I spoke too soon about Vortex

I tried to defend Vortex a few weeks ago, stating how great my new talon 10X42 binos are.

The optics are great BUT, the right eye piece fell off on my 2nd hunt, oh well, looks like I get to screw with their great lifetime VIP warranty now.

I'll report on the results when I get em........

I have heard discouraging things about Vortex. Would rather have optics that don't need a warranty rather than optics that have to tout their great customer service. Customer service doesn't help when you are in the middle of your lifetime hunt. Easy to work with if your are just shooting paper, different in the field. JMHO

All man made items have issues...

I just purchased two vortex products so I hope to prove you guys wrong

I had the same thing happen to a pair of vortex binos a year ago. They fixed them and sent them back promptly. That being said, I will be hesitant to buy anything else they make. I had the vortex viper scope also and sold it because of the clarity. I expect far more from my optics than a good warranty.

Honestly, Vortex has one of the lowest product return rates in the industry. They make a good product. Research the amount of scope returns other companies have, and you will be shocked at some of the companies who have the highest returns. When you produce thousands of products, you will have some problems, no doubt. I just don't like hearing someone bash another company because of one issue, when overall they are better than the others.

I would like to take a look at the return rates from different companies. Chad, can you provide some links? Im not finding out much on my initial search.

Ha. I read nothing but good things about Vortex on here how great they were better than Leopold glass etc. more reliable tougher better warranty etc. the list goes on.

I bought one and have been completely satisfied with it in every aspect.

Since I bought it, it has made me nervous because seems like all I read now are negative reviews on them fuzzy glass poor performance in low light wont hold zero etc etc.

I'm happy with mine and don't have any regrets.

I have had OK satisfaction with Vortex. I have a Razor spotting scope, and a Razor 5x20 rifle scope. I had one of the Viper PSTs and was less than impressed. Another gent I know had a crossfire on a rifle for his daughter, and it was a POS. Now for the price, maybe not bad, but for that Nikon buckmaster series is a better buy.

Ed

Vortex makes a solid scope internally. It is very strong and durable. It uses the same internal adjustments as Nighforce.

I personally do not like Vortex for 2 reasons. 1- the glass is not that great. It is very grainy and not as clear. 2- the FFP (first focal plane) reticle is too large on high power. It covers too much aiming area. I have a standard diamond target at 200 and 300 yards that is 1.5" across. On high power, the reticle covers up almost the entire diamond where I can not shoot to the center of the diamond. This is my main negative of most FFP scopes, including some of your high end Schmidt and Bender scopes.

But if you need a scope for larger targets with strong internals, Vortex is a good scope.

Are you guys joking????

I'm not posting this to get a rise out of anyone, so please read this with discretion and an open mind.

Anything mechanical will fail at some point and I mean anything! There is no measurable step one can take to prevent it from happening. Take your vehicles for instance how of those have broke down? Do you immediately jump on the first auto related forum and start bashing the manufacture for making something?

I personally like and enjoy using the Vortex products that I have, as well as Leupold, Zeiss, Swarovski, Simmons and several other products that I own. I also have a couple friends at Vortex. These are some of the nicest people that one could ever encounter. They also make every diligent effort to accommodate customers with questions, concerns and any other thing that needs to be addressed.

I find it disheartening when people bash a company publically over something like this.

Again, I'm not posting this to create a fight, but I'm hoping that some understanding would be taken into consideration.

Anything mechanical will fail at some point and I mean anything!



so you think the black Friday ad might fail and get released early?? lol jk

I don't think I have ever seen "grainy" glass in my life its either clear or not and the rest is light transmission. Please someone explain "grainy" to me?

I have one Vortex PST and I like it Ok. Like somebody else mentioned that he didn't buy scopes because of the great warranty. I feel the same way. I have a bunch of Leupold scopes, and it wasn't till 20 years after I bought the first one that somebody told me about their great warranty. Good to know, but I've still never needed it. Not yet. And it's been way more than 20 years by now.

I compared my old 6.5-20x50 30mm tube Leupold VariX-III to my new Vortex 4-16x50 30mm tube Vortex PST. Old Leupold is much better glass wise. It just is. But the PST isn't bad. It just isn't as good.

And binocs...I use some old Leica 10x40 Trinovid BA binocs. Had em for decades. Love em. My new Nikons can't touch em for glass quality. I have no IDEA what the Leica warranty is, and I guess I'll never need to know. Brother, those binocs are rock solid pure quality.

That's what product reviews are for, bash or compliment. I see no harm.
It would really worry me if everyone only gave the good side of things rather than give an honest review, even if it was negative.

I have Vortex binos, they are great.
I had a scope, sold it, my Leupold was nicer.

It's not as clear, it's not foggy. It's grainy. Like the old black and white TV's with the snow screen. It was grainy. That's all I can say, grainy.

Exactly what is "Mechanical" about bad glass?? Grainy glass has imperfections due to bad polishing. Think of it as sandblasted glass...it DOES exist..

I don't know if grainy is the right term, but there are major differences
in glass quality. I look at my Vortex crossfire and Nikon prostaff scopes and
the glass is about as poor as I can handle and stay sane. My Millet scopes are
a somewhat better. My Monox Z5 is much better and my Mark AR is about the same.
My vx3 2.5-8x36mm has some really nice glass.

I love my vortex but i will say this .....a while back when i was at swfa i looked threw about every scope they had there ( was there about 3 hr ) and to be quite honest not many of them could i see a difference in even the 4 grand ones . The thing i notice is that your only going to see it as clearly as your own eyes are no matter the scope .

It did, someone was playing with an old thread, and discovered how we link sales with our photo server and leaked the link.

Price points gotten a little high on the scopes. But binos and SS are still best in class for the price point.

lol..hope what I found is the right ad..killer deals

Not true. If you set up multiple scopes in field conditions at low light, you will easily see differences. Looking through them in a store or in broad daylight isn't a good comparison.

As I stated in my OP, the glass and function of the Talon Binos is REALLY good. I agree stuff breaks, I baby all my gear to the point of being anal. I was surprised it just fell off.

I have them heading back to Vortex now. I swapped a couple emails with their customer service gal, very courteous and prompt reply to my original email. She says they will be back in time for my January 1st hunt on the last weekend of deer season. So far so good. I feel confident Vortex will come through.

I bought a pair of the new Leupold McKinley bino's, the focus knob had some play in it. Leupold said I could wait for the new model McKinley bino to come in or I could pick any Leupold optic and swap. I chose the later, got a brand new scope which cost quite a bit more than the bino. I thought this was VERY good service.

Hell, I sent back my second Nightforce, an NXS 8-32X56. It had a small fleck of something on the inside, it was repaired very quickly, so no problem. Just a PITA.

He was looking through our windows.

The new shop is surrounded by windows for better perspective of how something preforms.

I put a vortex 4x16 diamondback on my new rifle.

So far I have been impressed

As for Vortex, I only have one scope, Viper PST, and it does what I bought it for...it tracks and tracks extremely well. I paid $800 for it. At that price I think I've gotten what I paid for. If you are buying a scope for hunting and are not buying it for the mechanics I would buy Swarovski or Zeiss instead because the glass is so much better.

does that include people?

Yup...

I have vortex viper binoculars and have put a lot of time on them with no complaints. I don't have a scope to comment about.

You get what you pay for is not true with Vortex - you get more.

Just like any company Vortex has a budget line of products and a top tier line of products and no matter what line you get in on you get their ridiculous warranty. Lots of people like to point to this say 'cluck cluck cluck - would rather have a quality product that doesn't break and doesn't need a warranty' followed by more clucking. Scopes will break, just like anything else in the world that has moving parts and Vortex doesn't care if you bought it from them, a vendor or dug it up under a 14 foot snowbank that was crushed under the feet of bigfoot himself. Their no-BS warranty, for life, fully transferable, and with a turnaround time on average of 5-7 days is far more than what they are obligated to do.

I have 6 separate pieces of Vortex equipment from their newest Gen2 Razor, to Gen1 Razors to a PST and some reflex sights, a spotting scope an a fixed power monocular. 3 times I have used their warranty

1 - bought a scope used from the internet, had the seller ship it to Vortex for a inspection. They shipped to me, on their dime, the scope fully inspected, cleaned, purged and replaced turrets because it "had a scratch"

2 - had issues with my Razor not holding zero, sent it to Vortex on a Monday (pre-paid by them) had it back by Friday (paid by them) and a phone conversation. The scope was fine but after testing tracking they cleaned and purged it for me just because, and told me where to look for issues. Rings had a stress fracture you couldn't see, once it was unmounted and i flexed on them I could see it.

3 - I damaged my scope, 100% my fault, they fixed it as if they were the cause.

No single event took more than 7 days, to say their warranty service is to make up for a subpar product is inaccurate and the warranty that comes on their products is by far what I would consider int he cost of the product, it's added value, far more value than most other providers offer.

and I would argue my Gen 2 Razor is as good or better than any top-tier glass out there.

What do you think happens if your S&B or Nightforce goes down? You think you will have it back in a week or so without question? Do you think if they new you were going to shoot a match or heading out to a hunt that they would work to ensure you had it back under ridiculous deadlines? Vortex will.

Update, Vortex has my binos, I've heard nothing from them yet. Thought I would at least have gotten an email confirming delivery.

Doesn't sound like you are going to be pleased by your posts no matter the outcome??

The tracking number makes you self-sufficient, why do they need to tell you what you already know? You will get a return shipping email when they are on your way to you and likely a call at some point but they need time to look at product and make the call or update useful to you.

Since you posted your note at 8pm on a Sunday I am guessing they got them on Friday or Saturday and have to them in well.

Buzz, you done got Dave riled up.

He won't quit, either.

Hey 7 days to fix something, that's top notch service right there. I can see where some are saying what they are about quality but I also see the CS side of it too.

Say you DO pay out the nose for a high end scope. And it does go down, without good CS you're going to have a super bad taste in your mouth! The company that jumps through hoops to fix the problem will win for me too.

All that being said, dang I wish I had a buddy at Vortex! Or Leupold. Or Nikon. Heck any of them! Lol

http://hunting.scout.com/story/1490218-vortex-optics-factory-tour-scope-testing?s=77

Dave is a Vortex lover, you always defend the ones you love, even if they do suck. Same goes with me, I love my Swarovski scope and many think they suck, so, ANYWAY

Yesterday, I received return confirmation, my binos are on their way back to me. I hope Vortex lets me know what happened to it and what they did to fix them. What I could tell the ocular cap was "cross Threaded" Don't know how you fix that, maybe glue it back on. Here's a picture, again, second time I used them???

I don't love them or hate them - they have demonstrated quality and good service, it's not personal. You will clearly never be happy since the fixed product is on it's way to you and you are still complaining about this happening. Crap happens, learn to judge people based on their actions to resolve and not on the action. Nothing is utopian and if you expect that you will have a lot of disappointment.

And let's note they were received on 12/7 and you were notified on 12/12 that they were on their way back....

I received them back from Vortex today, Very fast turn around. They were repaired, look fine. Time will tell if they hold up but right now, I'm a very happy camper.

Vortex has done what they said they would do. Great service in my book. Like I said I LOVE these binos, great glass, very positive adjustment's, smooth, no slack in the focus ring.

Let's go Hunting !!!

good to hear, and this is the exact example of why I wave their flag so much, you simply would not get that service from any of the other labels.... it's all part of the value proposition of owning a Vortex.

At the risk of stirring up more debate, I have mostly Leupold scopes and I hunt with Leica Binocs. Nothing on them has ever broken, and I'm talking decades on some of that stuff. I wouldn't know if they had good CS or bad. I haven't needed to. If I had pieces falling off my binocs, I'd move on to a higher grade of binocs. No excuse, in my book, for stuff falling off. But that's just me...

Reminds me of a guy I used to work with. He always bought Buicks. I always bought Nissan and Toyota back then. We got a nice bonus, and most of us were going to get sports cars. He was going for a Buick Regatta. I asked him why he kept buying Buicks. He said that the service guy knew him and would put him first in line to get fixed. I said to him, "John, I don't even know where the service department at Toyota is, since I've never needed to go there". He looked stunned to hear that kind of logic. After the Buick Regatta disaster, he went with Acura from then on. Never needed to go to Service. Point is, spend money on the right stuff and it won't normally need to get fixed.

Or, buy second level stuff and rationalize the repairs. So...seriously, the eyepiece fell off. Maybe I'd expect that with Tasco or BSA.

Good Point, The Talons were Little under $500, Had a $279.00 of Nikon ATB's never missed a lick, handed those down to my daughter.

We'll see how these Vortex hold up now. Also, we tend to spend more on our rifle scopes and less on Binos, yet we spend countless more hours looking through our binos.

Of course this mainly pertains to hunters. Real Snipers spend hours on their scopes, with a spotter behind them on a high quality spotting scope. Hmmm

So maybe you didn't speak too soon....? You already love your binos and admittedly, their customer service is great as well. That warranty is good for the life of your optics. Sounds like a good deal IMO.

Yep ,good deal, but a good point was made above, it is better never having to use Customer Service at all, but this is rare. With the toys we all love, something's gonna break eventually, good to have great CS to fall back on.

Years ago someone tried to sell me on Swift scopes. They were about a third the cost of a Leupold IIRC, and if they ever gave you problems all you had to do was take them to a dealer who handled them. You'd hand them the offending scope and they would give you a brand new one. Quite the deal...until you realize that you've exchanged a broken turd for a working turd. I doubt the returned scopes ended up anywhere but a dumpster. The point is, you can have a great warranty on a lousy product, you can have a bad warranty and lousy service on a bullet-proof product, and everything in between.

I've bought a multitude of Leupold optics and never had a performance or reliability issue with one...but I've never bought anything lower than Vari-X II. I can't vouch for the low end stuff.

One of these days I may buy a Vortex optic, but I am still not convinced they ate committed as an enterprise to being a long-term, high quality presence in the optics market.

Even though I was grumping about how a Vortex binoc could come apart like the OP's did, I do owna Vortex scope. I do like it. Maybe the glass isn't quite as good as I had expected (or hoped), but it's still good - and quite honestly it's plenty good enough. It's on my primary use rifle and that's where it will remain.