Lehality of .22 at 300 yards

I came across this video and was really surprised at the lethality of a typical .22 round at 300 yards.




Cliff Notes;

300 yards, clear ballistics gel block with 4 layers of demin on the front. Just over 11" of penetration, but no bullet expansion with a CCI Mini Mag (~1200 ft/sec 36 grain).


I was expecting a LOT less penetration than this. I am not saying this is a good hunting round at 300 yards, I am saying it is impressive at the penetration a .22 round still has at 300 yards.

That doesn't surprise me at all.

Speed is why so many bullets don't penetrate or perform well on game, they are going too fast. Many common hunting bullets will penetrate deeper at longer range due to reduced speed and expansion.

That's pretty interesting. I shot .22 LR on steel a couple of weeks ago and there was a very distinct ping on the hits all the way out to 400.

This is why many long favored calibers in both Europe and Africa favor heavy for caliber bullets and moderate velocity. Only the USA is in love with magnums. Several years ago I got a 9.3x62 and with 286 gr bullets at about 2400 fps it will shoot end to end on deer with very little bloodshot meat. Try that with a fast magnum.

Wind-age and Elevation

Use a copper bullet like a tsx it's easy to do.

the heavy and slow era died with Elmer Keith

No, it really didn't. The only thing that died was critters shot with big, slow boolits.

Nailed it

Yup

Blasphemy

How fast was the bullet going when it hit the gelatin? Are there ballistic tables out there giving the speed of a 22 bullet at 300 yards?

Obviously you've never been on safari and talked to any people that hunt dangerous game. Heavy and slow work, period.

Yeah, that is why I'm thinking about selling my old lever 45/70. When I shoot things they just fall over, nothing spectacular like running 250 yds before their heart explodes nor does it turn anything into a pink mist. I'm getting bored just killing things. Nothing to video and photos are boring.

Call me first, please sir.

Sure. With a BC of .126 and muzzle velocity of 1250 fps, the approximate velocity at 300 yards is 787 fps (assuming light crosswind).

w SK standard plus its about 14 mils from my 100yrd zero......

The only reason the big Africa cartridges don't shoot fast is because they are heavy. They kick as bad as any magnum. On both ends. And ballistic gel is not like hitting a rib or cartilage. It's the equivalent to hitting guts, fat or softer muscle.

I know this was a 22 LR but when I lived way out in the country my 22 Mag was sighted in at 217 (+/- can't remember exactly). Many and crow, coon and squirrel bit the dust at my feeder. And yes it had a 20'plus tall back stop behind it.
No way I would want to take a 22 round at any range.

Speed is what allows penetration, sure, but it is also what causes expansion when the bullet sees the initial hydraulic shock upon entering its terminal medium.

Heavy and slow usually results in under expansion or straight pass through. Just look at the heavy 300blk bullets. You have to go REALLY soft (or some exotic bullet profile) to get expansion when shooting subsonics. Even then, temporary and permanent cavitation suffer severely.

Right, so a big problem w the 62 gr ammo for the military in Somalia was that the bullets were punching right through the combatants, making nice ice pick like holes, but failing miserably at stopping them very quickly. Lots died but lots took numerous hits and continued to fight. No doubt many died later. So while lethal, often not quickly lethal. Slow lethal has only limited use for hunting.

P.O, Ackley, W.D.M. Bell and Roy Weatherby might have a difference of opinion when it comes to bullet penetration and velocity.

I ran too many to count test rounds through my 45/70 and whether at 25. 125 or 225 yds the recovered bullet never measured less than .45" in diameter.

Now back to topic of .22 lr at 300 yards.

Regarding the OP, just don't confuse stopping power with lethality. When I was a kid my granddad used to always warn all the grandkids to make sure that his cattle weren't down range past our target. He was sure he lost one to a 22.

I figure the OP's scenario only amounts to a slow death somewhere down range to something.

Black Hawk Down reference (book).
I think this is right on.

Cool video. No wonder the Thunderbolt boxes say "dangerous out to 1 mile".

A .375 h&h pushing a 270 grain bullet at 2700 fps isn't exactly slow




And on just about every African cartridge used they have "magnum" written on the headstamp with the exception of a slight few

Both principles work - just a matter of matching up the right bullet for the given application.

I like tougher bullets in general because they work across a broader range of conditions. Plus, you aren't always going to hit soft tissue.

This is why i very seldom think of selling my "444" marlin

Speed has been overrated as the "be all, end all" for years now.

But, hey, it sells a lot of rifles and bows.....

It's not a answer for everything but I do believe in hydrostatic shock being a good thing

Advances in bullet technology is much more important than increases made in speed.

Those old, heavy slow bullets were made because light, fast bullets blew up and wouldn't penetrate. That's not the case any more

All very true. But I see too many threads with folks drinking the KoolAid of fast,frangible bullets. Way too many. It's like many are having to re-learn the lessons of the early .250-3000 Savage/.220 Swift cartridges with soft bullets all over again.

Agree with that. Fast is fine but use a properly constructed bullet

I also believe that "too light" exists.

I cringe when someone shows up in camp with a .22-250 and 45 grain hollow points

Yes. It's all a balance considering the game sought and conditions.

People just get stuck on "one way is always best". When others propose alternatives, they go back to the "It's about shot placement" saw. Which is just an overall truism that always applies but is just the beginning of any analysis of what is best.

What many seem to imply is that if you don't agree with them on using the 45 grain .22-250 for deer or the 110 grain V-Max for elk, then it's because you just can't shoot. And then they post about how Uncle Joe killed his elk DRT with one. Sure, when they work - they work spectacularly. But when they fail - they fail just as spectacularly.

Many would do well just to follow the animal pictures on the box.

Yep. I grow weary of the "pappy hunted all his life with a .222 and 50 grain soft points an' never lost a deer" stories

They fail to mention that pappy never killed a deer at more than 50 yards and always hunted outta a truck or stand.

Hunt long enough, in varied conditions and you will learn that it's all about shot placement....sometimes means placing your shot at less than ideal angles.

Sometimes that animal isn't going to produce a perfect vital shots and you have to shoot him head on, up the rear or punch thru a foot of intestines to get to the heart/lungs. This takes appropriate caliber, bullet weight and construction

Sometimes it takes restraint. I will never have to put a bullet through a foot of intestines to get to the vitals or a texas heart shot. If no better shot than that is offered ill let it walk to hunt another day. I still like quality bullets.

Ive shot my fair share of deer with ballistic tips and traditional cup and core soft points. Results vary dramatically by exactly what you hit, be it flank, a rib bone, shoulder muscle, leg bone, back bone etc.

that's fine if you don't mind going home empty handed. its one thing when your on the ranch that you can be back at the next week.

if your out of state or the season is short its another story.


sometimes you have to take what's presented or hold off.....I'm likely to take a shot if I can work an angle to get to the vitals

Never going to get to shoot those Hornady z-max then.

Bring 'em to the house and I'll draw the right animals on the boxes for you.

They walk amongst us

Here's a starter kit for you RM:

That deer size Michelin bunny looks like it would require a partition.

Let's be honest...they couldn't put a picture of a tweaker on the box so they went with the next best thing

Bottom line the old slow cartridges with heavy bullets were very effective killers of heavy game back then and they still are today. It is what it is.

Zombie hog would've been a good idea. Or a ninja turtle for the green tip.

The .375 H&H MAGNUM was created in 1912....pretty recent I guess. Anyway , plenty of magnums were employed in Africa, the H&H, the .450 watts magnum, the .458win and .460 wby mags, the .378 wby, the .416 rem. Mag, etc.


If you wanna shoot a old, slow cartridge with a heavy bullet, go right ahead. I never said it didn't work. I just said it is antiquated

Antiquated is a poor choice of words.

.30-06. 1906
.375 H&H 1912
.270 Winchester 1925

We could get by just fine with either one of the mid-sized ones and the .375 for anything that walks the earth. Especially with today's improved optics and bullets.

Be sure of the target and of what is beyond it, even with a .22

the 06' and .270 are high velocity calibers. The 220 grain outta the 06' at 2400 fps could be considered slow but not a 150 at 2900 fps

I agree that anyone could get by just fine with those calibers on any continent

Constraints don't justify disregarding ethics. I hunt multiple states after multiple species every year and I have never felt the need to launch a hail mary so I don't go home empty handed. I have had unfilled tags, including elk. Hell, I almost didn't fill a bighorn tag but managed one last quick trip after I said I was done and got one. I went home empty handed because I wasn't offered a shot I considered good to take on the first trip.


If you absolutely have to kill something when you go hunting, maybe you need to reconsider why you are going hunting, no offense to you Sir.

Who said anything about disregarding ethics?

It's not unethical to use a stout cartridge/bullet combo to broaden your options on shots

This has been a good read:).

I shoot Raccoons all the time under my feeder at 136 yds with a subsonic 22. I don't know the exact bullet drop or speed, but my scope is maxed out at the vertical setting. If you hit them in the vitals, they drop just like they would at 20 yds.