Larue ARs

By the Grace of God we are finally getting rid of the Gov. issued M-16s. They were never IMO good carry LEO rifles. Anyhow we are now looking at Texas made Larue. We would shoulder the bill. Meaning each officer pays for their own rifle.

The one we are looking at is 2Gs per rifle. Are they that good and worth that price?? I know nothing about them and would think a lower price Sig, Rock or Smith would be ok.

Imo no not really. They are kinda heavy and will even be more heavy rigged out. Even their light isn't that light.

If you're shopping I would look at

JP - they have a great leo program check it out and their rifles are usually very accurate.

BCM

Daniel Defense - they offered a pretty good package

I would not Rock or Smith. I'm not up to date on my sig knowledge.

They are well made, accurate rifles. I've got a 5.56 predatAR with a 3-9x42 SWFA FFP scope on it that I like it a lot for longer range coyote hunting. That said they may be overkill from a cost standpoint for a police duty rifle unless Larue gives you a good break. Also depends on how they're going to be used and what sort of optics. If you're using backup sights and red dots, you might just as well save some money and look at daniel defense, colt, sig, etc. Noveske, Larue, JP, etc. are super nice but you're paying a lot for the name and aesthetics. If its a long ranch, sniper type rig needed then by all means look at the higher end stuff like Larue but for carry guns, might not be the best choice from a cost standpoint if everyone has to come out of their own pocket for it.

The cost scares me. It's 2 Gs and my wallet. A buddy just purchased a Sig from Academy . It was 1000 but Academy gave him a discount of 20 percent. The rifle looks legit, but I have NEVER shot one either.

It is (the Sig AR) IMO a carry LEO rifle, short and sweet. I'm not sure on where to go with a carry rifle. We have to "vote" and pass to take on the Larue, the price may be the kicker.

If you have to handle it in and out of your car all day along with your bag and donuts the billet aluminum and weight will add up. I think iliketohunt is going thru this now and is trying to lighten up

Had more than one officer tell me of problems with LaRue rifles.

I can only speak to what I currently own or have owned recently.

In .223/5.56; I've had DPMS, many PSA, DDM4v1, and a S&W sport. The only one I would really feel comfortable as a duty rifle would be the Daniel Defense. Don't get me wrong, I never had a problem with any of the others; and the PSA are all of high quality. It's just the DD has a reputation for being a reliable duty carbine.

In .308/7.62; I've had Armalite, Sig Patrol, DPMS Recon, and S&W M&P 10. This is a bit trickier as the Sig was an excellent performing rifle, but extremely heavy. The M&P 10 works well for my use, but the 18" barrel might not be ideal for patrol use. The AR10 had a 20" barrel, so even less handy. The DPMS performed well, but not sure I'd trust my life to it.

For a duty rifle I'd go Daniel defense. They're extremely well made and will be less than the larue by a good bit. I own both. Colt is good too but for similar money Daniel defense is where it's at.

I'd like to own one but for the price and its use there are probably better options out there.

I wonder how "precision" ars with tighter tolerances do in less than ideal cases.

Daniel Defense all the way. LaRue is not worth the money.

Si

JP.

+1 for JP Enterprise. Larue is not worth the cost.

I own a Larue and I wouldnt recommend for duty. Its very heavy and has very tight tolerances. It is stupid accurate for a gas gun but I could see it jamming if not kept clean, well lubed, and well fed. I keep mine squeaky clean and it only sees match grade ammo and handloads. If you're going for accuracy out of a gas gun then Id recommend. But if you're looking for reliability then Id go with something that other departments use.

Have two Larue rifles and love their design. Never had any problems with mine besides crappy brass while shooting suppressed.

Plenty of reliable ARs for a lot less money.

Our department SWAT snipers were using Larue for while, along with Surefire suppressor that came with the rifles. They were less than pleased with the combo. 1 out of 5 shots would be way off, but they could never say which shot. Didn't matter of it was with or without the suppressor. These were 308's and ran about $5k.

We were running either Colt or Rock River as patrol rifles, and we recently stopped buying the RR because of excessive throat and barrel ware.

I would suggest having your department do a Test & Evaulate with a couple different manufacturers for an extended period. That way it lets the user decide which rifle they like, ecspecailly since it's coming out of your pocket. The department can buy them as a package and you buy it from the department, usually makes it cheaper than what an individual can buy them for even at a discount.

If it were me, I'd buy the DD MK4V11, in a short barrel. Because who will really be making precision shots at over 100 yards in a patrol based function? Most shot opportunities will be within 25 yards.

I know of a department going to GA Precision AR-10's, for Sniper work. They brought up DPD, and Ft.Worth being less than pleased with LaRue. And every rifle has been tested with Federal Gold Medal Match 168 gr.

Personally, I'd stick with a bolt action, but that's just me.

unfortunately our rule book doesn't allow 99% of us to carry bolt guns

I agree with the bolt gun, and my dept is sticking with that until a better gas gun comes up. They want the gas gun because of the idea that when the SHTF, they can make entry with the gas gun where as a bolt gun they would be ditching in favor of a pistol. One gun, multiple uses.

Wow!!!! Surprised Texans disown LaRue like this. I've got NO dog in the fight, but it appears LaRue needs to step up their game when it comes to their rifles. The mounts, on the other hand, are on par w/the best in the land. Maaaaaaaaaaaybe they'll read this & realize "Texans are NOT recommending our rifles to other Texans". That's a BIIIIIIIIIIG 'in your face' for, not only an American company, but even more, a Texas company. It's not like the rec's are coming from a bunch of Texas hatin' Yanks. These are rec's coming from Texans about a TEXAS gun maker!!!!!!! Gotta' be a heavy hit to LaRue, if you ask me. Hey, there comes a time when almost anyone needs to be put in their place & it appears this is LaRue's time. Having said that, I have loved, & will continue to own, multiple mounts they offer as I see them not only on par w/the best, BUT, also made in Texas. LaRue, you're up to bat!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I love accuracy, but the weight and unbalance is not winning me. I waited a long time for their lightweight model only to be soon traded off. Fit and finish were excellent, balance and overall did not pass with my personal likings.

Great mounts. And great guns just not the premium they ask.

Right. Wasn't meaning as a patrol rifle, just for Sniper work.

Try Windham Weaponry.

So far the finish is amazing an very accurate out of the box.

I still recommend Larue if you're looking for an accurate AR10 platform. There are only a handful of comparable AR10s that come to mind....GAP, JP, Seekins. Their AR15 platforms dont seem to be anything special compared to Noveske, DD, Seekins, and the like. Heck my $400 frankenAR was shooting groups equal to my buddies PredatAR when we were both shooting open sights. Put scopes on them and Im sure the Larue wins, but I could tell my buddy was irked at our $400 vs $2000 AR test. But when we're talking AR10, they make some accurate sticks which I can attest to.

Some of the reason ppl arent gung-ho Larue is because by all accounts the owner is a little cocky and a bit of a jerk. I havent experienced it but enough guys on Snipers Hide have to where they despise him. Ive seen Larue do alot of nice things over the years but Ive also seen them do some pretty bonehead things. For instance, for some reason they are developing a 260rem platform instead of 6.5creedmor which makes about as much since to me as night vision for a blind man. When folks have asked why 260 instead of 6.5 he states that he builds what people have asked for. I call BS and think its just he's just being a smug jerk that wont admit he got it wrong.. Seriously, you're gonna tell me that most requests are coming in for a 260rem over a 6.5creedmoor when everyone and their mom is producing 6.5creedmoor?

This really hurts coming from the guy that sold me my Larue

JK John! The Larue is a beautifully made firearm that has yet to fail me.

If I didn't want to spend $2k I would go with a RRA.

I traded my LaRue off. It was accurate, it was very accurate for the first 20 shots then; it needed to be cleaned or it would not run. Was terrible for reliability if you drove on a dirt road in the Ranger the gun would jam on the second or third shot. Took it prairie dog hunting and only got to shoot it four times before I threw it in the case. I hate a gun that jams with a little dust, it just means it is not a good tool. I have no use for an accurate gun that can not run. There is no way I would recommend a LaRue for anyone other than a target shooter that likes to keep his/her gun squeaky clean.

I really wish I could recommend the LaRue but it has become like the really expensive 1911s pretty, accurate, over priced and unreliable. Give me a gun that goes boom every time and can keep a plate sized group at 200 yards and I am happy.

I hunt with a lot of Law Enforcement and do not want to see them harmed by a gun that will not run when it needs too...

I have never had an issue with my Wilson Combat ARs.

Sorry about that Wes! I bought into the "kool-aid" too (still have some of their rifles) but took awhile to realize that Larue guns just do not perform if exposed to the slightest bit of dirt or debris. Their tolerances are just too tight! They are picky about ammo too! Operationally my Colt LE6920 (not ammo picky) runs circles around any of my Larue guns but from an accuracy standpoint (bench shooting) the Larue is superb. Larue scope mounts are some of the best on the market!

I vote for the Daniel Defense. I wish I would've gone that route when I bought my patrol rifle. I have a RRA Elite Operator. Super heavy and I've had to do a lot of work to get the weight down. Still have the original heavy barrel for now but I'm trying to sbr it. The DD will be lightweight and fail proof right out of the box.

If these were A2 stocked and sighted with 20 inch barrels, they are awkward to handle in vehicles and heavy. A light, collapsible stocked rifle with 16 barrel would handle completely different. Are you wanting hard iron sights with round handguards that allow quick deployment of the rifle, or do you want flip ups and rails? With flip ups, you can get rifles in the five and six pound range from Rock River. A regular LAR-15 CAR M4 series can be found new on Gunbroker for $599.

If i wanted a precision AR Larue would be near the top of the list IMO, if i wanted a duty rifle that i could abuse, i would look elsewhere

I don't own any of their rifles but love the bipod and scope mounts I've purchased from them.

If you want to go the precision AR route I highly recommend Wilson Combat and JP Enterprises.

I have owned a lot of AR's. Lots of different manufacturers and I run a lot of rounds through them. Most of my friends are ex-SF folks and every time we go out they grab the Wilson Combat. I don't disagree with them. It is the best running, most accurate AR I have ever owned. The one problem with Wilson is getting one...you have to be patient sometimes.

Flip side, I sometimes wonder if this doesn't get overthought. Many of the lower priced units would probably do the job fine. For instance, I have a DPMS in .223. It has never, ever jammed and it is plenty accurate within 100 yards all day. I don't know, but some ego could get into these discussions. Maybe I am wrong. And...not being LEO...I sort of wonder how many times these get used...and how many rounds actually get fired in "anger". I know the "your life depends on it" chant, but still, reliability can certainly come well under 2 grand. I have a friend currently in Northeast Tarrant County SWAT. To my knowledge, he has never fired his on the job. Something to think about maybe...

I was thinking the same thing as I read the posts about LaRue rifled being very precise. What distances will you be shooting? Do you really need 1/4 MOA to shoot at 50 yards?

Yep, the entire setup needs to fit the task that it is meant for. Most of them, including the lower priced options, will do the job reliably. The snipers I know wouldn't be buying an AR anyway.

No, larue accuracy is not necessary but it sure is nice to know you can know what your equipment is capable of. Most patrol rifle accuracy is sighted at 50 yards with open or red dot type optics. I would want to know my rifle is capable of 1 moa at 100, but most will never know because they don't have magnified optics.

It's good the department is even allowing the chance at a larue. After owning one I would choose a lighter option like a dd or Another name brand that weighs in the same. Lightweight is a good thing to have when it will be likely carrying optics and probably two full mags. Weight adds up quick getting it in and out of a car rack daily

The PD Snipers I've visited with and had put to my range have all told me they need 1 MOA at 100 yards. Their engagements just don't dictate long range. I've seen the qualifying hostage target they have to shoot monthly, at 100 yards, and it ain't that hard to get it done. In other words, a long list of rifles will do it reliably.

If LaRue is so tight it must be kept perfectly clean, and oiled, I would want another brand. It reminds me of a particular brand of bolt action I have vowed to never own, for the same reason. If it can't get dirty, and keep running, I don't have any use for it.

Inquiring minds want to know!

I've hurt feelings saying it in public. I said I wouldn't do it again.

Exactly....

Man it's rough hauling my rifle to the truck every morning

BIL is about 6'3" and a deuce and a half, and worries when a rifle exceeds 7 pounds.

It has baffled me for years. Specially since I'm 5'9" 185 and run 13 pound, to 17 pound rifles.

You know I have two Tikkas.

I'm not ashamed to say that I spot and stalk 1/4 to full section pastures regularly and that I'll take all the weight savings I can get. I'm running some 6.8 AR's at just over 7 lbs. with thermals weighing as little as 1.4 lbs. with mounts. I love keeping the weapon part of the gear under 9 lbs. if possible. Makes the journey more enjoyable.

[/quote]

You know I have two Tikkas. [/quote]
I'm thinking Ruger.

Savage

Ahhhhh, I see. One brand I've never owned!

You lay on your stomach and rattle off how far you can shoot, I give real life true story info on an ideal weapon which happens to be a preferred lighter weight. Nobody wants a stupid azz 13 lb or even a 10 lb rifle when they are going room to room in a middle school.

Bahahahahha. He loves my Savage

It's rough when you throw on the added vest with rifle plates, and extra mags, on top of the vest you are already wearing and duty belt. Everyday an officer puts his vest and belt on is an additional 20-25 pounds worn all day. The extra vest and mags gets around 35lbs and the rifle is another 6-8lbs, so yeah it adds up. Plus if they end up doing building checks or a prolonged standoff, 6-8 pounds becomes heavy real quick.

I'll agree with you on the last sentence, but going a hundred yards with a couple extra pounds isn't that bad.

Lots of difference in actually carrying a rifle with you while walking versus sticking it in a gun rack for your patrol car to carry around.

That being said, I routinely carry an 11lb (OMG SOOOO HEAVY!!) 20" Hbar in the truck and while walking around. Plus it's my go-to 3gun rifle.

Cool story bruh tell us some more one upper stories of how awesome you are

Tell me more about the hardships of hauling an 8lb rifle in a car.

Dude, I'm just poking you, chill out. Mine get carried miles, every year, BTW.

Warn me next time you start bleeding and lose your sense of humor.

I try to worry less about my weights of my rifles and more about the size of my muscles.

Some people will never get it ^^^^^ But it's ok because he's "tactical" so he must know all

This. Exactly. Also add in there getting to a location and having to maintain cover on a section of house. 7 lbs is better to hold on target than 11 or 12. I promise.

Does it HAVE to be an M4 style rifle? There are a lot better options for a Police Patrol rifle.

Such as?

Yes. Most departments policies will dictate that it is an m4 type of variant. We only have a few brands we can choose from and only one Federal sku # for the ammo we can carry in it.

Just get the PWS MK110.....Great rifles and have 4 of them in my collection. I really like the MK110 SBR.....

I am sure my buddy would give all of you guys discounts also for being a LEO group.

Bull-pup rifles like the FN, AUG and Tavor are much better suited for urban patrolling.
They use the same ammo and some even use the same mags as the M4
16" barrel and the same terminal performance of the M4
Pica-tinny rails so you can use the same optics and lights
But in a smaller, easier to maneuver package.
They are typically 10" shorter and weight is more to the rear.
Better balance, easier to carry for long periods, easier to get in and out of a vehicle with.
Faster to get on target and stay on target.
MUCH easier to use in a dynamic environment.
Basically what a LEO needs.

I don't know about much easier to use. Mag changes and weapon manipulation of a bullpup isn't the most user friendly. Of course with enough training it would become muscle memory. I'm sure the prices are prohibitive for PD's as well.

cops dont need or use M-16's--------------- its just a dress-up accessory to make them feel important as they are giving tickets. There is no practical use for them. MABE the swat team,, but that's about it. At least I"m glad to hear the tax payers are not footing the bill, making the leos buy their own guns. Larue's are super accurate,,, which is not needed in a cops gun. No cop has ever made a 700 yard shot with an m-16----ever------- IN Waco they were shooting around 60-80 yards at the motorcycle gang,, any gun is accurate at that range. But pretend costumes are fun for leos.

Manipulation is not as bad as you think. It took me about two days of practice to get it down pat with my AUG. Price wise- they are about the same as a LaRue.

WOW. Cops absolutely need long guns. Not only are they out first defense against regular criminals who also have AKs and ARs but they are also our first defense against small and large scale terrorist attacks.

The troll is strong with this one..

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Hollywood_shootout


Here is why Richard

i would say this is not trolling as there are some people that do not think every cop needs an ar.

I can understand why people would debate this as there are pluses and minuses on either side.

I have carried and shot the snot out of nearly every AR here, and for reliability, it's hard to beat broken in properly maintained Colts. Even compared with rifles twice or more that price.

I have also loved Bushmasters, Smith's, stag, Rock River, CMMG, Core, Sig, and many others. To me, for what I want in a carbine, I don't need a 2k+ Wilson, LaRue, etc.

I think spikes price to value is a good call.

I just would not do a fraken AR...

What are the minuses? If I can walk down the side walk with an AR strapped to my back legally why in the hell would a cop not be able to have an AR in his patrol vehicle. It is hurting absolutely no one for them to have it, and could save a lot of lives in the instance the LEO needs that rifle. There is not one minus to a LEO having a patrol carbine.

This ^^^^ Basically what I said at the beginning of all this...

some people think that having police walking around with ARs and tactical gear is not the right decision. That it creates an more adversarial force as opposed to helping force.

There is also an argument that to continue have certain equipment, it has to be justified, therefor the scope of when it gets used is expanded beyond the original intent.

For you and what you want in a carbine....

For me and what I want.....I own a Wilson. And I enjoyed shooting it out to 1000 yards last weekend and killing pigs with it any any distance. I get a kick out of shooting it long range, so it's worth the extra coin for me.

Agree but on most occasions the AR is stored inside the vehicle and only used for certain circumstances. I don't think I've ever see a police officer just walking around with an AR.

And I made that point basically also. I own a Wilson and love it. So does my SWAT friend and SF friends...but it is used for hunting. I think high end AR's may be an overpriced, ego buy for how they get used for day to day LEO purposes depending on what your specific role is. As I said, I don't believe my SWAT friend has had to fire his in "anger".

I think you are right. They would be better off with a shorter barrel reliable platform like SapperTitan just built for his second 6.8. He shot it out to 500 yards easy with a vortex 1-4. I think he told me he had about 1800 total cost in it with the glass.

You know I have two Tikkas. [/quote]
I'm thinking Ruger. [/quote]

The Feds just started going to Rugers a few months ago. Maybe Ruger has stepped up their game.

Richard????does He go by Dicck???

Yep right at about 1800 and was pleasantly surprised how versatile it was with that 1-4. With the right conditions I'm positive i could get it out to 800

Cops don't need AR's just like civilians don't need AR's. It's just to make your ego feel better about being so ignorant.

And the word is "maybe" not MABE

How accurate are you at 60-80 yards with a pistol? I'd rather take that shot with a rifle

Keep trolling

^^^ clueless

I think the average guy on patrol needs a minimalist light weight 10.5" AR. Would be nice to have that department wide and suppressed. That way there is no doubt who is who when the hits the fan.

I agree with the 10.5 inch AR, but not the suppressor. Because when the SHTF your adrenaline will be kicking and chances are you wont even here the shots, but you will want the other guys on your team to here them. That's a big reason as to why operators only run 1 ear plug

I've never worn ear plugs while on a foot patrol and barely remember hearing the shots me and my team were shooting. Adrenaline is a wonderful thing. Your brain puts all the focus on what it is using which is mostly hands and eyes I guess the brain feels hearing isn't as important in a life and death situation.

Yeah, this sounds like a bunch of gun counter bs.

I'd advocate for suppressed guns for patrol officers for one reason- it protects their hearing. You guys are correct that your brain automatically ignores stimuli that don't contribute to decision making in a life or death scenario (in this situation, it's called auditory exclusion), but you're missing the point that you're still going to have hearing damage. I remember the first time I shot a deer- I was so excited that I didn't even hear the shot, but once the adrenaline wore off, I realized that my ears were ringing like crazy. The same thing will happen to our officers, and there's no reason not to give them what is basically a safety device.

And wanting other guys on your team to hear the shots? LOL, if they can't hear a suppressed 10.5" AR fire, they're not close enough to do anything to help anyway.

Yeah, the operators would not want to be running around being able to communicate while engaging a target, nor protecting their hearing......Just because you don't hear it does not mean it is not damaging your hearing......Also, "the other guys on your team" will be able to hear you engaging in combat. "That's a big reason as to why operators only run 1 ear plug" <<<<<< With running a suppressor you should not have to wear any plugs so all the more reason to use suppressed over unsuppressed while engaging a target. Also CQB can be executed all the while hearing your squad over your ear piece while engaging a target.

Let me better state what I meant, earplug was used in correctly, I meant ear piece. We have a system that is turned on, nobody has to key up a mic to talk, it's just an open line between everybody using that equipment. The ear piece picks up the auditory sound when you speak, so you don't have to speak into a mic, extremely useful because you can still use it with your gas mask.

Secondly, don't you think the other people on your team are going to be just as amped up as you? Do you think that they will hear the sound of a suppressed rifle as easily as they will hear the sound of one that isn't? Until you have been in that situation where you are making entry, you have no idea what it is like to violently enter some bodies house unwanted and unexpected, to have them jump and run from the couch to the back of the house, and you have to follow them passing up open doors and other threats. Everything becomes a blur in an instant and all your senses become impaired. Snapper knows what this is like prob better than most on this forum

Same reason night sights are pretty much pointless

Haha yeah, 2 of the easiest things to sell to rookies is night sights and concealed carry/backup holsters

Explain this one please sir.

Explain what? They are like little "Tackleberrys" when they are in the academy

I guess I don't understand. Thought you were saying backup isn't needed. Just wanted to get your thoughts on it.

Yeah I think a back up is a good idea. But be honest about what you need and will carry. I see guys buying a second P226 because they can use the mags they already have. You ever tried to put another full size pistol on you where you can get to it? Also, think about how you will carry it and make it accessible with your off hand. I personally carry one on the outside of my left leg. Most people carry ankle holsters on the inside of the ankle, but I found it easier to access on the outside even if I'm on the ground on my back.

I have an outer vest carrier so have to go ankle. No where else to put it.
Full size pistol is glock 22. Need to see if 27 is too big for ankle or not. If not, I can use full size mags on it. If so, I'll probably go glock 43.

You can buy my 342 pd at 10 oz if you're going to carry a secondary

I like glock, haha.

Go g43 then don't buy into all that shared magazine sales pitch crap.

I thought this was about Larue ARs LMAO

Some dbag derailed that a long time ago. Haha

I'm blocking everything you post from here on out

I had to read that twice, glad it said Glock.

Ha. Everyone knows they're going to be too heavy and too expensive. Hopefully 7mag does at least. My RRA with its stupid azz heavy barrel is no fun to hold on target for very long and I've knocked weight down everywhere else so far. No way id want to hold a Larue on target for a while. Fun rifle to have and shoot and hunt with but there are more practical options for patrol. Ill be super pleased with my RRA Elite Operator 2 when I can finally get around to putting a 10.5" BBL on it. That being said I still wish I had a DD MK18 or a DD M4V7.