texashuntingforum.com logo
Main Menu
Advertisement
Affiliates
Advertisement
Newest Members
TraeMartin, Beatixre, MooseSteed, Trappernewt, casyoo
71987 Registered Users
Top Posters(All Time)
dogcatcher 110,788
bill oxner 91,416
SnakeWrangler 65,416
stxranchman 60,296
Gravytrain 46,950
RKHarm24 44,585
rifleman 44,461
Stub 43,769
Forum Statistics
Forums46
Topics537,021
Posts9,719,484
Members86,987
Most Online25,604
Feb 12th, 2024
Print Thread
Page 3 of 3 1 2 3
Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: txtrophy85] #6757940 05/08/17 10:09 PM
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,075
A
aerangis Offline
Extreme Tracker
Offline
Extreme Tracker
A
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,075
Originally Posted By: txtrophy85
I'm not picking a side, but comparing the killing power of a bow and a firearm are two totally different things.

a 2" broadhead cut thru the heart or lungs is very, very deadly. completely apples and oranges.


Secondly, I've killed my share of deer and pigs with a .22-250 and a .223. but they make bigger calibers for a reason.

if a .22 LR or .22 hornet was all a person needed then they would have stopped production right there.



a man I know real well has killed a pile of deer with his .22 hornet. he has a small acreage tract in the hill country and baits them up to 30-50 yards and heart shoots them, doesent have a problem. they run off a ways and he finds them


now, based on that logic, a .22 hornet is a fine deer gun. but bring him out of that scenario he is going to be severely handicapped compared to larger caliber rounds.


I think that's the point of the story.


These threads always get derailed with people defending the use of small caliber firearms by touting stories of their grandfathers uncles cousin who fed his family for 50 years with a .222 but when it comes down to it, that guy hunted the same property, same scenario year after year and wasn't upset to let a deer get away if he wasn't presented a perfect shot. it worked for him in certain scenarios. it would not work in the majority.


I've seen guys hauling skidloaders with ford rangers but that doesent' make it acceptable nor recommended


Never fails.

We can't keep a discussion on topic without someone being criticized because they have to haul their skidloader with a wimpy Ranger instead of a manly truck like an F350. blah, blah, blah, Skidloader this, skidloader that, my skidloader cost more than your skidloader, my skidloander is bigger than your skidloader. And twice as long. Your GF said my skidloader can fill a hole twice as big as yours. And runs a LOT longer without running out of gas......

It's the same snobby attitude I get from the guys on my team at our sporting clays tournaments. They make a big show of opening their guncases and pulling out their $80k Kreighoffs and showing it off like its a sexy trophy wife. My Stoeger Coach gun shoots justas good as their fancy high dollar shotguns. If those jerks would stop avoiding me at the stands like they don't know me and stop running off the instant their done shooting a stage, they'd see for themselves how good it is. Snobs.

The comment of derailed threads with stories of old timers hunting using outdated methods of limited utility to hunt game, when other options exist, is a bit selfserving since the discussion diverged from the question that the OP asked which was "Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? That was the topic of the OP's question, not "are larger calibers more effective" as you stated. And the main point of comparison betwen old/outdated versus new/better was meant to shed light on the of becoming proficient in the use of the tools you use to hunt with, their strengths and limitations, and the importance of shot placement. There are much better choices than a 22 for hunting deer, but it's an acceptable choice for harvesting deer when used where and when it's most effective

Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: ChadTRG42] #6757977 05/08/17 11:06 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
N
Nogalus Prairie Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
N
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
Originally Posted By: ChadTRG42
Originally Posted By: budward
.300 blackout is a lousy round PERIOD

For close quarter combat in Afghanistan, Im sure its GREAT! But for hunting, its a lousy round, when compared to other cartridges. Doesn't hold a candle to a .243, much less a .270 or .308

.300 blackout - 115 gr UMC 2,295 ft/s (700 m/s) 1,344 ft·lbf (1,822 J)

.308 - 125 gr (8 g) Spitzer 3,100 ft/s (940 m/s) 2,668 ft·lbf (3,617 J)

308 has twice the energy and almost 1,000 more fps with a heavier bullet. My point being, why even screw with it when you can get a .308?


But all the rounds you speak of will not fit in an AR-15. And if a round is great for killing 2 legged critters, why wouldn't it work for the 4 legged one's? I have been hunting with a Rem 700 in 300 blk out for about 3 or 4 years now. I'm pushing a 125 grain bullet at 2300+ in a suppressed 16" barrel. Low recoil, great bullet performance, easy to handle, kills crap great. It has killed as effective as any 270 or other standard cartridge I've shot. Plus, the low recoil makes it VERY easy to shoot, and you don't get the flinch a lot of shooters get when shooting too big of a gun. You don't need a big magnum to kill a deer or pig for Texas hunting.


I have really learned a lot from reading your posts. Then, every once in a while you pop out with posts like that one - as if you are a total tacticool newbie who doesn't know the difference in hunting applications and combat applications. confused2

Lots of conflating battle gear, sniper gear, target punching gear and a bunch of other stuff in attempts to shoehorn every tacticool weapon into a good hunting tool these days. Too much trying to fit square pegs into round holes IMO. I know personally of 3 deer hit and lost using a .300 BO because Dads thought their kids couldn't handle a cannon like a .243. Now it appears adults can't either...


Originally Posted by Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: AP2020] #6758028 05/09/17 12:37 AM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 31,780
T
txtrophy85 Online Content
THF Celebrity
Online Content
THF Celebrity
T
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 31,780
i heard down at the range today that the .300 blkout is the best choice for hunting Bigfoot because it's less likely to pass thru and hit the loch less monster


For it is not the quarry that we truly seek, but the adventure.
Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: AP2020] #6758062 05/09/17 01:18 AM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,185
M
Misfire Offline
Pro Tracker
Offline
Pro Tracker
M
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,185
The 300blk is so underpowered I use mine to change the channel on the TV and flip the light switches on and off without having to leave my lazyboy.


.


"I wanna go fast" -Ricky Bobby

"Mind bottling isn't it?" -Chazz Michael Michaels

.
Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: AP2020] #6758069 05/09/17 01:26 AM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 31,780
T
txtrophy85 Online Content
THF Celebrity
Online Content
THF Celebrity
T
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 31,780
A .300 blk out is what I use when I want to pinch my wife's butt from across the room


For it is not the quarry that we truly seek, but the adventure.
Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: AP2020] #6759619 05/10/17 11:29 AM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 705
A
Age N Score ? Offline
Tracker
Offline
Tracker
A
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 705
popcorn


I Feed Indian Corn. The deer love it and all the colors make them stay at the feeder longer.
Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: Nogalus Prairie] #6760074 05/10/17 06:12 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 18,907
C
ChadTRG42 Online Happy
THF Celebrity
Online Happy
THF Celebrity
C
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 18,907
Originally Posted By: Nogalus Prairie
Originally Posted By: ChadTRG42
Originally Posted By: budward
.300 blackout is a lousy round PERIOD

For close quarter combat in Afghanistan, Im sure its GREAT! But for hunting, its a lousy round, when compared to other cartridges. Doesn't hold a candle to a .243, much less a .270 or .308

.300 blackout - 115 gr UMC 2,295 ft/s (700 m/s) 1,344 ft·lbf (1,822 J)

.308 - 125 gr (8 g) Spitzer 3,100 ft/s (940 m/s) 2,668 ft·lbf (3,617 J)

308 has twice the energy and almost 1,000 more fps with a heavier bullet. My point being, why even screw with it when you can get a .308?


But all the rounds you speak of will not fit in an AR-15. And if a round is great for killing 2 legged critters, why wouldn't it work for the 4 legged one's? I have been hunting with a Rem 700 in 300 blk out for about 3 or 4 years now. I'm pushing a 125 grain bullet at 2300+ in a suppressed 16" barrel. Low recoil, great bullet performance, easy to handle, kills crap great. It has killed as effective as any 270 or other standard cartridge I've shot. Plus, the low recoil makes it VERY easy to shoot, and you don't get the flinch a lot of shooters get when shooting too big of a gun. You don't need a big magnum to kill a deer or pig for Texas hunting.


I have really learned a lot from reading your posts. Then, every once in a while you pop out with posts like that one - as if you are a total tacticool newbie who doesn't know the difference in hunting applications and combat applications. confused2

Lots of conflating battle gear, sniper gear, target punching gear and a bunch of other stuff in attempts to shoehorn every tacticool weapon into a good hunting tool these days. Too much trying to fit square pegs into round holes IMO. I know personally of 3 deer hit and lost using a .300 BO because Dads thought their kids couldn't handle a cannon like a .243. Now it appears adults can't either...


I'll go ahead and take your bait. So, by saying the 300 blk out won't work and a "newbie who doesn't know the difference in hunting applications", riddle me this. Let's look at the standard "go to" energy chart of having the 1000 foot lbs of energy to be an effective killing cartridge for Whitetail and pigs. The 300 blk out has 1500+ ft/lbs of energy at the muzzle (see chart below), 1200+ ft/lbs at 100 yards, and doesn't fall below the standard 1000 ft/lbs until about 170 yards (with a 125 grain SST at 2350 fps, chronographed and confirmed in my rifle). And yes, everyone knows you can kill critters with much less ft/lbs. I have seen perfect mushroom shaped bullet expansion with pass throughs on everything I have shot, except for large pigs. For what the blk out is, it is a great cartridge. So, from an energy stand point, how can someone say it's not an effective round?

And for Dad's letting kids use a blk out and losing deer, that's simple shot placement and lack of practice for the child. I've killed everything I have shot at with a 300 blk out, except some pigs about 600 yards away once. And if they are using subsonic ammunition, that's a bad choice to begin with. It's like shooting a 45 ACP 230 grain FMJ round out of a rifle platform. There's no bullet expansion, no hydrostatic shock, and an ice pick wound. I even tell my customers that the subs make a poor choice for effective killing. Can they work, yes. But there needs to be clarification on which round was used (subs or supersonic round) that didn't work. There's a big difference there.

I think a lot of hunters, probably more than 50% in the field, have the idea of needing a much larger cartridge to "plan for" a bad placed shot to have more energy to make up the difference in a poor shot. A bad shot is a bad shot. If a 300 blk out drops a deer in it's tracks with a well placed shot, how is a 300 RUM going to do any better. Dead is still dead. Many hunters have this bigger cartridge mentality. A lot of it boils down to shooter ability and practicing enough to place a round on target where you want it. Some have this ability, some don't. Larger rounds have more recoil, more muzzle blast, and heat up barrels too fast to get a hunting rifle consistent and on target well. It's kind of like the little guy on campus who drives the big, jacked up, 12" lifted 4x4 truck.

For me, the 300 blk out is a perfect cartridge for simple shooting and hunting. I like what the blk out gives me. When the guys in my hunting camp asked me what I was shooting, and I showed them this little round, they smiled. Yes, it's a little round, but a VERY effective round. And when I'm killing the most crap in deer camp, and they see it's destruction, their opinion quickly changes. They begin asking more questions and getting more info on it. To each his own.

Just curious, do you drive a big, lifted truck?


Range Velocity Energy
(yards) (ft/sec) (ft-lbs)
0 2350 1532.7
20 2295.5 1462.5
40 2241.9 1395
60 2188.7 1329.6
80 2136.1 1266.4
100 2084.2 1205.6
120 2033 1147.2
140 1982.6 1091
160 1933 1037
180 1884.2 985.3
200 1836.2 935.8
220 1789.1 888.4
240 1742.9 843.1
260 1697.5 799.8
280 1653.1 758.4
300 1609.6 719


[Linked Image]
Custom and Precision Ammunition!!
https://DallasReloads.com/
Type 01 and Type 06 FFL
Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: AP2020] #6760148 05/10/17 07:32 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
N
Nogalus Prairie Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
N
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
No.

The title of the thread is asking if a .300 BO SUBSONIC is a good 200 yard deer cartridge. The expert on the video's definition of same is simply can he put a bullet on a target at 200 yards - that's good enough for him. Energy? Velocity? Heck, the 200+ grain subsonic rounds are not even designed to expand. It barely moves the steel, for heaven's sake. Psshhhh....who cares? He's good to go, it's a great deer cartridge. The whole thing is laughable.

By your own standards (1000 ft/lbs)- even a .300 BO SUPERSONIC is not a good 200 yard deer cartridge. Thank you.

Effective? I guess that depends on one's definition of effective. Effective for what? At what range? However you slice it, it's a piss ant cartridge compared to even such giants as a .243, 7mm-08, and the mighty cannon that is the .308. Your talk about the "destruction" it wreaks/"killing the most crap" compared to what your buddies are using sounds just like the tacticool guy at the range. What are your buddies using? .410 slugs? Pellet guns? .22 Mags?

I won't discuss calibers higher than above so as to not give some the vapors. smile


Originally Posted by Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: AP2020] #6760186 05/10/17 08:06 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 14,948
D
don k Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
D
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 14,948
Giving some the vapors? That was good NP. I haven't heard that in years. Made my afternoon.

Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: AP2020] #6760237 05/10/17 08:50 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
N
Nogalus Prairie Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
N
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
grin


Originally Posted by Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: AP2020] #6760893 05/11/17 12:20 PM
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 19,638
P
Pitchfork Predator Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
P
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 19,638
Yeah this thread got way off topic trying to defend the 300 blk while the OP was trying to promote using sub sonic that has a slower bullet speed than my Gamo pellet gun.


Marc C. Helfrich
Retirement Planner

www.insured-wealth.com
469-323-8920
Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: AP2020] #6762028 05/12/17 11:38 AM
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 2,265
maximus_flavius Offline
Veteran Tracker
Offline
Veteran Tracker
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 2,265
Again, a ton of difference between a supersonic 115/125 grain premium projectile & a 220 grain subsonic.

The answer to the OP's question is "NO", there is no way a .300BO subsonic is in any way, shape, or form a legitimate 200 yard deer cartridge.

Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: AP2020] #6762069 05/12/17 12:19 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
N
Nogalus Prairie Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
N
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
It's videos like that which spread irresponsibility like a virus. And it's the animals that pay the price. I wonder if he even knows any better?


Originally Posted by Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: AP2020] #6769119 05/19/17 11:52 PM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 4,592
C
chalet Online Content
Extreme Tracker
Online Content
Extreme Tracker
C
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 4,592
Sure it is, why not?


Shoot. Eat. Repeat.
Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: AP2020] #6769256 05/20/17 02:22 AM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 2,273
boonee Offline
Veteran Tracker
Offline
Veteran Tracker
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 2,273
Mine works fine at under 100. Hand loaded 240grain lead bullet, out of a 10" SBR with a Costal can!
Out of my "pig stand" 100 yards is the farthest I can see.
200 yard subs, not me... Supers out of the SBR/can, at 200, YEP!


Avenger Firearms 214-577-5818
avengerfirearms@gmail.com

Lifetime NRA member
Re: Is the 300BLK Subsonic a 200 yard Deer Killer? [Re: AP2020] #6769382 05/20/17 12:06 PM
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,031
V
Vern1 Online Content
Veteran Tracker
Online Content
Veteran Tracker
V
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,031
No.
Move along, nothing to see here.


Cheers,
Vern1
Texans since The Old 300 in 1824
NRA Lifetime Member
Page 3 of 3 1 2 3
Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread

© 2004-2024 OUTDOOR SITES NETWORK all rights reserved USA and Worldwide
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.3