X-sight?

I've been playing with the idea of getting the x-sight. I've been reading about it and I've seen a lot of mixed reviews. What do y'all think? If I did get one it would be going on a 6.8 AR

What kind of hunting do you do? Distances stalking of from blinds?

Do you mind spending 20 bucks on batteries each time you go out?

Mainly from box stands between 50 and 150 yards. And if it's worth it, I could live with the battery cost

Wait another 2 weeks to see what the next firmware changes do. Its a safe bet since you have money in your pocket at the moment as opposed to getting in a mixed bag with current issues.

Unless you want to join us "early adopters" that are funding the R&D that ATN should have done BEFORE they started shipping and have continued shipping products that do not meet the basic functions of a sight ( holding zero thru all zoom levels) I'd wait or look elsewhere.
Rumors and cryptic messages hint that we just have to wait for one more update though, so caveat emptor.

I read all the reviews and the .200 firmware thread before I decided to buy an X-Sight.

I have a pig hunting trip coming up next month and wanted some sort of night vision.

I have 2 adult sons coming with me the first one purchased a Gen 1 monocular and an IR laser sight to use. After trying them out I decided to give the X-sight a try. I used my Cabelas points to order a 5x-18x model. After downloading the .228 firmware and trying it out at the range, then playing with it at night I'm quite happy with it.

My 2nd son, after playing with his brothers Gen 1 and my X-Sight, and seeing that the 3X was available at Cabelas ordered one.

I like my 2nd sons 3x a little better than my 5x, I think. We'll see how they perform next month. If we can remember to hit the video button when the pigs come in, I'll post videos.

Is the X-Sight perfect? Do all the features work flawlessly? The answer to both of those questions is No. But other here on the site have shown that the X-Sight does work and does kill pigs at night.

So you have to ask yourself, how important are those features that are not working right? What other night vision in the same price range are you considering? Can you afford more $$$ to buy better night vision?

I'd be leary of the assumption that the next several firmwares will fix all bugs and enable all features. There will be more, some painful and some not. Having reasonable expectations makes the scope a lot more enjoyable. I'm thinking the next release will fix some things, maybe break others, and possibly introduce a couple of new features. I think over the next year we'll see this happen regularly until all the features are done and the bugs mostly gone.

As long as you understand the caveats, the scope is usable now, and likely to get better fairly fast, but I doubt we will see our first solid and complete firmware for at least six months. Code just doesn't get written and debugged that fast.

Also they have to make sure it does not become self aware!

What features are not working right now? I've seen some videos that it looks very functional and I've read some really negative reviews that say it won't hold a zero for more than a few shots

As a dealer, here's my thoughts on the X Sight... I've gotten to play with it a significant amount and will continue to.

First off, my primary focus with night vision is traditional optical NV. The digital scopes can't touch even Gen 2+ on image quality so I am still a very big fan of regular NV. I sell Gen 2+ scopes from Night Optics, one of the top companies, for the same price that Pulsar Digisights go for. So, you can compare them in some regards. I carry Pulsar because it does have a few advantages but I sell 5 gen 2+ sights for every digisight I sell.

That being said, ATN brought a game changer here simply due to price point and all around use. Pulsar's scopes still blow during the day, even though they are usable. ATN's X Sight actually is very good during the day and very functional at night. Combine that with a durable aluminum housing rather than the plastic used by pulsar and a pricepoint of $700 or less, and the X Sight is a really cool unit. I have one for myself and have ordered several. They all disappear within a few days. I just got two in this week, one is already sold and I'm sure I'll have someone call me on the other shortly. Two more coming in next week.

Have you received and tested the updated 3X scope ?
I like my 5x scope and am in the process of saving my pennies for a 3x scope.
I gave up on regular NV after trying digital and thermal years ago.
Digital does have some drawbacks, but it will slowly take over regular NV as the technology advances.
The X sight is a good example, once they get the bugs ironed out.
For under $800, you get a 5x18 Color Day/ 2 color Night scope that records and if you add a better illuminator, it's a very capable NV scope.
If you bought a Gladius 760 6X gen 2 scope, decent Illuminator and a DVR, your going to spend about $2,500 and would feasibly only be able to use it an night.

I've got 2 of the 3x scopes in stock and I'm decently happy with them. Follow the thread on here about firmwares and such.

I agree that digital will probably overtake traditional night vision eventually, but I think we are still years from that. Last night, we had a field test where we took an ATN X-Sight, Pulsar N750, Night Optics Gen 2+HP Spartan, and for grins my setup using an EOTech EXPS 3-2 combined with a Night Optics PVS-14 Gen 3+ and magnifier lens for it. This was on a new moon, so worst conditions possible. The Gen 3+ was the clear cut winner of the night while the Spartan scope was very close behind. The difference between both of those and the third place N750 was huge and the ATN came in last but decently close to the N750. Personally, I have to look at price as well. I'm a dealer so I have the absolute best for my own personal equipment. Well, 2nd best as I am probably going to sell my PVS 14 as a demo unit and buy a new Gen 4 (filmless L3 tube) for myself. So, for the price, my opinion is the Gen 2+HP has by far the best performance for the price.

I've heard that some of the newer 3x scopes still have a focusing issues.
Regular NV will be around forever, as they are used by Military and LE around the globe.
I personally prefer Thermal, but I only have so many organs to sell.
I went through the Pulsar line and still use a DFA75.
I've read and heard that the Armasight Drone Pro 10x is the top digital scope and well liked by UK hunters.
They compare it to Gen 2+ NV.
I'm hoping the X sight will improve with the next firmware update.

Yeah, they sell like hotcakes, but not a single one works as promised. With numerous threads on this forum and then threads from several other forums, it would appear that there are a lot of people who are out a goodly amount of money on batteries and ammunition in trying to get their scopes to work as promised, only to discover that they don't do what is claimed, or that some twit at ATN decided to make detrimental arbitrary firmware changes.

I am not a dealer. I would say that it would be silly to pay for a scope now when you KNOW it doesn't work as designed and promised. Maybe it will someday, but it doesn't right now. It isn't like ATN is going to run out of scopes. They will keep making plenty. There is no reason to rush out and buy one now.

I disagree with the comment about not a single one works. There are quite a few people that are using their scopes without issues. I'm one of them. I have .228 firmware and I can zoom in and out and my shots stay in the same 1 1/2" group. Day and night vision work well for the price.

I was happy enough with my 5x to by a 3x for my son. Haven't got to the range yet with his. Was supposed to today, but got called into work.

Questions:
Have you compared the images side by side on the 3X and 5X?
Have you noticed any wash out of the screen during daylight on a bright day?

Based on my results, I would like to hear from anyone that has tried using one of these in daylight and in snow covered ground. Based on my experience at the range, a white target with sunlight on it washes completely out unless you hold your hand partly over the end of the sight. Not a practical solution when hunting.

It seems you need to have a winning lottery ticket to get one that performs close to their claims.

For the life of me I can't understand how one persons X-Sight can hold zero under all magnifications and have a fixed reticle position on the screen using the exact same firmware as those that are having these issues.

Can there really be this much of a difference between units? If so, how stable of a platform is ATN shipping and where is their Quality Control?

Uh-huh. We have hundreds of posts here that indicate otherwise.

I have a PhotonXT that I am happy with. Theres something about these XSights that have me drawn to them! Im seriously considering the 3x version for a side by side comparison with my PhotonXT.

I have read lots about the Xsight and folks are really giving them the works! Quite possibly the best free and publicized "R&D" ever.

I have two comments here Pigsigcles

1) The daytime performance (washout) you are experiencing COULD BE considered normal for digital technology. I've used a wide range of digital products and it is very hard, dang near impossible at times, to see conventional targets in the daytime beyond 50 yards for a tactile purpose such as zeroing.

That said you can use these scopes in the daytime to hunt, won't be as good as standard glass BUT the X-sight(s) that I have used are a step up from other companies digital products during the daytime (overall) BUT will still suffer from washout due to the X-sight being digital technology.

Solutions I've used with other scopes is light backgrounds with black spray painted circles or rectangles to shoot at and if available always put your targets in the shade and try to shoot from the same coverage. The digisights have a lens cover that can be manipulated pretty easily to limit the sun coming in the front end and I believe this is why ATN went with a sunshade on the X-sight.

2) Q&A wise if it is made in China one can expect variance from unit to unit and we've seen that with the X-sight thus far. ATNs QC here in the States is going to make or break the X-sight in my humble opinion, it'd be nice if they'd produce a video and publish walking customer through the QC test process like I have seen from other companies and them on the THOR thermal scopes.

I agree. Mine is functional. Minimally perhaps. It does hold zero, it does work at night and it is usable. Going on a hunt in March, I wouldn't hesitate to use it. I would also buy it again.

Am I disappointed in the way this was rolled out? Sure.

No I haven't had a chance to get both sights out to the range. If I can get this damn IPS to take a firmware load I might even have the weekend off, and we have snow on the ground, to test them out. If I can't get it fixed here shortly I will be in all weekend working.

As for how one works and one doesn't, I think a big part of it was when I mounted my 5x it only needed a slight adjustment to be on at 100 yards. I was only 3" or 4" to the left when I sighted in. Others have reported having to make much larger adjustments to get zeroed in.

I'll let you know how the 3x goes if I can get out of the office.

Since there's been snow on the ground since November here in Upstate NY, all my testing has been done in the snow and in negative zero temps.
I've been shooting at a white pc of paper with a 3" orange sticker in the middle.
I've had no issues with the target washing out in any light condition, except when the sun was reflecting into the scope, which would wash out any scopes view.
Night shooting has been good to and I'll be happy when all this white stuff melts, so I can see what it'll do without the added brightness of the snow covered ground.

Comparing the X-Sight to pulsar/sightmark's offerings is about like comparing a red delicious apple to a granny smith. Both are apples but red delicious are sweet while green apples are tart. Both are good and have their place in cooking, but definitely different flavor profiles. ATN is a day scope with decent NV capabilities where as the Pulsar is a digital night scope with ok daytime use. The pulsars are much worse about washout than the ATN's, in my experience. That being said, they are better at night.

In regards to the X-Sight's washout, I did notice more with the 3-12x than with the 5-18x. It wasn't distracting or anything but it is something that I picked up on.

History on me: I am a dealer for pulsar/sightmark, atn, night optics, and armasight. Night Vision is my favorite thing to sell in my store.

In regard to the 'wandering' zero, at the same magnification, that's mostly been tracked back to loose screws securing the mount to the scope. This according to a dealer who posted here, saying most of his returns for this problem were caused by this.

The other issue is that after you have zero'd the scope, you must understand that this is DIGITAL zoom. That means that the onboard computer simply focuses on a smaller portion of the main camera's display, and up-scales it to the eye display. Under the current firmware (.228), it upscales from the center of the overall camera's image. That means when you zoom in, the reticle will 'walk' away from center of the screen - even though it is still zero'd to POI. The new upcoming firmware which has yet to be released, will center this upscale on the reticle instead, so that the reticle stays in the center throughout the digital zoom.

Hope this helps explain the two different kinds of 'wandering crosshairs' reports you've read about.

===
Also, my 3-12x unit came with a metal screw-on sunshade. Under no lighting conditions (except with IR pointed at a mirror or window in Night mode) have I experienced any washing out.

A powerful IR Illuminator can still wash out the night vision up close, and you can adjust the "Light Amplification" in Night mode, to compensate. If you leave the scope in Night Mode under normal light conditions, it will be totally washed out. Also, the Day Mode will still pick up a dim version of the IR Illuminator, in a slightly red shade of black & white. This is an alternate way you can operate the scope, if you're in close and total dark, but you find your IR Illuminator is washing out the Night mode.

Great write up and thanks for doing this. Sad part is those loose screw's are part of scope mounting 101.

Both of the scopes I got had the Allen head screws loose.

I am a STRONG fan of the ATN X Sight!

I ordered in late November and received it a week after Christmas, about a month earlier than Night Vision Guys promised delivery.

I did have serious issues initially as follows:

Excessive reticle correction to achieve zero. So much correction that at about half zoom the reticle would disappear high and left. Also the sight would freeze or turn off when I fired my LR-308. So INITIALLY I was VERY concerned.

Support was Excellent from Night Vision Guys. For the screen freeze/outage they said to tighten the battery cap. I was skeptical as I thought I had tightened it sufficiently. Treating it as I would any delicate instrument, I stopped tightening it when I felt the turning resistance was adequate. Sure enough I got another turn and a half before the battery cap bottomed on the base. Voila, NO MORE freeze/outage problem.

Then I noticed a little movement of the sight on its base one night while I was chasing zero. So I took it home and found the base to body screws slightly loose. I took them out, inspected the surfaces for damage and debris, place a bubble level on the base and another on the body (unit on it's side), aligned the 2 parts, applied blue loctite to the 3 mounting screws and tightened them as much as I dared. I'm now zeroed with the X/Y in the single digits. And now I can go to full zoom magnification with very little movement of the reticle on the screen. I use it with quick disconnects and it returns to zero every time I replace the sight on the rifle.

I've hunted with it twice and had it out to the range day and night 4 times. At the moment I am not using the wifi nor recording features and when I'm hunting with it I only turn it on to look at something then turn it off. I use a Equinox Z for initial acquisition then go to the X Sight. On my last hunting trip batteries lasted 2, 7 hour hunting periods. As I get more time to explore its features I'm sure I'll go through batteries faster, but lets face it, it takes power to generate the images day or night and I'm not unhappy at all to throw in batteries as necessary. I also use an IR laser on the rifle and I like the combination. It independently reinforces that the scope is still zeroed til I have more experience with it.

The fact is you cannot find anything close to the capability the X Sight brings for the money, and though this is my first experience with night capability, I bet it exceeds the performance of other night vision systems out there (excluding thermal). Also it will only get better as the firmware developers keep working on it.

Although the IR illuminator included with the sight is good out to 100 yards, I am going to look for a more powerful illuminator. I think the problem is more in the automatic gain of the Sight than the illuminator but I'm not that savvy yet.

The take away is that with a little help from the experts at NV Guys, and a little common sense maintenance, my X Sight is a Hog Deadly Instrument and I am VERY HAPPY with my purchase.

What quick disconnects are you using?

I like how you have constantly tinker with this quality device it's like buying a knife and having to sharpen it everyday albeit a junky knife from update after update, loose screws any chance it will be normal?

"Normal" compared to what? Which competing product, at this price point, with these features, are you referring to?
I honestly don't know how to answer this kind of subjective question without a frame of reference on what you consider to be "normal".

I don't want to give you the wrong answer, I've ordered so many things lately. I'll look at it tomorrow and get you an answer.

I think it's the Luepold Mk I Integral mounting system.

Newer 3x with no focusing issues....

House is 120 yards away

Thanks for the Pic HTXH.
A pic is worth a thousand unconfirmed words.
That is a big sight picture too and Perfect for the close range hunting I do.
If ATN can take care of the wandering reticle issue, I'd order one now.