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#6958473 - 11/13/17 12:34 PM Get new Rings or Start Shimming?
AdanV Offline
Outdoorsman

Registered: 07/27/12
Posts: 94
Loc: Katy, TX
Hey yall,

I'm having trouble zeroing a friend's bolt action rifle.
He recently got a scope for it. The old scope had a scratch on the lenses.

I have a laser bore sight and have the windage correct.
However, the elevation is incorrect and we couldn't correct it.

At 50 yards with the elevation maxed out, the reticle has to be almost 2 feet above the bullseye for the round to hit near the bullseye.

I've read that this is result of the back end of the scope being too low and needs to be raised.
Either by shimming or getting new rings.

Is it better to shim or to get new rings?

What can he use as shims?
I saw some youtube video of a guy using cut coke cans as shims.
_________________________
God Bless Texas
texas

Arsenal:
Springfield XD - .45
Remington 1917 - 30-06
Stoeger P350 - 12 Gauge

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#6958478 - 11/13/17 12:36 PM Re: Get new Rings or Start Shimming? [Re: AdanV]
Sneaky Offline
The "Grouch"

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 17304
Loc: Winters
Are you sure that youíre turning the turret in the correct direction?
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#6958492 - 11/13/17 12:42 PM Re: Get new Rings or Start Shimming? [Re: AdanV]
patriot07 Offline
Pro Tracker

Registered: 11/06/11
Posts: 1802
Loc: Royse City, TX
I agree with Sneaky that you may be turning it in the wrong direction. If that's the case, believe me that you aren't the first person to ever have this happen. Had a guy with a $1500 rifle and $1000 scope in the bay next to me who couldn't figure it out. Had a nice .25" group going with my 223, and he dumped a 308 round about 1.5" above my group on my target, 3' away from his bullseye. I look over and sure enough there are a couple bullet holes about 16"-18" to the side of his, so I just assumed he dialed it the wrong direction.

If you really do have an issue with your scope being 2' away at 50 yards, I'd look at the rings and base to figure out what's going on. New rings are a likely fix, but don't rule out anything that might be going on with the base either.

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#6958567 - 11/13/17 01:35 PM Re: Get new Rings or Start Shimming? [Re: AdanV]
Sneaky Offline
The "Grouch"

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 17304
Loc: Winters
Also, is he using a canted rail?
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#6958570 - 11/13/17 01:37 PM Re: Get new Rings or Start Shimming? [Re: AdanV]
AdanV Offline
Outdoorsman

Registered: 07/27/12
Posts: 94
Loc: Katy, TX
I too thought I was turning the wrong way.

While looking down the scope and laser boresight on, I would see the reticle move as I adjusted the turrets.
Windage was piece of cake and perfect. Only took a few seconds to correct it.

Elevation was way too low even when turned high all the way.
_________________________
God Bless Texas
texas

Arsenal:
Springfield XD - .45
Remington 1917 - 30-06
Stoeger P350 - 12 Gauge

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#6958583 - 11/13/17 01:44 PM Re: Get new Rings or Start Shimming? [Re: Sneaky]
AdanV Offline
Outdoorsman

Registered: 07/27/12
Posts: 94
Loc: Katy, TX
Originally Posted By: Sneaky
Also, is he using a canted rail?


It was a 2-Piece rail, very similar to the following:
https://www.academy.com/shop/pdp/leupold-rifleman-remington-700-2-piece-base#repChildCatid=31927
_________________________
God Bless Texas
texas

Arsenal:
Springfield XD - .45
Remington 1917 - 30-06
Stoeger P350 - 12 Gauge

Top
#6958597 - 11/13/17 02:00 PM Re: Get new Rings or Start Shimming? [Re: AdanV]
ChadTRG42 Offline
THF Celebrity

Registered: 09/16/09
Posts: 11492
Loc: Lewisville, TX
When looking through the bore and bore sighting, up is down and down is up. So, try dialing the other direction. You should be able to get on target. I don't use a laser bore sighter. Just pull the bolt, and with the rifle supported well (bipod, front sand bags, rear bags, etc), adjust the scope til the cross hairs line up to near center of the item/object you are looking at through the bore. I can bore sight a rifle in 1-2 rounds doing this method.
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#6958641 - 11/13/17 02:30 PM Re: Get new Rings or Start Shimming? [Re: ChadTRG42]
AdanV Offline
Outdoorsman

Registered: 07/27/12
Posts: 94
Loc: Katy, TX
Originally Posted By: ChadTRG42
When looking through the bore and bore sighting, up is down and down is up. So, try dialing the other direction. You should be able to get on target. I don't use a laser bore sighter. Just pull the bolt, and with the rifle supported well (bipod, front sand bags, rear bags, etc), adjust the scope til the cross hairs line up to near center of the item/object you are looking at through the bore. I can bore sight a rifle in 1-2 rounds doing this method.


Yup.
Did it both directions just to make sure.

Going up was correcting, just not enough as I maxed out.
Going down was making it worse.
_________________________
God Bless Texas
texas

Arsenal:
Springfield XD - .45
Remington 1917 - 30-06
Stoeger P350 - 12 Gauge

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#6958685 - 11/13/17 03:12 PM Re: Get new Rings or Start Shimming? [Re: AdanV]
Sneaky Offline
The "Grouch"

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 17304
Loc: Winters
Is there any way to swap the mounts? In the picture, they donít look like they can be swapped, but you said it was similar, and one looks higher than the other.
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#6958691 - 11/13/17 03:17 PM Re: Get new Rings or Start Shimming? [Re: AdanV]
FiremanJG Online   content
THF Celebrity

Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 21792
Loc: Wolfe City, TX
Is it a cheap scope? Running out of travel zeroing, is not a common thing.

Two options I see here.

1. Swap scopes.
2. Burris Signature Zee rings. They use a polymer shim between the ring and the scope. The rings come with a "0" MOA offset. You can order a kit that comes with 5, 10, and 20 MOA offset, if memory serves.

Be sure to clean all the packing oil off the rings, and torque to spec. I've seen scopes on heavy recoiling rifles slip inside those rings.
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#6958779 - 11/13/17 04:19 PM Re: Get new Rings or Start Shimming? [Re: FiremanJG]
AdanV Offline
Outdoorsman

Registered: 07/27/12
Posts: 94
Loc: Katy, TX
Sneaky,
It's the same mount and rings.

Fireman,
It's a Redfield.


I just talked to him.
We're going to shim it to see if that corrects it.

If it works, I'll relay the info to him about getting those Burris rings.
_________________________
God Bless Texas
texas

Arsenal:
Springfield XD - .45
Remington 1917 - 30-06
Stoeger P350 - 12 Gauge

Top
#6959117 - 11/13/17 07:43 PM Re: Get new Rings or Start Shimming? [Re: AdanV]
cxjcherokec Offline
Veteran Tracker

Registered: 09/22/09
Posts: 2383
Loc: Azle, TX
The problem with shimming is undue stress being applied to the tube body which can effect tracking and damage a thin walled tube. I would never recommend shimming. I say this light heartedly as not offend anyone since it seems , but I have seen this 3xs. the scope is mounted incorrectly, with the windage knob a 12 oclock and the elevation knob at 9oclock.

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#6959288 - 11/13/17 09:27 PM Re: Get new Rings or Start Shimming? [Re: cxjcherokec]
FiremanJG Online   content
THF Celebrity

Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 21792
Loc: Wolfe City, TX
^^Son of a gun, I forgot about that scenario!!!

O.P. from behind the rifle, you should have a knob at 12 o'clock, and one at 3 o'clock.
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#6959314 - 11/13/17 09:49 PM Re: Get new Rings or Start Shimming? [Re: AdanV]
Sneaky Offline
The "Grouch"

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 17304
Loc: Winters
I should have thought of that, too. Iíve done it before.
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#6959333 - 11/13/17 09:55 PM Re: Get new Rings or Start Shimming? [Re: AdanV]
patriot07 Offline
Pro Tracker

Registered: 11/06/11
Posts: 1802
Loc: Royse City, TX
Agreed, definitely double check that the scope isn't mounted 90 degrees off.

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