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Re: Missed opportunity Need opinions [Re: JHeflinland] #6085767 12/15/15 09:05 PM
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Send your scope back to Swarovski and have them install the TDX Reticle. The scope has a normal crosshair. But it also has additional hashes below the horizontal crosshair representing elevation out to 450-500 yards (depending on caliber). The center, horizontal cross hair has a mil dot on each side of the verical cross hair. This represents point of aim in a steady 10mph crosswind at 100 yards. The end of each additional hashmark is the point of aim at whatever yardage with a 10 mph crosswind. Long ranch shooting in 20-30 mph wind is not something I will attempt on an animal, but it can be doped. Just takes a ton of practice, a good program and accurate information on the wind conditions.

Then buy a range finder and spend lots and lots of time shooting the gun, scope and ammo you will be using to hunt. In all types of conditions and at various known ranges/elevation changes.

Re: Missed opportunity Need opinions [Re: JHeflinland] #6085878 12/15/15 10:15 PM
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Let's not guess, let's calculate it! A 270 Win with a 130 grain is just fine, if you know how to use it. This is with a 130 grain SP at 3020 fps.

If you have a zero at 100 yards, your drop would be about 35 inches at 450 yards, call it 3 feet. Shooting up 175 feet with 450 yards to target (1350 feet), that's only a 7.45 degree angle, which is not a lot. It would equal 446 yards actual distance that gravity would effect the bullet. When you get above 15 degrees (or much further out) is when you need to begin to account for angle shooting.

The wind would have blown the bullet off by 33 inches. So, the windage may have been close to your hold.

Your hold should have been higher than what you held for elevation. I'm pretty sure you hit low.

Now, if you want to learn how to shoot longer ranges, I highly recommend getting a scope you can dial elevation and windage for. Learn how to use it, and practice with it. The 270 Win is more than capable. I learned to shoot on a 270, and took a precision rifle class out to 1K yards with my 270 many years ago. So, it's definitely doable. Having a good scope (to dial) with good ammo is the key! Take a class to get proficient with it. If you want match grade 270 ammo, let me know!

20 mph for wind below

Range Elev Wind Velocity Energy
(yards) (inches) (inches) (ft/sec) (ft-lbs)
0 --- --- 3020 2632.6
50 -0.36 0.36 2901.5 2430
100 0 1.46 2786.1 2240.6
150 -0.76 3.33 2673.7 2063.5
200 -2.74 6.01 2564.3 1898
250 -6.04 9.57 2457.7 1743.5
300 -10.78 14.05 2354 1599.4
350 -17.09 19.5 2253 1465.2
400 -25.12 25.99 2154.2 1339.4
450 -35.02 33.6 2057.5 1222
500 -46.97 42.39 1963.5 1112.8


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Re: Missed opportunity Need opinions [Re: JHeflinland] #6085896 12/15/15 10:26 PM
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The swaro z5 with BT and 4W reticle would be good for this, dial the ballistic turret to desired distance and use the windage marks on the reticle for the mph wind. I believe the windage hold over for 20mph is the third line over, but could be wrong, haven't looked at it in a while.

Swaro also has an app that calculates the drop and windage based on your load, isn't perfect but gives an idea. Based on your load, it shows a drop of 34 inches for 450 yards and wind adjust of 31 inches for 20 mph, up to 47 inches for 30 mph wind.

Edit: was posting this the same time as chad. I also figured with simple math the real range was 446 yards, remember Pythagorean theorem? so the elevation was not really a big deal, it was the range and wind.

Last edited by Texas buckeye; 12/15/15 10:29 PM.
Re: Missed opportunity Need opinions [Re: ChadTRG42] #6086236 12/16/15 01:39 AM
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Originally Posted By: ChadTRG42
Let's not guess, let's calculate it! A 270 Win with a 130 grain is just fine, if you know how to use it. This is with a 130 grain SP at 3020 fps.

If you have a zero at 100 yards, your drop would be about 35 inches at 450 yards, call it 3 feet. Shooting up 175 feet with 450 yards to target (1350 feet), that's only a 7.45 degree angle, which is not a lot. It would equal 446 yards actual distance that gravity would effect the bullet. When you get above 15 degrees (or much further out) is when you need to begin to account for angle shooting.

The wind would have blown the bullet off by 33 inches. So, the windage may have been close to your hold.

Your hold should have been higher than what you held for elevation. I'm pretty sure you hit low.

Now, if you want to learn how to shoot longer ranges, I highly recommend getting a scope you can dial elevation and windage for. Learn how to use it, and practice with it. The 270 Win is more than capable. I learned to shoot on a 270, and took a precision rifle class out to 1K yards with my 270 many years ago. So, it's definitely doable. Having a good scope (to dial) with good ammo is the key! Take a class to get proficient with it. If you want match grade 270 ammo, let me know!

20 mph for wind below

Range Elev Wind Velocity Energy
(yards) (inches) (inches) (ft/sec) (ft-lbs)
0 --- --- 3020 2632.6
50 -0.36 0.36 2901.5 2430
100 0 1.46 2786.1 2240.6
150 -0.76 3.33 2673.7 2063.5
200 -2.74 6.01 2564.3 1898
250 -6.04 9.57 2457.7 1743.5
300 -10.78 14.05 2354 1599.4
350 -17.09 19.5 2253 1465.2
400 -25.12 25.99 2154.2 1339.4
450 -35.02 33.6 2057.5 1222
500 -46.97 42.39 1963.5 1112.8


Wow. This makes sense. Thank you!


If ducks had horns I'd probably be a duck hunter.
I am a horrible deer hunter. Probably the worst. Ever.
Re: Missed opportunity Need opinions [Re: JHeflinland] #6089611 12/17/15 09:02 PM
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You probably didn't get close to the animal.

I'm not gonna beat you up about taking the shot, I have longer range rig and if I would have been presented a standing 450 yards shot I would have tried given I had a good rest. Sometimes you pull off those shots sometimes you don't....part of it.

Keep after it you'll get your sheep


For it is not the quarry that we truly seek, but the adventure.
Re: Missed opportunity Need opinions [Re: JHeflinland] #6089680 12/17/15 09:42 PM
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There ain't but a handful of people on this forum that could have pulled off that shot in that wind. Honestly you were a fool for even trying.

Re: Missed opportunity Need opinions [Re: jdickey] #6089882 12/17/15 11:59 PM
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Says the guy who chases Bigfoot bolt
Originally Posted By: jdickey
Several errors in both factors of judgement in this scenario.....first and foremost, taking a shot like that with no practice and the total disregard as to the welfare of the animal. Apparently, your in a locale that allows 450 yard shots - do your home work for long range shooting, go practice with at least one box of bullets.

You may or may not have wounded the animal and it may or may not have survived. That is not the SPORTSMANS way of hunting!

Learn and understand both before you go out again! realmad


Originally Posted by ImTheReasonDovesMourn
I'd ask him if he's pregnant. He missed a s__tload of periods.

Originally Posted by Hancock
I'll take "things that look like a uterus" for $200 Alex.
Re: Missed opportunity Need opinions [Re: Ramsey] #6089908 12/18/15 12:17 AM
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What I would have done: GET CLOSER! Inch by inch if I wanted one that bad. There's a huge difference between 1/200yd and 450yd. Was at the range today at 200yd, and minor shooting style differences that had NO EFFECT at 100yd were making my dad and I hit completely off with the other's rifles (30-06, 22-250). I ended up having to re-zero both, though the smaller gun had minimal adjustment.

However, I went to the range today with the mindset for a similar scenario. I have a mule deer/aoudad hunt in North Texas next month and the hunt-organizer there told me the deer are easy to kill (<100yd) but the closest recorded kill shot on an aoudad was 150yd. So, I read up on some ballistics (minor stuff, I stuck to inches grin), and zeroed at 200.

Moral of the story: do some research and practice at longer distances.

Originally Posted By: Ramsey
If your sketch was to scale should have aimed close to where the 4 is
X2 ish

Re: Missed opportunity Need opinions [Re: chital_shikari] #6089919 12/18/15 12:29 AM
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Originally Posted By: chital_shikari
What I would have done: GET CLOSER! Inch by inch if I wanted one that bad. There's a huge difference between 1/200yd and 450yd. Was at the range today at 200yd, and minor shooting style differences that had NO EFFECT at 100yd were making my dad and I hit completely off with the other's rifles (30-06, 22-250). I ended up having to re-zero both, though the smaller gun had minimal adjustment.

However, I went to the range today with the mindset for a similar scenario. I have a mule deer/aoudad hunt in North Texas next month and the hunt-organizer there told me the deer are easy to kill (<100yd) but the closest recorded kill shot on an aoudad was 150yd. So, I read up on some ballistics (minor stuff, I stuck to inches grin), and zeroed at 200.

Moral of the story: do some research and practice at longer distances.

Originally Posted By: Ramsey
If your sketch was to scale should have aimed close to where the 4 is
X2 ish



You can't always get closer....a lot of times where you first see them is as close as your gonna get.

They can see a long, long way and if they are above you, as this one was, they will bust you


You better be good at stalking if your gonna go hunt one with a .22-250. That north Texas wind is gonna blow that little bullet all over the place







For it is not the quarry that we truly seek, but the adventure.
Re: Missed opportunity Need opinions [Re: JHeflinland] #6090611 12/18/15 02:01 PM
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I agree with txtrophy85....you have mad sheep drawing skills.
And about the shot, well, you learned a valuable lesson and seem remorseful for taking the shot. Sometimes when a person gets excited, they do silly things. I could write a book about it, myself.


Mmmm Hmmm
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