Yes you do and when you get called on it you play the victim. Thousands upon thousands of deer die every year due to a 223, they're not that tough.

Tossed it out, broke in a million pieces and buried deep with a ten ton bolder over top.

Happy New Years all you crazy sumbucks! May all your 223s hit like a sledgehammer and your 300s kick like a baby mouse!

It's just a discussion/debate. Just different thoughts and opinions. There's always a left side a right side and a line drawn in the sand in the middle. Some chose a side and stand by it, some straddle the line. To each there own, but there's nothing wrong with each one of us having a different opinion. No need to take it personal or put one another down. Hell here before long we may be standing side by side with one another with our 223s, 30-06s and whatever else we have defending our rights from our government. We're all outdoorsmen, hunters, family men, ect. Let's put an end to this thread and agree to disagree. Happy New Year, happy hunting, and God bless you all.

IMO it is not possible for either side to be a "victim" as long as the discussion is about a rifle caliber. Period. Again, some feel "victimized" because their skins are so thin you can see through them.

It's just a caliber debate. That's it and that's all.

Happy New Year!

And may all of you have a safe and prosperous New Year.

And yet another thread trolled by the all knowing. It's like ground hog day whenever your involved.

Thanks for the great topic input without trolling or anything like that.

Uh huh. Nothing can be added that you don't already know counsel.

A bullet does nothing more than poke a hole. Any energy beyond what it takes to poke that hole is wasted unless you relish the idea of killing the air behind an animal. Reminds me of the guys that "need" a 3/4 ton diesel to haul their 4 wheeler around. Some consideration is due on the concept of sufficiency. I've shot deer with a .223, a .243, a 7.65x53, and a .30-06 and they all met similar fates. I prefer my .223 because my shots are 200 yds max, I do a lot of walking looking for pigs, and I am confident in my ability with the rifle. I load the 65 gr Sierra Gameking to 2850 fps and I assure you it will poke through a front shoulder without difficulty. If I were making 300 yd plus shots regularly it might be different, but why anyone would shoot 300 yds as a matter of course in this state is unclear to me.

If you have ever been on a battlefield and could actually see what a 223 does to the human body, you probably would want to go to a larger round. After a night attack that we were almost over run, the next morning I counted over 10 holes in one NVA soldier. We had Spooky on site all night with flares going to the point it was almost like daylight. They would attack in waves, all we did was throw bullets in their direction, not aiming per se, but full auto rock and roll. My RTO was loading magazines as fast as he could for my platoon. Twice during the night we had chopper ammo resupply dropped into our perimeter. My 2 machine gun crews ran through all of their ammo and the 2 resupplies, they were stopping them, but we were only hitting them.

The 223 was designed around the M16, a combat weapon that served several purposes. It was light as was the rounds, so the soldier could carry more ammo. Most Infantrymen carried a lot of ammo, depending on the operation, we would carry between 10 to 30 magazines of 18 rounds per mag. Translate that weight and size wise to the same number of rounds in 308, and see if you would want to carry that many rounds. The 223 was not only designed to kill, it was also design to wound, a wounded soldier takes 2 men out of a firefight. The wounded soldier and the soldier having to move him to safety.

Try humping the boonies for weeks at a time carrying an M14 with the same amount of ammo. Not only the weight, but the length of the M14 was also a cluster in the jungle. But when the SHTF I would rather be throwing 7.62 than 223, I have seen what the 7.62 and the 223 does to human flesh. The result is enough to convince you to stay close to the M60's in the unit, they shot the 7.62 or the 308 equivalent.



My theory is, "If you have to ask if it a caliber is fine for deer hunting, then you don't have enough confidence in yourself to hunt our property". On our place everybody gets range time before they get to hunt. If you can hit "good" on the paper, you can hunt, but if you are all over the paper. The gate is on the south side and you get directions to it.

Military uses ball. You can't compare ball to a soft point for damage, that is moot and you know better. You can't compare a m4 to a machine gun as well. The saw is 5.56 and it will shred bones

Sign of true arrogance when you talk down and make light of someone else's experiences and still maintain you know more despite zero actual experience.

Well said ...

Please explain to me how having a different opinion on caliber choice is "talking down and making light of someone else's experiences", yet declaring as fact someone you don't know has "zero actual experience" is not.

Well said.....

I would NP but I don't have a 1000 yard range...

rick

Someone actually used the military as an example of the 223s killing power so I guess DogCatchers example isn't a moot point! Just like countless other men like Dog that will tell you that in a firefight, they would rather have the 308 than the itty bitty 223. A 223 will kill a deer but so will a pellet gun!

You called stx lucky for his success. Despite the fact that shot placement is the single biggest factor in a clean kill you call it luck he did what he did. Thats not a difference in opinion that is you belittling someone else. No different than someone telling a person after they win a sporting event they got lucky. There's also the multiple posts where you try to slight everyone standing up for the caliber when you exaggerate what people have said in defense of it.

Have you shot a deer with a 223? If so then you have had experience and I am wrong.

You are wrong.

OMG, guys, this thread has gone on for 22 pages already, and all that you've done is convince yourself that other TTH members are dipped in s*** and smoking crack. Guess what? Nobody is going to change their mind. If you hunted with each other in person, you'd probably find that you have more in common than you might expect.

Each should hunt as he likes with any legal equipment and then live with the consequences.

Most of you are probably pretty decent guys when you aren't in front of a computer ...

but I only see 9 pages.

Fine then you have experience. Mind telling us how many deer you have shot with a 223, where you hit them and the results.

Still doesn't change the fact about what you said to STX.

Before your edits, you truely are narcissistic

I should have never even posted in this thread. It is like crack... i just keep seeing stuff and having that knee-jerk response to reply. I'm not even sure why I came back to it in the first place.

.308 vs. 5.56 yeah it wins in a firefight. It wins all day in just about every category for any species. That doesn't mean the 5.56 is inadequate for deer. That is a fallacy of logic...