Main Menu
Advertisement
Affiliates
Advertisement
Newest Members
orlandowiebe, Z-man65, LWH, BigHit, Sifat
60476 Registered Users
Top Posters
dogcatcher 77503
stxranchman 52092
RWH24 44568
rifleman 43788
BOBO the Clown 41122
BMD 40539
Big Orn 37484
txshntr 33685
bill oxner 32681
sig226fan (Rguns.com) 30571
facebook
Forum Stats
60476 Members
45 Forums
476169 Topics
6246410 Posts

Max Online: 16728 @ 03/25/12 08:51 AM
Topic Options
#6237202 - 03/26/16 09:21 AM bumping shoulder
BassCat'99 Offline
Tracker

Registered: 02/15/13
Posts: 921
Loc: Stratford Texas
I've read where this has been refereed to and am wondering where is a good source to learning the method?
_________________________
TS

Top
#6237255 - 03/26/16 10:31 AM Re: bumping shoulder [Re: BassCat'99]
RiverRider Online   content
THF Trophy Hunter

Registered: 11/11/07
Posts: 6225
Loc: Wise Co.
You can buy body dies which only work the case shoulder and which are to be used with a neck sizing die. You can also use a FL die only. With either approach, it comes down to very, very careful adjustment in terms of how far you turn the die into its threads on the press. You can measure the shoulder of a fire-formed case and adjust the die based on that, or with the FL die you can work by feel---if you're dealing with a bolt action.

Adjusting the die is a tedious process. Turning it in 5 degrees pushes the shoulder 0.001 inch. Five degrees is less than a single tic of the second hand on a clock.
_________________________


Originally Posted By: Cleric
God I am hating caliber threads more and more

Top
#6237256 - 03/26/16 10:31 AM Re: bumping shoulder [Re: BassCat'99]
blackcoal Offline
THF Trophy Hunter

Registered: 01/19/12
Posts: 7568
Loc: 60 Mi North of DFW
Pee Wee football.
_________________________
The Greatest Enemy of knowledge is not ignorance,
it is the illusion of knowledge.--Stephen Hawking

Top
#6237276 - 03/26/16 11:02 AM Re: bumping shoulder [Re: blackcoal]
RiverRider Online   content
THF Trophy Hunter

Registered: 11/11/07
Posts: 6225
Loc: Wise Co.
Originally Posted By: blackcoal
Pee Wee football.



Yes, this explains it well.
_________________________


Originally Posted By: Cleric
God I am hating caliber threads more and more

Top
#6237292 - 03/26/16 11:32 AM Re: bumping shoulder [Re: BassCat'99]
blackcoal Offline
THF Trophy Hunter

Registered: 01/19/12
Posts: 7568
Loc: 60 Mi North of DFW
watching the opening 8 seconds of the Easter egg hunts this weekend is another good example.
_________________________
The Greatest Enemy of knowledge is not ignorance,
it is the illusion of knowledge.--Stephen Hawking

Top
#6237305 - 03/26/16 11:55 AM Re: bumping shoulder [Re: BassCat'99]
FiremanJG Offline
THF Celebrity

Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 17893
Loc: Wolfe City, TX
I just use an FL die, and do what River Rider explained.

Get a Hornady Head space gauge and use the proper insert for your cartridge. It is labeled on the back of the package. I'll measure five pieces of brass just to see if they don't all match, they almost always do.

Raise the ram with a piece of fired brass in the shell holder, screw in the FL die, until I can't screw no more. Lower the ram, turn the die a quarter turn, size the brass. Measure head space. It hasn't contacted yet, turn the die a quarter turn, size the brass. You will feel when you're making contact with the shoulder. The handle of the press will can over. Then the tedious size, measure head space, adjust the die process begins. Work on it, until you can size a piece of brass and you have shortened the distance from the case head to the shoulder by .002" It takes a while, but it's worth it.

When all is said and done I put timing marks, with a Sharpie, on the die threads, on the lock ring, and when I had a press I can to screw the die into, I'd put a timing mark on the press. So you end up with three different marks that should line up. That way when you've taken the die out of the press to work on something else, and you're re-installing you can put the die right back where it was when you found the proper bump.
_________________________


800 Yard Steel Rifle Range
Long Range Shooting Instruction
Memberships and Classes Available


Top
#6237307 - 03/26/16 12:02 PM Re: bumping shoulder [Re: BassCat'99]
BassCat'99 Offline
Tracker

Registered: 02/15/13
Posts: 921
Loc: Stratford Texas
thanks guys, I'll be working 308 and 6.5CM. Is it necessary for 223 that's in a gas gun?
_________________________
TS

Top
#6237311 - 03/26/16 12:09 PM Re: bumping shoulder [Re: BassCat'99]
FiremanJG Offline
THF Celebrity

Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 17893
Loc: Wolfe City, TX
I have done the same process for .308 gas gun. But .003" or .004" is acceptable. I want to make sure it chambers and ejects. And gas guns get very dirty!

I plan to do the same thing for .223 gas gun.
_________________________


800 Yard Steel Rifle Range
Long Range Shooting Instruction
Memberships and Classes Available


Top
#6237403 - 03/26/16 02:13 PM Re: bumping shoulder [Re: BassCat'99]
Judd Online   content


Registered: 01/22/09
Posts: 10761
Loc: Sachse, TX
.223 gas gun I'd use/buy small base dies to make sure you get a good base resize.
_________________________
Originally Posted By: Phil Robertson
Don't let your ears hear what your eyes didn't see, and don't let your mouth say what your heart doesn't feel

Top
#6237489 - 03/26/16 04:47 PM Re: bumping shoulder [Re: BassCat'99]
RiverRider Online   content
THF Trophy Hunter

Registered: 11/11/07
Posts: 6225
Loc: Wise Co.
I've used conventional .223 dies for a number of ARs I've owned and never had an issue. I would use SB dies if necessary, but only if I had to. No point in working your brass any more than necessary.
_________________________


Originally Posted By: Cleric
God I am hating caliber threads more and more

Top
#6237538 - 03/26/16 06:05 PM Re: bumping shoulder [Re: BassCat'99]
BassCat'99 Offline
Tracker

Registered: 02/15/13
Posts: 921
Loc: Stratford Texas
I have 4 AR's left and have not had a problem with them using Lee FL dies.
_________________________
TS

Top
#6237604 - 03/26/16 07:31 PM Re: bumping shoulder [Re: BassCat'99]
blackcoal Offline
THF Trophy Hunter

Registered: 01/19/12
Posts: 7568
Loc: 60 Mi North of DFW
Most likely you will not have a problem, but in the event you should have a tight chamber in the future the SB dies are available.
_________________________
The Greatest Enemy of knowledge is not ignorance,
it is the illusion of knowledge.--Stephen Hawking

Top
#6248824 - 04/05/16 02:29 PM Re: bumping shoulder [Re: BassCat'99]
JTPinTX Online   content
Woodsman

Registered: 04/01/15
Posts: 182
Loc: TX Panhandle
River Rider and JG gave good advice on using the Hornady guage and proper set up of the die. I usually set my die on precision rifles to bump right at .002, or a hair under. I think .003 to .004 is a better number for an AR.

Another thing I can say is die shims can be useful for making small adjustments when needed. You can put them between the die lock ring and the press to make quick or temporary adjustments without messing with the die setting. Shims cut from a coke can will be 3.5 thousandths. I have some I ordered from McMaster-Carr that are .002 thick. I use the .002 shims all the time. Shims can also be handy if you load for 2 different rifles chambered for the same cartridge. I have 2 7x57 Mausers, and one needs a different die adjustment by .003". In that case I set the die for the shorter one, and when sizing brass for the longer one I just put a coke can shim under the lock ring. Works like a charm.

Top
#6250022 - 04/06/16 01:30 PM Re: bumping shoulder [Re: BassCat'99]
redchevy Online   content
THF Celebrity

Registered: 10/25/04
Posts: 23452
Loc: Texas
I would like to see test results showing normal FL sized and then with the shoulder bumped and see differences in the groups and velocities.(say take 20 new brass load and fire then take 10 and load with normal FL size and 10 and load with the shoulder bumped .002 and compare what you get out of the second and so on firings, not just comparing multiple fired cases with bump to factory new never fired.)

I load for a few guns of the same caliber and use the same set of dies so I don't bump shoulders.
_________________________
It's hell eatin em live

Top
#6250066 - 04/06/16 02:21 PM Re: bumping shoulder [Re: redchevy]
ChadTRG42 Offline
THF Trophy Hunter

Registered: 09/16/09
Posts: 9433
Loc: Lewisville, TX
Originally Posted By: redchevy
I would like to see test results showing normal FL sized and then with the shoulder bumped and see differences in the groups and velocities.(say take 20 new brass load and fire then take 10 and load with normal FL size and 10 and load with the shoulder bumped .002 and compare what you get out of the second and so on firings, not just comparing multiple fired cases with bump to factory new never fired.)

I load for a few guns of the same caliber and use the same set of dies so I don't bump shoulders.


Accuracy would be good for either method with a tuned load for that method. The idea of bumping the shoulder back a small amount, about .002" to .003", is to prolong case life. It doesn't over work the web area, where the case head will separate. In my 300 WM and previous 260 Rem, I would wear out the case by either the primer pocket too loose or the case web from case head separation. I had brass in different groups with different firings and some sized with a bump and some with a FL size. The FL sized cases definitely wore out faster at the case web area, especially for the 300 WM. There are times when a FL size is needed. But most shooters can do well with a bump. The problem is bumping the shoulder is a more advanced way of reloading, and some shooters do not do it correctly and cause chambering problems. To keep it simple, a FL size is best.
_________________________

www.DallasReloads.com
Type 01 and Type 06 FFL

Top



© 2004-2016 OUTDOOR SITES NETWORK all rights reserved USA and Worldwide