agent your comfortable with and trust, just because an agent has sold 10 million that year doesnt mean they'll do the best job for you and vice versa. As many people on here said, there are good deals to be found. It just takes patience and sometimes being in the right place at the right time as Cameron00 said. Although I dont agree with him in that most agents are deplorable. Dont judge us all by a few bad apples just looking for a payday!



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Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: Frontgate Properties] #2799247 12/01/11 03:31 AM
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I do appreciate the input and I'm not trying to be rude but like I stated in previous posts we've used 3 different buyers agents.
All 3 came highly recommended and seem to be great folks, real straight shooters. We've been in contact with all of them for at least 3 years one of them I've known for 20+.
One quit because we when against his advice on the 2 properties he assisted us with and offered more than he suggested.
The other two are all for helping us in the future.

We haven't judged anyone, almost every agent we've met with buyer and seller alike have been professional helpful and friendly.

Seems to us that if every property we offered on is over priced by 25% ~ 50% like our buyers agents say, and is spot on or at most 10% over priced like the sellers agents says that's a huge discrepancy to work with.
If the sellers aren't willing to counter or even willing to look at another offer something aint going right in this process.


Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: Rustler] #2799892 12/01/11 01:06 PM
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Sounds like you're just having bad luck in that the properties you like are the ones held by people that don't really want to sell unless they get absolute top-dollar.


Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: cameron00] #2799898 12/01/11 01:10 PM
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Land is a very illiquid market with unique parcels. There isn't an obvious answer for any particular piece on how much it's worth - only a range. Two things that helped me:

1. I would point-blank ask the selling agent how serious their client was about selling the land. These days you can find a lot of people that are, we'll say, "very serious". i.e. They have to or they're going to lose it anyway.

2. I followed a ton of properties by setting up accounts on landsoftexas and har.com and a couple others and watched those that routinely dropped asking prices more closely. Those are the ones you know want to make a deal.

Good luck. It'll work out eventually.


Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: cameron00] #2800414 12/01/11 04:10 PM
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The last advice is very good, if you find a piece of land that has been on the market for 3 years and they have never reduced the price then that says something. You would like to see a land listing thats been on the market for awhile to be reducing the price periodically. And many agents will be honest with another agent if asked whether a seller is motivated or not. Good luck with your sure, if you stay with it you will find the right piece sooner or later.



Sincerely,
Trey Holdbrook
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Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: olducker] #2863936 12/23/11 08:55 AM
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Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: jeevanswaraaj] #2864024 12/23/11 01:20 PM
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There are like you said earlier a lot of places on the market that are way over priced but if someone would come up with what they are asking they will sell it. A few years ago I ran cattle on about a 100 acre place close to me. The person that owned it told me that I might start seeing people looking it over. He said that he got tired of hearing from realtors about selling the property. He said he put a big price on it an if someone was crazy enough to give him that he would sell it. Well within 6 months it sold. I have a small place near here that I am doing the same thing on. I have had people ask what I want for it. I have been telling them I don't want to sell it. Finally I just said that I want $10,000 an acre and don't come here wasting my time with a lower offer. Thank goodness I haven't heard from any of them lately.


Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: cameron00] #2864042 12/23/11 01:42 PM
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If they are asking 3250 per acre, they arent gonna take 1700 or 2200...They might take 2800, probably more like 3000.

I've got 10 acres for sale for 5500 a acre, I might take 5000, but I wont take 4000 or 4500. Lansd in the area sold for 6000 2 years ago and isnt even close to what my land is. I'll just sit on it. Thats the way people with land are. Ag exmpt and low taxes.


Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: 10pointdoe] #2864585 12/23/11 04:26 PM
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Sounds like you are looking at properties that others have purchased for investment.

A lot of land is sitting around at a price that its fine if it sells and fine if it doesnt.


Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: txbobcat] #2866326 12/24/11 03:56 AM
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Look at what the land is appraised at by the Apraisal Office. I am next door to a house and 2.5 acres that has been on the market since july 2007. The executor thinks because a realator told him it was worth a half million 4 years ago that it still is.






Re: Questions for rural/land real estate agents. [Re: DLALLDER] #2868109 12/24/11 10:39 PM
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The price is not the only reason a contrct may be turned down. There are tond of other things in an offer that coudld turn buyers off. Money down, financing, clauses in the contract. Lots that can turn a seller off. Second, a property is worth what someone is willing to pay for it. If you find something you really want and want to offer more than someone suggests or more than it may be "worth", then do it. Unless you are trying to make money on the place, it is your money and you can spend it any way you like. Why lose a place you REALLY want because of money? If you offered $2200 an acre on that place and they didnt counter, if you really like it and would be comfortable paying $2800/acre then submit another offer. Sound like most of your offers have been at 30% below asking price. That is pretty low. If I have a place listed for $450K and someone offers me $300K, I probably wouldnt think they were serious about buying.

Keep looking, dont give up. If any of the places you have made ooffers on are staying on your mind and the REALLY want it, go back and submit a higher offer.



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