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Shooting a doe with fetus
#6641599
01/20/17 08:06 PM
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Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 224
budward
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Woodsman
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OP
Woodsman
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Anyone ever had this happened? Shot a does this past weekend and found a fetus, that was a first, made me feel kinda bad. I'm all about good herd management but im questioning whether this was a good decision.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641606
01/20/17 08:10 PM
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 28,032
Navasot
Hollywood
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Hollywood
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I bet over %90 of hunters have...
Its just part of it and will not do anything to hurt your population unless your just at the brink of loosing your herd.. in that case you shouldn't be shooting any deer at all.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641607
01/20/17 08:10 PM
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 2,016
SingleShot85
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best decision you could have made.....
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641610
01/20/17 08:16 PM
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 7,289
BenBob
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Shoot them early in the season to avoid the likelihood of this happening if it is bothersome to you.
Tired, Wired, and Uninspired
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641611
01/20/17 08:17 PM
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 28,032
Navasot
Hollywood
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Hollywood
Joined: Sep 2011
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but then you shooting your bait for the bucks too!
actually the chances of them already being serviced by Nov.1st is quite possible here
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: Navasot]
#6641620
01/20/17 08:24 PM
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 7,289
BenBob
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but then you shooting your bait for the bucks too!
actually the chances of them already being serviced by Nov.1st is quite possible here Possible, but a lot less likely, depending on where you are hunting. Just giving him a chance to take some does with less chances of that happening. I figure anytime you are taking out a doe, you are taking 2-3 mouths out for every year that that particular doe is productive whether you see it or not.
Tired, Wired, and Uninspired
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641632
01/20/17 08:33 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 39,533
redchevy
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Hunting in Kendall County most of the does we shot were bread already. We hunt in pretty far south texas now rut is tail end of December so most of the time we don't see any.
Don't look at it, don't touch it and poke it with your finger, don't show your wife get past it and on down the road. Its no different than if you had shot her before she was bread. They are not people they do not have souls. Shot one with one of my buddies that was bread early and he picked it up and started playing with it... that's just wrong.
It's hell eatin em live
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641659
01/20/17 08:45 PM
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 31,897
txtrophy85
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For it is not the quarry that we truly seek, but the adventure.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: redchevy]
#6641671
01/20/17 08:53 PM
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 28,032
Navasot
Hollywood
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Hollywood
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Hunting in Kendall County most of the does we shot were bread already. We hunt in pretty far south texas now rut is tail end of December so most of the time we don't see any.
Don't look at it, don't touch it and poke it with your finger, don't show your wife get past it and on down the road. Its no different than if you had shot her before she was bread. They are not people they do not have souls. Shot one with one of my buddies that was bread early and he picked it up and started playing with it... that's just wrong. Pshhh you wouldn't like hangin around Cajuns.. that's a delicacy.. Pigs are better though.. like little skillets treats..
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641688
01/20/17 09:07 PM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 10,984
Texas buckeye
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Prime example here of different thoughts for different people. My son shot andoe so my daughter could field dress it, she wanted to get her hands bloody and she didn't have the opportunity to shoot one that night due to us being sighted in the tree stand immediately (first time I ever got busted in that stand too). Anyway, doe was pregnant as it was late December/early January. Both my kids found it fascinating and we dissected the amniotic membrane and got the fetus out. I didn't think anything wrong with it, but it was a deer and not a human. Doesn't make us any more the freak animal abuser or anything, just means I have curious kids.
Now to do that to a human fetus or something would be a little wrong (more like a lot wrong) but don't tell that to Kermit grosnel...
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641691
01/20/17 09:09 PM
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 18,934
ChadTRG42
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Almost all late season does will be pregnant.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641702
01/20/17 09:15 PM
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 12,547
chital_shikari
Minor in training
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Minor in training
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My dad shot an impala doe with a new born. We've killed preggo fallow and axis doe but no WT that I know of.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: Texas buckeye]
#6641705
01/20/17 09:16 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 39,533
redchevy
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Prime example here of different thoughts for different people. My son shot andoe so my daughter could field dress it, she wanted to get her hands bloody and she didn't have the opportunity to shoot one that night due to us being sighted in the tree stand immediately (first time I ever got busted in that stand too). Anyway, doe was pregnant as it was late December/early January. Both my kids found it fascinating and we dissected the amniotic membrane and got the fetus out. I didn't think anything wrong with it, but it was a deer and not a human. Doesn't make us any more the freak animal abuser or anything, just means I have curious kids.
Now to do that to a human fetus or something would be a little wrong (more like a lot wrong) but don't tell that to Kermit grosnel... curiosity is one thing hopping it around like a stuffed animal and chopping it with a machete are different to me.
It's hell eatin em live
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641710
01/20/17 09:22 PM
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Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 18,672
Roll-Tide
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641730
01/20/17 09:36 PM
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Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 15,637
QuitShootinYoungBucks
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I killed one on January 17, 2015. She had twins. From what I could tell, she likely would have given birth sometime in March or early April. I can post a pic if you guys can stomach it.
This was the second time it had happened that I noticed. Same thing, late doe hunt probably in 2009-2010.
https://web.archive.org/web/20170223065011/http:/www.rrdvegas.com/silencer-cleaning.html
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641768
01/20/17 10:07 PM
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 1,100
TackDriver
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Shoot the old does. Probability some of those old does can't get impregnated. Shooting impregnated does can't be avoided anyway, it will happen sometime.
Last edited by Big Stan; 01/20/17 10:11 PM.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641796
01/20/17 10:30 PM
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 18,934
ChadTRG42
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I will be shooting most of my does during bow season next year. 1- for practice with my bow. 2- so I can duck hunt more in late season.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6641854
01/20/17 11:05 PM
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 949
MoTex
Tracker
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Tracker
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I haven't shot one in January that didn't have twin fetus.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641856
01/20/17 11:05 PM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 14,949
don k
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Every Axis doe you gut seems to have a fetus.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6641859
01/20/17 11:08 PM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 14,949
don k
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I will be shooting most of my does during bow season next year. 1- for practice with my bow. 2- so I can duck hunt more in late season. I have pm'd you a couple of times asking if you have received my check but have not gotten an answer.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641893
01/20/17 11:28 PM
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,671
Txhunter65
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I agree with a post above, I guess everyone's got there own stance. I understand how someone could feel bad looking at the dead fetus. But at the same time you killed a potential mother. Even if a doe isn't pregnant or just not far enough along to see the fetus hunters typically don't feel bad about killing the doe. If a hunter is upset they've removed a potential fawn from the next years herd you're doing the same thing killing the doe before she's breed.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641895
01/20/17 11:29 PM
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 8,719
cameron00
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Have shot many pregnant does.
The only shot I ever felt bad about was a straight up blast to the jewels of a big boar walking away. Sure, it's a pig and someone had told me if you damage their nuts but they still produce a little testosterone they'll keep other boars from breeding but can't breed themselves, but it just felt wrong. Man code violation.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641902
01/20/17 11:30 PM
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 8,719
cameron00
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6641936
01/20/17 11:54 PM
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 29,602
Sneaky
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You killed a deer. If that doesn't bother you, neither should a second.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: Sneaky]
#6641941
01/20/17 11:59 PM
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 65,514
SnakeWrangler
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You killed a deer. If that doesn't bother you, neither should a second. Yup....simple really....dead deer....next....
I believe in science and I’m an insufferable [censored] Actually, BBC is pretty damn good "You Cannot Simultaneously Be Politically Correct And Intellectually Honest!"
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6642122
01/21/17 02:26 AM
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Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 224
budward
OP
Woodsman
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Woodsman
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Thanks for the responses.
She was old, and mean. I was trying to decide whether to take her or not, when 3 other does showed up she chased them all off, even rearing up and trying to fight one.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6642244
01/21/17 04:19 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,736
passthru
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It's pretty cool how by this time they look fully developed. Little hooves and all.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6643206
01/22/17 03:45 AM
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 259
Trash Fish and Cull Bucks
Bird Dog
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Bird Dog
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Most does killed during the general season have been bred and many miss an opportunity to collect beneficial information from the fetuses. If you measure the length of the fetus, you can backdate to find when the doe bred, usually within a few days of conception. By doing this for several does from a property or area, you can generate a graph of the rut in your specific hunting area.
The recreational value of game is inverse to the artificiality of its origin - Aldo Leopold
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: QuitShootinYoungBucks]
#6643317
01/22/17 11:30 AM
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Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,133
SR025
THF Trophy Hunter
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I killed one on January 17, 2015. She had twins. From what I could tell, she likely would have given birth sometime in March or early April. I can post a pic if you guys can stomach it.
This was the second time it had happened that I noticed. Same thing, late doe hunt probably in 2009-2010.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: TackDriver]
#6644114
01/23/17 12:41 AM
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 11,902
Simple Searcher
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Shoot the old does. Probability some of those old does can't get impregnated. Shooting impregnated does can't be avoided anyway, it will happen sometime. Shoot doe fawns, better eating and not pregnant (very highly unlikely). I have heard of this practice used in deer management before. Any doe that lives past being a fawn gets to make it to an old age. I have shot does in November that were pregnant, we had to look hard but we could find a small fetus. This is way more common than you think, most just don't notice.
"Man is still a hunter, still a simple searcher after meat..." Robert C. Ruark
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6644558
01/23/17 08:04 AM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 810
Bittercreek
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I will respond. To the OP. Manage your Herd. Maintain, decent Balance. Hunt the weather conditions; Late Season-Does? Shooting a Pregnant-Mother. NO. We don't do it. Ethics; with us.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: SR025]
#6644734
01/23/17 02:24 PM
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Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 15,637
QuitShootinYoungBucks
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I killed one on January 17, 2015. She had twins. From what I could tell, she likely would have given birth sometime in March or early April. I can post a pic if you guys can stomach it.
This was the second time it had happened that I noticed. Same thing, late doe hunt probably in 2009-2010. January 17, 2015.
https://web.archive.org/web/20170223065011/http:/www.rrdvegas.com/silencer-cleaning.html
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: QuitShootinYoungBucks]
#6645076
01/23/17 05:38 PM
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,845
Texan Til I Die
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That's about the most developed I've ever seen. I always check the does I shoot. Yep, this year's was carrying twins.
Silver spurs and gold tequila keep me hanging on. Pretty girls and old cantinas give me shelter from the storm.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6645081
01/23/17 05:40 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 39,533
redchevy
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Have seen a few like that, we always take advantage of the late doe season, just part of it.
It's hell eatin em live
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: Texan Til I Die]
#6645213
01/23/17 07:26 PM
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Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 15,637
QuitShootinYoungBucks
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That's about the most developed I've ever seen. I always check the does I shoot. Yep, this year's was carrying twins. I was watching her before the shot, and at one point I thought to myself 'She looks heavy/pregnant'. She had last year's fawns with her at the time, both were above average in size. I couldn't believe how developed the fetuses were. She had to have bred in September or very early October. Second time I've ever killed three with one shot.
https://web.archive.org/web/20170223065011/http:/www.rrdvegas.com/silencer-cleaning.html
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6645959
01/24/17 02:59 AM
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 1,773
Big_Ag
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You should be killing does as part of your herd/population management. Pregnant or not, you are removing that doe so it does not reproduce. You did the right thing.
As for shooting doe fawns, sounds like a good idea, but the risk of mistaking a buck fawn as a doe fawn are too great to take the risk in my opinion. I've seen many a buck fawn mistaken as a doe or doe fawn.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6646097
01/24/17 04:06 AM
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Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 646
themoonrulz
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I get it. You respect life. I'd probably be a little upset as well. But, you didn't know and thus you can't blame yourself. Sometimes hunting isn't pretty.
A real hunter never returns empty handed. Spending time in the wilderness temporarily satifies the soul, but leaves us longing for more.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6646147
01/24/17 04:50 AM
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 862
rattler03
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Tracker
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As far as shooting young does, I've heard that if you are culling bucks in hopes of improving genetics then you should target older does and let the younger ones mature. If through your culling plans, you expect to have better genetics in your younger age classes of bucks versus the older ones, the same will be true with your does. So, killing young does would mean you were targeting the "genetically improved" age classes of the herd.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6648272
01/25/17 05:35 PM
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 126
txlongshot
Woodsman
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Woodsman
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6648422
01/25/17 07:10 PM
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 124
old raider
Woodsman
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Woodsman
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 124 |
Twins too. Very interesting to examine the little guys.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6648437
01/25/17 07:17 PM
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Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 6,061
Wilhunt
THF Trophy Hunter
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Like already mentioned, 90 plus percent of doe killed in January will have the fetus. It is just the way of nature.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6648609
01/25/17 08:54 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,113
Ranch Dog
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I think that I read every post and it surprises me that no one has mentioned the management value of the fetus. If you are not measuring the fetus you are missing out on information very specific to the rut for the location you are hunting. No matter when you think the rut is, the fetus is the only measure of when it actually takes place. The fetus is measured with a ruler and the date of conception determined from the calculation on the ruler. After five to six years of collecting data, my hunters and myself had some very useful data. I also put together a simple form using Google docs that my hunters used to record buck sightings via their phone. The fetus measurements correlated with the buck sighting info makes a heck of a planning tool. Now, more than a dozen years since starting this the information it is still updated. Any annual swing from the norm is a cause for consideration but beyond this discussion. If a doe is taken during a youth hunt, the purpose of recovering the fetus is explained and every young hunter has actively wanted to participate with the measurement and math for determining conception. The fetus shown in the picture in this topic is pretty big but they are measureable pretty quick after conception when they are still little bitty. There is no doubt that this registers with the kids and those who hunt here, just how quick there is a life present in the womb.
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Re: Shooting a doe with fetus
[Re: budward]
#6649681
01/26/17 04:30 PM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 161
tbgascorer
Woodsman
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Woodsman
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 161 |
^ I was about to mention the same thing. I have seen it many times. You either are shooting a doe that will be pregnant or she already is. There is no difference.
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