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Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7183690 05/30/18 04:01 PM
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NP I think your comparison of sako-Tikka-semi custom tikka is off from my views. Having owned all 3 I wouldn’t specify the Sako is a better “hunting” rifle at all. In fact I would mark it as a clear second or even third. The stock Tikka in my eyes is clearly the best hunting rifle. Why? Because I recognize none of the shortcomings you list. On top of that and most important over the Sako is I’m not afraid to beat the hell out of it. It stands up for more. While the Sako is a far more beautiful gun and at least as functional people generally will not abuse them. Except for the Elite the only advantage I see of the Sako is in showmanship. Few people throw a Sako 85 on a rack and ride 4 miles to the stand, or stalk through brush. Yes it happens. But how often. Hunters don’t pay for fit, finish, and beauty. They pay for accuracy and reliability. On one note you’re right, the Finns have their shot together. They knew what a hunter wanted and made the T3.

The Sako is hands down the most beautiful rifle I’ve ever owned from the factory as well as a great weapon. Not even close to the best hunting rifle I’ve ever owned although I’ve never hunted dangerous game where CRF was a conversation. Then again I’ve never had my muddy, dusty, wet Tikka fail to feed or fire. So there’s that.

Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7183709 05/30/18 04:29 PM
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My hunting rifles are tools. I want the best tools I can get. I have carried my Sakos all over North America from Mexico to the Yukon and all in between.

Don’t be fooled by their looks - that’s just a bonus. From a reliability standpoint, they will handle anything a Tikka can (and more) without issue, I can assure you. And feel a helluva lot better in your hands resting over your pack when it comes time to make the shot of a lifetime.

YMMV. But I don’t see how one could objectively say a Tikka is better than a Sako. They are simply the same factory’s attempt to make a more affordable (read:lesser quality) alternative to their better rifles, pure and simple.


Originally Posted by Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: wp75169] #7183712 05/30/18 04:30 PM
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Originally Posted By: wp75169
Some Hunters don’t pay for fit, finish, and beauty. They pay for accuracy and reliability.

Many times on this very forum you can read hunters say, I don't like the way it looks, or, it looks cool. Hunters will buy camo underwear and phone cases cause they think it looks right, why not an eye appealing rifle?

Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: Nogalus Prairie] #7183738 05/30/18 04:45 PM
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Originally Posted By: Nogalus Prairie
My hunting rifles are tools. I want the best tools I can get. I have carried my Sakos all over North America from Mexico to the Yukon and all in between.

Don’t be fooled by their looks - that’s just a bonus. From a reliability standpoint, they will handle anything a Tikka can (and more) without issue, I can assure you. And feel a helluva lot better in your hands resting over your pack when it comes time to make the shot of a lifetime.

YMMV. But I don’t see how one could objectively say a Tikka is better than a Sako. They are simply the same factory’s attempt to make a more affordable (read:lesser quality) alternative to their better rifles, pure and simple.


For the record, I didn't say Tikkas were better than Sako's. As far as performance goes though.....shootability, function, accuracy, toughness, etc, they are every bit as good though, IMO. My rifles are tools too, nothing more.

Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: Nogalus Prairie] #7183753 05/30/18 04:57 PM
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Originally Posted By: Nogalus Prairie
My hunting rifles are tools. I want the best tools I can get. I have carried my Sakos all over North America from Mexico to the Yukon and all in between.

Don’t be fooled by their looks - that’s just a bonus. From a reliability standpoint, they will handle anything a Tikka can (and more) without issue, I can assure you. And feel a helluva lot better in your hands resting over your pack when it comes time to make the shot of a lifetime.

YMMV. But I don’t see how one could objectively say a Tikka is better than a Sako. They are simply the same factory’s attempt to make a more affordable (read:lesser quality) alternative to their better rifles, pure and simple.


I guess I wasn’t clear for sure. I meant the Tikka is as functional and accurate and a “tool” I don’t mind abusing. The sako will for sure take the abuse. And there are a few who will use them as such. But few. Again, I said elite. For me I won’t beat up a sako to get the same performance I can from a Tikka. The day a Tikka fails mei will reconsider.

And there are those out there, I’ve saw men drag $5,000 shotguns over barbed wire in a quail hunt. Most wont.

Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7183766 05/30/18 05:07 PM
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I have drug mine anywhere and everywhere. I consider the dings and marks on my 40 year old AV memories of great hunts. As for the Finnlights, they are synthetic rifles designed for backcountry hunts anyway. And the stocks on mine “fit” me like a glove.

As I said above, they have taken the place of more expensive hunting rifles - both factory and “semi-custom”. Money is not the issue (one way or the other/more expensive or less expensive) to me. Having a hunting tool I like the best is.


Originally Posted by Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7183772 05/30/18 05:11 PM
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I feel you’re view the world from and elite perspective and while I have a decent job that I’m not ashamed of I’m not at such a point to trash a beautiful gun. Although I congratulate you on your arrival.

Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7183776 05/30/18 05:13 PM
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And yes I cringe, I sold a rifle I had $4,000 in and tried to buy it back. He said he can’t sell it it’s his sons deer rifle. That blows me away.

Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: wp75169] #7183777 05/30/18 05:15 PM
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Originally Posted By: wp75169
I feel you’re view the world from and elite perspective and while I have a decent job that I’m not ashamed of but I’m not at such a point to trash a beautiful gun. Although I congratulate you on your arrival.


You’re way off base. No way you could get that from what I wrote. But, whatever.

Sakos are hunting rifles. They are built and designed to hunt with. So not sure who the “elitists” are - the ones who use hunting rifles to hunt with or the ones who would put them in a safe to pull out and look at. Nobody’s talked about “trashing” anything.

Something to think about....



Originally Posted by Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7183816 05/30/18 05:44 PM
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Maybe you should start a poll on who is willing to drag a beautiful rig through the muck. Heck I could be wrong.

And I guess trashing was the wrong word for sure.

Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7183822 05/30/18 05:48 PM
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Have owned Sakos and other fine looking and feeling guns, still have some. My best looking guns still get hunted with, after teh first couple scratches they become character marks with in some cases good mempries of tough hunts or there are a couple that are reminders I am not as agile as I one was. Still memories made and something to recall them by


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Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7185026 05/31/18 08:26 PM
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I love my Sako FinnBear Delux 30.06. there was a seasoned hunter in our deercamp when I was a very young kid and he had one in 25.06 and it was grand. I knew that I wanted a Sako and saved for years and finally bought one while working in college. It is a tool and it has a nice crease mark on it from a hunt about 30 years ago. It's a memory I tell people, and thus I will not have stock repaired or changed. I also have a new Tikka but still deer hunt with the Sako each year. It is by far my prettiest gun in the safe and gets used the most out of my bolt guns.

Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7185358 06/01/18 03:04 AM
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There is nothing rational about building custom guns, so take this for what it's worth. I scratch my head when people buy a Tikka for the action and throw the barrel in the trash to start over. I thought the barrel was the best part of the Tikka. That's the part I would keep.

If I were going to strip a rifle for the action, I would start with a Ruger, but I'm probably the only one.

Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: gusick] #7185472 06/01/18 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted By: gusick
There is nothing rational about building custom guns, so take this for what it's worth. I scratch my head when people buy a Tikka for the action and throw the barrel in the trash to start over. I thought the barrel was the best part of the Tikka. That's the part I would keep.

If I were going to strip a rifle for the action, I would start with a Ruger, but I'm probably the only one.


The reason for that is a certain contour, caliber and twist combination that Tikka flat out does not produce. And swapping a stock and bottom metal is an improvement over what Tikka offers.

If you got behind my 7mm-08 "rental rifle" you would understand. The only thing Tikka about it is action and trigger. Male, female, young and old all love shooting it.


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Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7185879 06/01/18 07:28 PM
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I just wish someone would buy the pre-Garcia L61R Finnbear 7mm Mag at the Allen Cabelas so I can quite getting tempted by it every time I go in. I don't "need" it but I do love those pre-Garcia Sako's. I'm really surprised they've had it as long as they have. I think the younger generations don't really know what it is. Granted they don't have a low price on it ($900) but it is worth that in excellent condition with leather sling and scope mount/rings. Some of the kid's these days probably see the plum color on the receiver and think it's reblued, flawed or something but older Sako's do that and it's beautiful.

Earl


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Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7200168 06/17/18 04:58 PM
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When I hear everyone say “Pre-Garcia,” are they referring to the changes made in beefier stocks/barrel contours in ‘69 or are they referring to the “lower grade models’ lesser quality finishing” after Garcia took over as the importer in ‘71?

I’m embarrassed to say I never took the time to look up what “Pre-Garcia” ever meant. Now, having done so, I wonder what everyone else’s reasoning behind using that particular label on their guns may be. From what I’ve read, Sako’s More desirable models don’t seem to have been affected. Am I wrong with this thinking?


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Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7200437 06/17/18 10:23 PM
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Short Story a lil long ....since you asked...

Firearms International ( FI Intl ) was the 1st US Importer, Washington DC of SAKO's after WW II when SAKO production was resumed after the Finnish/Russo War ended in August 1948. All of those rifles were stamped "Bofors Steel" on the barrels too + the FI Wash DC Importers label& the FI Wash DC as the importer. FYI Google that "Bofors" term to see what it means. In WW II the US Navy AA cannons (commonly referred to as "Pom Pom guns) used barrels made from Swedish Steel made from iron ore from the Bofors region of Sweden, as it has a higher heat tolerance in the finished steel products at that time...and lasts considerably longer. That labeling was later discontinued after the Bofors Name was pattened and Sweden wanted a royalty payment for use the Bofors name.

Needless to say SAKO responded with a major expansion to fulfull the Garcia Corp orders to the point they were forced to ship products that were not completely dry or poorly assemeled among other shorcuts, and the excellent decades old from the the turn of the Century reputation for workmnaship of SAKO was trashed ...hence the caveat of only buying "Pre Garcia " rifles was folk lore in the US for years and years years until Nokia took over the SAKO plant and installed rigid manufacturing controls.

Garcia Corp, Wash DC (the importer of fishing reels and other sporting goods items from Sweden and France) had promised SAKO that they could out sell FI Int'l substantially...and almost broke SAKO as a manufacterer until Nokia stepped in. I repped Stoeger Industries (and SAKO), the importer after Garcia Corp was fired in the mid-late '70's for only about 4 years, SAKO from '82 to '88 and was still finding Garcia labled rifles that needed to be returned and exchanged for current product.
Ron


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Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7202714 06/20/18 02:16 AM
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To add to what Wiley stated, there are many, many Pre-Garcia Sakos (made before the Garcia acquisition) that were not imported by FI Intl and have no import marks whatsoever. Both of my Finnbears have the original paperwork from 1969 from the Kaiserslautern Germany Rod and Gun Club where my Uncle purchased them for a whopping $100 with scope, sling and ammo each. Rifles purchased at the Rod and Gun Clubs and brought back by servicemen did not have any import markings - same gun as the FI Intl imports, just no import markings.

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Last edited by Earl; 06/20/18 02:22 AM.

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Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7202776 06/20/18 04:10 AM
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Earl, the guy Steve Glick I referred to as being on my plant tour in '84 was Colonel Steve Glick, Commander of the Army Field Sports program in Germany, and how he got to become the CEO of Stoeger Industries, with an early retirement.
Any of the SAKO's that were bouhgt in "local" markets in the various europen and British Empire countrie also would not have had a US Importer's mark, except for Canada. Stoeger had the import right for Canada, but can't say about any of the earlier Canadian importd guns.
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Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7202979 06/20/18 02:06 PM
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My Sako, bought in about 1980 or slightly later, has a Stoeger marking on the underside of the barrel.


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Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7203047 06/20/18 03:07 PM
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As my ever declining memory serves...ownership of "Stoeger" from the original family operated retail store on 5th Ave in Manhatten, down the street from Eddie Bauer, was resolved with the joint venture of Nokia and Llama in ummm 1975 +/- a year or so. Subsequently Stoeger was moved across the river to Bergen County, and located at 55 Ruta Ct, S Hackensack NJ. All of the imported firearms from Franchi to SAKO were roll marked with the Stoeger name after that with that address until Beretta bought out the SAKO portion after the break up of the joint venture. Stoeger had moved to Wayne NJ to upgrade and expand the warehouse I'm guessing about 1990'ish after the Sodini Family who had enginerred the joint venture was ousted, where the intial Beretta marked guns were shipped from, until the consolidation to the Beretta HQ's in Accokeek MD. Just a good way to guess at the age of Tikka T3's by the rollmark location.
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Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: WileyCoyote] #7203082 06/20/18 03:47 PM
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Maybe this will help some. I've had it marked for a long time.


https://hirvikota.wordpress.com/tikka-kivaareiden-valmistusvuodet-ja-sarjanumerot/

Re: Tikka/Sako what’s the diff? [Re: 603Country] #7205009 06/22/18 03:32 PM
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I was in your shoes and ended up with a Tikka. My thoughts were this
If I were to have only one it’d be a Sako
It’s really comes down to looks cause but guns function above normal.
The Tikki T3 is so hard to beat for what you pay for them.
For me it’s more about function then looks but honestly both rifles are above average in look and feel

After owning a few I think every hunting family should have a Tikka T3 lite in 243 to pass down. What an incredible rifle for deer hunting.

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