Have to love east texas

Until this weekend I'd only managed to get off work once to go hunting. Finally get to the place late friday night, get set up in the stand and about 30 minutes after daylight have a doe run across in front of me like her hairs on fire. 40 yards behind her came to hog dogs running right behind her. Now I've heard a million times that they "cain't control where the dogs run", but these looked like they had either shock or gps collars on and were running deer on private property.

there is a solution to that problem...........Some may not like it but it will put a end to it....There was a huge debate about this years ago....Me personally
catch one of them....turn the collar off
call the warden
let him come out and turn it back on and let them come on the property to find it....
Trespassing to start off with ....

I'm never interested in more regulation of anything but stories like this make me wonder if hunting hogs with dogs will remain legal.

Ha ha ha I had a similar experience years ago the only year I ever hunted in the pine timber. That was when I found out a lot of them East Texas boyz had a lease that started at the Sabine and ended at the Rio Grande. Nope don't want any part of it.

Seen it.

Simple answer to that problem at that moment

I had hog doggers once. It is one of the most maddening things that can happen while you are hunting.
They trespass on purpose, and they know they are doing it, then make every excuse in the world.

They raise 'em up that way. We're in the middle of negotiating an offer made by the neighbor to buy our share of the surface of a small tract that's been in our family since 1899. Once that's done, I'll be shed of that country for good, 'cept for the small amount of "mailbox money" from royalties off some horizontal lines underneath it. Good riddance. To quote a line from the movie Bernie, "Them people got more tattoos than teeth."

I'm generally not if favor of more laws, but we have got have better reinforcement of the ones on the books already. Trespassing needs to be aggressively prosecuted, and that includes trespass by dogs. DAs need to be willing required to prosecute based upon picture or video evidence. Virtually every county in Texas has a leash law.

I would also support a clarification to the existing law on dogs harassing livestock to include wild game on private property.

Born and raised in east TX - do all my WT hunting on my place there now.

Yep, there’s problem children there. And, yep, you’ve got to be aggressive in combatting them. That means cooperation among neighbors by getting to know them (instead of viewing them all as scum), aggressive monitoring of your place, and prosecuting the bad guys. Same as with any other place anywhere else in the state. East TX seems worse to some because there’s more people there and generally more and smaller tracts of land than in other places.

There’s scum everywhere-and good folks everywhere too. A lot of the generalizations are just folks wanting to lift themselves up by putting other regional groups down.

Could you shoot the dogs?

Not without some real risks.

Why shoot dogs just doing what they are bred/trained to do? These aren’t feral packs. The people are the problem-not the dogs.

Wisdom

If the dogs are chasing whitetail on your property you are within your rights to shoot them, and that is exactly what I would have done.

Problem solved. Problem stayin solved.

Because you can't shoot the trashy people that own them?

These are 2 of the dumbest comments i've ever read on THF. It solves nothing, and instigates a situation with someone who clearly is a dumb [censored] to begin with.

I bet those dogs won't come back on that property though.

You're so right. Fantastic solution.

They are a huge problem anywhere there are hogs. Make it a felony and it will stop pretty quick. Hog doggers with repect for property lines are few.

Another solution is to remove the collars a few miles from your property and take the dogs to an animal shelter. Or....so I've been told.

I could never shoot somebody’s dogs because I know how I’d react if someone shot mine. I’d find and talk with the dogs owner. You might find a hearty supply of pork in your freezer for your trouble.

I’d have a problem shooting someone’s dog or dogs. I’d try reason and common sense with the owners. If that didn’t work i’d try the legal approach. If that didn’t work, then I would be down to one workable solution, and by then i’d be mad enough and serious enough to do it.

Was not trying to bag on East Texas in my original post or even all dog hunters, grew up there and love it like no place on earth and will be back there for good as soon as the wife and I are retired and I'm old enough to remember going hound hunting for deer with my grandfather there.

I think its very grey area whether I could've shot the dogs. Certainly believe I legally could have it they were chasing livestock and probably would have done so in that event without hesitation. I've always kind of viewed dogs as like kids. If I'm not able to control my kids in a certain setting such as a funeral or social function then I'm not going to take them there. So to me that leaves two possibilities, Either the dog owner couldn't control his dogs to work close enough and follow commands in which case he shouldn't have been hunting with them close to property lines or Two, he simply didn't care. Either case makes it much more of the dog owner's fault than the dog's.

Edit to add: We've got national forest bordering us on two sides, and over the years most of the few problems we've had with trespassers have come in from those two sides rather than from the private neighbors. And that is the direction that the dogs and the doe were running from. So there isn't really any one specific person that I could talk to about it. Short answer is that as soon as I get the money those two sides of the place are getting high fenced.

Right on

Not trying to be a jerk, but I can get my own pork. What I would prefer is for people to leave my stuff alone and I will leave their stuff alone.

We have had a problem with people trespassing on to our property before. I don't know you and you are not supposed to be here. I am always armed, and if you are chasing animals with dogs trespassing on my property armed, it is now a felony. So, there's a major problem here. I will be on high alert when dealing with anyone like this. I don't want to shoot anyone's dogs either. But the trespasser would get one STERN warning from me with every law enforcement division notified (PD, sheriff, GW). If it happened again, I could guarantee you I would sling as much lead at these dogs and hope I got everyone of them.

I think Ted Nuggent said it best: ""I don't like repeat offenders. I like dead offenders."

If they are good dogs, they won't run deer. Deer are considered "trash" game to hog and raccoon hunters.

Some might see it as highly unlikely or even impossible, but a dog trailing a hog is just as likely to bump a deer towards you as it might away from you. I saw this as a kid growing up in Mississippi where using dogs to chase deer is still legal. I saw just as many if not more deer when still hunting when dogs were being used in the area as I did when they were absent. In fact, I liked the fact that deer were less likely to stay bedded when dogs were in the area, much like pressure from other hunters pushing deer to you. When the deer prefer to stay bedded, no one gets a shot at them.

Do I condone the practice? No. But I recognize that before I shoot another man's dog, it may actually be helping my chances.

Here's something else to keep in mind. I learned as a kid that when it came to being on deer drives, there were advantages to being one of the drivers. That's because the hounds would often jump a group of bedded deer and latch on to one of the does. This would often offer a shot to one the drivers on a deer the standers would never have seen. Why? With the dogs now on a hot doe trail, the wiser bucks would try and slip off to the back or side of the chase. No question, many a hunter has killed a buck that was bumped and not chased by dogs.

So before you go shooting dogs, realize they may be heating up the pot of opportunity.

Given that the whitetail are NOT your property, you have no right to protect them from the dogs. If the dogs were chasing your goats or calves, etc., that would be a different story. The deer belong to the state.

I think we all know that a good many hog doggers just turn their dogs loose & follow them. To believe otherwise is naive.

I don’t think anyone is arguing that fact.

I’ve caught them. I’ve dealt with them. They got the message. I didn’t have to shoot their dogs to convey it.

Negatory. You do not have the right to shoot a dog that's chasing wildlife. Livestock is another story.

Agreed. A lot of that goes on here on this forum. If you run dogs and have tattoos you must be trash, LOL.

I shoot feral dogs but that's another story. I won't shoot someone's geared up pig dog. There's other ways to handle that. If you're looking for trouble, shooting somebody's dog is a good way to find it.

No doubt there are civil issues that can arise, heck you can be sued for just yelling at a guys dog, but are there criminal charges that can arise. Many years ago the sheriff would not pursue a neighbor rancher for shooting my brothers dog that he claimed was casing deer.

Be careful with that doc. I lease out a little over 140,000 acres of private land to hunters. One of the hunters shot a dog that was running deer. The dog owner came after not only the shooter, but the landowner as well. The legal costs and time were a serious drain. In the end I was not found liable, but the hunter that shot the dog was found to be in violation of the law. Heavy fines and restitution were levied against him. I also threw him off the property for dragging me into that crap.

^^^^This^^^^

140,000 acres. Man what a spread.

I've never met him, but Doc seems like a good man. It's easy to type stuff on here but different for many to follow through in person. Be careful shooting a geared up dog, you may regret opening that can of worms. Should that dog be on your property and screwing up the one day that you finally have to hunt? No. Can you legally shoot him for chasing deer? No. I've been on both sides of this issue, be careful with that. You can start a war in a place that is supposed to be your happy place. Call your Game Warden. Get on the phone and talk to people, or meet them in person. Many times just communicating goes a long way.

Never shot one. I was asked to once, by a neighbor that I respected greatly. He said there were two chasing his sheep and he had all his grandkids and they were crying not to shoot a dog. I went to his house. He handed me his rifle. His wife was screaming at him in German as he walked out of the house, I assume, to not shoot the dogs with the children there. I went across the road to where he said they were chasing sheep. Saw sheep. Then this dog crested a little rise and it was the spittin' image of my childhood, crossbreed border collie named "Rocket". No way. Just took the rifle back and apologized.

What were the fines and the criminal/misdemeanor charges? Just curious.

It could certainly fall under Animal Cruelty to kill a domesticated dog not damaging your crops or livestock.

Now, if you did shoot one, I would simply walk away and keep my mouth shut.

Yep.....shoot......shovel.......,silence

I stand corrected, I thought chasing deer on your property fell under the statute.

Doc I had my first and hopefully last root canal done today. Took 2 hrs. There was no pain until the end, then it sucked. The Doc though was very pretty. So, there was that. Got to my truck and still couldn't feel the right side of my face. Tried to put a dip in but spilled $1.00 worth of Copenhagen on my lap. Sometimes life is just hard.

Sorry about that Copenhagen! Adding insult to injury right there!

We used to be on a lease out in red river county and had trail cam pictures of “hog dogs” running deer off one of our sets

I wouldn't kill someone's dog because it was chasing a deer or a pig or anything. I would try to find out whose dog it was and have a nice talk with them for sure, but wouldn't kill it because it messed up my hunt no matter how mad I got. That'll likely get you in trouble. If the dogs were harassing my cows, scaring the kids, or tearing things up around the house, they get an instant dirt nap and no one would say a word about it, law, dog owner, or otherwise. I kind of always thought that was the general understanding.

Bordering public land makes that sort of encounter a pain for you I am sure. I would almost have to expect it in that situation. No telling how many times those dogs have run through your place.

I had a truck load of men, and dogs drive up on the county road behind my shooting platform, while I was teaching. They drove by, then backed up. They said "excuse me sir, we wanted to let you know we will ne running dogs, hog hunting, and to please not shoot one of our dogs."

I said, I've got no problem with anyone killing hogs around here, please do. And I have no desire to shoot a dog, as long as it is not hurting me, or mine. But who do you have permission from? He named off about four names. I said, yeah I know all of them, and there are three other land owners you plan to hunt on, that you have not mentioned, me being one of them. I strongly suggest you stay, and keep your dogs, on property you have permission on. There are a couple thousand acres around here that I know both land owners, and I am an agent acting on their behalf, at all times. I recommend you get a map, and know who owns what land.

Never saw them again.

On the flip side, a guy I've worked at the fire department with for going on 19 years, runs dogs. He has every name and phone number of every land owner, and carries signed written permission, from all of them, on him when he is running dogs. Some gates stay locked, and he has the combinations. He is as good as they come, and I've trusted him with my life, and everything I own for almost 20 years.

People are individuals, and must be treated as such. Dogs, too.

The dog made it home. Charges were animal cruelty. Restitution for Vet bills and dog owners time were the biggest $. The dog owner went after the land owner as well. It did not hold up.

Don't like hog dogs on the place I hunt but it will happen from time to time. What I don't like is the ones that drive up to your gate and drop their dogs off onto your property. When you have both side of the road leased there is no way they didn't do it intentionally. They were running deer and anything else and shooting on the dirt road thinking it was no a public road, the local game warden took their Christmas money and guns.

Put out some 330 conibears baited with hog meat to control the coyote population.

Be careful shooting someone's dog. You could end up with a felony and it could be the last time you fire a gun.

Thanks, ChrisB. I would not recommend shooting a dog, especially one that has a collar. I am well aware that there are some hog hunters who knowingly trespass and should be prosecuted to the fullest intent of the law but I feel that they are a minority. I am aware that East Texas has the lion's share of these folks and thank God that I live and hunt out west.
All of the hunters that I know who hunt with dogs are on the property at the request of the landowner so shooting a dog would be more than a HUGE mistake.
Adios,
Gary

^^^^^^

Not true. And for those counties that DO have leash laws, they often apply only within the city limits.

I have encountered same problem in Haskell County but never in East Texas. I don't hunt down South but bet they have same issues.

I have to agree with all the above. I can understand the argument on both sides however, once the dogs cross the property line they and their owners should be held responsible. I have dogs and hate to think about it but do think sometimes there may be a need to SSS. Just my .02

Don't get me started on East Texas and Hog Doggers and such.

I grew up hunting and fishing in the Hill Country. Never experienced the same lack of respect for property lines, property ownership, etc....as when we moved to East Texas.

Not saying that these things don't occur other places. East Texas does not have a monopoly on that, but it seems to have a good many folks with a completely different mindset.

http://texashuntingforum.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/6462190/1

Before the season we were filling feeders, and I saw a dog with a collar on come running past with it's tongue hanging out, so I figured it might have been chasing deer since I've seen a few over the years since we've been there.
Later on, we were on the other side of the property at another feeder, and we had a guy on horseback ride up on us asking if we'd seen a couple stray cows.
I told him we haven't seen the cows, but I did see a dog run past us, and he said it was his.
The rancher runs cattle during the off season and when he removed them, a couple of the cows didn't want to leave.
That is why I won't get trigger happy! It would have been hard to explain to that guy on the horse that I just shot his dog.