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 Expansion/Penetration
#6186294
02/16/16 09:48 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 39,536
redchevy
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I have always heard/read about the bullet that entered in the front shoulder and angled back through the body and exited the rear or lodged in the hind quarter etc. and have always wondered about it.
Dad trapped two sows and some piglets yesterday, the piglets got out but he shot the sows and butchered them. The first sow was about 100 lbs he shot her in the neck but she turned, bullet entered in front of the front leg and exited the off side hind leg. Second one was about 70 lbs shot broadside in the neck into off side shoulder bullet did not exit and was recovered. Both were the same weight and type of bullet loaded from the same box and fired in the same gun.
Seems the guts don't provide very much resistance? Any other thoughts?
It's hell eatin em live
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Re: Expansion/Penetration
[Re: redchevy]
#6186331
02/16/16 10:11 PM
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Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 2,072
cabosandinh
Veteran Tracker
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Veteran Tracker
Joined: Aug 2013
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i've seen them all
shot at shoulder bullet exit at top of spine
shot at shoulder bullet exit at belly near hind (small hole)
shot at shoulder bullet exit on other side after breaking both blades
shot one in the gut on the run and it blew a massive hole on the other side with gut dangling out
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Re: Expansion/Penetration
[Re: redchevy]
#6186374
02/16/16 10:49 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 32,488
kmon11
junior
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junior
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 32,488 |
Depends on what part of the guts are hit and what is in them. Stomach full of food can stop a lot of bullet, empty not so much.
lf the saying "Liar, Liar your pants on fire" were true
Mainstream news might be fun to watch
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Re: Expansion/Penetration
[Re: redchevy]
#6187711
02/17/16 09:02 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 4,294
oldoak2000
Extreme Tracker
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Extreme Tracker
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 4,294 |
I have always heard/read about the bullet that entered in the front shoulder and angled back through the body and exited the rear or lodged in the hind quarter etc. and have always wondered about it.
Dad trapped two sows and some piglets yesterday, the piglets got out but he shot the sows and butchered them. The first sow was about 100 lbs he shot her in the neck but she turned, bullet entered in front of the front leg and exited the off side hind leg. Second one was about 70 lbs shot broadside in the neck into off side shoulder bullet did not exit and was recovered. Both were the same weight and type of bullet loaded from the same box and fired in the same gun.
Seems the guts don't provide very much resistance? Any other thoughts? Shot with what? Pistol or Rifle? sounds like Pistol (under 1100fps). A Rifle bullet going 2000fps+ will be affected by 'guts' much more than pistol bullet.
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Re: Expansion/Penetration
[Re: redchevy]
#6188486
02/18/16 01:13 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 39,536
redchevy
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Yes, it was a 44 mag ruger Blackhawk, I believe a 6.5" barrel... I loaded them, but honestly I couldn't tell you what bullet or powder I used, if I had a guess they are hornady xtp's and I believe the 1100 fps is about right. Its been a while since I loaded them 
Last edited by redchevy; 02/18/16 01:14 PM.
It's hell eatin em live
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Re: Expansion/Penetration
[Re: redchevy]
#6189249
02/18/16 06:54 PM
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 9,273
blackcoal
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 9,273 |
Tad off subject but this is good example of the shortfall when using gelatin to test penetration and expansion. There is a difference between heart muscle, liver and lungs and as pointed out above the contents of stomach and guts can differ. Even to the point the second piggy might have had a little more adrenaline shooting through its body.
The Greatest Enemy of knowledge is not ignorance,
it is the illusion of knowledge.--Stephen Hawking
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Re: Expansion/Penetration
[Re: redchevy]
#6189290
02/18/16 07:11 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 39,536
redchevy
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I feel like its perfectly on subject, kinda along the lines of what I was thinking when I posted it. Also probably a lot of the reason why bullets that work real well for through the ribs shots sometimes don't do nearly as well when they hit heavy muscle and bone.
It's hell eatin em live
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Re: Expansion/Penetration
[Re: redchevy]
#6189315
02/18/16 07:18 PM
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 9,273
blackcoal
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 9,273 |
I agree with you but didn't want to get anyone upset about official methods of testing so I apologized upfront as to not hurt delicate feelings. Remember the Glaser rounds?
The Greatest Enemy of knowledge is not ignorance,
it is the illusion of knowledge.--Stephen Hawking
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Re: Expansion/Penetration
[Re: redchevy]
#6189328
02/18/16 07:24 PM
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 7,935
bigjoe8565
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 7,935 |
I've given up trying to figure why billets do what they once they hit an animal. I shot a sow in her ear and bullet exited opposite shoulder. Hit another sow in the ear and it exits her lower jaw. Tried multiple times to line up doubles in small pigs with a 6.8 and .308 with limited success. Sometimes I'd get good penetration and take both higs out and other times I'd only get one pig. Bullets do crazy things once they hit flesh, bone and muscle.
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Re: Expansion/Penetration
[Re: redchevy]
#6189354
02/18/16 07:32 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 32,488
kmon11
junior
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junior
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 32,488 |
BC, I remember those rounds. I also pay attention to how a bullet preforms in the test media that truly matters every time I clean a pig, deer, elk... Ballistic Gel gives some info but is too consistent to give more than a good idea of what will happen with bone/muscle/vitals...
Well remember an elk shot by a friend that the stomach full of grass and alfalfa stopped a 160gr partition from a 7mmMag but another punched through both shoulders and exited. That elk was shot multiple times some good shots some not as good.
lf the saying "Liar, Liar your pants on fire" were true
Mainstream news might be fun to watch
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Re: Expansion/Penetration
[Re: redchevy]
#6189356
02/18/16 07:33 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 39,536
redchevy
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I think a lot of the crazy stuff can be eliminated by chooising a good bullet for the job. I have doubled hogs on several occasions. Shot a 100 and 80 lb sow double last year and the second was a through and through shot as well. 150 grain NP out of a 270 goes through a lot.
It's hell eatin em live
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Re: Expansion/Penetration
[Re: redchevy]
#6189389
02/18/16 07:46 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 32,488
kmon11
junior
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junior
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 32,488 |
I think a lot of the crazy stuff can be eliminated by chooising a good bullet for the job. I have doubled hogs on several occasions. Shot a 100 and 80 lb sow double last year and the second was a through and through shot as well. 150 grain NP out of a 270 goes through a lot. My doubles and a couple triples on hogs have been with partitions, the trips were with the 225gr partition from a 350 Rem Mag.
lf the saying "Liar, Liar your pants on fire" were true
Mainstream news might be fun to watch
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