1.Rebarrel cost? 2.Worth it?

1. Ok what should I expect to pay to re-barrel my 700 5R from .223 to .223AI. I supply the barrel? I will buy it already deeply fluted.

2. Keeping the .20" barrel, even worth it?

Been answered 5 times before, and you have Tony's number.

Wow, I thought I was indecisive, Buzz you make me feel better about me!

have we already talked about this, really? Hummm, I cant remember

My 223ai is 21 or so on length and pushes a 80gr vld at 2902fps.

24"
80 gr ELD-M
3085 fps

Three shot group at 100 yards .062"

Twist for the .223AI ?
7 or 8?

Buzz, you really are a piece of work.

Barrel = 325 - 375
Chamber = 250 - 350 w/crown
Muzzle break = $35 from Harrells
Thread for muzzle break and blend to barrel = 75 - 150

Yes, we've been through this all before.

Unless your 5R won't shoot, you aren't going to gain enough making that change to make it worth your while. Sell the 5r for full value, buy a donor action, and build.

Mine is 1:7.7

Spoke to Greg, at Bugholes.com about a 1:7. His take was, that would only be necessary for 90 gr Bergers (88 gr ELM-M had not been introduced yet). And if was going to run the 90's, I'd be top loading, only. He said everyone that tried 90's in a .223 A.I. went back to 80's so they could Mag (not clip) feed, and the 1:7.7 would do a fine job. He was right.

Mine is a 7 twist.

How many fps does AI’ing a 223 really gain?

100-140fps depending.

Heard of straight .223's (24") making an 80 gr go 2900 fps, and I think that's the top end. Nearly a 200 fps gain going A.I. I've also heard, in A.I. cartridges, the .223 yields the most gain in velocity.

How so?

7mm-08 A.I. gained 120 fps with a 162 gr.

I don't think it matters to Buzz. He just needs a reason to spend $700 on this project. Of course, in about 3 hours he will be at the pool with his ladies and we will have this conversation tomorrow after the coffee helps his head. Didn't we already do this yesterday?

I meant just the 223 version. Each case will vary and parent case design will affect how much gain the Ackley form yields.

Right. .223 seems to gain more than 100-140 fps, going to A.I.

Course, you and I are on different barrel lengths. So 100-200 fps would cover a broader spectrum. And this is only talking 80's. Drop down to a 55 gr and it'll be no telling how much faster.

I'm a 223/223ai lover. My current .223 is a 26" Brux sending 82 bergers at around 2925 via 8208. My .223ai is 20", sending the same bullets at the same speed, suppressed. 75 gr SS2's are a touch slower, but just as accurate.

223ai is definitely worth it, and if your barrel is accurate, it is likely worth just re-cutting the chamber and cleaning up the crown and threads. Remington continues to have their heads in the clouds with twist rate, so going AI on your barrel MIGHT allow for you to shoot 75's more accurately. If not, pick a good barrel manufacturer and go from there. Tough to go wrong in today's barrel world.

223ai is a hot rod, and will smoke everything native to Texas...the upside is that you can pile primers for cheap, deal with no recoil, and it's just inherently stupid accurate. The downside is fireforming, and tweaking the mag box if your are gunning bdl bottom metal. Problem solved, and staying solved, with accurate mags and taking a dremel to the front lip. Feeds slick as snot.

The more sloped the body of the case the more velocity will be picked up. IIRC for a 20 percent case volume increase exprct about 4 percent velocity increase, if you holding pressures the same.

10% is what I added to the load, once formed, and it made 10% more speed.

24.6 gr made 2800 fps (fire forming) 113 fps/ per grain of powder.

26.4 gr makes 3085 fps. 116 fps/ per grain of powder.

The pressure increases once formed. I have not been able to get the pressure up, while fire forming, even on compressed powder charges. The brass is just flowing so far, dropping pressure.

Now, can a .223 chamber make more velocity than a fire forming .223 A.I. chamber? I think, yes it certainly will.

edit: 7mm-08 A.I. chamber fire forming 2700 fps.

Fire formed> 3.5% increase in charge =4% more velocity.

Jason, I was not referring to a fire forming load in an AI chamber, but a standard 223 in a standard chamber and a 223AI in the 223AI chamber.

IE. if you shoot a 223 or 280 or what ever at X velocity and you cut that chamber to the AI version there is about a 4% increase in velocity for a 10% case capacity increase. Trying to remember where I picked up that little tidbit of Info and think it was in either one of the PO Aclkey or Ken Waters books I have read over the years.

I see.

I wouldn't doubt it. That would put the standard .223 making more speed, which it has to.

Seems like a giant waste of $700-900.

Never shot a sub 1/4 MOA rifle, I see. And on a twist rate you KNOW will stabilize the bullet you want to run.

He asked if it was worth it....to gain 100-200 fps on a 223 cartridge I think it's a giant waste of $700-900. Has nothing to do with twist rates or MOA's.

Yes, re-barreling does!

What he didn't say (today) is he will be loading a heavier, high BC bullet he currently cannot stabilize. And, no Remington, Tikka, Ruger, Winchester, Savage barrel will ever equate a Bartlein chambered to .0005", centered in the lathe. In this case, you do get what you pay for.

A lot of it depends on how accurate the rifle currently is and what he's going to do with it as to whether it's worth it. Also, can he shoot it well enough to make the difference worth it? I still don't understand tearing apart a 5R just to get a donor action.

All perspectives kinda like guys dropping an extra 15k on a diesel engine when they gas will do more than most need. For myself I like running a 21inch tube but getting 24-26" straight 223 velocity.

Once again, he can't stabilize the bullet he wants to run with his current barrel. And that 5R barrel is worth about $50 on the market. Pulled off a $50 barrel to get what he wants, so what?

Re-barrel it to 224 Valkrie.

Sell the 5R rifle as a whole, maybe $700. Go buy a donor action for $300 and a stock for 150-200 and come out ahead $200. Hell, you could buy a SA varmint on sale for $325, use all the pieces, and be nearly $400 ahead which would pay for half the barreling job. That's what.

In this thread I did not see where he said what bullet he wants to shoot. Just gives a twist.
Going to the trouble of a rebarrel for velocity (and accuracy) go to 22BR or 22-250.
I understand there is a different bolt face.

Yeah, well there are those of us that have answered these questions for 10 threads, over the last 6 months. We know the bullet he's wanting to run. And his current donor action is a bolt face for .223 based cartridges.