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#7028917 - 01/07/18 08:17 PM So, I was watching this video...
Bbear Offline
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Registered: 11/24/13
Posts: 878
Loc: West Texas
And Scott Satterlee was explaining his process for finding a load for his rifle in only 10 shots. Seems it's a variation of the OCW.

http://www.65guys.com/10-round-load-development-ladder-test/

I have a known load for my 308 so I loaded up 10 rounds per his instructions and shot them. Mixed in there was my load. Sure enough, my load was right in the middle of what he was talking about.

Now to try it with an unknown one and see how it goes.

Thoughts? Comments?
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#7028954 - 01/07/18 08:44 PM Re: So, I was watching this video... [Re: Bbear]
Sneaky Offline
The "Grouch"

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 18779
Loc: Winters
This is something I’ve always suspected, from what I’ve read and seen. I just never had the experience and confidence to put it together and try it. It makes sense to me.

When I get my STW all lined out, I’m going to try it, now that I have step by step approach to take. Thanks for posting that.
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#7028989 - 01/07/18 09:02 PM Re: So, I was watching this video... [Re: Bbear]
FiremanJG Online   content
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Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 24498
Loc: Wolfe City, TX
Every time I've shot a ladder test, it has given me solid data. But I don't look at velocities, I look at where they print, on paper.
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#7028992 - 01/07/18 09:05 PM Re: So, I was watching this video... [Re: FiremanJG]
Cleric Offline
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Registered: 03/11/12
Posts: 3207
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
Every time I've shot a ladder test, it has given me solid data. But I don't look at velocities, I look at where they print, on paper.


Wouldn’t the height difference be driven by the velocity difference? Or is something else effecting the bullet

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#7028997 - 01/07/18 09:07 PM Re: So, I was watching this video... [Re: Bbear]
joshf303 Offline
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Registered: 12/13/08
Posts: 821
Loc: Texas
Pretty much the method I've used for 5-6 years after switching from the OCW or Audette ladder routine. Only difference from Scott's is I'll run 1/2gr increments instead of 2/10s to find my initial nodes and pressure. More times than not there is a pretty good node to operate in 1-1.5grs under max pressure. I'll split that 1/2gr increment and run 5 over the chrono to see where my ES/SD is. If I like the numbers, I'll load up 15-20 and run out to distance to make sure it's gonna hang.

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#7029007 - 01/07/18 09:13 PM Re: So, I was watching this video... [Re: Cleric]
FiremanJG Online   content
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Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 24498
Loc: Wolfe City, TX
Originally Posted By: Cleric
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
Every time I've shot a ladder test, it has given me solid data. But I don't look at velocities, I look at where they print, on paper.


Wouldn’t the height difference be driven by the velocity difference? Or is something else effecting the bullet


Higher POI is correlated to velocity, so you are correct.

Reason I don't worry about the chronograph is that I don't have one I trust 100%. But I do have 800 yards. I can work the corrections backwards and find velocity. That is, after I decide upon, and reproduce a specific powder charge.
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#7029011 - 01/07/18 09:13 PM Re: So, I was watching this video... [Re: Bbear]
Eyesofahunter Offline
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Registered: 01/11/15
Posts: 629
Loc: Hill Country of Texas
Look for flat spot either in velocity or on paper, both work.

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#7029027 - 01/07/18 09:27 PM Re: So, I was watching this video... [Re: joshf303]
Sneaky Offline
The "Grouch"

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 18779
Loc: Winters
Originally Posted By: joshf303
Pretty much the method I've used for 5-6 years after switching from the OCW or Audette ladder routine. Only difference from Scott's is I'll run 1/2gr increments instead of 2/10s to find my initial nodes and pressure. More times than not there is a pretty good node to operate in 1-1.5grs under max pressure. I'll split that 1/2gr increment and run 5 over the chrono to see where my ES/SD is. If I like the numbers, I'll load up 15-20 and run out to distance to make sure it's gonna hang.



I checked my notes from my initial velocity readings, at .5 grain increments, to find max pressure. I found a flat spot at a velocity I like, and I’m starting there, with .2 grain increments above, below, and through that charge range.
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#7029044 - 01/07/18 09:37 PM Re: So, I was watching this video... [Re: FiremanJG]
Cleric Offline
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Registered: 03/11/12
Posts: 3207
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
Originally Posted By: Cleric
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
Every time I've shot a ladder test, it has given me solid data. But I don't look at velocities, I look at where they print, on paper.


Wouldn’t the height difference be driven by the velocity difference? Or is something else effecting the bullet


Higher POI is correlated to velocity, so you are correct.

Reason I don't worry about the chronograph is that I don't have one I trust 100%. But I do have 800 yards. I can work the corrections backwards and find velocity. That is, after I decide upon, and reproduce a specific powder charge.


Yeah makes sense you have 800 yard range


But if you have a good chrono like Labradar and 100-200 yard may be worth a try

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#7029058 - 01/07/18 09:50 PM Re: So, I was watching this video... [Re: Bbear]
FiremanJG Online   content
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Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 24498
Loc: Wolfe City, TX
I'm not saying otherwise. Just haven't really wanted to spend on a LabRadar enough to do it. That land payment would have bought lots of chronographs by now. sick
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#7029070 - 01/07/18 10:06 PM Re: So, I was watching this video... [Re: FiremanJG]
Cleric Offline
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Registered: 03/11/12
Posts: 3207
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
I'm not saying otherwise. Just haven't really wanted to spend on a LabRadar enough to do it. That land payment would have bought lots of chronographs by now. sick


It’s not just the payment...all the other stuff add up as well...

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#7029109 - 01/07/18 10:48 PM Re: So, I was watching this video... [Re: FiremanJG]
Eyesofahunter Offline
Tracker

Registered: 01/11/15
Posts: 629
Loc: Hill Country of Texas
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
Originally Posted By: Cleric
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
Every time I've shot a ladder test, it has given me solid data. But I don't look at velocities, I look at where they print, on paper.


Wouldn’t the height difference be driven by the velocity difference? Or is something else effecting the bullet


Higher POI is correlated to velocity, so you are correct.

.


Higher MV does not result in higher POI all the time.

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#7029123 - 01/07/18 11:14 PM Re: So, I was watching this video... [Re: Eyesofahunter]
TackDriver Offline
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Registered: 05/02/14
Posts: 840
Originally Posted By: Eyesofahunter
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
Originally Posted By: Cleric
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
Every time I've shot a ladder test, it has given me solid data. But I don't look at velocities, I look at where they print, on paper.


Wouldn’t the height difference be driven by the velocity difference? Or is something else effecting the bullet


Higher POI is correlated to velocity, so you are correct.

.


Higher MV does not result in higher POI all the time.


That is true, I have seen higher charges take a little dip on the paper.

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#7029174 - 01/08/18 06:10 AM Re: So, I was watching this video... [Re: Bbear]
FiremanJG Online   content
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Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 24498
Loc: Wolfe City, TX
True. As a general rule, faster equals higher. But that is not 100% of the shots.
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#7029584 - 01/08/18 10:51 AM Re: So, I was watching this video... [Re: Bbear]
Bbear Offline
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Registered: 11/24/13
Posts: 878
Loc: West Texas
Fireman, that's sort of why this idea intrigued me. I thought I would 'test' it using a known accurate load and my magnetospeed. I only had a 100 yard range to work with yesterday but,I did look at the group when done. The group was 10 rounds with a 1" vertical and about 3" horizontal. 30 mph winds might have had some effect on the horizontal though not much.
It was interesting to watch the velocity creep up using .3 gr difference in loads. The 'flat' spot was rather obvious. With my proven load right in the middle of the flat spot.
I did load 2 of each load, just in case the MS missed a shot. I'll probably do this again for a 30-06 I've had sitting in the safe and see what I see.
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Pay it forward - Kids are the future.

Rifles are similar to boats and young women...there's no end to how much money you can pour into them without making them any more useful.

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