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Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
#6832122
07/24/17 04:33 AM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 8,841
DocHorton
OP
THF Trophy Hunter
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OP
THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 8,841 |
I currently have an Ag exemption on my place, but doubt I will have any Ag production going forward. What advantages are there to converting to Wildlife exemption? Any special rules or regulations I should be concerned with? Is it possible to convert from Wildlife back to Ag exemption in the future?
Input and experiences appreciated.
Thanks
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6832174
07/24/17 11:25 AM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 8,334
Dave Davidson
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
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Posts: 8,334 |
Doc, I went from Ag to Wildlife when it became available and glad I did. No fences to keep up and don't have to mess with cows/bull and their antics with my feeders and fences. Trees falling on the fence are no longer a problem for me. If a deer gets out, I don't have to worry about it. I have to submit results and plans every year but that's not much problem. I'm in Montague County and it is my understanding that not all counties administer it in the same way. I am told that you cannot convert to Wildlife from farming/crops, only livestock. Be sure and keep your game cam cards for your annual report. And, not all rural county tax people like the idea of having reduced taxes. I would check with neighbors who don't have cattle to see what they do and how it works.
Without a sense of urgency, nothing ever happens.
Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley, Rancher Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6832177
07/24/17 11:33 AM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 5,225
Rustler
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 5,225 |
Tax rate is the same from wildlife to 1-D or 1-D-1 ( ag / open spaces) Every county can set different guidelines, best to check with your CAD. ---> TX comptroller
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6832254
07/24/17 12:55 PM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 60
moosehntr
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 60 |
You can convert from wildlife back to ag. As stated above every county is a little different, some are adamant about checking on everything and some could care less. Call you local CAD and they will provide you with information in regards to how they manage these accounts. Here is a link to simple FAQ's on the subject. http://tpwd.texas.gov/faq/huntwild/tax_valuation.phtml
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6832282
07/24/17 01:21 PM
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Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 6,034
tlk
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 6,034 |
most counties do not come check you once you get Wildlife - as long as you do your annual report and have at least 3 wildlife activities. I am ag now but will convert over next year. Just a lot less hassle to be wildlife. There a folks you can hire out there to help with your initial application to the county and make sure you are doing everything right. Well worth it
You can't fix stupid
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6832305
07/24/17 01:51 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
Nogalus Prairie
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
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Posts: 27,091 |
I find ag to be easier (timber and hay) on my east TX place. I don't like the thought of having to fill out reports to "The Man" about what I do on my own place/giving them nitpicky "say so". Same reason I don't do MLD. YMMV.
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6832361
07/24/17 02:34 PM
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 8,166
westtexaswatkins
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 8,166 |
I have the wildlife exemption on my place. Pretty easy and like mentioned I have to send in a report once a year and supposedly they will inspect every 3 years. My plan went into effect very smooth. The things they recommended were things I was going to do anyways.
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6832378
07/24/17 03:03 PM
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 8,719
cameron00
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 8,719 |
I've done both. Ag exemption was pretty easy on my last place, but it was a highly productive hay field and I just took pictures every harvest and sent them in. They actually drove out there a couple of times and checked, but the rancher who cut for me also wrote them a letter.
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6832382
07/24/17 03:13 PM
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Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 2,451
Dalroo
Veteran Tracker
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Veteran Tracker
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 2,451 |
I converted from Ag to Wildlife valuation a couple of years ago. Initially I hired a guy to do original plan and paperwork. He was helpful, but in hindsight I could of done most on my own.
In Brown County the staff has been very helpful answering questions and making it a fairly straight forward process. They do state that if doing Wildlife they will inspect annually, but go on to state that not realistic for them to visit every property regularly so rely heavily on the annual reports. From a paperwork perspective it is more work doing the report, keeping diaries, providing photos and receipts, etc. From a labor standpoint though, it is much easier than having AG activities - cows or production.
Each county has specific rules on submittals, so make sure you follow guidelines and should be no problems. For instance, in my county you must have 100+ acres, or be part of an association to manage for deer. If you are going to make predator control an activity you need to demonstrate that there is a problem. Just check their website and probably listed in an FAQ section.
Dalroo Deep in the Heart of Texas How about that Brandon!
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6832539
07/24/17 05:58 PM
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,729
Exbellicus
Pro Tracker
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Pro Tracker
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,729 |
Do you have much pasture? If so you can keep it in hay. Have a neighbor come bail it and you're good to go. No worrying about livestock or fences.
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6832543
07/24/17 06:04 PM
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 12,864
PMK
THF Celebrity
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Posts: 12,864 |
I converted our little place over to Wildlife Improvement Management 5-6 years ago while my mother was still alive. We did so mainly due to the feral hogs infested our place at the beginning of the drought since we have artisan springs and pretty much demolished our fences to the point I was chasing cows and/or fixing fences almost every week, so decided to convert. When my mom passed, that's when I realized her tax exemption number was not transferable to me, and when I applied, I no longer qualified since the place was wildlife instead of Ag. The following year I had to convert my farm tag trailers (4x) over to normal license plates jumping from $5/year to $70-120/year each.
I was told trying to covert back to Ag from Wildlife required the same 5 or 7 year probation time as not having any exemption taking to Ag.
"everyone that lives dies but not everyone who dies lived..."
~PMK~
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6832591
07/24/17 06:47 PM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 60
moosehntr
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 60 |
There should not be a probation period to convert from wildlife back to livestock. Both of these are practices under "Ag". The landowner simply needs to notify the appraiser of the desire to move from one ag practice to the other. This is a well written document on the subject of wildlife valuation. http://www.hillcountryalliance.org/wp-co...m_extension.pdf
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6832601
07/24/17 07:06 PM
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Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 2,451
Dalroo
Veteran Tracker
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Veteran Tracker
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 2,451 |
^^^Agree^^^
I do not believe there is a delay to switch from one to the other, either way. The only "probation" from my understanding is that if the land has to meet 1-d-1 Openspace valuation for 5 of 7 years. So if it hasn't and the valuation is denied by the Assessor then you would have to undertake the exempt activity for a minimum of 5 years while paying non-1-d-1 taxes, and then re-apply.
Just my opinion, but if land has existing 1-d-1 valuation it usually stays that way and no problems really arise unless it changes ownership. At that time the buyer becomes responsible for proving the Openspace activities have occurred for 5 of 7, and new plans must be submitted. For purchasers, you only have leverage from previous owner before close, so my lesson was to demand an affadavit and support docs stating how the land has met requirements.
Dalroo Deep in the Heart of Texas How about that Brandon!
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6834475
07/26/17 11:17 AM
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Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 17,226
6InARowMakeItGo
THF Celebrity
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I have the wildlife exemption on my place and it's pretty easy to keep up with, there are about 7different things you can do according to them but you only have to do 3 of those every year, and those three things I was already doing anyway so it works out good. Predator control is one of those things and they classify hogs as predators
🍻
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6835186
07/26/17 11:18 PM
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,499
JohnRussell
Pro Tracker
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Posts: 1,499 |
There is generally, depending if it is by county, a 2-yr "resting period" between AG and WLM. Working on getting dinner ready so cannot go too far into it, but a WLM is VERY easy and only costs "money" to set up, if you do not already have a water source.
The secret is to make it low cost and low maintenance. Once you do that, then you can do all the "extra stuff" you want.
Also, start with an intensive "plan" and then all you do is edit it, update it each year.
losing it.. putting it off till the last second, that can cost you a lot and be stressful as heck.
Ask any questions ya like.. going to go cook as I am hungry.. heh
Russ
Hunting is easy..it's getting permission from your wife that is tough.
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6835320
07/27/17 01:31 AM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,909
leswad
Extreme Tracker
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Extreme Tracker
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,909 |
Not paying sales tax is something you will miss.
FJB
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: Exbellicus]
#6836013
07/27/17 09:09 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 8,841
DocHorton
OP
THF Trophy Hunter
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OP
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 8,841 |
Do you have much pasture? If so you can keep it in hay. Have a neighbor come bail it and you're good to go. No worrying about livestock or fences. This is the only way I can keep it in Ag. I have about 60 acres of pasture, but in order to cut hay really needs to be cleaned up, sprayed, and leveled out a bit. I am thinking Wildlife may be the way to go....I'm already feeding, planting food plots, predator control, and have a levee system to retain water for duck season. Thanks for the input.
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6836024
07/27/17 09:17 PM
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 12,864
PMK
THF Celebrity
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Posts: 12,864 |
be sure to get the forms from the county instead of the TPWD ... I discussed with the county TPWD biologist to come up with the original plan, he gave me all the forms which I filled out by hand along with the typed up cover letter summary that I took to the county tax office to file, they said these aren't "our" forms and you need to transpose all the info over to "our" forms ... off to the lobby for an hour of manual transposes from TPWD form to the county form. Most counties you can pull the data off their website though now days.
some of the key points the TPWD biologist told me was to keep it simple and do NOT include habitat improvement for deer (song birds, small animals, bats, turkey, etc.) as that might throw in some additional rules and guidelines by the county that I wouldn't want to mess with ... and a lot of the improvements for the other animals was also in line with what was needed for deer ... just don't list deer on the plan.
"everyone that lives dies but not everyone who dies lived..."
~PMK~
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6836132
07/27/17 10:38 PM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 8,334
Dave Davidson
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 8,334 |
Doc, I was told that you can't go from farming to Wildlife; only from cattle, etc.
Without a sense of urgency, nothing ever happens.
Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley, Rancher Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6836184
07/27/17 11:43 PM
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 19,498
Erathkid
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
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We converted to wildlife a couple years ago. In fact we used "JohnRussells" format. ECAD said it was the finest, most concise plan they had seen.
Life is too short, as is. Don't chance it. Don't text and drive.
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6836536
07/28/17 12:55 PM
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,499
JohnRussell
Pro Tracker
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Pro Tracker
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,499 |
Lies, I tell ya! All lies! lol
My first plan was over 30 pages long and the lady made me redo it.. heh.
Now, I think it is like.. 15-25-ish?
The point of a plan, and I guess coming from owning my own businesses for so long, is to write the plan for YOU, not them. So many people write a plan of what the county wants and they can provide. That is like writing a tax return and just putting in the numbers you think they want to see, eventually, you will get so far down the rabbit hole of not knowing what you are doing or having enough that you will lose it all. I have seen it happen time and time again.
When I started out, I knew nothing and all I heard from EVERYONE.. and I am not kidding, I mean EVERY-freaking-one, was:
1 - Cut cedar 2 - provide protein 3 - Provide water
I was like, "what the hell does that mean?"
So, I called so many people. I called TPWD biologists from all over the state. They started getting in arguments with each other, hell, I had a TPWD manager call me and try to read me the riot act for making a mad post on a forum. Each TPWD person asked to see my plan. I sent it to them. I called and they never got back to me, so I asked him, "Have YOU read it?"..."No, I ha..." "Then shut the hell up".. lol
Let's just say, he is no longer at TPWD.
So... what is the "secret" to a WLM? Easy...
Easy is the secret.... and CHEAP.
Yea, you heard that right, EASY and CHEAP, just like when you were young and lookin.. never mind.. lol
Look, it is hard enough owning land. The last thing you want to do is have to pay out the wazoo to keep a tax credit that is supposed to save you out the wazoo, right?
So, you have to do 3 out of 7 things each year and you have to DOCUMENT them well.
Do 3 out of 7, you are golden. Have a bad year and do 2.5 or do not document, you are in catch-up-mode.
Do you have Whitetails? There is 1.
Do you have Rio Grande Turkey?
Well, Hogs.. do not count them as predator.. count them as HABITAT. Hogs eat the food and chase off the deer and turkeys. They eat turkey eggs that are laid in the tall buffalo grass. They will eat baby deer they find.
So, they are most certainly habitat control, not just predator, but.. if you hunt hogs... you do TWO things, one for WTD, one for Turkey.
See how that works?
You manage both, so hunting counts FOR both.
Now, protein.... you bet.. provide pellets when ya can, document that.. but, a protein tub is like 90 bucks for a 125lb or 200 lb. Deer cannot digest (arguably... since everyone has a different opinion).. 16-18% protein... but providing the minimum is the key. If all you can get or the best deal you can get is on the 20% protein.. grab that puppy. Buy 1 tub per 300 acres. Replace it or add another one every 6 months. They should last 9-ish, but why be too cheap? Buy 3 a year if ya like.
Pellets for 300 acres would run about $400 a month easy and ya have to keep them full. Deer lick. Hogs chomp. Protein tubs target the deer and are cheap. They qualify for the supplemental feed, so use them. THEN, you can add pellets all ya like and not stress over the qualifications.
Okay, you are at 3 now.
You have water of any kind? Add a tote with a float valve and a small trough. Put it in a PEN.. if it is in a pen, the big hogs cannot get to it. HOGS gulp, deer lick.. it lasts longer. Our 275 gal totes only have to be filled every 9-12 months, they last that long. (they are shaded).
4 things, and so far only the protein cost money (not counting the cost of the totes).
August - oct, invite friends out and have them sit on the stands for an hour.. do this a couple times a month and count the deer.
Census.
That with harvest counts and you have 5 things now.
We all hunt our hogs, right?
We all know what we got for harvests each year, right?
A protein tub, some water each year...
NOW.. you are saving money.
Now, we added about 20k gallons worth of rainwater collection tanks, a 12k gph transfer pump, some totes, so initially, we spent some money. We also made/bought hog traps so every single time we went out we could set them and count towards our WLM...
Initial start up can cost if you do it right and well... but, I guarantee the stress of not having to worry or have to argue your case.. SO worth the cost.
If you want a copy of my last year's WLM plan, PM me your email address and I will send it.
Also.. do not forget.. if you DO it.. record it.. does not matter if you put bird houses out and did not do all the monitoring etc.. just threw them in a tree... it ALL helps.. it all goes to show you are going above and beyond. Killed a few coons? ADD it.. shot a coyote... THOUGHT about how you can control them, ADD it. Learn to wordsmith.
"We are developing a plan for addressing the recent coyotes seen on the property." That is 100% Predator control for the year.
Russ
Hunting is easy..it's getting permission from your wife that is tough.
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6837054
07/28/17 09:12 PM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 8,334
Dave Davidson
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 8,334 |
Can't find mine but is about 3 typewritten pages.
Built a stock tank so I'm providing water. Planted some wheat so I have food plots. I supplemental feed rice bran so I have protein. I did state that my protein feeders got stolen so probably wouldn't replace them. Since I have the only land that is hunted in the area I told them that I figured I was feeding a lot of the neighbors deer. Shot 3 coyotes with pictures and 6 pigs with pictures. Printed out a bunch of game cam pics and sent them as a supplement.
Census? I admitted that I can't tell the tracks of one deer from another but I had a heckuva lot more pics of deer than I had tracks and spotlight counting. I did say that I consider both tracks and spotlight pretty ineffective methods of deer density. I also sent a pic of 6 kids that I took and showed them deer and hog tracks. No idea whether that impressed them or not.
Took pics of bird houses that squirrels and coons had gotten to and told them that I will still be doing it but consider it ineffective. Showed my bird and hummingbird feeders.
Took pics of brush piles that I refresh each year when I cut firewood.
Although only 3 typewritten pages, all of the pics add up to about 20 pages.
Mine is maybe overkill but the taxes without WLM would be ruinous. So far I've never had a problem.
Without a sense of urgency, nothing ever happens.
Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley, Rancher Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6837107
07/28/17 09:50 PM
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 65,524
SnakeWrangler
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 65,524 |
Wish I could get a wildlife exemption on my 2.5 acres.......
I believe in science and I’m an insufferable [censored] Actually, BBC is pretty damn good "You Cannot Simultaneously Be Politically Correct And Intellectually Honest!"
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: leswad]
#6837360
07/29/17 01:09 AM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 44,461
rifleman
Sparkly Pants
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Sparkly Pants
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 44,461 |
Not paying sales tax is something you will miss. That's an important one. Ours is easy to deal with, they just check the most recent GE images to verify trees are there and the hay field is clean.
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Re: Ag vs Wildlife Exemption
[Re: DocHorton]
#6837731
07/29/17 02:04 PM
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 19,498
Erathkid
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 19,498 |
We use a 3 ring binder, all receipts, pics of kills, including hogs, coyotes, racoons, brushpiles, feeders, water sources, etc. Anything you do needs documentation. It saves us approximately $7k a year in taxes. We also stress that we are providing quail habitat. Heard a Bobwhite the other day, in fact.
Last edited by Erathkid; 07/29/17 02:08 PM.
Life is too short, as is. Don't chance it. Don't text and drive.
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