texashuntingforum.com logo
Main Menu
Advertisement
Affiliates
Advertisement
Newest Members
TraeMartin, Beatixre, MooseSteed, Trappernewt, casyoo
71987 Registered Users
Top Posters(All Time)
dogcatcher 110,788
bill oxner 91,416
SnakeWrangler 65,413
stxranchman 60,296
Gravytrain 46,950
RKHarm24 44,585
rifleman 44,461
Stub 43,764
Forum Statistics
Forums46
Topics536,988
Posts9,719,168
Members86,987
Most Online25,604
Feb 12th, 2024
Print Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3
Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! #6192175 02/20/16 08:47 PM
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 4,053
P
Pig_Popper Offline OP
Extreme Tracker
OP Offline
Extreme Tracker
P
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 4,053
At deer camp my lease buddy keeps old mags on hand in the camp library , my how nice it was to read through an entire magazine without any mention of an AR15.

Don't get me wrong I understand the rifles historic value in protecting the country's freedom and I have a boatload of ARs but it was nostalgic to browse through a mag without an AR on every other page.

Balance is one of the sweet things in life - I wonder when the last Guns & Ammo mag was published that didn't cover an AR.......

Last edited by Pig_Popper; 02/21/16 07:19 AM.

This space is For Sale - inquire within ...
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Pig_Popper] #6192179 02/20/16 08:53 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 110,788
dogcatcher Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 110,788
Originally Posted By: Pig_Popper
At deer camp my lease buddy keeps old mags on hand in the camp library , my hoe nice it was to read through an entire magazine without any mention of an AR15.

Don't get me wrong I understand the rifles historic value in protecting the country's freedom and I have a boatload of ARs but it was nostalgic to browse through a mag without an AR on every other page.

Balance is one of the sweet things in life - I wonder when the last Guns & Ammo mag was published that didn't cover an AR.......


There is a big difference between cheap plastic and high grade wood. up


Combat Infantryman, the ultimate hunter where the prey shoots back.
_____________"Illegitimus non carborundum est"_______________

[Linked Image]
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Pig_Popper] #6192674 02/21/16 04:41 AM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 4,975
J
jbd76266 Offline
Extreme Tracker
Offline
Extreme Tracker
J
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 4,975
That' pretty much why I stopped getting guns and ammo. Every month was the same thing.

Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Pig_Popper] #6192719 02/21/16 05:19 AM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,168
T
Tactical Cowboy Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
T
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,168
Clinton ban was still in affect in 01.

Was there any good mall ninja stuff in that magazine?


The secret to a long life is to try not to shorten it.
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Pig_Popper] #6192762 02/21/16 06:45 AM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 32,442
kmon11 Offline
junior
Offline
junior
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 32,442
It is refreshing to read some of the older gun rags for that reason, and some of the writers of times gone by


lf the saying "Liar, Liar your pants on fire" were true
Mainstream news might be fun to watch
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Pig_Popper] #6192768 02/21/16 07:10 AM
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 2,416
T
tenyearsgone Offline
Veteran Tracker
Offline
Veteran Tracker
T
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 2,416
I'm probably younger than you and I'm kind of burned out on all the tacti-cool stuff we're bombarded with. I appreciate a precision weapon like most and have a few AR's, but don't really care about the latest whiz bang gadget that'll help me be an operator operating operationally.

Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Pig_Popper] #6192803 02/21/16 11:43 AM
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,499
C
charlesb Offline
Pro Tracker
Offline
Pro Tracker
C
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,499
Inertia seems to be the issue here. Most of the gun rags still haven't gotten the memo about the AR bubble popping, and long-range shooting only being relevant to the tiny minority who actually have access to that kind of shooting facility.

The advertisers who call the shots for gun rag content are understandably loathe to give up on the ridiculous mark-up and resulting high profits they have been able to gobble up from the 'tactical' market, but the writing has been on the wall for some time now.

They're understandably wanting to see how far inertia will carry them now that the heyday of "tacticool" profits is in the rear-view mirror, fading fast.

Some of the gun rags will become so fixated upon looking backward that they will fail, go out of business along with the dozens of AR-related manufacturers and faux-sniper custom rifle makers. The survivors that will weather the storm by looking forward should be easy enough to identify. - They'll be the first ones to drop the AR and long range shooting hysteria, focusing instead upon the sporting arms and self-defense weapons that will be dominating the market for the long run.

There are many who will regret seeing the tactical stuff take a back seat, but many more of us will be glad to see the return of the gun writer, gun culture, and the hunting story. The gun rags that survive should be a big step up from what we are seeing today.

It will be good for the Texas Hunting Forum too, when the primary focus returns to hunting in Texas.


Kind regards, charlesb


Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Pig_Popper] #6192856 02/21/16 01:29 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
N
Nogalus Prairie Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
N
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
The AR deal has gotten out of hand.


Originally Posted by Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Pig_Popper] #6192886 02/21/16 02:04 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 6,407
W
WileyCoyote Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
W
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 6,407
This'll sound funny to some folks here on THF who've gotten tired of my old school focus on re selling the lost arts of Still Hunting and Off Hand or African styled game shooting, by getting out of the box blind overlooking a timed deer feeder. I'd be lots more impressed with seeing folks hone their HUNTING Skills, and prove it with a hand held camera than ripping off a full magazine outta an AR something. And FWIW I'd really like to see Silhouette Shooting get some attention and be offered at Gun Ranges to emphasize the Hunting & Offhand Shooting skills.

While I agree with almost everything CharlesB had to say, in watching the various conversations of the LR crowd as it relates to 'yotes and hogs particularly, I can fully appreciate the skill sets and dedication it takes to successfully compete at busting steel and other targets at past the traditional deer hunting ranges I grew up with. And YES it is difficult to find places to shoot past 100 yards, much less past 600 yards

The phrase "Tacticool" and seeing the "T Cool Sly Stallone styled get ups" remind me of the Hollywood Cowboy moniker given to aspiring movie actors who hung at the drug store down the street from Warner Bro's with all the other film wannabe's.

If you want to really BE tacticool, go raise your hand while taking the Oath of Office to Protect and Serve against all enemy's foriegn and domestic, and take that step forward at the recruiting office...and the fine folks in uniform will Teach you how to earn the right to BE tacticool I feel certain.
JMHO & YMMV
Ron


Last edited by WileyCoyote; 02/21/16 02:34 PM. Reason: added a not so fresh thought

It is TIME for Term Limits, cause Politicians are like childrens diapers and for the same reasons...Robin Williams

"These are the times that try men's soul's"...Thomas Paine

"Those who fail to learn from History are doomed to repeat it" ....Santayana
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Pig_Popper] #6192939 02/21/16 02:42 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
N
Nogalus Prairie Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
N
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
An AR is just not the best hunting gun - period. It was not designed to be and cannot be made to be. I'm all for folks having fun and playing with them and enjoying them. That's cool. I have one myself and it's a hoot to shoot.

But it's obvious the KoolAid has been drunk when so many come on here touting ARs whenever a hunting rifle recommendation is sought. They are fun to have when you get into a sounder of hogs - but that's about it. For every other hunting application another choice is better.

I especially cringe when I see kids being forced to deal with a clunky AR pushed upon them to hunt with.


Originally Posted by Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Nogalus Prairie] #6192955 02/21/16 02:49 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 695
JD4030 Offline
Tracker
Offline
Tracker
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 695
Originally Posted By: Nogalus Prairie
An AR is just not the best hunting gun - period. It was not designed to be and cannot be made to be. I'm all for folks having fun and playing with them and enjoying them. That's cool. I have one myself and it's a hoot to shoot.

But it's obvious the KoolAid has been drunk when so many come on here touting ARs whenever a hunting rifle recommendation is sought. They are fun to have when you get into a sounder of hogs - but that's about it. For every other hunting application another choice is better.

I especially cringe when I see kids being forced to deal with a clunky AR pushed upon them to hunt with.


Well said, couldn't agree more.


Custom hay cutting / baling, combining in Southern Dallas / Ellis county; please visit our website or send me a PM for pricing, etc: http://stewart-farms.net/

Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Nogalus Prairie] #6193029 02/21/16 04:06 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,083
J.G. Online Content
THF Celebrity
Online Content
THF Celebrity
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,083
Originally Posted By: Nogalus Prairie
An AR is just not the best hunting gun - period. It was not designed to be and cannot be made to be. I'm all for folks having fun and playing with them and enjoying them. That's cool. I have one myself and it's a hoot to shoot.

But it's obvious the KoolAid has been drunk when so many come on here touting ARs whenever a hunting rifle recommendation is sought. They are fun to have when you get into a sounder of hogs - but that's about it. For every other hunting application another choice is better.

I especially cringe when I see kids being forced to deal with a clunky AR pushed upon them to hunt with.


I'm a bigger fan of bolt actions but those statements are simply your opinion and not to be misconstrued into pure fact.

I agree they are the best hot sounder gun. But they are just fine for stalking and killing deer and coyotes. They were designed to hunt men, lest ye forget. Go back in history and see all the battle rifles that made fine hunting rifles. 1903, M-1 Garand, M-1 Carbine, M-14, and now the rifle in question. If they didn't work, people wouldn't use them. Name me one more complete rifle that the average guy can order 95% of the parts, have them delivered in the brown truck, and assemble them in his garage with less than $100 invested in special tools. The Savage rifle is close, but I've got my own issues with it.

Trust upon a kid? I personally won't put an AR in the hands of my kids until they are in their late teens, they will master the bolt action first. But I can understand why so many guys hand ARe to their kids simply due to the adjustable length of pull on the stock.

The AR is not usually to my acceptable level of accuracy, but I am spoiled to custom barreled bolt actions that shoot tiny. But let's compare former acceptable level of accuracy 30 years ago working backward in history. Many, many hunters were satisfied with the ability to put three rounds in a pie plate at 100 or 200 yards. Today's ARe will shoot well smaller than that as a general rule. My LR 308 ended up putting five rounds inside 2 3/4" at 300 yards, and it is a mass produced rifle, not a custom.

Which leads me to the next reply. Those of you old grumpies complaining about the way things are going today are also forgetting how performance has drastically improved in rifles, ammo, loading components, and scopes. The average Joe now has the technology available to him to put together a scoped rifle, make a hand load for it, and shoot very small, very far out. Our general acceptable level of accuracy, as hunters, has drastically shrank. Thank God for smart men that aspire to improve products. And other men that figure out how to use them to those products' full potential.


[Linked Image]
800 Yard Steel Range
Precision Rifle Instruction
Memberships and Classes Available
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Nogalus Prairie] #6193030 02/21/16 04:06 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,168
T
Tactical Cowboy Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
T
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,168
Originally Posted By: Nogalus Prairie
An AR is just not the best hunting gun - period. It was not designed to be and cannot be made to be. I'm all for folks having fun and playing with them and enjoying them. That's cool. I have one myself and it's a hoot to shoot.

But it's obvious the KoolAid has been drunk when so many come on here touting ARs whenever a hunting rifle recommendation is sought. They are fun to have when you get into a sounder of hogs - but that's about it. For every other hunting application another choice is better.

I especially cringe when I see kids being forced to deal with a clunky AR pushed upon them to hunt with.


But it's so super modular and can be built to do anything and it's the best for everything and I want to look like a terrorist ninja while I hunt deer in my heated box blind and if you don't believe me you're wrong.


The secret to a long life is to try not to shorten it.
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: J.G.] #6193064 02/21/16 04:59 PM
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,501
R
RiverRider Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
R
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,501
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG


Which leads me to the next reply. Those of you old grumpies complaining about the way things are going today are also forgetting how performance has drastically improved in rifles, ammo, loading components, and scopes.


The improvements in equipment are real, no argument there...but they translate into traditional "old-school" stuff, too. You don't have to hunt with a long range rig like you have and use to benefit from the technological advances. I can have a rifle built using quality components that will be just as accurate as your stuff but still look like and carry like a conventional sporter with a classic stock. Actually shooting it and matching the long range hits on steel you can do with your style of rifle would be a real challenge due to ergonomics and rifle weight, but that's not on the radar for me and I don't care. We use rifles that suit our uses for them.

The long range thing is a very limited activity and not necessarily "the way things are going today." It's interesting to many but relatively few participate. FFP scopes with mil-dot reticles, tactical style stocks, and bigass bolt knobs have their place but there are still a LOT of guys out here who learned how to use a pencil to do math and believe that bullets should retain weight, penetrate straight, and exit.


[Linked Image]

"Arguing with you always makes me thirsty."

-Augustus McRae
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: dogcatcher] #6193066 02/21/16 04:59 PM
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,177
D
DH3 Offline
Pro Tracker
Offline
Pro Tracker
D
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,177
Originally Posted By: dogcatcher
Originally Posted By: Pig_Popper
At deer camp my lease buddy keeps old mags on hand in the camp library , my hoe nice it was to read through an entire magazine without any mention of an AR15.

Don't get me wrong I understand the rifles historic value in protecting the country's freedom and I have a boatload of ARs but it was nostalgic to browse through a mag without an AR on every other page.

Balance is one of the sweet things in life - I wonder when the last Guns & Ammo mag was published that didn't cover an AR.......


There is a big difference between cheap plastic and high grade wood. up

90% of gun show tables have black plastic crap. Only a few have real blue/walnut firearms. It's a shame that the spray and pray crowd provides the example for the next generation of hunters. rolleyes

Last edited by DH3; 02/21/16 05:00 PM.

Old age and treachery beats youth and stupid every time!
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Pig_Popper] #6193071 02/21/16 05:02 PM
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,501
R
RiverRider Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
R
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,501
I think it's a little skewed to assume that anyone who hunts with an AR is using "spray and pray" technique. No doubt some do, but I think some shoot a bolt-action that way and with a LOT of practice could do the same with a muzzle loader.


[Linked Image]

"Arguing with you always makes me thirsty."

-Augustus McRae
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Pig_Popper] #6193073 02/21/16 05:05 PM
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 4,053
P
Pig_Popper Offline OP
Extreme Tracker
OP Offline
Extreme Tracker
P
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 4,053
We are at a good juncture in applied technologies - good commentary all the way around!
This thread wasn't meant to generate a debate between bolt action or semi auto loaders or generations of enthusiast.

The old grump comment was funny - I'm 38 years old

A takeaway for me on this discussion is don't wait for a current gun mag to bring you a balanced diet of all styles of guns or the advertisements thereof - - - perhaps the best option for flipping through readings on the next road trip is a current Recoil issue and a well-aged Guns and Ammo from early 2000.

Half price books is usually a good source for a vintage copy of our beloved magazine.


This space is For Sale - inquire within ...
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Pig_Popper] #6193089 02/21/16 05:18 PM
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 14,199
T
tth_40 Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
T
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 14,199
I love my bolt actions, especially the much older ones. AR type rifles have their place, they're fun to shoot and tinker with. Like most on here, I have a few. Also love my Garands, lever actions and single shots.

Like others have said, it's a balance. At least (at present) we still have the freedom to choose pretty much what we want. Hopefully we can keep it that way.


Originally Posted By: theserxtremedays
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: RiverRider] #6193106 02/21/16 05:31 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,083
J.G. Online Content
THF Celebrity
Online Content
THF Celebrity
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,083
Originally Posted By: RiverRider
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG


Which leads me to the next reply. Those of you old grumpies complaining about the way things are going today are also forgetting how performance has drastically improved in rifles, ammo, loading components, and scopes.


The improvements in equipment are real, no argument there...but they translate into traditional "old-school" stuff, too. You don't have to hunt with a long range rig like you have and use to benefit from the technological advances. I can have a rifle built using quality components that will be just as accurate as your stuff but still look like and carry like a conventional sporter with a classic stock. Actually shooting it and matching the long range hits on steel you can do with your style of rifle would be a real challenge due to ergonomics and rifle weight, but that's not on the radar for me and I don't care. We use rifles that suit our uses for them.

The long range thing is a very limited activity and not necessarily "the way things are going today." It's interesting to many but relatively few participate. FFP scopes with mil-dot reticles, tactical style stocks, and bigass bolt knobs have their place but there are still a LOT of guys out here who learned how to use a pencil to do math and believe that bullets should retain weight, penetrate straight, and exit.


Do you really thing I see things as only one way to skin a cat? I thought that I conveyed that you could walk into Cabela's buy a sporter stock wood rifle, and a scope from the case, take it home, work up a load, and be hitting very small, very far in one day. I've actually done this very thing, save the one day part. So one does not even need to "build" a rifle to get it done. As far as scopes, it can also be done without knobs as long as there is a useful reticle.

The list of competent long range shooters is growing, but it is, and always will be, the minority by a wide margin. No news to me there either. But thankfully my phone keeps ringing, and the PM envelope keeps flashing. Probably because these people are realizing that learning the details to shoot far, directly translates into better shots up close, and that is half the point of what I'm doing.

Maybe you'd be surprised to learn that I was coyote calling three weeks ago, spotted one 500 yards out, wanted him in closer, saw him again at 250 yards, and still wanted him in closer. My barb wire fence was between he and I, and I don't like patching brand new fence. I hoped I'd get him inside 100 yards. Somewhere in the set he either lost interest or saw me from the woods, when I couldn't see him. I knew I wasn't camoed well enough when I started the set, but gave it a try anyway. Oh well, that's hunting, and I know what I should have done differently. Any number of mass produced, or custom rifles would have been appropriate for me to have been holding at the time. I happened to have been holding an AR in .308 that day. Coyotes are my favorite animal to try and outsmart, and feral hogs are my favorite animal to hate and to kill with extreme prejudice. Of late the semi-auto repeater, with a free floated barrel is what rides in the passenger seat for both of those animals should I encounter them.


[Linked Image]
800 Yard Steel Range
Precision Rifle Instruction
Memberships and Classes Available
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Pig_Popper] #6193115 02/21/16 05:38 PM
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,501
R
RiverRider Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
R
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,501
I hate to disappoint you JG, but I don't see a point to argue here.


[Linked Image]

"Arguing with you always makes me thirsty."

-Augustus McRae
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Pig_Popper] #6193119 02/21/16 05:41 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 32,442
kmon11 Offline
junior
Offline
junior
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 32,442
I love a blued steel and walnut stocked rifles, they are what I grew up with and still prefer today. I own a few black guns and they also have their place. As much as I like the Blued Walnut guns I have to wonder if all the guns sold these days were in that configuration, would there be a Walnut tree left that is big enough for a gunstock?

AR rifles can be made to be amazingly accurate in the hands of a good driver. There are some out there shooting tiny groups and pushing range much further than I would have ever thought possible.


lf the saying "Liar, Liar your pants on fire" were true
Mainstream news might be fun to watch
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Pig_Popper] #6193164 02/21/16 06:20 PM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 15,605
6
603Country Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
6
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 15,605
There's a lot to be said for an AR 15 for some kinds of hunting. I got into the pigs a while back and got two with the bolt 223, but if I'd had an AR15 I'd have really stacked them up. But, I'm not going to buy one. I'd consider buying one if they had a significantly better caliber available, but unless you move up to the AR10, there's not much that interests me. And the AR10's are heavy.

When we moved from the M14 to the M16, way back when God was a Staff Sergeant, I didn't like it. Light, yes. Easier to tote ammo, yes. Higher maintenance, yes.

For now, I'll stick to the bolt actions.


Not my monkeys, not my circus...
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: J.G.] #6193177 02/21/16 06:31 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
N
Nogalus Prairie Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
N
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
Originally Posted By: Nogalus Prairie
An AR is just not the best hunting gun - period. It was not designed to be and cannot be made to be. I'm all for folks having fun and playing with them and enjoying them. That's cool. I have one myself and it's a hoot to shoot.

But it's obvious the KoolAid has been drunk when so many come on here touting ARs whenever a hunting rifle recommendation is sought. They are fun to have when you get into a sounder of hogs - but that's about it. For every other hunting application another choice is better.

I especially cringe when I see kids being forced to deal with a clunky AR pushed upon them to hunt with.


I'm a bigger fan of bolt actions but those statements are simply your opinion and not to be misconstrued into pure fact.

I agree they are the best hot sounder gun. But they are just fine for stalking and killing deer and coyotes. They were designed to hunt men, lest ye forget. Go back in history and see all the battle rifles that made fine hunting rifles. 1903, M-1 Garand, M-1 Carbine, M-14, and now the rifle in question. If they didn't work, people wouldn't use them. Name me one more complete rifle that the average guy can order 95% of the parts, have them delivered in the brown truck, and assemble them in his garage with less than $100 invested in special tools. The Savage rifle is close, but I've got my own issues with it.

Trust upon a kid? I personally won't put an AR in the hands of my kids until they are in their late teens, they will master the bolt action first. But I can understand why so many guys hand ARe to their kids simply due to the adjustable length of pull on the stock.

The AR is not usually to my acceptable level of accuracy, but I am spoiled to custom barreled bolt actions that shoot tiny. But let's compare former acceptable level of accuracy 30 years ago working backward in history. Many, many hunters were satisfied with the ability to put three rounds in a pie plate at 100 or 200 yards. Today's ARe will shoot well smaller than that as a general rule. My LR 308 ended up putting five rounds inside 2 3/4" at 300 yards, and it is a mass produced rifle, not a custom.

Which leads me to the next reply. Those of you old grumpies complaining about the way things are going today are also forgetting how performance has drastically improved in rifles, ammo, loading components, and scopes. The average Joe now has the technology available to him to put together a scoped rifle, make a hand load for it, and shoot very small, very far out. Our general acceptable level of accuracy, as hunters, has drastically shrank. Thank God for smart men that aspire to improve products. And other men that figure out how to use them to those products' full potential.


Obviously it is just my opinion. I never said anything to the contrary.

But, guess what? Yours is just your opinion too. I don't appreciate being talked to like I am "forgetting" something or unaware of something or don't know something (such as the great improvements made in technology). I am aware. Not everybody just fell off the turnip truck. IMO despite all that, it's not enough to transform the platform. And IMO the platform itself is lagging behind other platforms for the vast majority of hunting applications. Hunting is not war. A battle rifle was never intended or designed to be a sport hunting rifle. Which is why an AR will never be the optimum choice in the vast majority of hunting applications. IMO.

The reason you rub folks the wrong way sometimes JG is you talk down to folks and state your opinions as "pure fact" and the last word on every topic. In other words, you do the same thing that rubs you the wrong way when you perceive (rightly or wrongly) others doing it. That post is a prime example.

Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: RiverRider] #6193188 02/21/16 06:41 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,083
J.G. Online Content
THF Celebrity
Online Content
THF Celebrity
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,083
Originally Posted By: RiverRider
I hate to disappoint you JG, but I don't see a point to argue here.


Well that's great!


[Linked Image]
800 Yard Steel Range
Precision Rifle Instruction
Memberships and Classes Available
Re: Just read through a July 2001 Guns & Ammo mag and not a single article on ARs - nice!!! [Re: Nogalus Prairie] #6193194 02/21/16 06:47 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,083
J.G. Online Content
THF Celebrity
Online Content
THF Celebrity
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,083
"An AR is not the best hunting gun, period".

Well, there is no period. Placing the period looks like that's the end of discussion and you are right, and everyone that uses them to hunt is wrong.

I'm not even a die hard AR guy, but I will defend those that are. Give me one choice in a rifle and it will be a LH bolt action.

Sure I rub people wrong, that's life.

But for YOU to point that out to ME is comedic at best. I've been to ban camp zero times for rubbing people wrong. How many times have you been?


[Linked Image]
800 Yard Steel Range
Precision Rifle Instruction
Memberships and Classes Available
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3
Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread

© 2004-2024 OUTDOOR SITES NETWORK all rights reserved USA and Worldwide
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.3