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#6451027 - 09/13/16 07:42 PM Is it odd? Is it a bad sign?
Ricochet83 Offline
Tracker

Registered: 10/03/13
Posts: 601
Loc: Sugar Land
So I am in Live Oak county and will be starting my 3rd season on my small acreage lease. I love the place as it has a great variety of animals and it is never dull. Question I have is with as many cams as I have running and as much time as I spend there I have never seen in person nor on cam a 10 point. It is high fenced with that being said I am just curious as to whether or not this is normal and if it's not normal is this a bad thing. I'm sure it's all in the eye of the beholder but I just find it odd myself. Opinions????
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#6451029 - 09/13/16 07:43 PM Re: Is it odd? Is it a bad sign? [Re: Ricochet83]
txshntr Offline
T-Rex Arms

Registered: 09/24/10
Posts: 33682
Loc: Mansfield, Texas
3rd season, small acreage, high fenced...

What does your herd look like? Large numbers? Are you seeing many mature deer on camera? Are there cows? Are there exotics? Any agriculture? Feed protein?
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#6451045 - 09/13/16 07:54 PM Re: Is it odd? Is it a bad sign? [Re: Ricochet83]
Ricochet83 Offline
Tracker

Registered: 10/03/13
Posts: 601
Loc: Sugar Land
Herd looks good. No mature deer on cam not seen in person. Numbers are a little high if I had to take a crack at it but not crazy high. Cows yes exotics no winter oats is only ag and yes on protein.
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#6451046 - 09/13/16 07:54 PM Re: Is it odd? Is it a bad sign? [Re: Ricochet83]
stxranchman Offline
Obie Juan Kenobi

Registered: 08/04/10
Posts: 52092
Not unusual since this is the first year HF. Your neighbor has some really big deer that were native genetics. I managed a ranch in the Hill Country that was LF when I started the first year in 1989. They were building the HF that fall when I started. I did not see on single 10 point that year LF and maybe one 9 pt but could not confirm it. The fence was finished the next year and protein was started. On the whole ranch I only saw 4 10 pts that first year on feed(second year). The second year on feed the number went to 12 or so 10 pts on the whole ranch. The next year I saw over 30's total in that on the whole ranch. Those deer were from the same genetics as when it was LF, they just got the benefit of increased nutrition and age. The genetics were there, what was lacking was age structure.
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#6451061 - 09/13/16 08:02 PM Re: Is it odd? Is it a bad sign? [Re: Ricochet83]
Ricochet83 Offline
Tracker

Registered: 10/03/13
Posts: 601
Loc: Sugar Land
Great. That makes me feel better. Time is the key on everything pertaining to this operation is really becoming apparent to me.
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#6451073 - 09/13/16 08:09 PM Re: Is it odd? Is it a bad sign? [Re: Ricochet83]
stxranchman Offline
Obie Juan Kenobi

Registered: 08/04/10
Posts: 52092
Fawn crops raised on good habitat and protein will tell you what you can expect in future years.
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#6451080 - 09/13/16 08:13 PM Re: Is it odd? Is it a bad sign? [Re: Ricochet83]
Ricochet83 Offline
Tracker

Registered: 10/03/13
Posts: 601
Loc: Sugar Land
That's another thing I was curious about is all the Doe with fawn pics I have from beginning of August when the fawns first got mobile I have not seen a set of doubles yet all singles and that is troubling to me with haw wet it has been the past 2 years.
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#6451135 - 09/13/16 08:34 PM Re: Is it odd? Is it a bad sign? [Re: Ricochet83]
stxranchman Offline
Obie Juan Kenobi

Registered: 08/04/10
Posts: 52092
I prefer a doe raising a single fawn. IMO they tend do a better job raising one single fawn. Also singles could be a sign of a younger doe herd. IME with a younger doe and one fawn, they tend to have a bit higher % of buck fawns.
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#6451141 - 09/13/16 08:38 PM Re: Is it odd? Is it a bad sign? [Re: Ricochet83]
Ricochet83 Offline
Tracker

Registered: 10/03/13
Posts: 601
Loc: Sugar Land
Ok well that makes since I was always under the impression/ assumption that the more fawns a doe has in a season the healthier the heard is.
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#6451146 - 09/13/16 08:43 PM Re: Is it odd? Is it a bad sign? [Re: Ricochet83]
stxranchman Offline
Obie Juan Kenobi

Registered: 08/04/10
Posts: 52092
Consider this if all the doe were to raise twins this year and next year. You will be over-populated in one year or maybe two. Deer will have to die to make room for the fawn crops in the near future. You will have a herd of young deer and something will have to die to make room for the next set of mouths. With a herd of very young bucks which young deer are you going to kill to make room once you reach CC and your target ratio?
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#6451163 - 09/13/16 08:54 PM Re: Is it odd? Is it a bad sign? [Re: Ricochet83]
Ricochet83 Offline
Tracker

Registered: 10/03/13
Posts: 601
Loc: Sugar Land
That is a very good point and makes since Steve. So then to try to get it as close to the same as possible with that logic my doe harvest this year should consist of 2nd year does and does with multiple fawns?
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#6451181 - 09/13/16 09:04 PM Re: Is it odd? Is it a bad sign? [Re: Ricochet83]
stxranchman Offline
Obie Juan Kenobi

Registered: 08/04/10
Posts: 52092
I would try to get an accurate ratio on bucks to does and does to fawns first from as many incidental counts sitting in blinds and/or when out on the place working. Then get an accurate head count on bucks from the TC's. Use your ratios(from incidental counts) to set a total number of deer once you have a number on bucks. That total will also tell you how many fawns you have this year. Once you have a number on the fawns it will tell you how many deer you will need to take or if you need to take any to make room for all those young deer. For me, what age does that I would take will depend on what the younger (mainly yearling) bucks look like. You might take 1 yr old does or doe fawns or older does. Total number of deer you have when season starts will tell you what you need to take off or if you need to take any deer off this year.
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#6451204 - 09/13/16 09:19 PM Re: Is it odd? Is it a bad sign? [Re: Ricochet83]
Ricochet83 Offline
Tracker

Registered: 10/03/13
Posts: 601
Loc: Sugar Land
Yes sir. Will be starting my tc counts the third week of September and will allow it to go the whole 14 days to get numbers. So I should have the Intel by the send weekend of October and be ready for the start of the season.
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#6451216 - 09/13/16 09:25 PM Re: Is it odd? Is it a bad sign? [Re: Ricochet83]
stxranchman Offline
Obie Juan Kenobi

Registered: 08/04/10
Posts: 52092
Do some blind counts also when bowhunting or rifle hunting also to back up the TC counts for ratios.
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#6451229 - 09/13/16 09:29 PM Re: Is it odd? Is it a bad sign? [Re: Ricochet83]
Ricochet83 Offline
Tracker

Registered: 10/03/13
Posts: 601
Loc: Sugar Land
Yes sir will do. I have already put a pen and notepad in every stand for ALL hunts this year to keep and ongoing talley
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