whats your management plan like?

hunting season is drawing to a close....time to start working on next years season. this year we're hoping to get some more permanent watering stations set up. planning to clear out a larger food plot...approx. 8acres...going to try and conduct some post season deer density studies to see how they vary from our pre-season results. may try a little February quail hunt even. don't do that too often.

I was curious though...for those of you who have a management plan? what is it?

we feed protein feb-sept, only light corn feeding during those months. turn the protein off and turn the corn on sept-feb then and swithch back again.

do some food plotting. we are 320ac low fence pretty far south. we shoot roughly 10 deer a year...our surveys have called for more periodically but we tend to stop around there. try to shoot bucks n does evenly. we tend to shoot our spikes. just as management deer....know they'll get bigger but its easier to harvest some buck density by shooting the spikes as opposed to the middle-age deer.

otherwise try to harvest our bucks at 4.5 or older. sometimes a 2.5-3.5 deer will present himself that is only a 6pt or something and we may take that as well. tend to have a lot of 8pt deer with antlers that slant fwd. seems to be a prominent genetic trait in the herd. we've grown some nice bucks...they are extremely elusive. but we get a glimpse of them from time to time.

what does everyone else do? whats your results been like? we're on our 8th year of management.

Sounds like you have a really solid plan. Our management plan really only differs on buck harvest criteria, and not by that muck. We take any 3.5 yr old that is less than 8 pts (or try to). We start taking 8pts at 4.5 unless they have something else going for them and then we start taking 10s at 5.5. The main difference is that we don't shoot any spikes unless they are 2.5 or older. This year for instance, with all of the rain this spring, most of the buck fawns on the ranch have had spikes 2-3 inches long. We have seen very few "nubbin" bucks like we normally would. In most years we only have a few of the earliest born fawns with spikes showing.

I figure out how many Deer I want to get taken. X amount of Bucks and X amount of Does. I then get hunters to take that amount.

If I like it, I shoot it.

And never let those 2-1/2 spikes get any older, even if it means taking an occasional younger spike that lags his peers.

Put Erich's and bcranch's together and that is pretty close to our basic plan. I'm a firm believer in keeping a balanced buck to doe ratio and the herd within the carrying capacity of the range. Though very early in our management program, our deer herd already had a good foundation. Our buck to doe ratio is very close to 1:1. We are very fortunate to have land with big neighbors and low hunting pressure. However, we only have a deer per 30 - 35 acres, so we are trying to increase the population and took only two does last year and 0 does this year. We saw our first doe this year that made it to December with twins which I attribute to the better rainfall and the supplemental feeding we began in the spring of 2013. We only saw 1 spike this year that was 1.5 and my daughter passed it on her last day and took a good mature 8 that showed up about 10 minutes later. Otherwise, we would have taken him rather than a doe for meat. Our plan also calls for removing as many hogs and coyotes as possible. All traps are going back to work this weekend. We put in two tanks and cleaned out another. Two of them are very deep and should hold water through almost any drought. We have some additional tanks we need to repair and clean out in the next year or two. We have 1 food plot we plant both spring and fall and plan on adding another this year.

(1). My plan is to limit human activity in my core hunting area (230 acres of 700) during the offseason.
(2). Hang-on stand has been set up high with the access point away from deer trails.
(3). Tripod feeder has been removed and will now hand corn twice a week.

I only bow hunt on this E Texas property and the deer are quite picky.
No Pop-up blind, no feeder, and less overall activity should result in a more comfortable deer herd.

I meant hand corn ONCE every TWO WEEKS

Our plan is similar to what's been posted.

Do a few population surveys in the late summer. Assess where we are vs target density. Set desired doe harvest and buck harvest to achieve target density and B:D ratio. Try to take does early before they are bred. Take culls as the opportunity presents itself.

We have free-choice protein going year round.

Previously we hammered 1.5yo spikes, but last two years the majority of our 1.5yo age class has been spikes so now we focus on those culls 2.5 and older. Our culling progression looks like this: 2.5yo must be 6 points (with brows), 3.5yo must be 8-pts. We take trophy 8's at 4.5, and we try to let anything 9pt or above make it to 5.5.

Of course alot of this is theoretical as we are 425 acres LF in the Hill CO. Hard to control numbers, or buck ratios as many get hammered. But, we do the best we can. We have been part of the area WMA since its inception, and that is helping alot.

I hunt a lot of smaller properties.. 500acrees- so it's simple.. Feed as much as my budget allows, keep track of the deer as much as possible, keep the places as quiet as possible and shoot only 4yr old and older bucks.and as many doe as my tags allow. On my 40acre track I even go to the point of only bow hunting.

Similar to others with the exception that we really hammer 3.5 year-old 6, 7, and 8s that are "
barely" legal for AR. Our neighbors won't shoot less than 15 inches of spread so we have an over representation of these 13 - 15 inch deer that at 3.5 years old are really doing a lot of breeding. Not sure it helps but it makes us feel better. I shot a 105 inch 7 point with a 1.5 inch brow on one side and 13.5 inch spread. His traveling buddy is a 10 that is the same age and at least 125 ... got a pass. Hope he makes it for next year.

We have around 630 acres. Our plan is to remove cedars around oaks so that the oaks will be less stressed and can produce a better crop of acorns. We clear selected areas of underbrush yearly (this year we focused on cleaning grape vines from oak stands). We have built and maintain many tanks and have dug pits in creeks in a few spots to help them retain pools of water longer. We have 2 free choice protein feeders that feed year round. We plant 2 large spring food plots that are fenced and kept cattle free, then 10-12 food plots of varying sizes in the fall (we figure that by clearing out some underbrush and improving native plants, our spring green-up is better than most food plots we could plant). In the late summer through early spring we spin 13 feeders. We trap the hell out of coons, hogs, foxes, skunks, etc (helps the quail and turkey populations).

Regarding hunting, we were level 1 MLD this year. There are a couple more hunting this weekend, but I think our total will be 12 does and 4 bucks. We killed 2 decent bucks and 2 culls. Several culls got away. My son missed a 3 pointer and we never could get a shot at a 5 pointer (big 4 on one side and a long spike on the other). Honestly, our killing plan has been shoot what makes you happy. We've all killed nice bucks, so it takes a nice mature buck to make us happy. This year we killed a few extra does because of the MLD tags.

With all we do and have done, the easy and cheaper things (food plots and feeders) probably have the smallest impact on the overall game improvement. I think the brush management, water source improvement, and pest / predator control have the biggest impact on the game.

Feeders and fall food plots help draw the game for hunting, but likely don't have as significant of an impact on the game as improving native browse health. Incidentally, I observed more game at stands that had food plots and feeders than stands with just feeders. Almost without fail, the deer came, browsed the food plot, ate just a bit of corn, then browsed the plot again before leaving (normally they would stay around 30-45 minutes, with corn feeder eating 5 minutes or less).

Sorry for the wordy response, just my observations from our place.

I envy some of you guys that hunt in high density areas. Our management plan consists of burning, pushing scrub cedar, planting milo in spring, oats in fall, feed year round, and still be lucky to shoot 2 bucks on 400 acres. This year I shot a 3.5 8 point that was cruising, looking for a doe. He had some ground shrinkage but was an otherwise beautiful buck. He was 14" wide. If he'd stopped at the feeder and given me more time to check him out, I probably would have let him go another year. Oh well. Meat in the freezer, and a pretty euro mount.

We pretend like we know what we are doing, pretend like we want to do it right, and then shoot the first stud-baby that walks out

This year was rough on our youngsters....we didn't even do good on our doe numbers.

interesting reads .....years ago I was involved with the Cherokee wildlife management coalition
the TPW suggested in our high density deer situation to only take one mature buck per 200 acres
and one doe per 100 acres
10 off 320 is a very high number though for sure
that's a deer for every 32 acres btw ?
I wouldn't consider that a management plan at all
unless maybe you are surrounded by a lot of large not hunted acreage
that might help those numbers a bit

The place in question in the original post gets several population surveys done a year as well as blind counts etc. They always come back higher than a cats back. Its 320 acres 2 sides unhunted improved pasture/irrigated row crop and the other two sides brush. We don't feel the two hunting neighbor sides shoot any does, just the big buck if it walks out, so we have a lot of deer. We have been shooting 10 or so a year for the past 3 years and the population if anything has grown.

Try out fire and utilize the ash instead of spending all that money to remove the underbrush... burn it and you will get so much more back in return.

like a I said interesting read , I figured that if it could handle that kinda harvest rate it meant for sure they are managing the neighbors deer as well.

Only problem I see with burning is it is hard on the brush/trees you want to keep as well. We lost a lot of bigger trees when our place burned. Several are coming back out from the bottom, but who wants a dead 20 foot tall mesquite that's sprouting out from the base?

And we been waiting on a Golf game so you could accomplish that?!?! SMDH



I only have 15 acres now, so management is pretty much out of the question, but the Ag agent and the USDA agent told me ,as far as my land, it is one of the best they have seen for wildlife but on a small scale.

I think manipulation your land in the interest of wildlife, is the single most important thing you can do, sure is the "funnest" IMO too.

All interesting responses. thankyall for posting. interesting to see what some of yall do just in the management of the land and not just the animals and hunting.

for us our management plan makes it like hunting season year round. there's always something to work on at the ranch and its all fun.

MELackey reminded me of something else. About 4 years ago at the advice of our biologist we began hinge-cutting our mesquite wherever possible rather than removing them completely. The theory was to provide better nesting cover for quail and turkey. We also started working on the raccoon numbers. Each year we have seen the turkey numbers improve, and the quail numbers hold steady. Last weekend there was a group of 16 gobblers running together.

Nav, we would love to do a controlled burn. But, the place is not cross-fenced so it's impossible to "rest" one area after burn unless we put up an electric fence or something. Still trying to work something out though as burns can be a powerful tool in our region.

Next year I plan to disc and fertilize a couple ~3acre plots. Will probably plant winter oats, but the fertilized ground should pop with spring forbes as well.

Every county is different.

Plus, they are probably harvesting more deer because they are pulling more deer off neighboring places with feed and water.

After 3 years if they were hurting the population they would have realized it by now

Anyone have property in the Hill Country? I've noticed some places have cleared out just about all the cedar, and just have grassland dotted with live oaks. This seems like it would be good for livestock, but terrible for deer. Most of these places are high-fenced and run no livestock so I'm wondering about that.

The highfence places have predator control a lot easier and the deer wont need as much thick cover imo. Also if they have the money to do that I would imagine that they are feeding plenty. like you said good for livestock and for the most part that's what they are.

Try out fire and utilize the ash instead of spending all that money to remove the underbrush... burn it and you will get so much more back in return.

[/quote]

MELackey reminded me of something else. About 4 years ago at the advice of our biologist we began hinge-cutting our mesquite wherever possible rather than removing them completely. The theory was to provide better nesting cover for quail and turkey. We also started working on the raccoon numbers. Each year we have seen the turkey numbers improve, and the quail numbers hold steady. Last weekend there was a group of 16 gobblers running together.

Nav, we would love to do a controlled burn. But, the place is not cross-fenced so it's impossible to "rest" one area after burn unless we put up an electric fence or something. Still trying to work something out though as burns can be a powerful tool in our region.

Next year I plan to disc and fertilize a couple ~3acre plots. Will probably plant winter oats, but the fertilized ground should pop with spring forbes as well. [/quote]

I burned off my place each year, in different places. One year I may have burned 5 acres, the next year 10-20 acres in another spot. never had trouble with my cows being in the "burn", they kept the grass down and didn't mess with the forbes and new brush growth. I had x's fences, but didn't fence them out. Area doesn't need a "rest" IMO, works in the "wild" for eons..

TXAG hit it with brush piles. We've created a few small piles here and there. Old bed springs also make great spots for quail. We had several around when we bought the place, so we turned them into quail spots. Periodically throw a couple of coffee cans of milo into them. Mesquites get cut and the stumps sprayed.

For brush clearing we use a Bobcat with a tree shear and a D3. We3 burn the piles, but are reluctant to just light the brush. Don't want to take the chance on stressed oaks or pecans.

For the question about places with no cedars and the preference of game, we see more deer bedding down in the areas we've cleared some of the cedars and brush from under the oak stands. The deer seem to prefer bedding down in areas that provide a decent view around than in thick stuff.

That's the majority of leases! lol

Northern Edwards County, 223 ac, low fenced.

Land was raw when acquired.

Our plan consist of feeding 7 corn feeders year round. Use to be 9 but cut back. From Jan-Aug we mix the feeders with corn and protein 50%/50%. We have one protein feeder and fill it w/ straight protein during that timeframe. Keeping it full is a problem as our herd consists mainly of axis (>50%). Sept-Dec we fed straight corn.

We have two watering stations set up and been thinking about adding a third.

Salt and trace minerals blocks at both water stations as well.

Owned the property going on three years. First year whitetail numbers were low, but biologist suggested shooting 8 does and all cull bucks seen (whitetail) plus every exotic doe seen. In those years we have only taken cull and one trophy buck. Numbers have risen on cameras and sighting over the years to now start taking does in the coming year(s). Axis does are taken at every sighting. I shoot 5-8 a year, and the numbers seem to increase each season.

Tried food plots two years ago, ground is just too rocky to make a sizeable plot. Made two small plots and they were doing great. Herd of axis came thru and boom. Gone.

Cedar management is another thing that I will look into this coming year. The place is covered in cedar and in three years, it seems they have multiplied 5 fold, even in the drought. Oaks are stressed from the drought but are also covered/surrounded by cedar.

It depends on how hot the burn is. I've been burning this week when temps are low and ground moisture is extremely high. The biggest problem is keeping the grass lit. A little wind helps, but when it blows strong you hold a tight sphincter. Our grass burns and stops right at the cedar. It is an art to do successfully. Come spring, the turkey and deer will be all over the new growth.

The truth is only certain places can be effectively managed. Small acreage with lots of neighbors? Chances are any deer that has potential will be shot before they reach 3.

A trophy buck is one that reaches its maximum potential in relation to its genetics. So a Hill Country buck that reaches age 6 and scores 130 or 140 may be the best genetically that can be done with that deer herd. In South Texas a 6 year old buck with top end genetics may reach 170-180 plus if allowed to live long enough to grow that big. In either area a buck will not reach its potential if it is dead at age 3.

If the property is large enough then the number one management tool is age. You can manipulate the brush, feed all day long, etc. but if a buck is not allowed to reach their full potential then it is for naught. Age 6 or older seems to be the age bucks start to top out. Holding off on killing promising bucks is the single most difficult management technique to accomplish - human nature is to not be patient and talk yourself into shooting the deer before its prime because of the fear that someone else will kill it or it will die before the next season.

The second most important management tool is controlling the number of mouths to feed in relation to the amount of food available. The exact same concept is used when managing ponds for bass. There is only so much food available for the carrying capacity - so biologist will tell a pond owner to cull the numbers so there is more food available for fewer mouths. Same with deer - doe numbers control is critical.

Habitat management, feed, etc. are all very valuable and can enhance the results but again without age and population control the other stuff is a waste of time and money.

I mean good for animals that eat grass. Unless they are doing something to get forbs into the grassy areas, I don't see much for the deer to eat except the acorns when they are dropping.

Since I just read that recent research studies on cedar show that it does not suck large amounts of water out of the ground as recently believed, I'm not so sure of the benefit of getting rid of it to grow grass if you are trying to grow deer.

I started a thread about removing cedar to stop killing my oak trees and letting more grass grow. Where did you read about cedar NOT being a water hog?

There are many hits on this with google, but here is one:

http://www.plateauwildlife.com/seasons/spring2009.pdf

Basically says oak trees use more ground water than ashe juniper, and that neither one sucks water out of the limestone under them. Apparently, cedar traps and holds more rain water in its needles than oaks do on their leaves, and this trapped water is evaporated, keeping it from hitting the ground. I guess that would still be a reason to remove them. But, I know that deer spend the day in cedar, and only venture into open fields at dawn dusk (generally speaking). I'd certainly want to keep a lot of cedar on my place, if I had one.

Our place has some of the most impenetrable grass ive ever seen. Is thick and grows to 5-6 feet tall given adequate rain and forbes still grow up in it during the cool months, granted they grow better if you run the disk over the grass.

Across the road from my parents house is about a 200 acre costal field. Deer don't eat costal to my knowledge, but there are probably close to 100 deer in that field every evening eating, stuff grows in between.

Yes, I guess forbs grow in the grass because you do see deer in fields eating something, but I don't think I'd spend all the time and money required to remove cedar if I were trying to increase the size or health of the deer herd. The time might be better spent trying to grow more forbs in what fields and meadows you already have. Of course, clearing cedar from shooting lanes is another matter.