Texas Hunting Forum

weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut

Posted By: Chickenman

weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/17/17 12:59 AM

I’m in a rut. I've been at it for about 9 months now and have certainly seen/felt improvements but its taking longer than expected. Not trying to win any awards or be the biggest on the block.

Initially, I set some achievable goals:
Get Stronger - progressing but slow in my opinion
Add Weight - I don't stay comfortable for long - I've doubled the weight from when I initially started if not more
Allow recover time (because I have elbow issues) - I work out 3-4 days a week so every other day mostly due to time restraints
Eat More - check - lost some fat gained muscle mass
Eat Protein - no way I can get in 200g of protein a day but I try (I read that I need 1g per pound of body weight)
Considering reevaluating these goals.

I’m 6’ 4” 230lbs (+/-)and 37 years old. I consume a pre and post work out shake. I work out at home. No gym. Dumbbells, curl bar, bench, triceps bar is what I use. Plenty of plate weights and dumbbells. I've logged every workout on a spreadsheet including measurements because I felt the need to track my experience.

What am I doing wrong?
What would help my growth?
Is there a magic formula?
High reps low weight or low reps high weight? Recently, I started doing high reps lower weight every 4th workout.

I've researched this a little bit and have read plenty of conflicting information. Everyone has an opinion.
Posted By: Paluxy

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/17/17 01:58 AM

I'm not a weight lifter by any stretch but I watched this guy develop this program. It's worked for many,

http://www.weightrainer.net/spreadsheets/matrix.html
Posted By: Chris42

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/17/17 09:55 AM

Dips. More dips.

Personally I prefer a mix of weight and reps.
Posted By: DPirates80

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/17/17 01:46 PM

Eat more even if you are eating a lot. Lift only 4-5 days a week and on them days, lift heavy each day. On rest days, eat eat eat! My advice to getting big from personal experience when I did power lifting was to lift huge, eat huge, and rest huge. Its hard to supplement a lot of that in though, I understand. But if you want to break through walls, you gotta do what you gotta do.
Posted By: Leonardo

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/17/17 10:16 PM

What type of gains are you looking for? Lifting more weight, cut fat, lean up, look more defined?
Posted By: Chickenman

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/17/17 10:50 PM

Thanks for the suggestions so far.



Interesting. I downloaded the matrix. I'll try to fit it in.

Originally Posted By: Chris42
Dips. More dips.


I'm partial to bean dip.

Originally Posted By: DPirates80
Eat more even if you are eating a lot.


I'm going to start tomorrow.

Originally Posted By: Leonardo
What type of gains are you looking for? Lifting more weight, cut fat, lean up, look more defined?


Not concerned with cutting fat or leaning up. Looking to lift more weight and sure, some definition. I want to feel and see the difference.

Example from 9 months ago to today:
bent flys went from 3 sets of 10 reps @ 20lbs to 4 or 5 sets of 10 @ 35lbs
tricepts extensions went from 20lbs (I know I know) to 5 sets of 10 80lbs
concentration curls went from 20lbs to 40lbs (I'm ready to add 5lbs this week)
I keep my reps to 10 unless I have cut the weight in half. In those cases, I double the reps or do burnouts
Posted By: txtrophy85

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/18/17 12:49 AM

what do you mean by improvements?

did you take any before measurements?
Posted By: scalebuster

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/18/17 01:00 AM

There is a magic formula. Do a cycle of Anadrol 50. It'll get you past that wall and give you a whole new attitude.
Posted By: A.B.

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/18/17 01:50 AM

When my boys would peak, we would add negatives for two weeks. Making sure to vary the width of our grips.

Put 50-75 lbs above your max and fight it on the way down for 5-7 seconds.


Don't worry, everyone finds a plateau. Negatives and rest will push you through.
Posted By: Paluxy

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/18/17 02:18 AM

Originally Posted By: Chickenman
Thanks for the suggestions so far.



Interesting. I downloaded the matrix. I'll try to fit it in.


Avoid the red and blue pills
Posted By: DPirates80

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/18/17 12:30 PM

Originally Posted By: scalebuster
There is a magic formula. Do a cycle of Anadrol 50. It'll get you past that wall and give you a whole new attitude.
If you're going to do a steroid, please be careful with oral steroids like this. Stick to a short cycle. Injectables are better for longer cycles.
Posted By: BOBO the Clown

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/18/17 02:37 PM

Originally Posted By: scalebuster
There is a magic formula. Do a cycle of Anadrol 50. It'll get you past that wall and give you a whole new attitude.


Tell your kidneys bye bye
Posted By: titan2232

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/18/17 03:03 PM

Change up your workout, but stay with the heavier weights.

Maybe incorporate a Smith machine if you can come across a cheap one.


I personally believe anything past 5 reps (when trying to gain strength and size) is a waste. Certain things like calves have to take an absolute beating to get bigger.


Bench: 8 sets of 3 reps, 1 set of 2 reps, and finish with 1 rep (all max weight)

Heavy tricep rope pressdowns was my go-to for size
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/18/17 11:37 PM

Everything I read says diet is 70-80% of your gains. You have to have a caloric surplus to build muscle, and you have to get over 200 grams of protein for your weight. Once you get to a certain point you aren't gonna get stronger unless you get bigger.

I hit 200 grams protein pretty easily.....
Wake up--double scoop protein shake (50-60 grams)
Mid morning--Protein bar (20 grams)
Lunch--Turkey or Ham sandwhich, two eggs, yogurt, vegetables (30-40 grams)
Mid afternoon--Single scoop protein shake (30 grams)
Dinner--30-40 grams
After workout--double scoop protein shake (50-60 grams)

Total 210-240 grams of protein per day. You just gotta drink it.


As far as getting stronger what others posted is true....switch up routines, reps per set, even the order of your workouts. I try to hit each body part every 4-5 days, and every workout is different.

Do some searches on Bodybuilding.com....lots of good articles and info on that site.
Posted By: KWood_TSU

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 02:13 AM

Check out Jim stoppani. Awesome workouts and advice. He has a lot of different workouts that you can get access too. Some are shreds, some are mass gains.

You need to do low reps, high weight. Gotta eat big to get big.
Cottage cheese and Greek yogurt are good for protein that is not meat.

And body change is a really slow process unfortunately. And change is good to shock the muscles. Throw some front squats, reverse grip bench press, etc in.
Posted By: KWood_TSU

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 02:22 AM

Here's a sample of my workouts that I'm doing. We work out all body parts twice a week. This is a shred though, but he says you can gain good muscle on this if you eat a lot. Let me tell you, these workouts are brutal.




Posted By: A.B.

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 02:26 AM

This isn't rocket science boys.


Go with the KISS method..... Keep it simple stupid


Eggs, tuna, chicken, peanut butter, bananas, water, milk, a little red meat as far as diet.


Heavy weight, low rep, and rest.


Make sure you have a spotter and throw in some negatives.


Never trust the Husker chart. Go with single rep max. Nothing like throwing up enough weight the bar bends. Oh yeah!
Posted By: A.B.

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 02:28 AM

Ain't a one of you mentioned legs! Real men don't don't forget leg days.....
Posted By: KWood_TSU

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 03:17 AM

Originally Posted By: A.B.
Ain't a one of you mentioned legs! Real men don't don't forget leg days.....


I said we hit everything twice a week.
My largest love/hate relationship for sure.
Posted By: A.B.

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 03:29 AM

Originally Posted By: KWood_TSU
Originally Posted By: A.B.
Ain't a one of you mentioned legs! Real men don't don't forget leg days.....


I said we hit everything twice a week.
My largest love/hate relationship for sure.



There ya go. Everyone loves bench, but hang clean, clean & jerk, and squat will give you the " bad arse" look.
Posted By: huck18

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 03:42 AM

Originally Posted By: DocHorton
Everything I read says diet is 70-80% of your gains. You have to have a caloric surplus to build muscle, and you have to get over 200 grams of protein for your weight. Once you get to a certain point you aren't gonna get stronger unless you get bigger.

I hit 200 grams protein pretty easily.....
Wake up--double scoop protein shake (50-60 grams)
Mid morning--Protein bar (20 grams)
Lunch--Turkey or Ham sandwhich, two eggs, yogurt, vegetables (30-40 grams)
Mid afternoon--Single scoop protein shake (30 grams)
Dinner--30-40 grams
After workout--double scoop protein shake (50-60 grams)

Total 210-240 grams of protein per day. You just gotta drink it.


As far as getting stronger what others posted is true....switch up routines, reps per set, even the order of your workouts. I try to hit each body part every 4-5 days, and every workout is different.

Do some searches on Bodybuilding.com....lots of good articles and info on that site.


Ignore every bit of this.
Posted By: huck18

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 03:56 AM

Originally Posted By: A.B.
This isn't rocket science boys.


Go with the KISS method..... Keep it simple stupid


Eggs, tuna, chicken, peanut butter, bananas, water, milk, a little red meat as far as diet.


Heavy weight, low rep, and rest.


Make sure you have a spotter and throw in some negatives.


Never trust the Husker chart. Go with single rep max. Nothing like throwing up enough weight the bar bends. Oh yeah!


This is good advice.

For strength you want to lift heavy, 5 reps or less. Mix up your workouts at least every few weeks if not more and use big compound movements. Bench, Squat, Deadlifts, Bent Over Rows and Power Cleans, should make up the base of your workouts. Don't use a smith machine or machine versions of these lifts, use the real deal old school iron. I also agree with AB about doing the negatives to get out of rut. Also doing sumo versions of the main lifts will also make your regular narrow lifts much stronger. You can also add bands or chains to the barbell to create what is called "over speed eccentrics" which is a over speed negative. For more info on the use of bands or chains research the Westside Barbell Method and Joe DeFranco.

As far as diet goes. You only need 1 gram of protein per pound to maintain or gain. The whole 2 grams per pound that the body builders preach is bro science, complete garbage made up by supplement companies to sell more junk protien to people who don't know any better. Your much better off just eating more whole foods. I got some of my best gains by eating more healthy fats (fish, nuts, coconut oil, MCT oil, avocado, bacon, etc..).
Posted By: huck18

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 04:06 AM

Originally Posted By: A.B.
Originally Posted By: KWood_TSU
Originally Posted By: A.B.
Ain't a one of you mentioned legs! Real men don't don't forget leg days.....


I said we hit everything twice a week.
My largest love/hate relationship for sure.



There ya go. Everyone loves bench, but hang clean, clean & jerk, and squat will give you the " bad arse" look.


Yep. The squats are what get you those big testosterone and hgh boosts.

http://fitness-science.org/squat-vs-leg-press-effects-testosterone-growth-hormone-cortisol/

https://breakingmuscle.com/learn/new-study-pits-barbell-squats-against-leg-press-machine
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 05:11 AM

Originally Posted By: huck18
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
Everything I read says diet is 70-80% of your gains. You have to have a caloric surplus to build muscle, and you have to get over 200 grams of protein for your weight. Once you get to a certain point you aren't gonna get stronger unless you get bigger.

I hit 200 grams protein pretty easily.....
Wake up--double scoop protein shake (50-60 grams)
Mid morning--Protein bar (20 grams)
Lunch--Turkey or Ham sandwhich, two eggs, yogurt, vegetables (30-40 grams)
Mid afternoon--Single scoop protein shake (30 grams)
Dinner--30-40 grams
After workout--double scoop protein shake (50-60 grams)

Total 210-240 grams of protein per day. You just gotta drink it.


As far as getting stronger what others posted is true....switch up routines, reps per set, even the order of your workouts. I try to hit each body part every 4-5 days, and every workout is different.

Do some searches on Bodybuilding.com....lots of good articles and info on that site.


Ignore every bit of this.


Lol. I've put on 16-18 lbs in the last 8-9 months, most of it muscle. But yeah, ignore all of it. Lmao.

You then said in your next post to eat one gram of protein per pound of body weight, that's exactly what I said too. Lol. Great post, troll.

So diet doesn't matter and you should do the same workouts all the time....got it. roflmao

Posted By: Paluxy

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 12:07 PM

Originally Posted By: DocHorton
Originally Posted By: huck18
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
Everything I read says diet is 70-80% of your gains. You have to have a caloric surplus to build muscle, and you have to get over 200 grams of protein for your weight. Once you get to a certain point you aren't gonna get stronger unless you get bigger.

I hit 200 grams protein pretty easily.....
Wake up--double scoop protein shake (50-60 grams)
Mid morning--Protein bar (20 grams)
Lunch--Turkey or Ham sandwhich, two eggs, yogurt, vegetables (30-40 grams)
Mid afternoon--Single scoop protein shake (30 grams)
Dinner--30-40 grams
After workout--double scoop protein shake (50-60 grams)

Total 210-240 grams of protein per day. You just gotta drink it.


As far as getting stronger what others posted is true....switch up routines, reps per set, even the order of your workouts. I try to hit each body part every 4-5 days, and every workout is different.

Do some searches on Bodybuilding.com....lots of good articles and info on that site.


Ignore every bit of this.


Lol. I've put on 16-18 lbs in the last 8-9 months, most of it muscle. But yeah, ignore all of it. Lmao.

You then said in your next post to eat one gram of protein per pound of body weight, that's exactly what I said too. Lol. Great post, troll.

So diet doesn't matter and you should do the same workouts all the time....got it. roflmao



I was wondering the same Doc.
Posted By: titan2232

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 12:09 PM

One of the most overlooked factors in all of this is genetics.

I've seen guys spend hundreds a month on supplements, work out 5-6 times a week very hard, but still somehow look like an AID's patient.
Posted By: Paluxy

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 12:24 PM

Originally Posted By: titan2232
One of the most overlooked factors in all of this is genetics.

I've seen guys spend hundreds a month on supplements, work out 5-6 times a week very hard, but still somehow look like an AID's patient.



But they are "wiry".
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 12:25 PM

KWood....how long do those workouts take you? What rest periods are you using between sets?

That looks like a long, hard workout!
Posted By: Chickenman

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 01:22 PM

Consumed 203g of protein yesterday which was hard. I'll start lifting heavier today.

I have read that genetics is the number one factor in results. Maybe I'll not shape up the way I want but at least I'll have my smarts.
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 02:12 PM

Originally Posted By: Chickenman
Consumed 203g of protein yesterday which was hard. I'll start lifting heavier today.

I have read that genetics is the number one factor in results. Maybe I'll not shape up the way I want but at least I'll have my smarts.


I agree, consuming that much protein in solid food without supplements is hard for me too. I couldn't eat that much without feeling bloated and too full all the time with my other foods, so I had to add in shakes to get in all the calories and protein I needed.

One thing I will add....I hit a plateau a couple months ago, so for example, for my bench I have switched to really focus on incline bench with varying levels of incline and have focused more heavily on dips, with much less emphasis on flat bench. I also may start with inclines one workout and the next workout I will switch the order and go in reverse. I have noticed some change for me and I will do this for a couple months and then switch it around again.

Keep at it, you will get there!!
Posted By: bill oxner

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 02:45 PM

Originally Posted By: DocHorton
Originally Posted By: Chickenman
Consumed 203g of protein yesterday which was hard. I'll start lifting heavier today.

I have read that genetics is the number one factor in results. Maybe I'll not shape up the way I want but at least I'll have my smarts.


I agree, consuming that much protein in solid food without supplements is hard for me too. I couldn't eat that much without feeling bloated and too full all the time with my other foods, so I had to add in shakes to get in all the calories and protein I needed.

One thing I will add....I hit a plateau a couple months ago, so for example, for my bench I have switched to really focus on incline bench with varying levels of incline and have focused more heavily on dips, with much less emphasis on flat bench. I also may start with inclines one workout and the next workout I will switch the order and go in reverse. I have noticed some change for me and I will do this for a couple months and then switch it around again.

Keep at it, you will get there!!


People do not burn calories the same way they consume them. After digestion they go into your system and stay in a general metabolic pool. The amounts of fats, carbohydrates, and protein consumed have little or no effect on your upper body muscle growth. Google general metabolic pool and see for yourself.
Posted By: huck18

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 02:46 PM

Originally Posted By: DocHorton
Originally Posted By: huck18
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
Everything I read says diet is 70-80% of your gains. You have to have a caloric surplus to build muscle, and you have to get over 200 grams of protein for your weight. Once you get to a certain point you aren't gonna get stronger unless you get bigger.

I hit 200 grams protein pretty easily.....
Wake up--double scoop protein shake (50-60 grams)
Mid morning--Protein bar (20 grams)
Lunch--Turkey or Ham sandwhich, two eggs, yogurt, vegetables (30-40 grams)
Mid afternoon--Single scoop protein shake (30 grams)
Dinner--30-40 grams
After workout--double scoop protein shake (50-60 grams)

Total 210-240 grams of protein per day. You just gotta drink it.


As far as getting stronger what others posted is true....switch up routines, reps per set, even the order of your workouts. I try to hit each body part every 4-5 days, and every workout is different.

Do some searches on Bodybuilding.com....lots of good articles and info on that site.


Ignore every bit of this.


Lol. I've put on 16-18 lbs in the last 8-9 months, most of it muscle. But yeah, ignore all of it. Lmao.

You then said in your next post to eat one gram of protein per pound of body weight, that's exactly what I said too. Lol. Great post, troll.

So diet doesn't matter and you should do the same workouts all the time....got it. roflmao



Where did I say diet doesn't matter and you should do the same workout? I said exactly the opposite. Your protein powder and protein bar advice is pure garbage no other way around it. "You just got to drink it" is a great way to get bloated, kill your kidneys and piss away a lot of money for no reason.

If you don't think Bench, Squat and Deadlift should be the base of a strength program I don't know what to tell you but all the experts who do it for a living will disagree with you. Mark Rippatoe and Louie Simmons have trained the strongest men in the world and they don't do it by bodybuilding.

His goal is to get stronger so he should be doing a strength type program. Not hypertrophy. You can gain muscle and still not get stronger, that's a fact. Two different types of training you have strength training which will be done in the low rep range (1-5 reps) and hypertrophy (body building) which will be done in the higher rep range (8-15 reps). You will get very different results doing one way versus the other.
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 02:58 PM

Originally Posted By: bill oxner
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
Originally Posted By: Chickenman
Consumed 203g of protein yesterday which was hard. I'll start lifting heavier today.

I have read that genetics is the number one factor in results. Maybe I'll not shape up the way I want but at least I'll have my smarts.


I agree, consuming that much protein in solid food without supplements is hard for me too. I couldn't eat that much without feeling bloated and too full all the time with my other foods, so I had to add in shakes to get in all the calories and protein I needed.

One thing I will add....I hit a plateau a couple months ago, so for example, for my bench I have switched to really focus on incline bench with varying levels of incline and have focused more heavily on dips, with much less emphasis on flat bench. I also may start with inclines one workout and the next workout I will switch the order and go in reverse. I have noticed some change for me and I will do this for a couple months and then switch it around again.

Keep at it, you will get there!!


People do not burn calories the same way they consume them. After digestion they go into your system and stay in a general metabolic pool. The amounts of fats, carbohydrates, and protein consumed have little or no effect on your upper body muscle growth. Google general metabolic pool and see for yourself.


You're wrong, Bill. You can't consistently build muscle with a diet that is deficient in protein. Period. It's simple biochemistry, muscles are made up of protein and water and need both to grow.
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 03:02 PM

Originally Posted By: huck18
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
Originally Posted By: huck18
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
Everything I read says diet is 70-80% of your gains. You have to have a caloric surplus to build muscle, and you have to get over 200 grams of protein for your weight. Once you get to a certain point you aren't gonna get stronger unless you get bigger.

I hit 200 grams protein pretty easily.....
Wake up--double scoop protein shake (50-60 grams)
Mid morning--Protein bar (20 grams)
Lunch--Turkey or Ham sandwhich, two eggs, yogurt, vegetables (30-40 grams)
Mid afternoon--Single scoop protein shake (30 grams)
Dinner--30-40 grams
After workout--double scoop protein shake (50-60 grams)

Total 210-240 grams of protein per day. You just gotta drink it.


As far as getting stronger what others posted is true....switch up routines, reps per set, even the order of your workouts. I try to hit each body part every 4-5 days, and every workout is different.

Do some searches on Bodybuilding.com....lots of good articles and info on that site.


Ignore every bit of this.


Lol. I've put on 16-18 lbs in the last 8-9 months, most of it muscle. But yeah, ignore all of it. Lmao.

You then said in your next post to eat one gram of protein per pound of body weight, that's exactly what I said too. Lol. Great post, troll.

So diet doesn't matter and you should do the same workouts all the time....got it. roflmao



Where did I say diet doesn't matter and you should do the same workout? I said exactly the opposite. Your protein powder and protein bar advice is pure garbage no other way around it. "You just got to drink it" is a great way to get bloated, kill your kidneys and piss away a lot of money for no reason.

If you don't think Bench, Squat and Deadlift should be the base of a strength program I don't know what to tell you but all the experts who do it for a living will disagree with you. Mark Rippatoe and Louie Simmons have trained the strongest men in the world and they don't do it by bodybuilding.

His goal is to get stronger so he should be doing a strength type program. Not hypertrophy. You can gain muscle and still not get stronger, that's a fact. Two different types of training you have strength training which will be done in the low rep range (1-5 reps) and hypertrophy (body building) which will be done in the higher rep range (8-15 reps). You will get very different results doing one way versus the other.


You said "ignore every bit of this". I said essentially, he needs to have a proper diet, get the proper amount of protein, change up his workouts, and to get stronger past a certain point he's going to have to get bigger. Those are all facts.

You then went on to basically say the same thing I had just said.....switch up your routines, 1 gram per pound of bodyweight, etc. Just funny how my post is garbage but then you say the same thing.

And by the way, increasing protein intake, including whey protein, has been shown to be beneficial for overall health and will not harm your kidneys at all. Do some research on the topic before you spout off on things you don't know about.

Take a look at some studies done on the subject...
https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthrea...1#post813528571
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 03:06 PM

Originally Posted By: huck18
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
Originally Posted By: huck18
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
Everything I read says diet is 70-80% of your gains. You have to have a caloric surplus to build muscle, and you have to get over 200 grams of protein for your weight. Once you get to a certain point you aren't gonna get stronger unless you get bigger.

I hit 200 grams protein pretty easily.....
Wake up--double scoop protein shake (50-60 grams)
Mid morning--Protein bar (20 grams)
Lunch--Turkey or Ham sandwhich, two eggs, yogurt, vegetables (30-40 grams)
Mid afternoon--Single scoop protein shake (30 grams)
Dinner--30-40 grams
After workout--double scoop protein shake (50-60 grams)

Total 210-240 grams of protein per day. You just gotta drink it.


As far as getting stronger what others posted is true....switch up routines, reps per set, even the order of your workouts. I try to hit each body part every 4-5 days, and every workout is different.

Do some searches on Bodybuilding.com....lots of good articles and info on that site.


Ignore every bit of this.


Lol. I've put on 16-18 lbs in the last 8-9 months, most of it muscle. But yeah, ignore all of it. Lmao.

You then said in your next post to eat one gram of protein per pound of body weight, that's exactly what I said too. Lol. Great post, troll.

So diet doesn't matter and you should do the same workouts all the time....got it. roflmao



Where did I say diet doesn't matter and you should do the same workout? I said exactly the opposite. Your protein powder and protein bar advice is pure garbage no other way around it. "You just got to drink it" is a great way to get bloated, kill your kidneys and piss away a lot of money for no reason.

If you don't think Bench, Squat and Deadlift should be the base of a strength program I don't know what to tell you but all the experts who do it for a living will disagree with you. Mark Rippatoe and Louie Simmons have trained the strongest men in the world and they don't do it by bodybuilding.

His goal is to get stronger so he should be doing a strength type program. Not hypertrophy. You can gain muscle and still not get stronger, that's a fact. Two different types of training you have strength training which will be done in the low rep range (1-5 reps) and hypertrophy (body building) which will be done in the higher rep range (8-15 reps). You will get very different results doing one way versus the other.


Maybe you missed the title of the thread "Weight lifting upper body muscle GROWTH - in a rut". Last time I checked, growth is hypertrophy.

Reading comprehension would help you.

Nothing in my post even addressed the specific workouts....again, reading comprehension would do you some good.
Posted By: Chickenman

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 03:15 PM

Originally Posted By: DocHorton
....so I had to add in shakes to get in all the calories and protein I needed.


I just ordered a morning protein shake. I'd like to get 60-70g in my system by 7am. That makes the other 160g or so easier.
Posted By: huck18

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 03:22 PM

So I guess you just read the title and not his actual stated goals then?

"Initially, I set some achievable goals:
Get Stronger - progressing but slow in my opinion
Add Weight - I don't stay comfortable for long - I've doubled the weight from when I initially started if not more"

Getting stronger and adding more weight to his lifts is not hypertrophy it's strength. He is most likely pretty new to this and doesn't know the difference between strength and hypertrophy which is why he said "add upper body muscle growth" in the title but his stated goals are not adding muscle but adding strength. Newbies don't know that muscle doesn't necessarily = strength.

Again none of this changes the fact that your advice to consume expensive garbage protein sources is terrible advice for anyone doing anything. Whole natural foods will always give you better results than processed garbage.
Posted By: huck18

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 03:24 PM

Originally Posted By: Chickenman
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
....so I had to add in shakes to get in all the calories and protein I needed.


I just ordered a morning protein shake. I'd like to get 60-70g in my system by 7am. That makes the other 160g or so easier.



You will gain as much if not more fat than muscle from doing this. Mark my words.
Posted By: huck18

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 03:30 PM

Originally Posted By: huck18
Originally Posted By: Chickenman
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
....so I had to add in shakes to get in all the calories and protein I needed.


I just ordered a morning protein shake. I'd like to get 60-70g in my system by 7am. That makes the other 160g or so easier.



You will gain as much if not more fat than muscle from doing this. Mark my words.


http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/09/03/too-much-protein.aspx

http://www.naturallyintense.net/blog/diet/nutrition/are-protein-shakes-bad-for-you-and-do-they-work/

http://www.phillymag.com/be-well-philly/2013/11/26/lay-protein-powder-stat/

http://nutritionstudies.org/no-whey-man-ill-pass-on-protein-powder/
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 03:31 PM

Originally Posted By: huck18
So I guess you just read the title and not his actual stated goals then?

"Initially, I set some achievable goals:
Get Stronger - progressing but slow in my opinion
Add Weight - I don't stay comfortable for long - I've doubled the weight from when I initially started if not more"

Getting stronger and adding more weight to his lifts is not hypertrophy it's strength. He is most likely pretty new to this and doesn't know the difference between strength and hypertrophy which is why he said "add upper body muscle growth" in the title but his stated goals are not adding muscle but adding strength. Newbies don't know that muscle doesn't necessarily = strength.

Again none of this changes the fact that your advice to consume expensive garbage protein sources is terrible advice for anyone doing anything. Whole natural foods will always give you better results than processed garbage.


Maybe you didn't read his stated question...

His specific question was "What would help with my growth?". I answered it.

I guess we can just disagree that consuming protein shakes as a supplement is terrible advice. I know what works, what weight lifters, bodybuilders, and athletes do, and what research says....that is good enough for me. I never said natural foods aren't good, but for most people to get enough protein when they weigh 230 lbs is gonna take some protein supplementation.

Carry on...
Posted By: Chickenman

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 03:39 PM

Originally Posted By: huck18
Originally Posted By: Chickenman
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
....so I had to add in shakes to get in all the calories and protein I needed.


I just ordered a morning protein shake. I'd like to get 60-70g in my system by 7am. That makes the other 160g or so easier.



You will gain as much if not more fat than muscle from doing this. Mark my words.


A few months ago, I had to take a break from all the online information related to working out because it all conflicted. One leading experts opinion would say the opposite from the next leading expert.
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 03:44 PM

Originally Posted By: Chickenman
Originally Posted By: huck18
Originally Posted By: Chickenman
Originally Posted By: DocHorton
....so I had to add in shakes to get in all the calories and protein I needed.


I just ordered a morning protein shake. I'd like to get 60-70g in my system by 7am. That makes the other 160g or so easier.



You will gain as much if not more fat than muscle from doing this. Mark my words.


A few months ago, I had to take a break from all the online information related to working out because it all conflicted. One leading experts opinion would say the opposite from the next leading expert.


I use ISO 100 by Dymatize. It's a Whey Protein with no fat, very low carbs, and 110 calories per serving with 25 grams protein and BCAA's. It's a very clean protein and you aren't gonna get fat from that, and it can help you get some more calories for a surplus while making sure you hit your protein goals.

If you take a mass gainer with tons of carbs and fats, then sure, you will gain fat as well. I've done that and while I gained weight it also added to my midsection so I quit and now just stick to clean protein to add lean muscle.
Posted By: huck18

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 04:05 PM

"It's a Whey Protein with no fat, very low carbs, and 110 calories per serving with 25 grams protein and BCAA's. You aren't gonna get fat from that and it can help you get some more calories for a surplus while making sure you hit your protein goals.

If you take a mass gainer with tons of carbs and fats, then sure, you will gain fat as well."

Dietary fat is not bad for it. It doesn't make you any more fat than carbs or proteins. In fact carbs are the real enemy as far as fat gain is concerned. This is the biggest misconception ever.

You can and will get fat from eating too much protein, that is a fact. All the excess protein you take in is stored as fat. Doc is way behind on the science, he is stating old bodybuilding bro science from 20 years ago.

I lost 10 pounds of fat from eating a ketogenic diet which was 70% fat, 20-25% protein and 5-10% carbs. Read the article from Doctor Mercola I posted. He actually is up to date with the new science.


http://www.express.co.uk/life-style/heal...-after-40-years

https://bengreenfieldfitness.com/2012/05/can-you-build-muscle-on-a-low-carbohydrate-diet/

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/christiane-northrup/saturated-fat_b_4914235.html

https://www.ted.com/talks/peter_attia_what_if_we_re_wrong_about_diabetes/transcript?language=en
Posted By: titan2232

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 04:53 PM

Low carb/sugar Whey protein in itself will not make you gain fat and may not even create an insulin spike (depending on how sensitive your body is to sugar)

It will however increase your overall calorie intake without giving you a satisfying feeling (I never could cure my hunger with whey or meal replacements) 2cents
Posted By: titan2232

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 05:00 PM

Originally Posted By: huck18
"It's a Whey Protein with no fat, very low carbs, and 110 calories per serving with 25 grams protein and BCAA's. You aren't gonna get fat from that and it can help you get some more calories for a surplus while making sure you hit your protein goals.

If you take a mass gainer with tons of carbs and fats, then sure, you will gain fat as well."

Dietary fat is not bad for it. It doesn't make you any more fat than carbs or proteins. In fact carbs are the real enemy as far as fat gain is concerned. This is the biggest misconception ever.

You can and will get fat from eating too much protein, that is a fact. All the excess protein you take in is stored as fat. Doc is way behind on the science, he is stating old bodybuilding bro science from 20 years ago.

I lost 10 pounds of fat from eating a ketogenic diet which was 70% fat, 20-25% protein and 5-10% carbs. Read the article from Doctor Mercola I posted. He actually is up to date with the new science.


http://www.express.co.uk/life-style/heal...-after-40-years

https://bengreenfieldfitness.com/2012/05/can-you-build-muscle-on-a-low-carbohydrate-diet/

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/christiane-northrup/saturated-fat_b_4914235.html

https://www.ted.com/talks/peter_attia_what_if_we_re_wrong_about_diabetes/transcript?language=en



Everyone's body is different, but I'm a firm believer that any excess animal fats and proteins consumed are used for energy IN THE ABSENCE OF CARBOHYDRATES.

It is an absolute fact (in regards to my body at 37 years old with mild activity) that I cannot gain fat when I cut real/fake sugar and carbs from my diet (two months of zero carbs with 5000 calories daily with little exercise resulted in no weight change)

Was losing an average of 4 pounds a week when I kept those calories around 2500 while keeping carbohydrates at 0.
Posted By: A.B.

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 05:04 PM

Originally Posted By: titan2232
One of the most overlooked factors in all of this is genetics.

I've seen guys spend hundreds a month on supplements, work out 5-6 times a week very hard, but still somehow look like an AID's patient.



Very true. My son's ending totals in powerlifting were almost identical to mine. Lots of changes over the last 30 years, but the genes stayed the same.
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 05:07 PM

It doesn't matter if your excess calories come from fat, protein, or carbs. Caloric surplus in any form causes you to gain weight....not too much protein, Huck. Your body needs the correct balance of macros to consistently gain muscle with resistance training. It's not bro science, it's biochemistry. Protein is the building block of muscle...it needs proteins to grow. You aren't going to gain muscle from eating extra carbs and fats...those are used by the body for fuel. Regeneration and hypertrophy of muscle comes from your body breaking down and using proteins. Your body will break down less protein through catabolism by oxidation with a proper balance of carbs and fats in your diet, and that is why those are important as well. You can keep arguing with me if you want, but I'm done with you. I'm tired of you agreeing with me and arguing at the same time and proving your posts wrong.

http://www.builtlean.com/2013/09/17/muscles-grow/

Your ketogenic diet had a caloric deficit...that's why you lost weight. It had nothing to do with your low protein.
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 05:15 PM

Is this the Dr. Mercola you're talking about? After reading about him, I wouldn't trust a single thing he recommends....just read through his views on medicine, vaccines, etc. He's basically a medical and scientific outcast.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Mercola

"Mercola has been criticized by business, regulatory, medical, and scientific communities. A 2006 BusinessWeek editorial stated his marketing practices relied on "slick promotion, clever use of information, and scare tactics."[3] In 2005, 2006, and 2011, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration warned Mercola and his company to stop making illegal claims regarding his products' ability to detect, prevent, and treat disease.[6] The medical watchdog site Quackwatch has criticized Mercola for making "unsubstantiated claims [that] clash with those of leading medical and public health organizations and many unsubstantiated recommendations for dietary supplements."[6]
Posted By: huck18

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 06:14 PM

Originally Posted By: DocHorton
It doesn't matter if your excess calories come from fat, protein, or carbs. Caloric surplus in any form causes you to gain weight....not too much protein, Huck. Your body needs the correct balance of macros to consistently gain muscle with resistance training. It's not bro science, it's biochemistry. Protein is the building block of muscle...it needs proteins to grow. You aren't going to gain muscle from eating extra carbs and fats...those are used by the body for fuel. Regeneration and hypertrophy of muscle comes from your body breaking down and using proteins. Your body will break down less protein through catabolism by oxidation with a proper balance of carbs and fats in your diet, and that is why those are important as well. You can keep arguing with me if you want, but I'm done with you. I'm tired of you agreeing with me and arguing at the same time and proving your posts wrong.

http://www.builtlean.com/2013/09/17/muscles-grow/

Your ketogenic diet had a caloric deficit...that's why you lost weight. It had nothing to do with your low protein.



Yes your body needs protein to grow but far less than what your saying. There are body builders that use a keto diet and gain muscle. And if your in a caloric surplus your gonna gain fat, no way around it. Doesn't matter if that surplus is from protein.

https://ketogains.com

Saturated fats and cholesterol are also important building blocks to gain muscle. There is a reason why the navy seals use the ketogenic diet. You can attack Doctor Mercola all you want but many other doctors like Peter Atilla and Dominic D'Agosteno who is doing work with the keto diet for the Navy Seals agree with him and the science has consistently been moving in that direction. You are wrong and 20 years from now you might figure it out. If your "done with me" then move along. I'm just trying to save the OP the trouble of gaining 10 pounds of fat from your ignorant advice.

I've posted many links with studies and proof to back up my claims you've done no such thing. And yes your advice is 20 year old bodybuilding bro science.
Posted By: huck18

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 06:17 PM

Originally Posted By: DocHorton
Is this the Dr. Mercola you're talking about? After reading about him, I wouldn't trust a single thing he recommends....just read through his views on medicine, vaccines, etc. He's basically a medical and scientific outcast.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Mercola

"Mercola has been criticized by business, regulatory, medical, and scientific communities. A 2006 BusinessWeek editorial stated his marketing practices relied on "slick promotion, clever use of information, and scare tactics."[3] In 2005, 2006, and 2011, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration warned Mercola and his company to stop making illegal claims regarding his products' ability to detect, prevent, and treat disease.[6] The medical watchdog site Quackwatch has criticized Mercola for making "unsubstantiated claims [that] clash with those of leading medical and public health organizations and many unsubstantiated recommendations for dietary supplements."[6]


You mean all those trustworthy main stream doctors opinions that have been killing people for years.

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/09/13/well/eat/how-the-sugar-industry-shifted-blame-to-fat.html?_r=0&referer=https://duckduckgo.com/

Ever notice how all the pro excess protein powder articles come from sites like bodybuilding.com that sell....you guessed it those same garbage protein powders.

Your way behind the times scientifically.
Posted By: Sneaky

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 06:46 PM

Talk about conflicting views, huh?

Chickenman, I'll just add this....do a little research on the experts you listen to. Sometimes, a photo of the person will tell you what you need to know. A lot of the experts out there are not natural. Their workouts and advice are tailored to that, but they don't explain that. These workouts aren't very effective for a natural lifter beyond the beginning stages. Many, many people follow their advice with good starting results, then top out quickly and wonder why. Dial in your nutrition and workout based on a trusted, natural strength training expert.
Posted By: txshntr

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 08:45 PM

Originally Posted By: Sneaky
Talk about conflicting views, huh?

Chickenman, I'll just add this....do a little research on the experts you listen to. Sometimes, a photo of the person will tell you what you need to know. A lot of the experts out there are not natural. Their workouts and advice are tailored to that, but they don't explain that. These workouts aren't very effective for a natural lifter beyond the beginning stages. Many, many people follow their advice with good starting results, then top out quickly and wonder why. Dial in your nutrition and workout based on a trusted, natural strength training expert.


A lot of truth to this. I used to compete in lifting and I didn't look the same as my team, didn't eat the same as my team and didn't train the same as my team. What worked for me would not work for Chickenman.

Now, if you are built like a fire hydrant, I might be able to help you rofl

I will add that you shouldn't discount the "abnormal" workouts. Trained strength is much different than true strength. If you hit a wall, many times it helped me to work on "true strength" and then turn the focus back on trained. By this, I mean I used to go move stone from one pallet to another, stack and unstack wood, etc. This type of training requires balance of muscles and counter muscles. You don't just move them, but do it deliberately making sure your core stays centered.

One of the biggest mistakes I have seen from gym rats and beginners is they don't counter their workouts and only focus on one muscle group. (If you do presses, do pulls). Also, many pay more attention to a certain muscle group because of aesthetics and then can't figure out why they aren't getting stronger...it is because they are ignoring the larger muscles. Alot of people that concentrate on curls constantly are guilty of this.

My 2cents
Posted By: KWood_TSU

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/19/17 09:17 PM

Originally Posted By: DocHorton
KWood....how long do those workouts take you? What rest periods are you using between sets?

That looks like a long, hard workout!



In between super sets, obviously zero. In between sets, 1 minute for now. Every 2 weeks it drops 15 seconds. That one took me 1.25 hours.
And yes, they are long and hard.
Posted By: BOBO the Clown

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/21/17 03:12 AM

Originally Posted By: A.B.
When my boys would peak, we would add negatives for two weeks. Making sure to vary the width of our grips.

Put 50-75 lbs above your max and fight it on the way down for 5-7 seconds.


Don't worry, everyone finds a plateau. Negatives and rest will push you through.


I'm not a doctor or professional but this guy with a bunch of pictures of him and people withmedals thingys with lots of circles on always had a hell week. Basically partner exercises with towels. More or less controlled negatives on everything. I remember my muscles just screaming for help. Ironically my next test out numbers a few months down the road was always higher then the one we took before tear down week. Any way, way cool facility in Colorado Springs, they had some cool weight thingy's there.

I can't attest to all the bodybuilder stuff and technics, we where more concerned with functional strength and being able touch our toes, also dedicated much of our time to plyometrics and stretching.

Now...I just pull tires, load up packs and play with kettle bells and sandbags.
Posted By: fadetoblack64

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/25/17 12:21 AM

all exercise will shorten your life......scars your arteries. Biggest scam there ever was. Especially running and weightlifting.


But its a huge economy so they say its good for you.

I can go on if yall want me to. rofl
Posted By: fadetoblack64

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/25/17 12:30 AM

But as Huck18 said........this is the lifestyle and will make you live healthy as long as possible...ketogenic diet/ eating style.


Check your blood sugar level.......its a cheap thing from any drug store.

I am not big anymore but I can beat your arse within a few seconds no matter your size rofl
Posted By: KWood_TSU

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/25/17 03:26 AM

Originally Posted By: takewhatyoucan64


I am not big anymore but I can beat your arse within a few seconds no matter your size rofl


Roy d mercer, is that you?!?
Posted By: fadetoblack64

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/27/17 11:42 PM

Originally Posted By: KWood_TSU
Originally Posted By: takewhatyoucan64


I am not big anymore but I can beat your arse within a few seconds no matter your size rofl


Roy d mercer, is that you?!?



You plotting on me boy?
Posted By: KWood_TSU

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/28/17 02:51 AM

Originally Posted By: takewhatyoucan64
Originally Posted By: KWood_TSU
Originally Posted By: takewhatyoucan64


I am not big anymore but I can beat your arse within a few seconds no matter your size rofl


Roy d mercer, is that you?!?



You plotting on me boy?


Just depends on how big an ol boy are ya?
Posted By: Chickenman

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/28/17 03:10 AM

I am on day 9 of consuming 200 grams (+/-) of protein. Its been a real challenge.

Elbow flared up again after lifting heavy twice in three days.

Took two days off and hit it again. As best I can tell, the only difference I feel is at the bench. 3 set of 10 @ 225lbs was easier. Dumbbells went from 40 to 44lbs. I'll move to 235lbs on the bench tomorrow which is where I have stopped in the past. Maybe move to 245 by mid May. That would be interesting.

Since I am consuming a bunch of food, I am fixing to incorporate cardio.... which I hate.
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/28/17 03:38 AM

Originally Posted By: Chickenman
I am on day 9 of consuming 200 grams (+/-) of protein. Its been a real challenge.

Elbow flared up again after lifting heavy twice in three days.

Took two days off and hit it again. As best I can tell, the only difference I feel is at the bench. 3 set of 10 @ 225lbs was easier. Dumbbells went from 40 to 44lbs. I'll move to 235lbs on the bench tomorrow which is where I have stopped in the past. Maybe move to 245 by mid May. That would be interesting.

Since I am consuming a bunch of food, I am fixing to incorporate cardio.... which I hate.


Awesome! I am on a cutting diet right now and I can tell my strength has dropped a little since I am eating less with less carbs.

I started taking Fish Oil pills about a month a half ago when my shoulders and elbows were hurting all the time....it helped me a lot. Soreness was noticeably improved in my joints. It's been shown to be effective at reducing inflammation in the joints and cartilage tissue.

https://www.organicfacts.net/health-benefits/oils/health-benefits-of-fish-oil.html
Posted By: fadetoblack64

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 04/30/17 11:12 AM

https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=231343




[Comments enabled]

The medical industry doesn't want you to read this.

Nor does the food industry.

But you should read it, and let it sink in.

There is a lot of BeeEss flying around about low-carb eating. Here are some common myths and truths related to this lifestyle.
•Myth: It's a "fad diet." Eating low-carb is a lifestyle, not a diet and it is not a fad. In fact humans, prior to the discovery of high-density agriculture, almost-exclusively ate in this fashion. A "fad" is an unproved and new way of doing something without examination as to validity. It is in fact the modern mania with vegetable oils, nearly none of which exist in nature, along with other highly processed foods such as cereals and sugar-laden things, driven by literal billions of advertising dollars, that is the fad. Nobody spends a billion dollars advertising broccoli crowns on TeeVee!


•Myth: Low-carb eating means not eating vegetables and fruits. Nonsense. For nearly everyone who decides to eat low-carb their consumption of vegetables greatly increases, especially when it comes to green vegetables. There is no restriction whatsoever in the consumption of things such as spinach, broccoli, brussels sprouts, cucumbers and its soaked-in-vinegar friend the dill pickle, various forms of peppers and similar. Small, nutrient-dense fruits and berries, along with nuts, are also compatible in amounts comparable to that which would be found "in season" naturally.


•Myth: Low-carb eating means not getting enough fiber. Oh really? All those vegetables are an insufficient source of fiber? Like hell; what's missing is the artificially-added back fiber that people love to crow about in things like bread, which wasn't there in the first place due to all the processing. I suppose if you want to eat what amounts to cardboard (cellulose) that has been put back into a processed food so it can claim to be "high fiber" then yes, it means "not getting enough" but the last time I checked cardboard wasn't a naturally-occurring thing nor would you find it tasty -- unless it was slathered with sugar. Guess what gets added to these "foods" to make all that added-back fiber palatable? Yep.


•Myth: Low-carb eating means not having enough energy since you don't have carbohydrates. Fact: Your body, even if you're very slender with zero perceptible fat on you, has enough fat in storage to run ten marathons without eating, yet you can't even run one with a maximum load of stored carbohydrate. Your stores of glycogen, which is what carbohydrate is metabolized into in the body, are limited to about 2,000 calories at most. Even the leanest person has five to ten pounds of fat stored on them (and most have a lot more) with each pound being 3,500 calories. You do the math.


•Myth: You need carbohydrates. Fact: There are no essential carbohydrates. There are essential fatty acids and protein complexes, along with ascorbate (vitamin C) that your body cannot synthesize, but no such thing exists for carbohydrates. The exact amount of carbohydrate your body requires is zero.


•Myth: You can't perform athletically without carbohydrates. Fact: Athletic performance, especially for endurance events such as running at double-digit mileages, is not only possible without carbohydrates it in many ways can be superior. During heavy exertion the digestive system is effectively shut down because the body shunts its energy resources to the skeletal muscles to drive that performance. Since carbohydrate stores are limited to about 2,000 calories and a mile of running requires somewhere between 100 - 120 calories to sustain plus your base energy requirement (another 150 calories/hour or so) during longer endurance events you're constantly "dancing with the devil" in attempting to consume carbohydrates and digest them while your digestive system is barely functional. If you lose this dance you either vomit or have an immediate need to relieve yourself out the other end -- and both of those events come with dehydration, which is very dangerous when exerting yourself heavily. By contrast when running on lipids (fats) even the leanest athlete has more than enough fat in their body to run several ultra marathons back-to-back and thus need consume nothing in the way of food, requiring only hydration and electrolytes that can be immediately absorbed by the intestines. Further, studies have shown that those who are low-carb adapted burn much more fat during exercise than those who run into glycogen-deficit due to lack of carbs during a workout. In other words if part of your fitness goals include losing or maintaining body mass then being keto-adapted, that is, eating low-carb, will make your exercise far more productive in terms of losing weight -- 2.3x as much, to be precise.


•Myth: There's nothing to eat, it gets boring fast, and nutrient quality is poor. Fact: See the below list; virtually everything available to eat before the introduction of cheap international transport and "factory" foods is compatible with low-carb eating. Any form of animal flesh, eggs, cheeses, most vegetables and modest amounts of fruit and nuts are what make up a low-carb dietary intake. In addition virtually all spices are zero-carbohydrate and can be used without concern as to quantity. When you eat a lot of carbohydrate you're targeting caloric intake since high-carbohydrate foods have very low nutrient levels. The poster child for this is of course sugar, which other than carbohydrate has essentially zero nutrients, but it doesn't end there. Most high-carb starchy foods have very low vitamin and other nutrient loads compared against foods such as broccoli, kale and similar. Broccoli, for example, has your entire Vitamin C and K requirements in one serving along with a very high nutrient and protein balance score yet nets only 31 calories per serving and 6 grams of carbs, 2 of which are indigestible (fiber.) Rice, on the other hand, has a very low nutrient balance score, a decent protein balance, 205 calories/serving (6.6x as much!) and 45g of carbs yet only one gram of fiber (1/4 as much.) It also fails to provide any material amount of your vitamin requirements; the only related item that measures reasonably-well is folate. On the other hand when you eat low-carb your nutrient levels are naturally very high since those non-animal-source foods compatible with low-carb eating are sparse in calories. In short, assuming you consume the same caloric intake, what you "crowd out" when eating high-carb is nutrition while what you "crowd out" when eating low-carb is junk.


•Myth: Low-carb means eating a very high amount of protein. Fact: Low-carb eating contains moderate protein levels. Very high amounts of protein in fact are not "low-carb" since protein, when taken in beyond metabolic needs, is converted to glucose in the body. That would be the opposite of what you're intending. Don't trim the fat off your steak, consume it instead.


•Myth: Your cholesterol balance will go to hell on a low-carb diet and you'll have a heart attack. Fact: HDL typically goes up and LDL typically goes down, which is good, not bad. However, there are several flies in the ointment of the common rubric regarding cholesterol, dietary fat and heart disease, not the least of which is that the correlation in several studies, including recent studies, has been backward. That is, increased carbohydrate and PUFA (polyunsaturated fatty acids -- read, vegetable oils) intake is associated with increased, not decreased, ischemic heart disease. Want to have a heart attack? Eat carbs and vegetable oils. Seriously, I'm not kidding.


•Myth: You won't stick with it even if you try it. Fact: If you really do keto-adapt it is unlikely you'll ever return to eating high-carb foods en-masse. Why? Because you'll find them to be too sweet and no longer tasty. Sugar and its analogues are quite-addictive, and like most addictive things their "dose response" goes down the more you use them. That is, after a while a given amount of sugar doesn't taste "sweet" any more, so you add more to get the same "sweetness." Stop consuming sugars for a few months and suddenly even a tiny amount tastes too sweet, and is no longer pleasant. In addition once you become keto-adapted you are no longer a slave to food. People are utterly shocked to find that I often wake up in the morning and have no desire to eat anything until somewhere around lunchtime! They wake up famished every morning and immediately hit the pancakes, cereals and breads. I did too, until I went keto-adapted and that all disappeared. If you've ever been "hangry" it's because you're actually experiencing withdrawal from the addictive nature of fast carbohydrates. If you enjoy being a slave then may the chains rest lightly on your back, but just remember that this form of slavery comes with greatly-increased risks of heart disease, obesity and diabetes. Are you sure it's worth it?


Once again, for those who missed it the last time, here's the "don't eat" list:
•Anything with added sugars on the label irrespective of amount. If a word ending in "-ose" is on the label, it's a sugar. Maltrose, dextrose, sucrose, fructose, etc. All are sugars. Go through your cupboard and throw all those packages and cans out, and don't buy any more of them.


•Anything with man-made PUFAs in it. There are two basic types of PUFAs -- Omega-3 and Omega-6. Omega-3 is good for you in reasonable amounts and is almost-exclusively found in the flesh of animals, including most-especially fish. Omega-6, on the other hand, is found naturally in most plant material. The problem is that the amount found in plants you eat whole is tiny but when concentrated into man-extracted oils from vegetable sources you wind up consuming thousands of times more of it than you ever could by eating the actual plant. Cottonseed oil, for example, is full of this stuff, yet you'd never sit down and eat a bowl of cotton seeds! Likewise, you'd have to eat something like two bushels of corn in a single sitting to get the amount of PUFA found in one tablespoon of corn oil, but it is utterly trivial to consume that amount in baked goods. This is true for all vegetable oils. The only exception? Small amounts of olive oil are reasonable used as a salad dressing. But you should never, ever, cook with vegetable oils including sauteeing, frying, basting or similar because the fact that they're unsaturated means they oxidize rapidly and heat makes them oxidize more and faster. The "switch" to vegetable-based oils in fryers has probably killed more Americans in the last 40 years than all other causes of death combined. By the way, if you want the worst of the worst they come in the form of anything that has the word "hydrogenated" on the label. Those are PUFAs that have been chemically stabilized so they are a solid and don't spoil while on the shelf in the store. Let me be crystal-clear: The amount of PUFA you can safely ingest, and thus should ingest, is zero, with the exception of room-temperature olive oil used as a salad dressing or similar. That section in your grocery store is IMHO "heart attack in a bottle."


•"White", starchy vegetables and plants. This means rice, potatoes and similar. Rice and potatoes are peasant food. If you'd otherwise die they're acceptable, I guess, but I'd hardly call them my first choice. Rice I've already covered but potatoes aren't far behind. Their nutrient balance is severely skewed and, frankly, sucks. With 63g of carbs and 278 calories in one large (300gm) potato, while they have a decent amount of fiber (7g) and a good protein balance the rest is lacking. Of the vitamin complex only C and B6 are well-represented, and only half of your needs (compare against Broccoli.) The real problem with starchy foods is that they're carb-dense but nutrient-poor on balance which means they're not only incompatible with low-carb eating they will probably crowd out the nutrient-dense vegetables you should eat. Since these tend to digest quickly they also provoke a large insulin response. Note that any of these fried in PUFAs, such as french fries, dramatically multiply the trouble.


•Grains (especially wheat) and anything made with them. Cereals and similar are even worse than starchy vegetables in that the fiber is nearly-all absent as processed and thus has to be added back. Whole-wheat bread has a horrible protein quality score, is very high in carbs with 2 slices having 24g all on its own (20 of which "count" as there are 4 of fiber) and a modest nutrient balance. Store-bought breads and cereals, however, almost all contain hydrogenated oils -- that is, the worst sort of PUFAs. In terms of insulin response grains are almost-indistinguishable from table sugar and some are actually worse.

So what do you eat?
•Green vegetables such as spinach, kale, broccoli, brussels sprouts, cucumbers, etc. All are high in nutrients, low in calories, very low in carbohydrate and glycemic load and most have a good amount of fiber as well, all of it being naturally-occurring (not "added back.") Frozen is fine, fresh is better.


•Modest amounts of fruits are fine, eaten whole, approximating what you could obtain in season. Note that neither fruits or vegetables should be "juiced" or otherwise processed; doing so grossly speeds up the absorption of the sugars and destroys much of the fiber value! Eat your strawberries, in other words, as strawberries, not as a component in a "smoothie."


•Full-fat cheeses are perfectly ok; they have a near-perfect (75-80/20-25) balance of fat:protein. Do not buy the "reduced fat", "2%" or similar cheeses.


•Eggs likewise have a decent balance of proteins and fats, eaten whole, although they are a bit protein-heavy. Eschew the "eggwhite" and "eggbeaters" nonsense; break actual eggs and prepare them as you wish (it's perfectly ok to cook them first if you want them hard-boiled!) On mass eggs have about 6 grams of both fat and protein, but since fat is 9 cal/gm the energy balance (which is what you care about) is 1.5:1 in favor of fat. This means about 40% protein, 60% fat when you do the math; the goal for a non-athlete is around 20-25% of intake from protein, so they can't be your primary source but they're good overall.


•Full-fat meats and fish. Pork, chicken, beef and similar are all fine but do not trim or remove the fat portions. This means you eat your chicken skin-on, eschew the "skinless" chicken breast in favor of the complete version and eat it all. For steak, consume the fat and do not trim it; same with pork. For fish prefer fatty fish such as salmon and tuna.


•Reserve your excess fat, especially from bacon and sausage cooked for breakfast, and use it for cooking purposes -- such as sauteeing or even microwaving vegetables. If poured into a coffee mug it will keep for several months in the refrigerator without a problem. If you're older than 40 your mother probably did this and she knew what she was doing. For other cooking purposes (e.g. if you want to have an omelet and don't happen to have handy reserved bacon fat) use butter. Coconut oil, incidentally, if you can find it without extra crap in it, is mostly saturated fat and is one of the very few exceptions to the "no vegetable oil" rule that can be used reasonably-liberally. Be careful buying it however as much of it is stuffed full of hydrogenated crap which turns it into one of the worst instead of being in the "acceptable" column. READ THE LABEL.


•Use all the spices you wish. Virtually all of them are zero-carb and zero-calorie. The same is true for hot sauces and such, but check the labels to make sure they're not stuffed full of sugars or hydrogenated oils. Most are not but there are exceptions.

If you eat this way it is very hard to exceed 50g/carb a day. As an example a cup of brussels sprouts has eight grams of carbs, only five of which count (3 are fiber and don't digest.) If you eat a cup of those, two cups of broccoli flowers during the day in various snacks (8g more), one cup of green sweet pepper chopped up as a component of a main course or side for dinner (4g net) you'll have eaten quite a decent amount of vegetables yet you only consumed 17g of carbs net all day; you'd also have consumed just 108 calories. You could triple that and still be ok on the carbs and yet have consumed just about 1/6th of your caloric intake requirement!

It then becomes a matter of choosing protein sources without trying to limit fats and, in fact, buying the cheaper sources tends to work better because the stores charge more to trim or otherwise remove the fats! Between eggs, cheeses and animal products while intentionally leaving the fat content present you'll wind up with a low-carb diet that is very rich in nutrients and almost-completely absent in insulin-spiking carbs that also happens to be free of PUFAs that are associated with heart disease.

Oh, and you won't be hungry either; your body knows how to regulate its food intake all on its own if you simply stop poisoning the signalling pathways (largely mediated by leptin) that tell you whether you're hungry or not.

Welcome to waking up and not really wanting anything to eat until the middle of the day; a nice side effect of living this way is that your pants will fall off.
Posted By: huck18

Re: weight lifting upper body muscle growth - in a rut - 05/04/17 03:36 PM

Originally Posted By: takewhatyoucan64
https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=231343




[Comments enabled]

The medical industry doesn't want you to read this.

Nor does the food industry.

But you should read it, and let it sink in.

There is a lot of BeeEss flying around about low-carb eating. Here are some common myths and truths related to this lifestyle.
•Myth: It's a "fad diet." Eating low-carb is a lifestyle, not a diet and it is not a fad. In fact humans, prior to the discovery of high-density agriculture, almost-exclusively ate in this fashion. A "fad" is an unproved and new way of doing something without examination as to validity. It is in fact the modern mania with vegetable oils, nearly none of which exist in nature, along with other highly processed foods such as cereals and sugar-laden things, driven by literal billions of advertising dollars, that is the fad. Nobody spends a billion dollars advertising broccoli crowns on TeeVee!


•Myth: Low-carb eating means not eating vegetables and fruits. Nonsense. For nearly everyone who decides to eat low-carb their consumption of vegetables greatly increases, especially when it comes to green vegetables. There is no restriction whatsoever in the consumption of things such as spinach, broccoli, brussels sprouts, cucumbers and its soaked-in-vinegar friend the dill pickle, various forms of peppers and similar. Small, nutrient-dense fruits and berries, along with nuts, are also compatible in amounts comparable to that which would be found "in season" naturally.


•Myth: Low-carb eating means not getting enough fiber. Oh really? All those vegetables are an insufficient source of fiber? Like hell; what's missing is the artificially-added back fiber that people love to crow about in things like bread, which wasn't there in the first place due to all the processing. I suppose if you want to eat what amounts to cardboard (cellulose) that has been put back into a processed food so it can claim to be "high fiber" then yes, it means "not getting enough" but the last time I checked cardboard wasn't a naturally-occurring thing nor would you find it tasty -- unless it was slathered with sugar. Guess what gets added to these "foods" to make all that added-back fiber palatable? Yep.


•Myth: Low-carb eating means not having enough energy since you don't have carbohydrates. Fact: Your body, even if you're very slender with zero perceptible fat on you, has enough fat in storage to run ten marathons without eating, yet you can't even run one with a maximum load of stored carbohydrate. Your stores of glycogen, which is what carbohydrate is metabolized into in the body, are limited to about 2,000 calories at most. Even the leanest person has five to ten pounds of fat stored on them (and most have a lot more) with each pound being 3,500 calories. You do the math.


•Myth: You need carbohydrates. Fact: There are no essential carbohydrates. There are essential fatty acids and protein complexes, along with ascorbate (vitamin C) that your body cannot synthesize, but no such thing exists for carbohydrates. The exact amount of carbohydrate your body requires is zero.


•Myth: You can't perform athletically without carbohydrates. Fact: Athletic performance, especially for endurance events such as running at double-digit mileages, is not only possible without carbohydrates it in many ways can be superior. During heavy exertion the digestive system is effectively shut down because the body shunts its energy resources to the skeletal muscles to drive that performance. Since carbohydrate stores are limited to about 2,000 calories and a mile of running requires somewhere between 100 - 120 calories to sustain plus your base energy requirement (another 150 calories/hour or so) during longer endurance events you're constantly "dancing with the devil" in attempting to consume carbohydrates and digest them while your digestive system is barely functional. If you lose this dance you either vomit or have an immediate need to relieve yourself out the other end -- and both of those events come with dehydration, which is very dangerous when exerting yourself heavily. By contrast when running on lipids (fats) even the leanest athlete has more than enough fat in their body to run several ultra marathons back-to-back and thus need consume nothing in the way of food, requiring only hydration and electrolytes that can be immediately absorbed by the intestines. Further, studies have shown that those who are low-carb adapted burn much more fat during exercise than those who run into glycogen-deficit due to lack of carbs during a workout. In other words if part of your fitness goals include losing or maintaining body mass then being keto-adapted, that is, eating low-carb, will make your exercise far more productive in terms of losing weight -- 2.3x as much, to be precise.


•Myth: There's nothing to eat, it gets boring fast, and nutrient quality is poor. Fact: See the below list; virtually everything available to eat before the introduction of cheap international transport and "factory" foods is compatible with low-carb eating. Any form of animal flesh, eggs, cheeses, most vegetables and modest amounts of fruit and nuts are what make up a low-carb dietary intake. In addition virtually all spices are zero-carbohydrate and can be used without concern as to quantity. When you eat a lot of carbohydrate you're targeting caloric intake since high-carbohydrate foods have very low nutrient levels. The poster child for this is of course sugar, which other than carbohydrate has essentially zero nutrients, but it doesn't end there. Most high-carb starchy foods have very low vitamin and other nutrient loads compared against foods such as broccoli, kale and similar. Broccoli, for example, has your entire Vitamin C and K requirements in one serving along with a very high nutrient and protein balance score yet nets only 31 calories per serving and 6 grams of carbs, 2 of which are indigestible (fiber.) Rice, on the other hand, has a very low nutrient balance score, a decent protein balance, 205 calories/serving (6.6x as much!) and 45g of carbs yet only one gram of fiber (1/4 as much.) It also fails to provide any material amount of your vitamin requirements; the only related item that measures reasonably-well is folate. On the other hand when you eat low-carb your nutrient levels are naturally very high since those non-animal-source foods compatible with low-carb eating are sparse in calories. In short, assuming you consume the same caloric intake, what you "crowd out" when eating high-carb is nutrition while what you "crowd out" when eating low-carb is junk.


•Myth: Low-carb means eating a very high amount of protein. Fact: Low-carb eating contains moderate protein levels. Very high amounts of protein in fact are not "low-carb" since protein, when taken in beyond metabolic needs, is converted to glucose in the body. That would be the opposite of what you're intending. Don't trim the fat off your steak, consume it instead.


•Myth: Your cholesterol balance will go to hell on a low-carb diet and you'll have a heart attack. Fact: HDL typically goes up and LDL typically goes down, which is good, not bad. However, there are several flies in the ointment of the common rubric regarding cholesterol, dietary fat and heart disease, not the least of which is that the correlation in several studies, including recent studies, has been backward. That is, increased carbohydrate and PUFA (polyunsaturated fatty acids -- read, vegetable oils) intake is associated with increased, not decreased, ischemic heart disease. Want to have a heart attack? Eat carbs and vegetable oils. Seriously, I'm not kidding.


•Myth: You won't stick with it even if you try it. Fact: If you really do keto-adapt it is unlikely you'll ever return to eating high-carb foods en-masse. Why? Because you'll find them to be too sweet and no longer tasty. Sugar and its analogues are quite-addictive, and like most addictive things their "dose response" goes down the more you use them. That is, after a while a given amount of sugar doesn't taste "sweet" any more, so you add more to get the same "sweetness." Stop consuming sugars for a few months and suddenly even a tiny amount tastes too sweet, and is no longer pleasant. In addition once you become keto-adapted you are no longer a slave to food. People are utterly shocked to find that I often wake up in the morning and have no desire to eat anything until somewhere around lunchtime! They wake up famished every morning and immediately hit the pancakes, cereals and breads. I did too, until I went keto-adapted and that all disappeared. If you've ever been "hangry" it's because you're actually experiencing withdrawal from the addictive nature of fast carbohydrates. If you enjoy being a slave then may the chains rest lightly on your back, but just remember that this form of slavery comes with greatly-increased risks of heart disease, obesity and diabetes. Are you sure it's worth it?


Once again, for those who missed it the last time, here's the "don't eat" list:
•Anything with added sugars on the label irrespective of amount. If a word ending in "-ose" is on the label, it's a sugar. Maltrose, dextrose, sucrose, fructose, etc. All are sugars. Go through your cupboard and throw all those packages and cans out, and don't buy any more of them.


•Anything with man-made PUFAs in it. There are two basic types of PUFAs -- Omega-3 and Omega-6. Omega-3 is good for you in reasonable amounts and is almost-exclusively found in the flesh of animals, including most-especially fish. Omega-6, on the other hand, is found naturally in most plant material. The problem is that the amount found in plants you eat whole is tiny but when concentrated into man-extracted oils from vegetable sources you wind up consuming thousands of times more of it than you ever could by eating the actual plant. Cottonseed oil, for example, is full of this stuff, yet you'd never sit down and eat a bowl of cotton seeds! Likewise, you'd have to eat something like two bushels of corn in a single sitting to get the amount of PUFA found in one tablespoon of corn oil, but it is utterly trivial to consume that amount in baked goods. This is true for all vegetable oils. The only exception? Small amounts of olive oil are reasonable used as a salad dressing. But you should never, ever, cook with vegetable oils including sauteeing, frying, basting or similar because the fact that they're unsaturated means they oxidize rapidly and heat makes them oxidize more and faster. The "switch" to vegetable-based oils in fryers has probably killed more Americans in the last 40 years than all other causes of death combined. By the way, if you want the worst of the worst they come in the form of anything that has the word "hydrogenated" on the label. Those are PUFAs that have been chemically stabilized so they are a solid and don't spoil while on the shelf in the store. Let me be crystal-clear: The amount of PUFA you can safely ingest, and thus should ingest, is zero, with the exception of room-temperature olive oil used as a salad dressing or similar. That section in your grocery store is IMHO "heart attack in a bottle."


•"White", starchy vegetables and plants. This means rice, potatoes and similar. Rice and potatoes are peasant food. If you'd otherwise die they're acceptable, I guess, but I'd hardly call them my first choice. Rice I've already covered but potatoes aren't far behind. Their nutrient balance is severely skewed and, frankly, sucks. With 63g of carbs and 278 calories in one large (300gm) potato, while they have a decent amount of fiber (7g) and a good protein balance the rest is lacking. Of the vitamin complex only C and B6 are well-represented, and only half of your needs (compare against Broccoli.) The real problem with starchy foods is that they're carb-dense but nutrient-poor on balance which means they're not only incompatible with low-carb eating they will probably crowd out the nutrient-dense vegetables you should eat. Since these tend to digest quickly they also provoke a large insulin response. Note that any of these fried in PUFAs, such as french fries, dramatically multiply the trouble.


•Grains (especially wheat) and anything made with them. Cereals and similar are even worse than starchy vegetables in that the fiber is nearly-all absent as processed and thus has to be added back. Whole-wheat bread has a horrible protein quality score, is very high in carbs with 2 slices having 24g all on its own (20 of which "count" as there are 4 of fiber) and a modest nutrient balance. Store-bought breads and cereals, however, almost all contain hydrogenated oils -- that is, the worst sort of PUFAs. In terms of insulin response grains are almost-indistinguishable from table sugar and some are actually worse.

So what do you eat?
•Green vegetables such as spinach, kale, broccoli, brussels sprouts, cucumbers, etc. All are high in nutrients, low in calories, very low in carbohydrate and glycemic load and most have a good amount of fiber as well, all of it being naturally-occurring (not "added back.") Frozen is fine, fresh is better.


•Modest amounts of fruits are fine, eaten whole, approximating what you could obtain in season. Note that neither fruits or vegetables should be "juiced" or otherwise processed; doing so grossly speeds up the absorption of the sugars and destroys much of the fiber value! Eat your strawberries, in other words, as strawberries, not as a component in a "smoothie."


•Full-fat cheeses are perfectly ok; they have a near-perfect (75-80/20-25) balance of fat:protein. Do not buy the "reduced fat", "2%" or similar cheeses.


•Eggs likewise have a decent balance of proteins and fats, eaten whole, although they are a bit protein-heavy. Eschew the "eggwhite" and "eggbeaters" nonsense; break actual eggs and prepare them as you wish (it's perfectly ok to cook them first if you want them hard-boiled!) On mass eggs have about 6 grams of both fat and protein, but since fat is 9 cal/gm the energy balance (which is what you care about) is 1.5:1 in favor of fat. This means about 40% protein, 60% fat when you do the math; the goal for a non-athlete is around 20-25% of intake from protein, so they can't be your primary source but they're good overall.


•Full-fat meats and fish. Pork, chicken, beef and similar are all fine but do not trim or remove the fat portions. This means you eat your chicken skin-on, eschew the "skinless" chicken breast in favor of the complete version and eat it all. For steak, consume the fat and do not trim it; same with pork. For fish prefer fatty fish such as salmon and tuna.


•Reserve your excess fat, especially from bacon and sausage cooked for breakfast, and use it for cooking purposes -- such as sauteeing or even microwaving vegetables. If poured into a coffee mug it will keep for several months in the refrigerator without a problem. If you're older than 40 your mother probably did this and she knew what she was doing. For other cooking purposes (e.g. if you want to have an omelet and don't happen to have handy reserved bacon fat) use butter. Coconut oil, incidentally, if you can find it without extra crap in it, is mostly saturated fat and is one of the very few exceptions to the "no vegetable oil" rule that can be used reasonably-liberally. Be careful buying it however as much of it is stuffed full of hydrogenated crap which turns it into one of the worst instead of being in the "acceptable" column. READ THE LABEL.


•Use all the spices you wish. Virtually all of them are zero-carb and zero-calorie. The same is true for hot sauces and such, but check the labels to make sure they're not stuffed full of sugars or hydrogenated oils. Most are not but there are exceptions.

If you eat this way it is very hard to exceed 50g/carb a day. As an example a cup of brussels sprouts has eight grams of carbs, only five of which count (3 are fiber and don't digest.) If you eat a cup of those, two cups of broccoli flowers during the day in various snacks (8g more), one cup of green sweet pepper chopped up as a component of a main course or side for dinner (4g net) you'll have eaten quite a decent amount of vegetables yet you only consumed 17g of carbs net all day; you'd also have consumed just 108 calories. You could triple that and still be ok on the carbs and yet have consumed just about 1/6th of your caloric intake requirement!

It then becomes a matter of choosing protein sources without trying to limit fats and, in fact, buying the cheaper sources tends to work better because the stores charge more to trim or otherwise remove the fats! Between eggs, cheeses and animal products while intentionally leaving the fat content present you'll wind up with a low-carb diet that is very rich in nutrients and almost-completely absent in insulin-spiking carbs that also happens to be free of PUFAs that are associated with heart disease.

Oh, and you won't be hungry either; your body knows how to regulate its food intake all on its own if you simply stop poisoning the signalling pathways (largely mediated by leptin) that tell you whether you're hungry or not.

Welcome to waking up and not really wanting anything to eat until the middle of the day; a nice side effect of living this way is that your pants will fall off.


Yep. This is true from my experience. When I don't eat this way I'm always hungry and get fat. When I do I have more energy, I'm never hungry and fat is effortlessly burned off.

Doctors, the food industry, and academia have been killing people for years with the modern food pyramid.
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