Still struggling to hold steady

I know the #1 answer is more practice.

So I went to sight in the new shorty rifle this afternoon at the farm. At 35 yards I had no issue. Boresighted and had it dead center in 3 shots (mil/mil made that easier than its ever been. I've seen the light!) And no problem at that range holding steady (12x fixed power SWFA scope).

Head on down to 100, and the unsteadiness starts to really show. I tried multiple positions, rests, and holds, and couldn't get rock solid. It's something I have struggled with for a while. If I have a front and rear bag, I can get really steady, but using anything else, including my Caldwell dead shot pod thing, I'm just shaky.

I was able to get my rifle properly sighted in, but it took me around 12 rounds. With 7 or 8 of those shots being shots I instantly knew I pulled, or wasn't on target.

Anybody have any tips?

Watch a few u-tube videos to study proper shooting positions, and trigger control. Then practice dry-firing every day for a while, and I believe you will see some improvement.

Too elaborate, it not so bad that I get off target, its just that I'm shooting a 3-4" group from improvised rests, when I am able to shoot better, if I have bags, and a bench. I built this rifle with the idea that I would like to be able to shoot 1-2 moa eventually out to 500 or so.

So I'm looking for tips on how y'all hold steady using any available rest. Specifically what yalls shooting form usually is.

That's a good idea hermano. I'll do that.

Golf???

Ouch

Some would argue, but you can steady a rifle easier by turning the magnification down rather than up. The principle is much like that of steering a vehicle where you can stay between the lines more easily if you focus farther down the road rather than right in front of the vehicle. When you aim from a wider field of view, the muscles are not continually trying to compensate for visible movement.

I can shoot groups that just as tight with a 0X, red dot sight at 100 yards, than I can can with a 9X scope at the same distance.

I get that, and I've done that before. Thats why I listed its a 12x fixed power scope.

Ahhh hemm....

I know, I know... I just can't spend the money on the class. Unless you want to trade a class for food, or a wedding cake lol.

Well, when the time comes let me know.

If it were steel or a big load of gravel I'd be all over trading.

You obviously recognize what many hunters don't, that the value in magnification is not to give close up views, but to recognize the target at much greater distances. Many a German fell during WWII to bullets fired by G.I. snipers using fixed, 4X and 2X scopes.

I can only estimate that the "sweet spot" range of a 12X scope would be somewhere beyond several hundred yards.

On the lighter side, should you ever need to see the craters on the moon..

Drink a lot of caffeine?

Don't shoot a 12x scope is the answer

When I first started reloading and was working up different loads I also had an issue holding on a "bulls eye" or dot consistantly. I started printing a target off of the computer with one horizontal and one vertical line around .125 thick with a 1 inch circle on the apex. It was easier for me to hold on the "cross hairs" on my scope to match the X on the paper. It is just something that worked for me.

Sort of...

Zeroed on 20X Sunday, and 21X today. Going unsupported, I drop down to 12X, but that was after having practiced at 8X, then 10X for a couple of years.

Yes, true. But I didn't buy the scope to shoot groups at 100 yards from an improvised rest. But that's where I needed to sight it in.

But I want to get better at it anyways.

You should sight in from a solid rest such as bags on a bench. Once sighted in then you start practicing off-hand and from sticks. If you can shoot 3"-4" groups at 100 yards from sticks that's pretty good.

Dry firing can help develop technique.

Stop smoking and drinking coffee.

I disagree with the turn the scope down crowd. I'm no expert but the better I can see the target the easier it is to hit it.

You can still see the target perfectly fine with lower magnification. Have you ever used a laser sight on a pistol while trying to hold steady? Same concept. I can hold a pistol pretty steady but the second I see the laser I notice my slight tremors. Then slight tremors turn into larger tremors. Turn off the laser and then I'm back to normal.

High magnification causes over correction. I call it fighting the wobble. The more unsteady you are (heavy rifle offhand) the least magnification you should use. As your steadiness improves, your magnification can increase.

I shoot at 100 yards at about 8x. It works

One of my favorite Jack O'Connor stories was when he was out trying for some kind of varmints at medium range with a rifle that had a 6X scope on it. He posted himself at a high place - but the varmints were not cooperating that day.

So he decided to head back to camp, and started walking down the hill - when a big bobcat popped out of the brush, not far ahead of him on the trail. He described the frustration that followed when it was impossible to get a clear sight picture at close range with the 6X scope.

Jack was all set up for varmint shooting - but then when an actual hunting opportunity popped up, he was SOL.

I like 12x or better at the range, but when in the field I set my scope at 4x unless a situation calls for more, or less power.

If I were going to buy a single power rifle scope for hunting, it would be 4x.

I have the same problem. I have noticed that it is slowly going away for me. Im not sure why or what I am doing other than practicing a lot. 2-3 trips a month to the range has kept me from shaking so much I think. I still shake a bit but it has decreased by 50% or more and I think it is from practice and better breathing techniques.

You have a front bag and rear bag and cant hold steady? Its in your head man what are you shooting? Have you tried it with a .22? serious though not trying to be funny

This scope isn't really for hunting. Other than shooting over a feeder at 150 yards. It's for target shooting. But I would still like to learn to hold the rifle steadier at the closer ranges.

If your shooting at your own range have a few beers, or whatever fits your fancy... I sighted in every client at 100yrds and the ones that couldn't qualify that would fix it 100% of the time

I was rock steady as a kid, the 39A and I were deadly. I need at least a front bag these days. I use my left fist for a rear rest with only a front bag and I can do better.

No, I said with a front and rear bag, I can hold very steady. It's when I'm shooting off a backpack, or a bag of corn on the hood of my truck. I'm just wondering if my form or grip is an issue. Form and grip are going to have less impact when the gun is on bags.

AHHHHH my bad I over read that.... is this with any rifle or just this new one?

It's always been an issue. But I'm sure it's magnified (pun not intended) since its a fixed 12 power and I can't just crank it down like I normally would.

In those scenarios, get the rifle to balance almost on its' own. That is usually right ahead of the magazine. Having the rifle muzzle heavy, or butt stock heavy makes improvised rests more difficult. Get your firing hand out of steadying the rifle if possible. Trigger control and follow through are always important. Try to get in a position where your non-firing hand is doing the work of steadying the rifle. Use anything you can to build a position. And get your elbows rested against something.

A thousand yards off a feed sack, on the hood of the truck, is more than do-able once you disect the problem and learn to improvise.

Thanks JG. That's what I'm hoping to hear. I appreciate it.

Control the rifle, don't let it control you.

Make sure you are leaning forward into the rifle, and using the grip hand to pull rearward to apply firm pressure into the shoulder - really firm pressure. When firm enough pressure is applied, the crosshairs should remain steady when dry firing when the trigger is pulled. If the crosshairs jump with dry firing, you need to apply more rearward pressure and/or work on your position.

If the position is sitting or standing, make sure to lean the upper body forward from the waist into the rifle.

There is a difference between a backpack and a bag of corn. The corn actually should be pretty steady. Backpacks can vary quite a bit depending on how firmly they are packed.

Two days over a prairie dog town did wonders for my shooting. Nothing can take the place of sending lots of boolits down range. Except maybe a lesson from JG.

What is your grip on the rifle like? Are you strangling the rifle, or just supporting it?

I noticed especially with my pistol shooting the tighter I held the gun and more I tried to keep it from jumping when I shot the worse my groups were. The more I concentrated on trigger pull and just letting the gun recoil how it recoiled the better my shooting was.

breathing

trigger control

light trigger pull

practice

sorry about the 'golf' comment, was a bit unfair
'

Big Fitz and I ended the day on the evil roof top. Smacked the crap out of 400 yards many times, we did.

Caffeine?

Caffeine doesn't give me the shakes

Try changing your target.
I find I shoot the diamond targets the best if I just aim for the very tip. It gives me a very fine point of aim.
Aim small. Miss small.

Controls wobble a bit but nothing like trigger time and finding what works for you.

I drink over a pot of coffee a day every day. Coffee doesn't give me the "shakes" either, but it does make the cross hairs bounce around a little on high power at 100 yards.

Thanks guys. Good tips.

When I am sighting in a rifle, I try to get the gun as steady as possible with front and back bags and make sure I get that job done well.

When target practicing, I typically use just a front rest of some sort, bag, block, whatever is at the range. I really bury the rifle butt into my shoulder and barely grip the gun with my trigger hand. I have the rifle balanced in the front sight and the shoulder, and really concentrate on breathing. There is always some wobble, as your heart beats and breathing, and that is magnified the more mag your scope has. I try to shoot on a deeper exhale, and always try to let the gun surprise me. Target shooting is fun, should be fun. I think of it almost like the samaurai archers and a battle for perfection between the weapon and the warrior. I am not that good, but you get the point.

If you are shaking, it is either nerves, too hard a grip, or trying to jump the trigger. Simply put, the gun doesn't shake on its own. It is you doing it. So I would try to figure out exactly what part of this is causing the shake. I think you will find your answer yourself and be able to get to the bottom of it more quickly than we can.

And despite what many people think, caffeine makes most people shake. So does adrenaline. I am a microsurgeon, and I have seen people shake violently under a microscope when training from nothing other than being excited and full of adrenaline. With a 12X fixed scope, you are working under a telescope, which is the same principle, and any amount of excitement, adrenaline, or caffeine could be causing the shakes. Especially if they go away when you double bag your gun. Focus on breathing and calming down.

Dry fire a few times at the range before you put any ammo in and see if you can get a non-shakey picture and if you can, then you know its jumping the trigger. If you can't, then it is either excitement, or grip.

It's not that it gives you shakes, it's that it generally it increases contractility (& rebound after-load) which can/will make your heart beat not only faster but harder, meaning each beat can 'bounce' the cross-hairs around more. Won't be an issue on a firm rest but can make a drastic difference when the 'rest' is your body.

Have you tried a steady rise shot? Im bad about getting jumpy if I try and hold steady for to long... my gun is usually moving when I squeeze the trigger.. I breath out as I rise to my target and squeeze off all at the same time... hard to explain but somehow I steady better with movement..

These are all awesome tips guys, cant wait to get back out there. Just wish good ammo was free...

For me, precision shooting is a lot like overhead welding. - It is a matter of deliberately relaxing each and every muscle that is not directly required for the job at hand.

This relaxation means there will be less tremor, and incidentally it makes the shooting process a lot more enjoyable, less tiring.

As an extreme example: Once I was invited to shoot a benchrest rifle, a thirty pound bolt gun chambered in 30-30 Winchester of all things. The owner of the gun gave me three rounds to shoot, which is more generous than it may sound like when you consider the pains that those guys go through to produce accurate ammunition for their guns.

The gun weighed thirty pounds, was securely mounted on a very nice custom shooting rest, and was shooting a 30-30 load that was on the light side. So, after aligning the crosshairs on the target for each shot, I deliberately avoided touching anything on the gun except for it's hair trigger.

After viewing my group, the owner commented that I shot the gun better than he did, by which I guess he must have been putting it to his shoulder, etc. thus allowing heart beats and muscle tremors to have more of an effect.

This is an extreme example, but it shows the general direction to go for. - Relaxed muscles, minimum required contact, trigger control, careful sighting.

With lighter made, heavier recoiling firearms you are not of course going to get by without a firm grip upon the weapon - but even then if you look into it closely, you will probably find that you are tensing up muscles that are not really required for the job at hand. It's a natural human tendency that you have to be aware of so that you can control it.

Kind of like folks who wrinkle up their faces and frown when trying to think something over... They may unconsciously believe that all of that facial muscle action helps them to think - but does it really? Is all of that really necessary?

So, if you are struggling to hold steady, that struggle may be doing you more harm than good.

There are lots of good tips here, this is my two cents on the matter.

I know we rarely see eye to eye, but thank you. I think that may have alot to do with it too. Im tensing up most of my muscles while shooting. (Maybe a subconscious was to compensate for recoil). Which is odd, because recoil doesn't bother me in the least, but I do also have a tendency to flinch for some reason also. I've been working on the flinch for a while now, and its getting better. I just don't know why I do it at all, since recoil doesn't bother me.

One thing that can help tremendously for that tension is dry firing with the gun at the range, looking at the target. Once you can get the gun to where there is minimal shake or no shake and just the typical up and down figure 8's of breathing and heart beat (hopefully even those to e minimum) then you load a round and start getting to the same spot and squeezing off a round.

If you do this more than actually shooting, it will make a big difference in your actual shooting. And once you develop that muscle memory, then you are good to go...

What caliper gun are you firing? Another thing to do would be fire .22LR to help avoid flinching and tension associated with recoil. If you are still shaking with the .22, you need to work on form.

And .22 lr is cheap compared to centerfire ammo.

Yeah, go shoot a couple 100 rounds of .22 then shoot your main rifle. I've done this & it can make a good bit of difference.

I'm shooting a .308 I'll put some rounds through the .22 next time I'm out there

That's how I shoot offhand as well, it seems to work better for me.

Do you have Parkinson's or something? That's a serious question.

There's no reason you should be all over the place while using a rest unless it's that or are holding exceedingly tight.

Are you looking at the target, thus "chasing" the bullseye with the reticle? You should be focusing of the crosshairs.

You shouldn't have to do anything besides make minute aiming adjustments and squeeze the trigger. The weapon should be sitting in the rest just about perfectly aimed.

Could we get a pic of your setup?

Did you read the whole thread? I don't have an issue with a solid rest. I was looking for tips on shooting from improvised rests (sticks, backpacks, etc...)

Setup as in rifle? Or rests?

Here is the rifle.

Yeah, I did. I still don't have those problems using other types of rests.

Are you using a sling? Are you shooting at the right time during your breathing? Are you focusing on the target instead of the reticle?

Have you recently changed brands of corn, or maybe using 40# sacks rather than 50# ? Might want to change the PSI in the front tires. All joshing aside, sounds like the issue might be in breathing and/or forgetting some fundamentals. You remember techniques (you mention form) on the bench but off the truck hood you may lean into the truck. Also might want to take look at your general health. Blood pressure, pulse rate, simple things that come gradually and are not noticed by you. When you get to my age you can be standing next to your backstop wondering why you are holding a roll of tape but no target. When you do figure out the issue, post it so we can put it in our check off list to remember.